[Closed] Young babies on bikes

i've been researching stats for babies injured or killed in biking accidents whilst gaffa taped to the toptube.... so far i'm 120% certain that i'm right, there's no point trying to argue with me as i'm always right. here's a picture of a tube station. hang on? sorry got a bit carried away... no injuries or deaths from my gaffa tape method... i think you'll all find my way is safest. remember to hydrate though! you dont want your kid missing out on your rad skills because you havent drunk enough water to concentrate on those drops!

Phil seems to be suffering from STW delirium.

My son went into a Topeak Babysitter seat at three months. I rolled up towels to chocj him and hold his head in place. The bike fell over with him in it on one of the first rides and he was fine, the harness holding him in place. At five months he did his first cyclosportive which included the Col d'Aspin and at seven months 700km of cycletouring in a week. He usually fell asleep within a few minutes and didn't wake till hungry about three hours later. When awake he was as happy as could be.

TJ is a non-parent. He has seen other parents doing things before, therefore quotes that as a way forward for parents. He therefore has a point and it should be placed in order of merit along with his views on how to defuse bombs, his experiences with the Mars space program and his thoughts on Scotland.

That's a bit low, attack the argument, not the arguer.

I would imagine being jiggled around on a trip to the shops is somewhat less physically traumatic than the trip through the birth canal

Perhaps in a different way. But being born isn't exactly trivial is it?

If you see a baby left unattended in a bike seat, is it reasonable to ride off on the bike so that they don't get distressed?

Molgrips, that looks like the best solution. The only questions being, 1) do they come in my size and 2)Are you sure that tidy type won't mind?

However, agree with the more robust solutions here. I took my twins out from 3 weeks old, just gaffa taped one to my downtube and hung the other from the bars.

Peyote - I'm sorry you failed to see the humour in my post. However, knowing how my view on all things children changed when I became a parent, the underlying point still stands.

To add to the differrences between Amsterdam and the UK - can we define how much safer it is to travel by bicycle it is there anyway? I'd treat cycling differently if I lived there - with their greater respect for cycling, better infrastructure etc.

Sorry CM I am not sure I understand your question.. Is this what you Earth people call 'humour' ?

Sorry CM I am not sure I understand your question..

Which one?

That one.

difficult question to answer and no-one is 'right'

it all comes down to your own personal acceptance of risk & responsibility. Location/duration/equipment/consequence/likelihood are down to the parent and no-one else.

Personally I didn't consider riding with my sons until they were both able to sit unaided and had demonstrably strong necks. Even then it was only short visits, on quiet roads at quiet times.

My kids, my responsibility

Depends on the 'papoose' in question. Fabric wrap around front carrier - great. Some rucksacky types - perhaps not. I've seen some kids being majorly jiggled about like ragdolls in those Tomy front mounted ones

I did notice that the front ones that I have seen (including Baby Bjorn) specifically say don't use for cycling. Whether this is just a regulatory issue I don't know. My worry would be that if you crashed then the consequences are likely to be much more serious for the child with the weight of you behind it squishing it into the top tube or the door of a car. This is purely fear rather than statistically based but in this case I prefer to be cautious.

edit: just to add, when mine were young I used a trailer even in traffic as I noticed that cars gave the trailer a much wider berth than just a bike with a child seat and once you get used to it you can get through some quite small spaces

Peyote - I'm sorry you failed to see the humour in my post. However, knowing how my view on all things children changed when I became a parent, the underlying point still stands.

Ah. 😳 Didn't realise it was tongue in cheek!

Interestingly, my view on all things children didn't change drastically when I became a parent. Expecting another one along shortly so it may change then, but we'll see...

One of our baby slings says on the advice that came with it not to use it for downhill skiing. I think that advice is aimed at Scandinavians who perhaps use skiing as more of a mode of transport than the British!

Joe

I am by no means an adult and qualified to answer this properly, but my 3 cents are that I once saw a dad go up something steep with his baby on a seat on the back and tall over backwards landing on the baby. Not a good thing to watch!

We use one of those Baby Bjorn thingies and find it to be excellent. Little _mw's head is supported by a collar that comes all the way up to the top of her head - when she's bigger, it'll fold down and she'll be put in the other way around and look forwards. It is possible to get this collar tight enough that she can't move her head at all, not very comfortable I assume, but it gives an idea of how much support is offered. The minimum size of baby is 8lb, so we had to wait a couple of weeks for her to fatten up before using it, but I guess that for many kids that means it's suitable for use from birth.
Personally, I wouldn't cycle with her in it, but maybe that's a reflection on my riding ability, or lack therof!

I once saw a dad go up something steep with his baby on a seat on the back and tall over backwards landing on the baby.

No, you didn't. That never happens. People in the Netherlands ride with babies all the time, and there are still living Dutch babies. Impossible.

EDIT: actually wait - there isn't anything steep in the Netherlands is there?

My views are similar to BenMW. Don't have a baby yet but she was due on the 21st. I think I'd be too nervous with the papoose (and my missus wouldn't have allowed it anyway) to enjoy the ride much. She'll be walked about in the Babybjorn from fairly early on though. It's surely a personal decision and I'm looking forward to getting a trailer for off road. I'll be interested if my views change after the birth. I'm fairly relaxed about these sorts of things usually. I feel that TJ's experience is just as valid as other peoples BTW.

One thing I'd point out is that it could be safer than taking your baby in a car and no-one gives that a second thought

We do give it a second thought. We research our baby car seats carefully...

Anyway, where's postierich when you need him?

You've misunderstood me molgrips. I mean that people don't consider the risk of simply undertaking a car journey.

Hmm...

One thing I'd point out is that it could be safer than taking your baby in a car and no-one gives that a second thought

This is one of the things that makes me laugh. You will put a baby in a car seat and drive at 80 mph but not in the same seat in a bike trailer at 10 mph.

Postirich - is he not in jail for taking his baby out on his bike?

TJ, that's cos we are worrying about different things. My car has nice suspension to iron out shaking. Plus it's big enough not to get crushed beneath the wheels of another vehicle - monster trucks excepted.

But its not a rational approach to risk. In a car speeds thus momenteum are much higher. You are just accustomed to be thinking your car is safe and your bike is not despite the facts.

Here we go, off on a (pointless) tangent...

<fights urge to join in>

You are just accustomed to be thinking your car is safe and your bike is not despite the facts

I ride my bike a lot, I clearly don't think it's unsafe.

However I appreciate that towing a baby a few feet behind me below bumper-height is putting the baby in significantly more danger than I am high up riding the bike...

And btw the approach to risk IS plenty rational, what's different here is evaluation of criteria.

At 12 weeks old my son was cycling and hucking jumps. He thought he was' all that ' until he only came third in a local elite xc race. That put the little show off on his place.....

After that he was to ashamed to cycle, so used his croozer trailer from then onwards.....

DrP

A baby on my bike is definately unsafe...I just don't have the skillz

At 12 weeks old my son was cycling and hucking jumps. He thought he was' all that ' until he only came third in a local elite xc race. That put the little show off on his place..

yeah, that's right. My foetus pwned him that day!

However I appreciate that towing a baby a few feet behind me below bumper-height is putting the baby in significantly more danger than I am high up riding the bike...

If you take it on roads.

Oh one more (small) point abt trailers that I thought about while having my nap... the dust/dirt 'spray' issue. When using the trailer even with mud guards on your bike there may be dirt flecks which reach your little one even through the mesh of the front 'window.'
Might or might not be a problem in your mind.
However, ff the trailer has a rain cover you can pull this down over the front and the flecks cannot get in, tho then you may have over heating issues in the hot sun... so you'd need to double check air-circulation in the back and sides of any trailer is available.

-just trying to think of things not necessarily obvious to help you make your decision

If you take it on roads.

Which I don't, for the above reasons 🙂

[url= http://www.bakfiets-en-meer.nl/2011/04/11/bakfiets-touring-with-baby-and-toddler/ ]Some practical experience from the Netherlands 1[/url]

[url= http://www.bakfiets-en-meer.nl/2009/01/20/test-carrying-a-newborn-on-a-bike/ ]Some practical experience from the Netherlands 2[/url]

Oh one more (small) point abt trailers that I thought about while having my nap... the dust/dirt 'spray' issue. When using the trailer even with mud guards on your bike there may be dirt flecks which reach your little one even through the mesh of the front 'window.'

I find that on the road bike with full guards, it is fine, whether or not the window is open she doesn't get sprayed. On the mountain bike with just a crudguard type thing, you have to think about what you'll be riding through and close the rain window if there's going to be too much mud. Did a mountain bike ride in the rain a bit back and the amount of mud on the rain cover was shocking.

Joe

This is one of the things that makes me laugh. You will put a baby in a car seat and drive at 80 mph but not in the same seat in a bike trailer at 10 mph.

Though you're getting confused about different aspects of safety - vibrating young children and not supporting their necks properly has been proven to be harmful. Totally different thing to risk of serious injury or death in a car crash. Then again, I'm very much an advocate of taking kiddies about on bikes, but even if we are talking about replacing a car journey with a bike journey, by considered opinion is that the car is probably safer.

On the mud thing, I have sometimes brought my children home with splattered faces 😳

The Beamlet was offroad (albeit on smooth tracks) in her Chariot at the age of 3 months:

[url= http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3516/3758175930_0d644a77f5.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3516/3758175930_0d644a77f5.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/beamans3/3758175930/ ]IMG_9306[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/beamans3/ ]Mark and Kirsty Beaman[/url], on Flickr

Front cover was up in that picture but is now down for all trips before anyone starts.

She graduated from the baby bivvy (which doesn't secure the occupant at all) to the infant sling at 1 month old on which she was strapped in with he head supported so she was out on smooth trails behind the bike from that point onwards.

I find that on the road bike with full guards, it is fine

I use a Dew 700c hybrid with 40mm ish tyres on (forget what size, they are Schwalbe Marathons with a reflective strip on the side that makes them look like whitewalls 🙂 ) with full SKS guards, and there's still a bit of trail crud thrown up. I'm considering a grandad style mudflap 🙂

Beamers.. yep the infant sling is indeed ace. Never had the baby bivy.

This is one of the things that makes me laugh. You will put a baby in a car seat and drive at [u]80 mph[/u] but not in the same seat in a bike trailer at 10 mph.

70 mph please Jeremy, try and be a responsible road user.

Wow - loads of opinions STW collective thanks...! 😀

FWIW - we have a 'papoose' thingy - which she really doesn't like... however... she also has a baba-sling - which she loves.

She is only just over 9lbs now - and while her head/neck muscles are getting stronger, she certainly isn't stable.

I wouldn't get the baby seat on the back of the bike yet - and thinking about it... a large trailer would be too big for the camper.....

Definitely not doing anything other than very rural lanes - distances around 2 miles I guess....

So - possibly papoose/sling that supports her head - more googling required...!

On a different note, being 'new' to parenting... Mrs chalkstorm and I are gobsmacked at the amount of contradictory advice out there..... everyone has an opinion... and only a few have eyes open enough to realise that all kids are different - and what works for some may not work for others...

Again, appreciate your thoughts & comments.... 😉

We were fortunately in Canada whilst pregnant so splashing out on the complete list of accessories for the chariot (we drew the line at the cross country skis though) whilst expensive was as ludicrous as it would have been over here.

Plus the fact I was determined to limit the number of wheeled devices that we bought for transporting our nipper about.

The Beamlet loves the Chariot and now that she is talking cries "Faster Daddy, faster" when I take her out in it behind the bike.

Oh, and FWIW the Beamlet was doing 35mph plus (downhill on smooth roads devoid of traffic) from about 3 months onwards.

and thinking about it... a large trailer would be too big for the camper....

Chariots fold up pretty thin, so you might be surprised.

Re country lanes though - round by me they are pretty narrow and windy, and see some shocking driving. I'd say they were among the more dangerous roads to cycle on, some of them. Drivers come winging around the corners and only have a few m in which to stop.