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I've worked in global roles for 20 years, ranging from startups to global mega-corps. I always expect to be flexible, and expect flexibility in return. I'm currently working for a small growth stage company with headquarters in Texas, R&D in Israel, workforce spread across EMEA and AMER, and customers all over the world.
In that kind of environment if you can't adjust your days then you are toast. My day often looks like this:
6-8am Calls with customers in APAC (Australia/New Zealand/Singapore/Japan/India)
8-9am Chase the kids out the door, walk the dogs
9-10 Email, internal calls with EMEA team
10-11:30 Gym
11:30-3pm Do some work, eat a sandwich, talk to East Coast US
3-4 Kids home from school, chat with them, prep dinner
4-7 Do some work, talk with Central/West Coast US. (hopefully wife comes home at a decent time and gets dinner on)
Some days/weeks are busier than others. If I feel like I'm not doing enough I'll work longer, if I feel like I'm doing too much I'll take some time back. I might do some work over a weekend if I need to, likewise I'm taking Friday afternoon off to take the kids to a ski lesson. We are supposed to track time off (UK regulation) but I don't bother, I'm the only employee in the UK.
Most importantly - I've never stayed in a job I didn't enjoy or feel empowered to manage my own time.
Are these jobs six figures?
Do they advance society/environment?
If they are £30k a year jobs for supplying/shipping tat around the world then forget it.
I worked on site for 5years, ~3months at a time with a week's break, sometimes in nice locations more often in 3rd world shit holes.
I then bought a house with the money. I now work for beer money and have clocked off at 5pm sharp every day since.
So in summary I would tolerate some of these working conditions mentioned if financially it was worthwhile. I would have an end goal and be disciplined enough to not blow the salary on trinkets/shiny cars.
Personally speaking, I'd consider myself well paid. Whether or not what I do advances society or the environment is very subjective, since you asked the question I expect you'd think not.
Working on site for 3 months at a time and earning enough in 5 years to buy a house with the money I'm guessing you worked overseas and were compensated for those long hours and shitty conditions with lots of tax free money? Everything comes at a price and we each make the right decision for us.
My job fits pretty well with the life we choose to lead. If I had to tolerate conditions I'd leave and find something more enjoyable, regardless of the money. Likewise, if happiness for my family meant taking a lower paid job then I'd do it in a heartbeat and we'd adjust our lifestyle.
I did much the same as RNP. Which is why I'm 'ruined' for office jobs now. Email me with some bullshit questions at 1559? Nobody's going to die as I shut my computer down and give it not a second's thought until sometime around midmorning the next day.
RNP must be doing overtime I'm usually home at 3:30.
Yes it was overseas engineering blue collar work for a UK company so UK salary and tax. The pay was generous/good.
I was burnt out after five years and did miss a lot of social/family events. but it served a purpose and set us up financially.
The talk of being beholden to demands from 3 time zones sounds abhorrent to me and something that should be well remunerated but also something that would only have a short life span before taking the money and bailing out.
The amount of flexibility and consideration I give my employer is in direct proportion to the amount of flexibility and consideration they give me.
The current lot are pretty good, I try to be pretty good back.
I think a good position to be in is that your employer should mostly be thinking that they owe you one, ie they know that you've gone above and beyond for them, but don't take it for granted.
The talk of being beholden to demands from 3 time zones sounds abhorrent to me and something to me that should be well rewarded for but also something that would only have a short life span before taking the money and bailing out.
That's the thing, I'm not beholden to any of those 3 time zones. I do it because I enjoy talking with people from all over the world, learning different perspectives in both personal and work lives, and occasionally I get to travel and spend time with them in person which is pretty cool. I don't have to do any of the things I do at work, I choose to do them because I find it rewarding and meaningful - I am helping people to improve and grow their businesses, which in turn should improve their lives and those of their employees.
Coincidentally it also means that by breaking up my day I can remove some of the pressure that would otherwise come from both parents working "normal" jobs and having to get everything done either before or after 9-5. I realise I'm in a lucky situation, sometimes it takes a thread like this to remind me of that 🙂
I worked on site for 5years, ~3months at a time with a week’s break, sometimes in nice locations more often in 3rd world shit holes.<br style="box-sizing: border-box; --tw-translate-x: 0; --tw-translate-y: 0; --tw-rotate: 0; --tw-skew-x: 0; --tw-skew-y: 0; --tw-scale-x: 1; --tw-scale-y: 1; --tw-scroll-snap-strictness: proximity; --tw-ring-offset-width: 0px; --tw-ring-offset-color: #fff; --tw-ring-color: rgb(59 130 246 / 0.5); --tw-ring-offset-shadow: 0 0 #0000; --tw-ring-shadow: 0 0 #0000; --tw-shadow: 0 0 #0000; --tw-shadow-colored: 0 0 #0000; color: #000000; font-family: Roboto, 'Helvetica Neue', Arial, 'Noto Sans', sans-serif, -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Noto Color Emoji'; background-color: #eeeeee;" />I then bought a house with the money
Did this for 10 years. probably 10 years later than RNP so needed longer to buy the house - Gained alot of valuable experiance.
now i manage a team doing the same stuff in nicer places .... moneys not nearly as good when your not dealing with maleria/typhoid and corrupt officials.
Lot less stressful though and I've not had a gun pointed at me for while.
These days i have a lunch blocked out in my calendar and i drop the kids at nursery at 8. and eat tea with the family most nights/rarely travel. I do start ops dial ins at 7am and i get the odd 2am call when shits going south - the flip side is no one bothers me if my lunch run goes over time.
I do know folk that manage a team here and Singapore - I've never worked out how they can do both effectively. they are directly opposing demands and so must be chasing tail constantly.
One of my friends is pretty senior in a global IT mega-corp and was account manager for some blue chip client who had 8am sync up meetings every working day.
Unfortunately for him, he was 3 time zones away so that translated to 5am his time...and he was then expected to be available for the remainder of his working day to manage his local team in his local time zone.
Though I didn't feel too sorry for him as he's so well paid...he's still working for the same company but manages a team out in India so he's spent the last couple of months back and forth to India to attend a regular day long meeting. I thought that kind of business travel would have had the nail put in it's coffin by Covid but apparently not...
"I thought that kind of business travel would have had the nail put in it’s coffin by Covid but apparently not…"
My experience is that when things are going well Teams / Zoom is fine... when things aren't going well then you need to be seeing the whites in their eyes as it were. In person still has it's place for all the additional non-verbal / visual cues.
The common way I see this work in terms of work life balance is per a poster above, you drop the intensity and give yourself flexibility to have long lunches at the gym, do school runs etc, but with the payback that your work days are 11-12 hours from start to finish 4 days a week then a normal one on Friday due to there being fewer meetings.
he’s spent the last couple of months back and forth to India to attend a regular day long meeting
So no ESG strategy for that business then. I don’t know how this kind of thing can be justified in this day and age.
In the above post, if you’re off to the gym, going for a long lunch and doing the school runs your work day isn’t 12 hours.
I deliberately avoid sending mails in the evening even if I happen to be looking at the phone as again it creates the wrong impression.
The schedule email send function in recent Outlooks is great for not bothering people in the middle of the night OR appearing busy in the middle of the day when you're really at a cafe/rave/trail centre.