It’s fascinating how it’s turned around, suggestions are investors were worried how quickly it was gaining in value as it wasn’t sustainable…. or it could be because for the second time, i invested…. and tanked the market!
Exactly the same happened last time I invested 🤣

Tempted to buy now for sure, or monitor the situation for a short while at least… who’s to say it’s finished decreasing yet…

…all creeping back up again – slowly! 🙂

Not sure what the technical term is for what I’m doing, but I’m playing with XRP – waiting for it to get to 42/43p ish then sell it all. It’s pretty volatile so I then let it drop to below 38p and buy the same value in £ back again. So I’m basically increasing the amount of XRP I own.

This is an interesting one.
Since posting a week or so ago, I have done a little bit of looking about and had decided to set-up an account (probably with coinbase or binance).
I was thinking of making small-ish regular investments – the sort of money that I obviously wouldn’t be happy about losing, but equally wouldn’t give me sleepless nights if it all disappeared.

Having looked at the chart, I did wonder if I’d already missed the boat as it was heading north fairly rapidly. I seem to have a knack for timing these things right at the peak and losing money in the short-term at least.

I think I should get an account in place in the next few days, so I am ready to invest when I feel it’s the right time.
The drop in the last couple of days looks like a lot when you view a week chart, but when viewed over 3 months or more, it is (currently) just a blip. I guess that may change if it keeps heading down.
I’d be buying for the medium to long-term so would not try to get too twitchy at short term volatility.

I should probably read back through the thread, but what are the general thoughts on coinbase or binance? From what I have seen, coinbase has a much simpler interface, while binance seems like something more suited to short-term trading? I need to look at fees etc. before deciding.

Oh, I have been listening to The Missing Cryptoqueen podcast on the BBC – it’s fascinating & hard to believe it actually happened (or is still happening) in this day & age.

I put some money in Coinbase but quickly shifted to Binance, Fees on CB are nasty and there are loads more Altcoin pairings available on Binance.

Basically simple trading platforms cost more money in fees. Never buy at market. Coinbase has a pro platform which is harder to use but cheaper.

The beauty of crypto is its volatility, use an advanced platform and limit orders to buy and sell based on the amount of risk you want to take without having to look at it. I’ve had a rolling limit on ADA for a while now, set a low limit buy, high limit sell and just repeat each time it sells. I’m not taking profit though just increasing portfolio.

Got an order fulfilled today at 0.6, had a .68 limit sell order which I cancelled but I’d have made £60 this morning if I’d have left it. I think it will reach higher on the bounce but who knows.. it’ll probably be worth .50 by teatime 🤣 but if you spend a bit of time gambling on the ups and downs it can be very rewarding.

I’m long on cardano as with a few other defi currencies anyway – so it’s not of much consequence the ups and downs but it means I can keep my cost averages in the right direction.

Bitcoin has had a spread of 31-39 k today, if your balls are big enough there’s plenty of money to be made! (And lost)

I’m using Kraken – for basic playing with low amounts is that OK? Seems simple enough, they seem to be 2.75% fees based on what I’ve currently purchased. Not bothered about a few pence in fees here and there, just enjoying the ride at the minute.

Not sure I’d being putting my money in on a medium to long term basis. It feels like something you really have to keep your eye on.

Kraken is the best exchange for most currencies IMO, secure, has plenty of coins on there and importantly for us accepts bank transfer unlike Coinbase so the fees are very good.

I feel the ‘ride’ is about to get a bit sporting…!

Edit: 2.75% fees means you’re buying at market – try and get a bit of an understanding of using limit orders, fees will drop hugely. 0.0something % maker/taker fees. £120 order cost me 19p earlier.

Limit ordering – will have to look into that. I’m still a newbie at this game!

Can I do that on Kraken Pro? And is there an idiots guide to what it is?

Think I definitely dropped into the red today. XRP had been keeping me afloat the past few days. I’ve bought a few more xrp and Ada today and that’s it now, going to sit on it for a while and see what happens.

Limit ordering – will have to look into that. I’m still a newbie at this game!

Can I do that on Kraken Pro? And is there an idiots guide to what it is?

Google kraken limit orders/fees/ etc, the knowledge base is really good.

Yes you can use kraken pro but I would start on the website, it is a lot easier to get used to. Basically if you buy on the main kraken buy screen, at market, you give them a few percent as a ‘spread’ which is their fee. They don’t charge an actual fee for this but they take a little slice of your trade.

Limit orders essentially say buy or sell at a certain price. I.e you could create a limit buy for 1 bitcoin at 30k, and when the market hits that price it will buy, and if you create a limit sell for 1 bitcoin at 40k it will sell. Different fees for whether you ‘make’ or ‘take’ the order but ignore this for now. It’s basically 0.0something percent which is a lot less, and means you can play at taking profit – market buy/sells end up costing you 5% or so so you need a lot of swing to make it worthwhile. There are caveats to this but the kraken knowledge base explains it all.

Once you understand it all you can involve things like conditional closes which make trading really easy, you can use things like stop loss/take profit orders to make it a bit more ‘hands free’ which is really important with crypto as those of us who can’t spend the day watching it miss out on a lot. Keeps some of the emotion out of it too, which is good.

How does it work with Kraken, if you want to convert your crypto back to ‘real’ money?

In eToro it’s a very quick ‘close position’. Is it similar with Kraken?

Are Coinbase Pro limit orders fees similarly low? I signed up to it but the above suggests I probably should have gone with Kraken or Binance.

I also thought Coinbase accepted bank transfer?

Do all these crypto-currencies waste a load of electricity to be created?

Bitcoin is certainly an outstandingly disastrous idea, in a world that is meant to be addressing severe climate change…

The power consumption of Bitcoin is about 75TWh/year. That’s *dodgy back of the envelope maffs* equivalent of pointlessly turning on fifty billion electric fires and then running air conditioning to cool the room down again.

I don’t want any involvement in it and urge everyone else to avoid it for the same reason

Exactly… but after one response the issue gets ignored because people want to get rich but Bitcoin and rich people aren’t great if you are hoping to avoid climate breakdown.

I read that Bitcoin uses about half the power that Youtube does.
What about the environmental impact of watching cat videos?

I read that Bitcoin uses about half the power that Youtube does.
What about the environmental impact of watching cat videos?

You just saved my sanity

In eToro it’s a very quick ‘close position’. Is it similar with Kraken?

Etoro is a bit crappy for this IMO, you don’t actually own the coins, and you can’t really trade properly. You just close the entire position and lose out on the spread and I think also quite a hefty fee? Kraken allows you to sell at market, which is essentially the same as closing a position on etoro, but allows you to sell just a bit or all, and allows you to do more advanced stuff. Bear in mind you also have withdrawal fees to get your money back into your Fiat account on top.

If say you wanted to take some profit on etoro, you’d have to close the whole position, then open a new one for the smaller amount and lose out on the spread again, and suffer the $5 withdrawal fee if you want to realise that profit back to your bank account.

I couldn’t get Coinbase to work – uk bank transfers no longer allowed possibly due to the rule changes this year. You have to buy btc using a debit card and then it’s 3.75%, but you can then trade that on the Coinbase pro platform.

I was reading up and went with Kraken, not regretting it…..so simple!
Bought more Ethereum earlier when it went super low, hopefully it’ll be a good thing that will pay dividends…. I did buy at the weekend and then it slumped so I do have around £40 to break even but I’m looking at the longer game 👍

I read that Bitcoin uses about half the power that Youtube does.
What about the environmental impact of watching cat videos?

You could engage in all kinds of whatabouary, but it doesn’t reduce the carbon footprint of other reprehensible activities.

Do all these crypto-currencies waste a load of electricity to be created?

Bitcoin is certainly an outstandingly disastrous idea, in a world that is meant to be addressing severe climate change…

Bitcoin relies on a concept called Proof of Work where transactions deliberately require a high level of computational effort as a means of security.

I think Ethereum and others use a concept called Proof of Stake, which is faster and less intensive.

Oh, I have been listening to The Missing Cryptoqueen podcast on the BBC – it’s fascinating & hard to believe it actually happened (or is still happening) in this day & age.

Anyone thinking of “investing” in any type of Crypto currency needs to listen to this:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p07nkd84/episodes/downloads

If you want to know what the next financial scandal is going to be, this is it.

Chew

Anyone thinking of “investing” in any type of Crypto currency needs to listen to this

I agree, but OneCoin wasn’t a cryptocurrency. It was a ponzi scheme scam made to look like a cryptocurrency.

Although, I would still be doing a lot of research on the lesser known crypto-currencies before buying.
At the end of the podcast series, they talk about a new coin being sold in a similar way by some of the same people involved in OneCoin. I think it’s called Dagcoin.

“ I read that Bitcoin uses about half the power that Youtube does.
What about the environmental impact of watching cat videos?”

YouTube for better or worse is a big chunk of the media industry and provides entertainment, education and marketing to millions of people. What exactly does Bitcoin contribute to humanity?

If entertainment is doing great favours for humanity by taking their minds off the important problems of life, instead of resolving them, if education means being able to build a bridge between reality and your own selfish world, if marketing means wasting resources on things we neither want or need, then youtube has a value
If crypto breaks the monopolies that banks and govs have, employers, institutions etc can take the power out of the hands of the richest, that seems well worth it.

If crypto breaks the monopolies that banks and govs have, employers, institutions etc can take the power out of the hands of the richest, that seems well worth it.

Ignoring the fact that that makes no sense, I assume you mean that cryptocurrencies may have some overwhelming benefit that outweighs the downside. In which case one has to ask why that isn’t apparent yet – all it’s done in the dozen or so years since the Nakamoto paper is make money for some already rich people, gamblers and criminals. Given the choice I’d spend my CO2 emissions on Youtube.

Venezuelans have found it really useful as an alternative to their regular currency which is experiencing ridculous levels of inflation.

On a slight tangent – has anybody looked at Non-Fungible Tokens? They seem to be taking off for digital art with some of the artists getting on board claiming to be making more from the token side than they would if they just sold the artwork in the traditional way.

They seem like they could be quite useful as a proof of ownership for just about anything. If a seller has the item but not the token associated with the item then is it stolen?

Venezuelans have found it really useful as an alternative to their regular currency which is experiencing ridiculous levels of inflation.

Why would you swap one volatile currency for another?

I’m sure most people have swapped to the usual default of using the dollar on the black market.

Ignoring the fact that that makes no sense, I assume you mean that cryptocurrencies may have some overwhelming benefit that outweighs the downside. In which case one has to ask why that isn’t apparent yet – all it’s done in the dozen or so years since the Nakamoto paper is make money for some already rich people, gamblers and criminals. Given the choice I’d spend my CO2 emissions on Youtube.

+1. This supposed financial revolution shows no sign of getting off the ground.

Throw into the mix the complete anonymity of who holds what, the fact that a small number of players hold vast numbers of coin & they are able to manipulate the price, that state players are using it to launder money, that large crypto holders are shorting the currency.

Why would anyone get involved in it at all???

Venezuelans have found it really useful as an alternative to their regular currency which is experiencing ridculous levels of inflation.

A vanishingly small number of Venezuelans are using Crypto currency, and I’d imagine if they could use (say) tomato paste as an online currency to buy food and prescriptions and so on, they’d just as happily use that…

I’m trying to buy a crypto that avail on Binance. I opened account but wiring GBP to them can take up to 2 days it says – and its untested. I have a Coinbase account and I know wiring money takes up to a hour.

So – would the easy way to do it be:

Wire to CB
Buy BNB
Transfer BNB to Binance
Trade BNB to the final crypto I want?

1st time you transfer money on Binance it may take a while, I dont know, are you all verifid etc?
The quick transfer (bank transfer) is almost instantaneous

Ignoring the fact that that makes no sense, I assume you mean that cryptocurrencies may have some overwhelming benefit that outweighs the downside

If everyone doesnt have to rely on the financial institutions’ regulations, fees,etc,government decisions etc, to do business, and are thus freer to work and live as they choose, that seems positive.
Which is what cryptos aim to do, no?

Since we are conditioned to rely on money. And for most, that comes from doing the same job for 50years, and banks offer what-2%pa interest?
Crypto looks better than mugging grannies, or taking millions off the government for ‘PPE contracts’

Since we are conditioned to rely on money. And for most, that comes from doing the same job for 50years, and banks offer what-2%pa interest?
Crypto looks better than mugging grannies, or taking millions off the government for ‘PPE contracts’

I’m not sure I get what you’re getting at. If crypto did ever replace fiat currency then it just becomes a normal means of exchange, people would still have to earn it somehow, it’s just that they would be given bitcoin or whatever for their time instead of pounds or dollars. If crypto does work it wont make anyone rich, we will still have to work. It only does at present because the amount of pounds it can be exchanged for varies so much,

If everyone doesnt have to rely on the financial institutions’ regulations, fees,etc,government decisions etc, to do business, and are thus freer to work and live as they choose, that seems positive.

Regulations are there to protect the average person in the street.
Northern Rock goes pop, you’re savings are protected.
Bitcoin goes pop, then you’re on your own.

Article here that explains it better than I can:
https://www.fscs.org.uk/news/protection/cryptocurrencies-risk-cover/?gclid=CjwKCAiA1eKBBhBZEiwAX3gql_bP-iLWw65CDvzgQCBnAbY_Z-EbT-182oMEyB6oQkt-4dchqNYO0RoCqncQAvD_BwE

I have some magic beans for sale if you’re interested?
Guaranteed to make you rich….

If you don’t like it don’t invest. Just because it’s not guaranteed doesn’t mean it’s not a valid investment. It’s volatility doesn’t necessarily outweigh its benefits as a hedge against inflation – it’s no different from investing in anything else. Northern rock.. that made a lot of people lose out.

The eco argument isn’t really valid. If you don’t like it’s eco credentials, again don’t invest. But unless you live a green life don’t take foreign holidays etc then why bring that into it – the number of people in bitcoin is huge. I’m not really into bitcoin but the eco bit doesn’t bother me. Saw an article the other day about the amount of money Barclays had invested in fossil fuels – your money can be bad enough for the environment anyway.

Got a nice return on my average buy in on ADA today… something like 0.52avg and we are trading over a quid. Outperforms my stocks and shares by a long way. Hoping for a nice correction so I can sell now and rebuy a nice dip before Monday.

Worth 5 minutes of anyone’s time:

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/video/2021/feb/25/why-bitcoin-is-so-bad-for-the-planet-video-explainer

I read that Bitcoin uses about half the power that Youtube does.
What about the environmental impact of watching cat videos?

The difference is that the big cloud service providers are actively trying to reduce CO2 use and report such things regularly etc.

The bitcoin miners don’t GAF about their environmental impact and just want the cheapest electricity going which is normally coal powered.

The eco argument isn’t really valid. If you don’t like it’s eco credentials, again don’t invest. But unless you live a green life don’t take foreign holidays etc then why bring that into it – the number of people in bitcoin is huge. I’m not really into bitcoin but the eco bit doesn’t bother me. Saw an article the other day about the amount of money Barclays had invested in fossil fuels – your money can be bad enough for the environment anyway.

I’m not sure that ‘fossil fuels are also bad’ invalidates the environmental argument against Bitcoin.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-56215787

Bitcoin’s energy use is even more hideous than I realised. It uses half as much electricity as the entire internet’s data centres. And as much as the Netherlands. Ten times as much as Google.

It’s complete insanity in a world moving headlong into a climate disaster.

“ The eco argument isn’t really valid. If you don’t like it’s eco credentials, again don’t invest. But unless you live a green life don’t take foreign holidays etc then why bring that into it – the number of people in bitcoin is huge.”

This is a non-argument. Many people, many countries and many governments are trying to make the ecological impact of human life less of a problem. It’s very difficult but the world is slowly trying to dig itself of a very very big hole.

Apparently 100 million people have bitcoins. Whilst about 4000 million people use Google. But Google uses only 10% of the electricity that Bitcoin does. So Bitcoin uses 400x as much energy per user as Google. And I wonder how much active use of each there is? How many Google searches per person per day vs how many Bitcoin transactions?