Beginner tourer! CX or (wait for it…) Carrera Subway?!

Last year during lockdown I was saving some cash being furloughed and not going anywhere so I figured it was a good time to start accumulating some gear to give touring a try (hence the posts on tents and sleeping gear).

‘The midlife crisis’ as its become to be called (the wife).

I assumed I’d use my CAADX – not ideal but I’m not buying a touring bike at this point. It has a rack and I have ortlieb’s for the work commute so whilst not ideal I figured it’d do the job. I’m not planning ride around the world. Just Short local-ish trips to start with anyway.

However, In September my MIL asked me what she should do with my late FIL’s bike that was idling in the garage. Carrera Subway (LTD no less!) 2009 I think .. I’ll have it thank you for a runaround / nip to the shops bike.

So I put a rack on it to use the ortliebs.
Then recently I started thinking hmmm maybe I could use this for touring instead…triple chainset as opposed to the CAADX double .. relatively decent (cable) disc brakes…mudguards ..I got rid of the horrendous adjustable stem …put some new bars on it ..ergo grips … new seat post … marathon plus tyres .. handlebar bag.

Go on ..tell me what you think …. not the worst idea?!

Here it is when I got is so you’ll have to imagine the pannier bags on it and the non-horrendous stem!

Or this …
how to take screenshots

The Carrera all day long. In fact I have a mountain biking buddy who tours a bit and that’s what he uses. He put some nicer MTB wheels on it when moving away from 26 inch wheels, but stock apart from that, he really rates it.

Whichever is most comfortable really. Carter’s looks like it would be but I’d give them both a long day in the saddle and see which one ticks the boxes

My wife’s first ‘proper’ bike was a Subway, fantastic bike. Saw her through her first century and 1000s of commuting miles. I had a CAADX and due to the CX geometry I found my weight was thrown too far forwards giving me sore neck, back and arms on rides over 2hrs even though compared to my other bikes the contact points were the same (saddle to bars, handle bar drop etc).

Thanks! I’d prefer to use the Subway so I think I’ll forge ahead with that plan.
Good idea to get some longer rides in on it … I may need to play about with the cockpit to get more comfortable.

Do I need to be concerned about the wheels?
I’ve put some Marathon plus tyres on but they’re just the bog standard 32 spoke wheels. I don’t intend carrying a huge amount but I am camping so there’ll be the loaded rear panniers and a tent strapped to the top of the rack.

Anything else to consider? I’m all ears for advice !

I have a CAADX which I find perfect for touring, having tried a few, it does have a triple tho.

But I am used to drop bars and road bike position. No way would I choose to ride 6hrs on the road on flat bars.

I would choose the Carrera if the sizing was right. Most European touring bikes don’t use drops, but they have handlebars with a wider variety of hand positions.

Maybe grab a set of Moloko bars or similar, with a pair of Ergon grips that have stubby bar ends built in?

https://www.bikemonger.co.uk/surly-moloko-bar-12444-p.asp?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5rXartGi7gIVuYFQBh0KHwWkEAQYAyABEgIsmPD_BwE

Depending upon how much you lug about, might be worth considering a low rider front rack like a Tara to balance out the weight for better handling? Handy you have mid fork eyelets.

if you use the Carrera consider chucking on a set of bar ends and mini Tri bars for a bit of extra comfort. My first tourer was a slicked mtb as it was the only bike I had.

Depends largely on what you define as ‘touring’ (ie distance, surface, carriage, required gearing etc)

You can feasibly (road) tour on any bike, just strap/bolt stuff to it and/or self and turn pedals.

Have (road) toured and grocery-shopped (works out the same thing as I fill large panniers) variously on:

– a 1989/90 ATB/MTB with with a large hiking rucksack (this method of carrying camping kit not recommended, bike was fine though, just plodding). Did over a century in a day and it beat me up, so panniers next time.

– a 26er (M-Trax) rigid steel MTB w/pannier racks and Schwalbe Marathons. It turned out to be a bit noodly at the rear but was carrying a lot of weight.

– a 26er (Kinesis) lightweight aluminium MTB with steel forks and 2” Schwalbe Hurricane tyres and Freeload/Thule strap-on racks. OK for commuting and light touring on mixed terrain. Gravellish.

– Retro tourer (Reynolds 531 Super Tourist), 700c, hand-built wheels and frameset. 28c Marathons, triple, and Brooks Pro saddle. Very comfortable, fastish, eats miles for breakfast and is stable carrying loads. No complaints, would prefer disc brakes but is not a deal breaker as everything else about it is a joy.

One thing I’ve found using flat or riser bars for touring, is that adding long, curved ergonomic bar-ends help on long stretches/headwinds and for extra purchase/better grip positions on climbs.

We’ve three ‘do everything’ bikes,l. A CX women’s converted to flat bar when mrs_oab’s small hands didn’t get on with the brakes on drop bars. I’ve a shiny new Merlin Gravel. Midfle_oab a Boardman CX. All comfy, fast and go anywhere.

The one thing that I’ve now realised it that both are completely over geared for touring. If we were in flatlands, they are fine. Unloaded, they’re a touch too high a gear. Loaded they are just too high a low gear.

Other advice – spread the luggage weight around a bit. Bar bag, consider front panniers, etc.

I am camping so there’ll be the loaded rear panniers and a tent strapped to the top of the rack.

My advice would be to go light on the gear. The amount of crazily overloaded touring bikes I see on social media when I also see ultralight hikers doing the opposite amuses me.

Lightweight tents, like the lanshan, are much cheaper now. With a decent light sleep pad and bag and you’re away. Stove is grams and can fit with a gas bottle inside a titanium cook pot. Then just clever and essential clothes choices.

Deffo the subway though. Just make sure the wheel stays very true and tape some spare spokes to the frame.

Would also think about some cheap bar ends to mix up the hand positions.

Yeah I’m aiming to pack as light as I can. When I said loaded panniers I didn’t mean bursting at the seams.
I’ve got a one man tent .. a pretty small Alpkit sleep mat .. a brukit to get me away for now .. the sleeping bag is the main outstanding purchase. Again – looking for something relatively light and compact.

I’ll take a look at some bar ends thanks.

Intrigued by that Moloko bar .. not sure I want one but I’d love to try one! .. it looks like On One do a similar bar (Geoff?) for a lot less £.
I’m 6’1” so I need to make sure I can get comfortable .
Not sure that the Ortlieb bar bag I have would work with it tho.

I bought On One Geoff bars. Thought they would be useful for bike-packing.

I can fit either my (small) tent in a roll/harness on the bars, or the sleeping bag (an old but good Vango Ultralite 900) which will stuff into the drysac and then into the harness.

(yikes @ the shonky taping job)

All said and done I prefer flat bars and bar-ends so the Geoffs (just gather dust. My 610mm flat bar still takes the tent or bag easily. The Geoffs (2019) seem really hefty and very rigid for my liking, and I’m no lighweight. I appreciated the pseudo-aero/stretch position, but still missed the ‘pistol-grip’ position offered by brake hoods. Prefer drop bars ultimately, but for simple MTB conversions for touring then found I preferred bar-ends. ymmv. I since looked at Koga Denhams and they look well thought-out (to my way thinking)

If I ever take the MTB bikepacking then Ergon GP grips/ends are near-perfect. I use GP3s for weekend type ‘touring’, which is more gravel/MTB with a dayback or minimal overnight kit. Long-distance/endurance I would look at GP5 bar ends, or else changing bars to Koga Denham or similar.

I used these Procraft Evo bar-ends for a few years and really liked them (were also hugely economical, before Bre*it)

They’re lightweight, fit flush inside the bar-tube (gripped via an expanding wedge) so take up no additional room on the bar. Also easily removed in seconds should you want to go MTBing off piste/leave them in the tent (remember to pack barplugs if removing)

Do I need to be concerned about the wheels?

No, my pal just had some nice left over wheels that he put on the subway when the last proper 26er MTB went.

Pwersonally I prefer a flat bar bike. I have also become a big fan of frame bags

Might be worth servicing the hubs, new bearings, pack with grease and ensure spike tension is good and even.
Subways are great bikes, they aren’t lightweight but can do a bit of everything. I’ve recommended them to loads of people as a bike for people who just want to get to work or do a bit of all sorts.
Weirdly as it’s a Carrera I’d take up the manufacturer name as Carreras are nicked quite a bit, they’ve been the brand to have amongst kids recently.

Thanks for the replies .. appreciate it.

This is where I’m at now with the tent dropped on the rack for the full picture

The bars are 740mm and they feel pretty wide to me but not uncomfortably. I know everybody has wider bars these days but I’ve been mostly on drops for the past 5 years! I think a riser stem might be a better option for me tho.
I guess I need to do a couple of hours on it and see how it feels

Nothing wrong with the Carrera, a mate of mine toured the Pyrenees on one and has a good photo of him going up the Tourmalet on his hanging in his hallway, he’d probably still be using it now had it not been stolen.

With regards to bars, whilst i generally prefer drop bars as i ride more road than anything these days, for all day rides i still prefer riser bars with ergo grips as my carpal tunnel syndrome plays up if im on drops for more than 3 or 4 hours. I’m currently using On-one Brians, basically a standard mtb riser with a luggage loop on the front, i find it quite excellent.

Did all my longest tours on 26inch wheels bikes. Easy to pick up spare wheels in far flung places and to be honest at the time 29ers weren’t really a thing.

Also wouldn’t worry too much about weight of the bike of you are doing long trips. The stronger the better and if you need to shed a kilo take one less bottle of water or eat a bit less for the week before you ride 😉

Comfort is key on a tourer. Get those bars higher up level with the seat maybe?
I reckon you could go with some narrower bars, some flat bars with some bar ends would be good, maybe just cut those down a bit and add the bar ends.
I am jealous of the plans you are making! Have fun.

@b230ftw … thanks! I’m slowly getting there!

I’ve just been out tonight for 90 mins once I’d got the kids in bed to see how it is with those bars.

You can see they’re much lower than in the original picture with the adjustable stem. I think I’ll change the stem for a riser stem and see how that works. I’ve seen a 30/35 degree one so that should get the bars back up to where they were.
Then I’ll decide what to do about the bars. I may prefer a flat bar if I can get away with it

Well I’m Pretty excited that after over 12 months of starting on this plan and collecting gear I’m going to do my first overnight trip next week!

I’ve not been cycling a huge amount (more of a runner these days) but I’ve booked a campsite 55 miles away so hopefully I’m not biting off more than I can chew!
In my favour, I have pretty much all day to get there …prob a lunch stop on the way. Plenty of photos and I should have the weather.

I’m trusting in Komoot and using its ‘cycle tour’ search option on my edge explore which looks to make use of 2x NCN routes where it can.

Heck! It’s only one night .. What’s the worst that can happen 😁

I’ve digested a million packing lists. Pretty much got what I need.
Any last minute tips or essential packing items that I may not have considered?

Sounds great. I took a whole day for 50 mile ride/overnight stay some time ago. That was after a long period of nin-cycling, and also avoiding busiest roads so I winched it the long way around in a leisurely fashion. My preference even when fit

I’ve digested a million packing lists. Pretty much got what I need.
Any last minute tips or essential packing items that I may not have considered?

For one night? No idea what you may have forgotten. I usually forget toothbrush or ibuprofen

Another pack list to add to yr collection 😎

Bike tools/puncture kit/pump
Mat
Tent
Sleeping bag
minimal wash kit
Light jacket for evenings
Medications if required
Phone (fully charged) plus power pack if required. I normally plan ahead and pre-save key maps (from Streetmap) as a series of screenshots to save on battery and data.
Facemasks x 2
Tick Twisters
Small SAK
Small first aid kit
Money/change/debit card
Water/bottle
Fruit bars/peanut butter sarnie/banana whatever

Should see you alright if you’re eating on the way.

If you really want to cook/brew then a small stove and whatever. I’d normally be grabbing scran on the hoof for an overnighter.

I’m on a tight budget and like to pack light have been through a few permutations. Have gotten to the point where tent, bag and mat fit easily into one pannier

– Proaction Hike Lite tent £15 in Argos sale
– Vango Utralite bag £8 from FB marketplace
– Crivit inflatable mat £13 from Lidl or Aldi IIRC

*edit 4x Karrimor panniers (£15 FB marketplace again!) Still yet to get a rack for the front ones so just using a bar-roll/bag (£9.95 Lidl)

No better feeling than heading out on a sunny day with everything you need to be self supported.

@p7eaven

Call me paranoid, but everything in my panniers is in binbags for waterproof too.

My pannier pics would be boring….!

My pannier pics would be boring….!

I’m weird like that 😎

Luckily mine (panniers) came with waterproof raincovers but I’ll keep the phone/battery pack in a watertight bag also if it’s hooning down.

Thanks @p7eaven … yeah just the one night. If all goes to plan i’ll be trying to get a 3 night trip planned next.
I think I’m covered with most of that list … plan to eat on the way .. grab some food for the campsite and I have a brukit for a a cuppa / pasta etc.

I’ve come this far with my posts asking for touring gear advice so I thought I’d write a post about my first overnighter!
Tuesday evening I was packed and ready to set off Wednesday morning.
Kids were offloaded to my parents and I was away by 10am.

I’d booked a campsite (Ushagap Farm) in a place called Muker int’ Yorkshire Dales. The weather was perfect. This was the first time I was really using my Edge Explore and I’d downloaded the course from Komoot using the ‘road touring’ course option. This was also my first time using a Komoot course.
53 miles it said. Might be a but much since I’m more of a runner these days but I wasn’t in a rush.

Had a lovely time bimbling along making my way through Middlesbrough, Stockton and skirting around Darlington before arriving in Richmond.
20 minute stop for a sandwich, top up the water bottles and on my way again.

I was placing my trust in Komoot and so far so good .. it kept me on the NCN routes where it could and the quieter back lanes. I was really just enjoying the ride. The owld Carrera was doing sterling service.

The campsite is around 20 miles further west from Richmond.
Around mile 40 Komoot took me down a back lane marked ‘Swale trail’ which I expect some of you will know about. By the time I reached the gate where the Swale trail commenced I’d gone a mile or two down that back lane. I made a decision to carry on along the trail which the sign on the gate indicated was a mtb trail. I could see the road to my right over a few fields and it clicked that Komoot was basically just keeping me off that road – even though it had been pretty quiet anyway so I’d have much preferred to have been on that. not that Komoot was to know. It wasn’t an ideal track on a loaded bike.
So, lesson learned – pay attention to road signs too and use some common sense!

After a couple of miles of rough ground I got back to the road, grabbed an ice cream in Gunnerside and finally reached the campsite at 4.30. It’d been a lovely ride but the last 15 miles had dragged on.

Checked in, tent up, shower, food. Pleased to say I had a great night sleep in my Alpkit skyhigh 500 bag – First time I’d used that.
The firepot chilli wasn’t even too bad!

I had a slightly different route home planned and I stayed on the main roads for quite a lot of it, ignoring the Garmin constant requests to do a U turn and made it home 90 minutes quicker.

I wasn’t sure I’d enjoy another 50 miles home the next day but I really did.
Clearly the weather played its part.

Thoroughly enjoyed it. Nice to not be racing about. Looks like I packed everything I needed and nothing I didn’t. Next time I’m going to try to do a 3 night trip if I can wangle it.

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Top work fella.

I’ve a few long weekends over the summer, and a new tent incoming. Mrs_oab and I are heading out for at least one overnight, myself I hope more.

Now THATS what I’m taking about! Nice work!

You don’t need the latest and fanciest kit as you’ve shown, just the willingness to have a go and be determined to chill out and relax and enjoy it.

I’m doing the same soon, got a gravel bike last year and just got a tent in the sales. Need some other bits and bobs but they’ll all be going in a couple of panniers – can’t wait!!

I wouldn’t quite go that far @b230ftw given I had a new MSR tent, new sleeping bag, mat, brukit etc ! but in bike terms yes – just a 2010 carrera subway albeit with a few adjustments to make it more touring friendly.

Good luck with your plans.

The gear I have bought is all useful stuff for off the bike camping anyway so money well spent

Fantastic feeling being self propelled and self supporting isn’t it. Good stuff.

Cheap bikes make great tourers imo

There’s many different ways of touring, light v heavy, comfort vs minamilist etc.

I’m much in the heavier and more comfy side. It’s nice to stop for a day somewhere and look around. It’s not always about being as fast as possible.

We found theres a lot of times you need to leave your bike locked up, or chuck it on a boat/bus etc. It’s a lot easier if you are not worrying about getting it scratched and so on.