What happened to my post?

I have a Salsa Cutthroat and a Cannondale Topstone with 700c wheels.

I am considering selling the Topstone as the Cutthroat does everything the Topstone does plus is more capable offroad.

It might be slight slower on the road compared to the Topstone but honest not by much.

I wouldn’t sell my XC bike and replace it with the Cutthroat though, its capable but its not a mountain bike.

Not a cat in hells chance i’d do a rigid, narrow bar 29er as my only bike. Are they capable? Yes. Are they as much fun as a proper hardtail on rocky, rooty, fast singletrack? No, not even close.

I tried a vagabond for a short while with 2″ tyres but soon moved it on as it really didn’t do what I was after. Ended up n+1 with an Awol with 37mm tyres & mudguards for the road & a monstercrossed Cannondale Flash for exploring the Chilterns highways and byways, which it is great at.

Sounds like the consensus of opinion is that I’m better off with what I have considering the Cutthroat is best with 2.25 tyres. I’m going to put a Chronicle on the front of the krampus and see how it goes

Not a cat in hells chance i’d do a rigid, narrow bar 29er as my only bike. Are they capable? Yes. Are they as much fun as a proper hardtail on rocky, rooty, fast singletrack? No, not even close.

It does depend where you ride though.

For me the nearest single track that really warrants a mountainbike is Swinley and the army heathland to the south (and Surrey beyond those).

The more local stuff is definitely quicker and more fun on a Cx/gravel bike. The descents might be a bit “ohhhhhh shiiiiiiiitttttt” at times, but they’re rideable and the flows better on the lighter bike. And I do tend to ride things the opposite way round to how I would before. Using the bumpy rooty single track as a climb then coming back down the fire roads.

Sounds like the consensus of opinion is that I’m better off with what I have

Not what I got from the thread. I’d have to see a spreadsheet based off all the comments 😉

In my limited testing the CX bike is quicker that the XC bike by around 1mph.

On my 10 mile commute to work my CAADX is not quite 1 mph faster than my Vagabond, which I normally use. If I used the Vagabond in a cross race I don’t think I’d be placed any lower than on the CAADX. The bar end shifters might cause some issue with quick dismounts, though.

I had a vagabond, a rigid 29er and a cross bike at the same time. I think the vagabond lasted 2 proper rides before being sold.

The cross bike is far more fun to ride, it’ll pop off things, jump, corner and do anything else you need it to do right up untill you run out of tyre and start smashing the rims into things.

Yeah, we’ve had this discussion so many times I think we can all finish each others sandwiches now! 😀 I would never describe my CAADX as fun to pop off things. It’s a harsh, aluminium cross bike which is brilliant for ‘cross races and general hacking about on but has its limits, especially on the really rocky mountain tracks around here. As has been said plenty of times before, location and style of riding is key. The Vagabond works for me massively more than the CAADX, which has only been used for racing and 2 commutes since I had the Vagabond.

We’re lucky around here – loads of properly technical riding, alongside hundreds of miles of routes over the hills and through the countryside. As much as I love my Vagabond (and cross bike) I still need at least one MTB. There’d be no point in living in a MTB mecca with just the gravel bike!

This is my Cutthroat running Vittoria Mezcal’s, and heaven forbid a pair of SiD’s. Just because it can…in this guise it receives more negative comments from people than a Tory MP. Currently the standard fork is on and a pair of Teravail Sparwood’s. Regardless of its configuration it’s fun!!!

My favourite type of comment is ‘you’re better off doing that on a hard tail mountain bike’, yeah, but I don’t own one and I can do it on this without problem…I’ve lost count the number of times I have wanted to say to a rider ‘you’re better off doing that on a Cutthroat’.

@wind-bag now that looks awesome and the more I think about where I ride and the type of riding I do I’m nearly convinced I could do it on a cutthroat with two wheel sets. Now to get brave and put stuff up for sale to fund it.

Wind-bag you’re a hipster. Just embrace it.

I think drop vs flat handlebars is quiet a small part of the variables between bikes. A stretched position with hands closer is more aero. More upright with hands further apart is better for technical stuff. The shape of bar doesn’t on it’s own determine either the stretch or how far apart your wrists are

The flat bars and bar ends on my 1990s mountain bike had a more stretched position than my drop bar gravel bike.

Even though the bars on my gravel bike not that wide, 44cm i think, I don’t think my hands were further apart on my 1990s mountain bike. The bars were wider at 550mm. I lost 15mm each side to bar ends. On my gravel bike my wrist are outside the drops when it gets technical. So probably just as far apart

ampthill

On my gravel bike my wrist are outside the drops when it gets technical. So probably just as far apart

True, but you’re out in front of the wheel, low down, with your arse in the air, which isn’t ideal, and trying to lean the bike and be active in the corners becomes much harder, and the upper part of the bars is clashing with your forearm when to try to lean over a lot. It all means going slower in tech stuff.

True, but you’re out in front of the wheel, low down, with your arse in the air, which isn’t ideal,

That’s my point. You can have high drops or low flats. So I’ve had this worse on older flat bar bikes

But we don’t need to argue. We choose what the bars we like

Good thread, and probably (for some people) one that ties into a couple I’ve made recently about N+1.

Having ridden mountain bikes for 30+ years, I fancied a similar bike just for whizzing round the local area, on and off road. Have had road bikes in the past but don’t really enjoy it. Had a cheap Boardman CX but that was very heavy and not much good at anything so didn’t enjoy it.

In the end I decided to build a light rigid mtb and se if it scratched the itch.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49755769343_19d6169104_c.jpg

It was awesome, flew around everywhere and brought back memories of mid 90s were bikes were light and just took off. (rose tinted glasses I suspect but…)

However, the On One morphed into a hard tail with 1×10 and a dropper. Mainly because that’s the type of bike I ultimately have the most fun on. Now it isn’t as capable as my main HT, so it stays unused.

Bit daft really but I think the moral of my story is that a bike (any bike) only makes sense if you are actually going to enjoy (continuing) to ride it, not just novelty value.

If that’s the case, whatever you choose will be an awesome build/buy 🙂

I think my thinking on this has been the worsening of my wife’s health and the limitations that has on driving to the mountains with some regularity and the appeal to just jump on a bike from the house has its advantages at the moment. A drop bar 29er/rigid like the cutthroat with two wheel sets just seems to fit that hole at the moment. I know my Vaya will take 700×50 tyres which I thought we the same as 29×2.0 but according to Salsa the Vaya won’t run 29x 2.0? As 2.0 Maxxis Ikons would have been worth considering

Bit of an old thread now but I feel that one point has been missed

I think there are quite a few dimensions in the spectrum from gravel riding to proper mtb. There’s at least steepness, roughness/looseness and jumpiness if you like. Some of these favour flatbars (over drops) while others just favour suspension and bigger tyres, and that leaves a set of conditions where monstercross bikes make a lot of sense

I mean, if a trail gets particularly steep or full or jumps/drops I really don’t want to be riding with dropbars even if the surface is perfectly smooth

But if a trail is roughly surfaced but otherwise quite wide/straight/not too steep, dropbars are just as good as flat bars

The Dales is a good example of somewhere where a monstercross bike makes more sense than an flat-bar XC bike

TL-DR: wind-bag’s Cutthroat looks the ideal bike for somewhere like the Dales

Swinley red on a cross bike with 33mm tyres is not so bad. Ok I’m not as fast as on a HT or FS and drop offs on Red 25 are sketchy. But you can either handle a bike or you can’t. Makes for more of a challenge. Just watch for punch flats landing the table tops.

This is my Cutthroat running Vittoria Mezcal’s, and heaven forbid a pair of SiD’s. Just because it can…in this guise it receives more negative comments from people than a Tory MP. Currently the standard fork is on and a pair of Teravail Sparwood’s. Regardless of its configuration it’s fun!!!

Based on my results trying to gravelise my Superfly hardtail, I think I really really need a Cutthroat with SIDs in my life. More realistically though I guess I could just fit drop bars and some TRP Spyres to my Superfly…

I have a rigid 29er which could be described as a monstercross were it not for the flat bars. But they are narrow high sweep bars and they have little stubby bar ends on, and the position is fairly stretched out, and it’s fast, comfortable and has multiple hand positions. Drops aren’t necessarily a requirement for a long distance bike.

@13thfloormonk me too. I’m still hankering for a Cutthroat but heading into hospital next week for surgery and selling a house so probably Spring/Summer next year. Just wish their frame only option was more colourful

Just noticed the updates to the new Pipedream ALICE notably 29×2.4 tyres so an option instead of the cutthroat? Steel which I love, dropper post compatible, carbon fork option and cheaper by a considerable margin.

A.L.I.C.E.

Think what the very best MTBers were riding in the 80’s. Add a bit to allow for better breaks, tougher wheels etc and there you are. EG. Miners path on Snowdon wouldn’t be at the limit.

just found this post. i like it.

i bought a Ti Fargo last december.
just put it’s 5000 mile on it this week.
so far this year i have ridden the Jennride on it, 2 days of the Dales divide and the Dales 200 road route.
so that is lakes rocks n stuff, dales tracks and also dales tarmac.
i used the same Teravail sparwood tyres for all 3 events with zero problems.

so i reckon they a very capable. ;o)

@ton love the Fargo.
Pics please

https://photos.app.goo.gl/4uPDV1D4mo5USePx8

That’s lovely Ton,how you getting on with those bars?

bars got changes last week to a set of salsa bends, with less sweep. feels better.

another picture by the STW photogropher.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/x4goRvPPax8K3RgM7

Looks ace Ton!
Cheers

I own a Cutthroat.

I ended up in a position in October of last year of having no bikes all of a sudden (work in industry, switched jobs and had to hand some bikes back, with covid there was nothing available.

Wanted a gravel bike and ended up with the Cutty by accident more than design. While I wait for my trail bike to arrive in the spring of next year it has been my only bike for bike packing and trail riding.

I love it and have fun riding on the trails and have done a 50 mile day just on singletrack, that was mentally tough but doable.

I am on my 3rd stock fork which tells me that its not up for trail riding hard or maybe I am unlucky (minor issues not catastrophic failure and Salsa have been awesome)? Either way I would stick a suspension fork in if you will be trail riding lots, will make a big difference, and be prepared to upgrade to hydro brakes depending on which model you get.

I live in an area where there has been a huge investment in trail building this year and so I chose to buy a trail bike too to maximise the fun but if that wasn’t happening the cutty would probably do the job for me.

Hope this helps!

Jammy Bugger ton, I have been looking for a ti large for since forever. I had the sand old large about 10-12 years ago and I was fantastic but just too heavy and dead unladen.

@jblewi cheers for the insight, the two main trail centres near me aren’t too gnarly unless you choose a black run (too old for that) so I can get round on the Vaya on 700×42 Resolutes so think a bike taking 29 x 2.2/2.4 would be great.

I keep having similar deliberations to fudge, not helped by the fact one of my riding mates has just bought a very nice ti Ribble gravel bike.

But I just can’t get past the limitations of drop bars for any techy off-road (and I spent years racing cross as well as mtb). My ‘gravel’ rides tend to be maybe 10% road to link stuff, 70% gravel fire roads, and again 20% rooty twisty sloppy singletrack to link stuff.

I think I’ve ended up with pretty much the perfect bike for this – a Stooge Speedball with loop bars. The bars really make the difference – for short road sections or breezy gravel stretches I can get a good aero position on the front bar extension. Otherwise theres a lot of control afforded by the wide ends, and a comfy hand position for 50 mile + rides. Also its a 5 min job to swap on some straight bars for a blast round the local trail centre!

3″ tyres roll well (Chronicles – not great in mud but fine elsewhere) and give enough bounce at 15psi that suspension hasn’t been considered.

But ultimately I reckon any 29er with loop bars would make a great (more off-road focused) gravel bike, and probably cheaper/ more easily available, and more adaptable. Anyway thats my five penneth-worth, good debate this!

I reckon any 29er with loop bars would make a great (more off-road focused) gravel bike

This, if my ride has more off-road interest or I’m on the bike for a long time. Gravel bike if it’s only a few hours off-road or generally more road-based riding. 29″ wheels and loop bars are a good combo on a rigid bike. Likewise 700 x 40 or 650 x 50 and drops match well.

But I just can’t get past the limitations of drop bars for any techy off-road (and I spent years racing cross as well as mtb). My ‘gravel’ rides tend to be maybe 10% road to link stuff, 70% gravel fire roads, and again 20% rooty twisty sloppy singletrack to link stuff.

Ritchey Beacon bars make a fairly big difference here

From what I can tell they have much less drop and reach than most other offroad drops, which I find really helps

I’m currently building a more off-road focussed gravel bike without drops, on my last bike I used some Alpkit Confucius bars I had in my spares box with some really old bar ends the bike shop gave me positioned exactly where the hoods on where on my GT grade. It worked really well until I crashed and destroyed them.