We have one in the garden, I was thinking of adding one around the side of the house for bike washing purposes. If I add copper pipe around the outside, it’ll be at risk of freezing, won’t it? Ok so we live in a pretty mild part of the country but taking the long view it can get cold from time to time.

Would lagging be enough to stop it freezing? Can you get flexible pipes that don’t split? Could I use a length of hose, given that I don’t trust Hozelock fittings to not leak a bit eventually?

Freezing isn’t an issue as long as you can isolate at source.

I wanted to be able to leave it on, to make bike washing as quick and easy as possible. Don’t fancy having to go back inside to turn it on.

Or.. hmm.. I could use a motorised CH valve and press a button to turn it on. Or I have it connected to the internet or a temperature sensor.

But then I’d have to route the pipes inside the house, which would be a ball-ache.

it’ll be at risk of freezing, won’t it?

Only if you leave water in it.

A stop valve inside the house, turn it off when it’s cold and open the outside taps and let them drain.

No water, no freeze, no problem.

Yes it will, but if you add an isolating valve where you put the T in to feed the new tap you will be able to switch it off [and open the tap to drain some of the water] if it’s going to get cold.

edit: Doh, Perchy’s fingers are quicker than mine.

Double edit: If you did it in plastic pipe it would be less susceptible to splitting

A stop valve inside the house, turn it off when it’s cold and open the outside taps and let them drain.

Faff innit. Would like to do away with faff. I want a jet-washing station where I can just roll up, turn on the washer and clean the bike.

edit: Doh, Perchy’s fingers are quicker than mine.

….and Nobeers are quicker than mine. A pattern emerges in the responses….

Are you saying I’m slow? 😥

Don’t fancy having to go back inside to turn it on.

You’d only need to switch it off inside if there was a risky of freezing. Anyway…. plastic pipe FTW.

Faff innit. Would like to do away with faff. I want a jet-washing station where I can just roll up, turn on the washer and clean the bike.

And for probably ten months of the year, that’s what you get.

For the other two months, It takes 5 seconds to turn an internal valve in your house, before your ride and another 5 to turn it off again afterwards.

Or 2 seconds to tap on the window and ask someone in the house to turn it on and off for you, which is invariably what I do.

Hardly faff.

Your hose will freeze up anyway so you couldnt just leave that outside and expect it to just work in sub freezing temps, so no less faff to turn off a tap indoors too while getting the hose back out on the rare occasions its actually sustained below freezing.

It takes 5 seconds to turn an internal valve in your house

I dunno.. I’m usually caked in mud, so I have to remove shoes, jacket, bib tights, go through to the kitchen, turn on tap which would have to be hidden somewhere, then put something else on and get my wellies from the garage cos it’s cold, then go back out and clean the bike.

That’s faff, in my book.

Your hose will freeze up anyway

Using it when frozen isn’t an issue – it’s so rarely cold enough that I’d manage. The issue is the risk of overnight freezing splitting the pipes then pissing water all over the place when it thaws.

Just get one of these and use a 2nd short hosepipe.

It takes 5 seconds to turn an internal valve in your house

I dunno.. I’m usually caked in mud, so I have to remove shoes, jacket, bib tights, go through to the kitchen, turn on tap which would have to be hidden somewhere, then put something else on and get my wellies from the garage cos it’s cold, then go back out and clean the bike.

That’s not what he said, turn on the tap before you go out on the bike, it’s hardly gonna freeze up over the time of the ride, given that you live on the south coast!.

Here you go

We have a house [admittedly in a pretty frost free location, but it has been known to freeze/snow] that has a standard plastic CH type hot and cold feed in the completely unheated garage – it’s never burst in >25 years.

I’m usually caked in mud, so I have to remove shoes, jacket, bib tights, go through to the kitchen, turn on tap which would have to be hidden somewhere, then put something else on and get my wellies from the garage cos it’s cold, then go back out and clean the bike.

Turn it on before you leave the house. Turn it back off after you re enter the house, having cleaned your bike.

If it’s so cold that the pipes will freeze in the time it takes to go for a bike ride during the day then it’s probably too cold to be out riding anyway.

Turn it on before you leave the house.

Not a bad idea but I’d forget 🙂

Sharkbait’s solution could be good. Presumably that stuff is flexible enough not to split. It says underground use only though.. wonder if that’s because of UV light? I could cover it with something other than earth.

Not a bad idea but I’d forget

As do I ….and that, my friend, is why I usually tap the window and ask one of the kids to do it.

It’s worth the miniscule effort to sleep soundly at night when it’s minus 15 outside knowing that the pipework cannot burst because it’s empty.

If you really want to make it easy, fit a Sure Stop valve.

http://www.surestop.co.uk/owners/

It says underground use only though..

It says ‘outdoor and underground’, its alkathene pipe, the stuff farmers use to get water supplies around their fields. It can still freeze though.

Seems the risk with freezing isn’t splitting the pipe, more like blowing the fittings off.

Not that this is being over-thought or anything……..but if it’s gonna be that much hassle to turn off/on an isolator every now & again, then just get a second hose to run round from your current tap….

Like this:

http://www.argos.co.uk/product/1478208

Yeah I have thought of the Hozelock option, but as I said they always seem to leak, wasting water. And occasionally blow off, wasting a LOT of water.

then just get a second hose to run round from your current tap….

I’ve already suggested that but using a y splitter at the original tap so the issues below don’t happen.

Yeah I have thought of the Hozelock option, but as I said they always seem to leak, wasting water. And occasionally blow off, wasting a LOT of water.

stumpy01 – Member

Not that this is being over-thought or anything……..but if it’s gonna be that much hassle to turn off/on an isolator every now & again, then just get a second hose to run round from your current tap….

I do exactly that with a splitter like Gary M suggested. Never had an issue with Hoselock fittings. Just turn the tap off when you finished with it rather than let the pressure build up against the Hoselock fittings?

The current tap is in the garden, inside the gate – I wanted one outside so I don’t have to go round and open the gate.

Never had an issue with Hoselock fittings

I have.

molgrips – Member

Yeah I have thought of the Hozelock option, but as I said they always seem to leak, wasting water. And occasionally blow off, wasting a LOT of water.

You’re doing something wrong then….
We’ve got an outside hose – it was quite a cheap one I can’t remember the brand…
In 6 years, using it for watering the garden, washing the car & washing the bike it has never blown off the tap. Not once. Once it’s on, it’s on…..you’d pull the barb fitting off the hose before you released the locking fastener from the tap itself.

It does drip but that is from the tap handle itself, not from the fitting – the tap is very old & needs a new washer. The amount of water lost is probably <1 cup of water in over an hour of car washing.

If you are that bothered about water loss, you shouldn’t be using a hose & ‘jet washing station’ to wash your bike. 2 buckets would save you a lot more water than worrying about the tiny leakage at the tap/hose union……..

you’d pull the barb fitting off the hose

That’s what’s happened, a few times. It also leaks slightly.

This thread has been de-railed somewhat. Question was about flexible piping, which seems to have been answered.

2 buckets would save you a lot more water

Don’t think so, but in any case the jetwasher saves a huge amount of time. And drippin water is 24/7 and a complete waste, it does nothing.

Don’t think so, but in any case the jetwasher saves a huge amount of time.

So you’re going to leave the jet washer plugged in?

Also if it’s freezing temps then washing your bike and creating a puddle that will turn to ice maybe isn’t the best idea.

Also if it’s freezing temps then washing your bike and creating a puddle that will turn to ice maybe isn’t the best idea

No, I’m not going to clean my bike in freezing weather. But the pipes have to be outside all the time even when I’m not cleaning my bike, and I don’t want them to burst if they freeze.

Seems like the MDPE pipe doesn’t split when it freezes.

molgrips – Member

Seems the risk with freezing isn’t splitting the pipe, more like blowing the fittings off.

I’ve definitely experienced that with plastic.
Chased the pipes back into the house, looking for means of isolation and there was none. Lazy plumber had T’d straight off the water tank in the loft!

Seems like the MDPE pipe doesn’t split when it freezes.

It does. The water supply to each pitch at the caravan site our van is on is fed by alkathene pipe, the supply to ours and another couple split mid December. All the pipes now have a ‘heat trace’ fitted to prevent freezing.

No, I’m not going to clean my bike in freezing weather

So why can’t you just isolate the supply then?

This thread has been de-railed somewhat

Can’t believe that happened on an STW Forum!! 😀

So why can’t you just isolate the supply then?

I explained it up there. I wanted to know if it’s possible to do it without the extra faff of isloating the supply.

You may not consider it a faff, but I do and I am considering my options.

You may not consider it a faff, but I do and I am considering my options.

Fair enough, I thought it would only be a faff if you were using it 🙂

Depending where the tap is could you run pipes indoors?

Or if you do need to isolate an outdoor section, you dont need to make it difficult like in the back of a cupboard. Extend the pipe to somewhere accessible indoors and put a ball valve isolation on it with an easy to turn handle, before then having it go outside.

It has occurred to me that I could maybe take the feed from the downstairs bog and through the understairs cupboard to near where it needs to be – then chase it through the wall for a short distance.

I wouldn’t bother isolating it in that case, I don’t think.

Perfect, just put an easily accessible isolation on it for if you do need to do that.