Viewing 40 posts - 81 through 120 (of 1,034 total)
  • Elon Musk
  • uponthedowns
    Free Member

    Tesla market it as “full self driving” capability and it’s available for purchase by the public.

    From the Tesla website

    Autopilot, Enhanced Autopilot and Full Self-Driving Capability are intended for use with a fully attentive driver, who has their hands on the wheel and is prepared to take over at any moment. While these features are designed to become more capable over time, the currently enabled features do not make the vehicle autonomous.

    argee
    Full Member

    Elon Musk is just one of those new wave business men who have hit a certain area of the market with and won over the younger audience, that’s what has allowed Musk to actually keep Tesla going, his showmanship has brought in more backers and money to allow it to be where it is today, as if it were any other business, it would have died years ago.

    Tesla now produce decent EV cars, and are the market leader for this technology, they are perceived as being way ahead of the competition as well, which is always a good thing to have, yes they make their profits through carbon credits, other business interests and data, but they have pushed their technology and abilities upwards at the same time.

    The future is also pretty good for Tesla, they have a good foundation, have built the support network required and yes, they will struggle with raw materials, but they’ve also quietly ditched that whole EV for under 30k or whatever it was, Musk was smart enough to see that was just one vanity project too much, and with a 33% increase in price for the base model over the last 4 years, it looks like they’re going to have to play to the middle classes or above from now on.

    The self driving thing is another bonus for them, we’re all talking about it and discussing the viability, at the same time every Tesla out there on the road is providing data to the Tesla Corporation on road mapping, driver habits, etc, etc, etc, they are building up data packets that will be worth a fortune in the coming years!

    thols2
    Full Member

    The self driving thing is another bonus for them, we’re all talking about it and discussing the viability, at the same time every Tesla out there on the road is providing data to the Tesla Corporation on road mapping, driver habits, etc, etc, etc, they are building up data packets that will be worth a fortune in the coming years!

    This is the core of Musk’s problem – the idea that any publicity is good publicity. It’s marketed as “full self driving” but that is a misrepresentation of what it can do.

    Yes, the cars can record massive amounts of data, but using that data to train the self-driving algorithms requires a human to go through the video frame by frame and tag the key objects in it. That is extremely slow so the limit is the number of humans they can afford to employ, not the quantity of data. You would probably end up with better data by just employing ten professional drivers to drive selected routes that include the important things that the algorithm must identify rather than relying on videos of amateur drivers. The professional drivers will provide a better model for the algorithm than amateurs and it would probably take about 1000 humans to tag the data from 10 cars driven 8 hours per day.

    However, the biggest problem with self-driving is simply that it requires massive computational power to identify and track all the objects in an urban environment. Tesla cannot afford to put that sort of computing power into a car so their current system will never be able to provide what Musk is promising without compromising safety. Still, if you think that any publicity is good publicity, killing pedestrians and cyclists probably won’t be seen as a problem.

    p7eaven
    Free Member

    Musk is the GOAT and The GigaTrump. Now to:

    1. Make Tesla cars affordable for the new Musktrutherz

    2. OurDearLeaderDealer-ize Twotter

    3. Deliver a mil-spec gigatruck so the Musktrutherz can #ownthelibz from behind bulletproof glass before buggering off to Mars. selling golden tickets for a post-WW3 off-Earth production of ‘Death on Mars‘ whereby we discover that Mars was once just like Earth until it was entirely consumed by greed, bots, infowarz, climate catastrophe and thermonuclear conflict.

    killing pedestrians and cyclists probably won’t be seen as a problem.

    The future = (still)cars, so zero cyclists and pedestrians will be available for comment/injuring. #notaproblem

    #moarcarz
    #cartrainz
    #carwarz
    #carwarez
    #stillcarz
    #ancapz

    nickc
    Full Member

    they are building up data packets that will be worth a fortune in the coming years!

    as @thols2 points out, this sort of IA needs computing power that Tesla doesn’t have, and even it’s lead AI scientist in his own blog says pretty much the only -The Only – difference between what they’re doing now, and what they did decades ago with what was hailed as the the first real AI system that could handle human interface information (crudely drawn numbers) is computing power and data size. In other words the technology hasn’t advanced in 3 decades because they don’t have the capacity to do so.

    Daffy
    Full Member

    Nvidia are putting a lot (a real lot) of money and effort into solving this. If you’re expecting anyone to solve this in the near term, they’d be the smart bet.

    squirrelking
    Free Member

    It’s marketed as “full self driving” but that is a misrepresentation of what it can do.

    No it’s not. See the post at the top of the page.

    Also…

    He bought nothing to Tesla (an existing company when he joined) but money. He’s a computer nerd who bet some of his Dads wealth on what became PayPal, and then used the money he earned from selling shares to invest in Tesla. He has no engineering skill.

    This pretty much nails it. He’s a nerdy guy with marketing skills but he leaves the engineering to others and throws tantrums when he doesn’t get what he wants.

    …I thought he was an arrogant engineer? Is he or isn’t he? Make your mind up.

    One of the problems with engineers is they tend to be very arrogant about technological solutions and dismissive of people who disagree with them.

    Your quote is still pish BTW, that’s nothing to do with being an engineer and just basic arrogance/groupthink.

    bails
    Full Member

    It’s marketed as “full self driving” but that is a misrepresentation of what it can do.

    No it’s not. See the post at the top of the page.

    You mean the post where Tesla call it

    Full Self-Driving

    ?

    BoardinBob
    Full Member

    using that data to train the self-driving algorithms requires a human to go through the video frame by frame and tag the key objects in it

    You know those Captcha things on line to verify you’re not a robot, and you have to look at a bunch of small pictures and identify the pedestrian crossing, traffic light, school bus, tree etc. It’s no coincidence that all the things you have to identify are potential driving hazards…

    dissonance
    Full Member

    It’s no coincidence that all the things you have to identify are potential driving hazards…

    Chimneys are a driving hazard?

    thols2
    Full Member

    It’s marketed as “full self driving” but that is a misrepresentation of what it can do.

    No it’s not. See the post at the top of the page.

    As bails pointed out, it’s marketed as “Full Self-Driving Capability.” That is what Tesla call it. That’s misleading, to put it very mildly, it cannot safely do anything without a driver keeping their hands on the wheel and constantly monitoring it to make sure it doesn’t drive under a truck or into a parked car. Calling it “Self-Driving” just encourages idiot fanbois to do stupid things.

    kimbers
    Full Member
    thols2
    Full Member

    Flaperon
    Full Member

    I saw his diatribe against home working and thought that it seems a brilliant way to advertise to Tesla’s competitors that they might be able to poach their top staff and the knowledge they take with them.

    Just because Musk spends his 60-hour working week on Twitter doesn’t mean that everyone else needs to.

    ^^ completely agree about the stupid robot thing being used as a distraction.

    mert
    Free Member

    FWIW Tesla have had their wrists slapped and significant fines for how they’ve advertised and marketed their “full self drive”.

    chvck
    Free Member

    I saw his diatribe against home working and thought that it seems a brilliant way to advertise to Tesla’s competitors that they might be able to poach their top staff and the knowledge they take with them.

    Probably no coincidence that he tweeted about layoffs a couple of days later. Getting rid of your best talent first probably isn’t wise though…

    thols2
    Full Member

    Fools and their money…

    p7eaven
    Free Member

    He’s obviously invested in upsetting ‘Democrats’ across the pond. I found this, how do they say, ‘spicy take’ (?) on the Tubes:

    What does all the (largely manufactured yet now became Frankenstein’s Monster) ‘culture war’ stuff have to do with selling beans or beer or vacuum cleaners or electric cars?

    What’s Musk’s long game now he’s trading divisive politics? It’s not like he’s vapour where is hasn’t been criticised for years and years is he just look at a way to silence/discredit critics by labelling them all as ‘nasty butthurt liberals’ or somesuch?

    Is climate change denial just around the corner for Musk? I always wondered how you could claim to be helping to tackle climate change while simultaneously funding engineers to find a way to ‘better’ existing airliner travel with rocket travel at x1000 (fossil fuel) emissions.

    It feels somewhat like we are all being trolled by an ‘edgy’ teenaged billionaire internet troll?

    p7eaven
    Free Member

    *oops

    It’s not like he’s vapour where hasn’t been criticised for years and years is he just look at a way to silence/discredit critics

    It’s not like his vapourware hasn’t been examined/criticised for years and years. Is he just looking at at a political way to silence/discredit critics? Or is this a career change to media/celeb/grifter?

    B.A.Nana
    Free Member

    Nvidia are putting a lot (a real lot) of money and effort into solving this. If you’re expecting anyone to solve this in the near term, they’d be the smart bet.

    My money is on Qualcomm

    dissonance
    Full Member

    What’s Musk’s long game now he’s trading divisive politics?

    Isnt he is just a thin skinned manchild who cant handle criticism and hence lashes out whenever anyone dares to challenge his pronouncements?

    thols2
    Full Member

    This is an interesting point from the author of Black Swan.

    p7eaven
    Free Member

    Isnt he is just a thin skinned manchild who cant handle criticism and hence lashes out whenever anyone dares to challenge his pronouncements?

    Possibly a large element of that – but I think he’s media savvy enough to turn it to his advantage. At least in the short term/ or while there’s still some gravy in this ‘culture war/antiwoke’ train.

    It’s all a bit weird tbh, it does just make me think he’s a big troll looking forward to using his vast influence putting Trump back in power 😉

    nickc
    Full Member

     but I think he’s media savvy enough to turn it to his advantage.

    And yet not savvy enough not to tweet/conduct interviews when drunk or stoned.

    p7eaven
    Free Member

    not savvy enough not to tweet/conduct interviews when drunk or stoned.

    On the contrary surely? While (at least to cynical & skeptical old farts such as your’s truly) Musk’s (for instance) Joe Rogan appearances might come over as horribly calculated/self-conscious, the ‘jokes and tokes’ of the middle-aged mega/rich keen to project an ‘I’m not like the other billionaires – trust me’ image…

    … to the YouTube/meme-media/me-me-me-me generation/demographic surely Musk’s ‘kool with the kidz’ projection is radical, and real, and just the sort of fresh waters they’re thirsty for?* Not like that stuffy, heavily-censored and fake old mainstream/old-guard politics rubbish? Add to a degree (even though it’s all fake/hustling to my mind) that last point is still a point.

    I believe it’s known as “good optics“

    thols2
    Full Member

    What do you throw a drowning lawyer?

    Spoiler:
    Their partners and associates.

    BruceWee
    Full Member

    It reminds me somewhat of Sick Bicycle Co’s approach to product testing.

    thols2
    Full Member

    When you lay it out in simple terms like this, yep, it sure does look like a scam.

    Flaperon
    Full Member

    Thols2 – give your anti-Tesla diatribe a rest. You come across like a vaccine-denier picking and choosing the bits and pieces you can find in the media to support your case.

    It literally says on the page with accident statistics “we count any crash in which Autopilot was deactivated within 5 seconds before impact”.

    You can overcome stupidity to an extent with technology, but eventually you will come across a sufficiently determined idiot.

    thols2
    Full Member

    So, if I understand this correctly, a frontal crash will usually mean the system failed whereas other crashes are more likely to be the fault of another vehicle. What this means is that the Tesla system is woeful at avoiding obstacles.

    dissonance
    Full Member

    It literally says on the page with accident statistics “we count any crash in which Autopilot was deactivated within 5 seconds before impact”.

    Ermm, yes?
    You seem to be implying the person disabled it and then crashed for shits and giggles?
    As opposed to it disengaged itself because its confused or the driver disengaging it by desperately slamming on the brakes/steering to try and dodge the scenario the self driving has put itself in.

    HoratioHufnagel
    Free Member

    I worked in the industry and I wouldn’t trust any of these “semi autonomous” systems at all.

    The company I worked for saw it as an advantage that the driver was ultimately responsible, as they could save millions on testing their systems properly. And don’t expect the regulators to do the job either. I think for pedestrian detection, they just test it once and give it a pass or fail. For a system dealing with complex situations, human behaviours and weather conditions it’s an incredibly poor way of making sure these things are robust.

    The all-or-nothing approach is the only one that makes sense. Thats the approach taken by Waymo, Wayve, FiveAI amongst others. Google realised pretty early on humans are incredibly poor at watching and checking a semi autonomous car.

    kerley
    Free Member

    Google realised pretty early on humans are incredibly poor at watching and checking a semi autonomous car.

    They are not that good/attentive when actually driving so take that responsibility away but expect them to still stay focused just in case is recipe for disaster.

    kimbers
    Full Member

    I think the lesson here is

    Don’t announce multi billion dollar takeovers when you are high as shit!

    So he’s pulled out

    Twitter are suing him and Twitter shareholders are likely too as well

    Drac
    Full Member

    He’s a bit rubbish at pulling out.

    Not read the whole thread, so probably been mentioned multiple times, but it baffled me why the world’s richest bloke would invest most of his fortune in a social media platform that could collapse/wither away into nothing – they all die eventually

    leffeboy
    Full Member

    would invest most of his fortune

    I got the impression that he was largely getting the money from elsewhere rather than it all being his

    I got the impression that he was largely getting the money from elsewhere rather than it all being his

    Richest man in the world borrows money. Wow haha. Not disputing your input, but bloody hell, aint it ridiculous?

    I thought he was rinsing Tesla for it though, hence the share crash?

    Just sort the world debt you massive **** – that said, not sure who the world owes money to…..

    pk13
    Full Member

    H is about to spend the rest of his life in court fighting Twitter. Unless he moves to Mars.
    He needs investigating by the SCC now. pump and dump king

    nickc
    Full Member

    Richest man in the world borrows money.

    TBF If I was buying something like Twitter I wouldn’t use my own money either.

Viewing 40 posts - 81 through 120 (of 1,034 total)

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