Any Metal Gate Design/Fabricators on here to advise?

I want to put a metal gate across the driveway. This will replace to old rotten wooden gate that was there. There are big brick pillars to support it.

We want a bi-fold gate because it takes up a lot less of the drive when it is opened and means we will be able to open and close it with the cars on the drive. The old gate that just remained tied open because it was so long it meant we couldn’t use the last 2.5m of driveway. The full and detailed instructions for the bi-fold mechanism are shown in the picture below along with my design idea.

I want to use some spare strengthened glass panels that will match the balustrade. These obviously need to be supported both sides and as I can’t bend the glass to slide it in, It will need to be able to remove the supports from one side.

My basic idea is to get some reasonable size box section to make the main frame. Weld some support plates in the corners to keep it square and strong. The glass panels will rest on the main frame, pushed against the front support panels. On the back there will be bolt on support bars to stop the glass falling out. I have only put 2 of these on the diagram but am thinking I will probably add several vertical ones rather than the diagonals.

Will the gate sag?
What can I do to stop that?
Any better design suggestion where the main criteria is a gate where the maiun visual feature is the large glass panel?

Using the glass is going to add a lot of weight and it will be difficult to put diagonal bracing that won’t interfere with the visual aspects of the glass.

Could you not use a laser cut mild steel decorative/patterned panel instead that could be welded in thus creating a strong but visually appealing design?

The laser cut design cut depict a headless squirrel……

If you insist on the glass could you put a wheel on the bottom of the middle gate hinge and have a curved steel track on the floor for it to run on whilst supporting the weight?

Will the glass itself not provide the diagonal bracing?

those diagonal braces are the wrong way round?

well they are if it was wooden.

Sliding gates on wheels set behind/in front of the pillars. A layered arrangement (can’t think of a better term) would be more compact and allow easy pedestrian access, i.e. only one panel needs to slide for a pedestrian, all four for a car

Glass panels are bloody heavy but needed for the aesthetic continuum with the glass balustrade along the side of the drive.

The drive slopes so any wheel will only be in contact when the gate is fully shut.

The glass, in my design, is resting on the frame as there is no way to fix it firmly so it will provide little actual bracing.

Diagonals copied from the leaflet. Wood works best under compression whilst steel is better under tension perhaps?

No space for a sliding gate, already consisted, and there is a separate pedestrian entrance.

I can see there will be a lot of weight on the hinge at the gate post but my question is more about whether the corner panels on one side of the frame will be enough to maintain square. Any way to estimate the load and the strength?

Isn’t having glass panels a bit risky considering that one day you’ll most likely go careering towards them on one leg on a discarded rollerskate carrying a poorly fastened rucksack full of kitchen knives and a large tub of hungry pirahna…..or something?

Kayak – that is exactly how I maintain my reputation. World Class Accidents don’t just happen.

Thinking a bit more about the centre wheel idea. It will touch when fully closed and I could build a small support post for when it is fully open. This would mean it will only be unsupported during the actual process of opening and closing which might help.

Windy location? Big area of glass acting as a sail could give it quite a lot of energy once moving?

The glass, in my design, is resting on the frame as there is no way to fix it firmly so it will provide little actual bracing.

I was thinking that maybe you could have a tightish fit in the frame and shim it but thermal expansion will toast that 🙁

How about having the glass panels come down from above on ropes?

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And painting a squirrel on your car 🐿️….

One of my mates works for a company that makes bi and tri fold gates. I’ll ask him.

Could you have a gate either side nick. Reduce the load on the hinge by having shorter sections. The extra parking bay on the right is set back a bit isn’t it

Windy location?

Thats my thought – the glass turns the gate into a sail – so you’ve got two  stresses on the gate pillars and the fixings that go into them – the weight bearing down and the wind load horizontally. They’d be pretty lively to handle , especially hinged in the middle, when opening / closing in any wind – thats something your visiting postman / milkman / jahova’s witness is going to have to contend with so theres a bit of a liability issue.

However – the diagonal brace is pretty ugly if your balustrade you’re matching in otherwise frameless. I’d use the glass as its intended and mount it in the frame using weld-on glass balustrade clamps. That way the glass is held away from the metalwork which is important as if theres any rattle or friction between the steel and the glass and an edge chips the whole sheet can just pop. The clamps have a softer hold in also isolate the glass and steel a bit to allow for any expansion/contraction.  But also being clamped in securely it becomes a stressed member and does the job of bracing the frame. It also makes replacing glass easy after an ‘accident’. How many spares have you got? 🙂

Would you be better with some 10mm acrylic perspex than with glass? You’d remove about 60-70% of the weight and still achieve the same aesthetic.

How about making a Steel frame, with a rebate to hold the glass. The glass could then be bonded in place like a car windscreen. PU adhesives are readily available.

Plenty of rigidity and no worries about rattling etc…

Those gates will be pretty heavy.
Brick pillars are not that good at taking bigger loads and the windage of the glass will def not help.

If you want heavier gates the recommendation now is to have a steel post with a brick skin if that’s the aesthetic that you want.

But I cannot see why you would want ed glass in a gate… Is it to keep the draft out?

(And my money is on the glass breaking due to flex.)

Stainless box and polycarbonate could work.
2 gates of 2 panels so 4 panels total.
Approx 1mtr tall and 1mtr wide.
Gives a 4mtrs opening when both sides fully opened, or 2mtr when 1 side is.
Each pamel could be magnetically held back to stop Unwanted swinging.
Probably be light enough to do away with x bracing, amd maybe a gusset would add in stiffness.

Also see perforated stainless steel sheets for some bling.

Polycarbonate is quite a good idea to remove the weight problem while maintaining the aesthetic.

The opening is 2.5m and only used for vehicles (cars & bikes) so the gate is to discourage people ‘accidently’ walking down the drive for a quick look around. Clearly they can still get onto the property but it will at least deter them.

I guess with polycarb we could make the two rectangular frames and then have the panel mounted in a U-channel top and bottom that bolts to the frame. There can be gaps either side between the panels and the frame to let the wind blow through and also allow the panels to be slide to the side whilst the u-channels are bolted in place.

We are getting closer to a solution. Thanks

****, he’s getting the angle grinder out next 😯

while polycarbonate solves weight problems its prone to getting scratched and once its does instead of looking like glass it looks like plastic.

Also keep in mind – if you’re seeking to match the existing glass… polycarbonate is clear – as in colourless – , glass isn’t colourless, its green. Side by side the gates and balustrade will look different. I’ve bought ‘glass look acrylic’ which has a green tint where I’ve needed to make fake windows on filmsets that are safe for stunt actions and the like (and where things need to be lighter and safer to transport) . Acrylic is more prone to scratching than polycarbonate though – as in wipe it with a cloth and its ruined. I dont know if theres a glass-look polycarbonate available.

Hmmm you could stick the glass to the front of the frame(like they do with the frameless patio doors).

TBH I’d probably just get some glass panels made with holes for mounting and not have any metal frame.

(Probably terribly pricey in the current market)

These things are going to be a tad heavy and as mentioned an interesting windsail and def likely to want a bit of serious metal post to hang em off.

Just think poly carbs a bit meh asthetically and doesn’t it flex?

I do think you want a certain amount of weight to gates anyway not some flimsy shite.

Anyone else picturing this?

I don’t get the wind sail worry comments.
There are plenty of metal gates that are fabricated as full panels. Quite often a steel frame with cladding infills. If anything the weight of the glass would mean a greater wind load to move them.

As a side note, part of the inspiration for using the glass panel is the pile of 6 spare glass panels leaning against the garage wall that I can’t think what to do with and no-one seems to want.

As promised I asked my mate:

His idea is sound. It will need diagonal bracing. The metal box section we use is 60mm x 60mm x 3mm thick, but that’s for a pair of bi folding gates with an opening span of 6.5 meters. He will have to be careful of the brick pillars though. They will have to be strong.

Is that an EV charger coming out of the grate under the door??

love the sign btw 🙂

The diagonal bracing or ‘support strut’ as you have noted, is, as previously mentioned, the wrong way round.

Theres a potential for you to end up with some very very heavy, and not very strong gates if you get it wrong – I’d get yourself some CAD (sketchup!?) or some graph/lined paper and do some real thinking before you start chopping up random bits of box section.

Marginal saving in weight but possibly less visually unpleasant, could you use some stainless steel cables and turn buckles for diagonal bracing?IANAE

EV Charger – Yes. I have a crap 2011 Nissan Leaf with about a 30 mile range I use to get to and from the train station / shop as I can’t walk and don’t want to wreck the V8s with short journeys from cold, I mean because I am a die hard eco-bunny. Just plugged into a 3 pin mains socket and takes about 3-4 hours to fully charge because the battery capacity is so small.

Bracing direction – I just copied the picture in the leaflet but will check out other metal gates to see what is best practice. I think that the bracing for metal gates is reversed from wooden gates because wood works best as a brace under compression while the metal works best under tension but I will check.

Brick Pillars are fairly beefy. They are square with two bricks end to end on each side and used to have a single span 2.5m gate hanging from them. Admittedly, that was a wooden 5 bar gate but they do look suitably over-engineered. There is the option of rebuilding the one that the gate will have off as a brick skinned metal post, should that prove necessary.

Steel cables were considered but I couldn’t find and nice clamping mechanisms to hold the ends of the cable neatly. The best solution appeared to be to hide the clamps inside some kind of box which didn’t look great. The trouble with the gate is that you can see both sides and there isn’t really anywhere to hide stuff.

I am thinking that having a wheel at the end of each section of gate furthest away from the hinge will provide support. It will only be in contact when the gate is fully open or fully closed but this will be 99% of the time so there will only be any strain for the short period while the gate is being opened which, hopefully, the brick pillars will cope with.

Will check out the costs / weight of 60mm box section but 40mm with 2mm walls was coming in at just around £50 per metre in stainless or £30 galvanised mild steel.

Will check out the costs / weight of 60mm box section but 40mm with 2mm walls was coming in at just around £50 per metre in stainless or £30 galvanised mild steel.

Welding pre-galvanised steel is pretty horrible for fumes and can make you pretty ill (actually galv can make you feel ill in the short term, the hexavalent chromium fumes from stainless can make you properly ill in the long term). It also burns off all the protection where you’ve welded it – you can patch that with zinc paint on the outside but it doesnt really match the rest of the finish, especially as the glav weathers from silver to grey but the paint doesnt, but you can’t protect the insides of the tubes at those joints. It would be prettier and longer lasting to use plain mild steel and get the whole thing galvanised once completed so that all the hinges and fittings are all protected (theres a protocol to follow in terms of how you joint tubes is something is being hot dipped but easy enough to implement with what you have in mind) but that means your frame will be weather proof inside and out with no vulnerbility to corrosion at the joints. So long as you’ve got a galvanisers reasonably local to you its pretty cheap.

Don’t be tempted to use galv as a basis for something you intend to paint on ‘belt and braces’ approach- paint and powder coat doesnt key to galvanised surfaces properly and just peals off over time