Heads up for you all as this is something I had no idea about.

had an email from my employer questioning a payment to amazon prime on my work credit card. I assumed it was fraud but ‘just in case’ I checked against my own account. To my surprise it is my amazon account, but I haven’t ever used this work credit card on amazon.

Turns out I didn’t have to, the card I’d used 7 years ago and had expired (possibly 2 cards ago) has been stored in their system. When my current personal card expired and the payment was refused they dipped straight into the work card as the long number stays the same when it is reissued.

apparently it’s in the small print of amazon and the CC providers.

A sort of PSA, delete your expired cards.

To my surprise it is my amazon account, but I haven’t ever used this work credit card on amazon.

How come they had the details?

My cards have changed number every time they’ve been issued.

the Credit card providers send the updated details through to the retailers.

I’m sure there’s a perfectly logical explanation, but why would Amazon have your work CC details?

When my current personal card expired and the payment was refused

So can they can’t use your expired card and how come it was not  automatically updated?

Then again mine have never been automatically updated.

Not just Amazon, I had a travel insurance company using my 2+ years expired old debit card to automatically renew without any letter or e-mail. I wasn’t impressed with the company, or my bank, makes a mockery of having an expiry date.

We’ve had something similar. One of the oldies gives us their CC details when buying pressies for grandkids. Out of the blue they had an Amazon payment. We dug around a bit and found the main card used on the account had expired, so took the Prime monthly payment from the next card down on the list of stored ones. Bit naughty in my opinion, I’d rather they suspended the service and sent us an email to sort it.

It’s not just amazon, if you give your credit card details out for a recurring payment they can be used years after expiry. You authorise the use of your credit account not the specific credit card when you give the details to be used in the manner of amazon where you either have a recurring payment or a stored payment method which can be used with out re entering card details.

All the major credit card providers provide this update service totally legally. And it’s in the t&c’s.

Its something to watch and normally catches people out when they sign up to recurring payment contracts on CC’s then cancel the card to get out of them.

I had a credit card cancelled and replaced after I had some fraudulent payments on it. Then a month later, I had a charge from Netflix on the new card. Even though I had never used that card at all. So the bank must have supplied the new details to Netflix.

After phoning to complain again, they agreed to completely cancel the new card and close the account.

As said previously, the card schemes have services to allow merchants to update the card that they have stored when the card is re-issued by the card provider e.g. Visa

The idea is stop you having to tell your gym, your car insurance, your home insurance, Netflix etc every time your card expires. People get very upset when their house burns down and they find they’re not insured because the last payment was declined (yes, it really does happen).

Never rely on a card being cancelled or expiring to terminate a contract – always do it explicitly.

Apple Pay and Google Pay work in a similar way. The token (pseudo card) provisioned to your phone is associated with a real card. When the issuer re-issues a card due to expiry they send Visa/MasterCard a message telling them to associate the token to the new real card.

When my current personal card expired and the payment was refused

So can they can’t use your expired card and how come it was not  automatically updated?

No idea, presume the provider hadn’t updated them with my details on the card I normally use. Hence unde their conditions they can use a twice expired card that I used once 7 years ago.

Hence my surprise.

Also some advice here: https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/banking/recurring-payments/

The bank are legally obliged to cancel any recurring payment if you ask them to. And they have to refund any charges after you asked for it to be cancelled.

Kind of related – anyone seen the new law they’ve brought in in California? Hope this goes worldwide –

“http://www.niemanlab.org/2018/07/thanks-to-california-a-news-site-or-other-business-now-has-to-let-you-cancel-your-subscription-online/”

Summary – online subscriptions have to be cancellable online, they have to inform subscribers every time they take payment.. etc. Good stuff.

Amazon took payment for a Kindle subscription my wife took out (and immediately cancelled) on her account from my card, without my permission.

I had used it once on her account

when I called and asked for the two payments to be refunded and the subscription cancelled they wouldn’t deal with me, had to speak to the wife, even though it was my card

after 6 weeks of not being refunded I eventually had to raise it with my CC company who immediately sorted it

are these places setting up DD mandates on your cards for like a subscription service or something? If so I’d imagine a cancelled/expired card wouldn’t matter then. the DD mandate will be independent of your card number.

Any time I’ve ever had a new card the long number has always been different, just the last 2 numbers mind, but still different, any acounts like ebay or buying stuff from amazon the n can’t then take any money out, I need to store the new card. That’s just stored cards, as I say DD will be different, I think anyway.

Just guessing there though.

Google “vau visa” or “abu mastercard”.

Larger merchants will probably integrate into these systems, smaller merchants probably won’t.

You’re welcome 😊

Its not a direct debit. Direct debits are linked to a bank account, they won’t work with a credit card. Instead, it is a “Continuous payment authority”.

Direct debits are probably a better option if you are signing up for something. Because you can go onto your online banking, and see a list of all of the direct debits you have setup, then cancel them whenever you like.

But with a continuous payment authority, you have to phone up the shop or credit card company, and ask them to cancel it.

Also with a direct debit, the bank will send you a letter to confirm it has been setup. But if you sign up for a continuous payment authority, you might not realise until money goes out your account a month later.

ah right, cheers craig.