[Closed] WINTERS COMING!!!! SNOW!!!, new tryes on car 'All season'?

Hmmmmmmm

after watching this i think the only way to be sure in snow/ice/really sh*tty winter weather is to have a second set of dedicated 'winter' tyres on steel rims...

Mmmm, just settling into a comfy chair with a big mug of coffee.
Biscuit anyone?
8)

Last time I went to the garage for tyres I enquired about winter and all season tyres and they didn't know what I was talking about 🙄

I need new so will watch this thread

[url= http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/what-tyres-for-part-time-4x4-car ]done to death? yeah - by you, twice in the space of 20 minutes.[/url]

oops sorry mods/people can you delete this one... wtf??? need a new laptop aswell!

I bought some Chinese made "Goodride" winter tyres from our local tyre emporium last year - think they were £70 each fitted. I wasn't expecting much other than a swift snowy death, frankly....

Turned out they were great. Tamed the wheelspin in wet/slippy conditions (small light car with a tad too much oomph at times), were absolutely brilliant on roads covered with running water (remember last year?) and coped with icy/snowy roads way better than regular tyres have done (me and the wife both work across Derbyshire, including the higher colder bits)

Well worth the cost, not much wear after probably 7 months fitted (Nov-May), and currently sat in the garage waiting to be put back on, probably after the clocks change.

I'm sure other, better tyres are available, but I'm happy with those ones.

I had a set of Vredestein Quattrac 3's on the old car, granted not a full winter tyre, but i live in Gloucestershire i don't get full winters!!! At the time i was commuting to Chester weekly and did have to drive them in snow and whilst full winter tyres might have been better, they were fine. Certainly more usable than the tyres on the M3 trying to leave the services Oswestry way!!!

When the tyres on the new car wear out i will fit another set of vredesteins.

For the mileage i do it made little sense to get two sets, probably perish before they wore out!

Winter tyres make a remarkable difference IME

Slight tangent. Probably a daft question but on a FWD car can you get away with just a pair up front? Just thinking that I could keep 2 cars moving for the price of 4 tyres. I know it'll offer less grip on the lightly weighted end and possible induce oversteer more readily but if driven sensible surly it'll help with just getting traction.

as you say it has been done to death on here! I bought hankook 4 season tyres last winter and they do seem a fair better in snow, wet and cold, though the yaris they are on is pretty great in snow anyway. bit noisier in summer though.

If I really absolutely had to drive in snow without fail for a large proportion of the year I would buy proper winter tyres, but don't have to and don't have anywhere to store spare wheels. kwik fit have started doing summer/winter tyre storage in the european style I believe, if you can bear giving them any money.

I think if you are driving on sheet ice then you are in a bad situation whatever tyres you have fitted.

Second set of wheels here with proper Dunlop 4D winter tyres

Not driving like a fudd makes more difference than any tyre could ever make.

Nokians and Vredesteins are the ones I would choose. I am mad about tyres since I've used so many and can always tell the difference. I would only go full winters. If you're going for a different size tyre (smaller the better so long as it fits over your calipers and is very close to the original circumference) for cheapness, make sure those insurance folk know - they like to wriggle out of things even when you've been good and halved braking distances etc. I honestly don't understand why people think it's fine to drive around on summer tyres in cold weather and/or snow and then flash me as I'm zooming everywhere!

Just noticed a comment above - only get all four done or just don't bother - putting winters on the front and summers on the rear will be interesting - I've seen a car do a 180 when braking normally on snow!

And with winter tyres, I could drive as fast as I wanted in an RX-8 (so I guess like a fudd?) and have more traction than on mildly damp roads in the summer with Potenza RE040s.

Proper winters for winter

Decent summer tyre that can handle rain for summer.

Saying that I have Nokian WRG2 (now discontinued) which are an all-weather tyre rather than an 'all season'. They are 90-95% of the winter performance of a full winter tyre but were better than anything else out there when it came to slush and just normal uk rainy winters. Also very efficient and better ride quality that any other tyre I've used.

Makes sense to us now to always use winters in winter. One bump or missed day of work and that's the cost of tyres. If you have the car for at lea 3 years it only really costs you the price of the spare set of wheels to put them on.

I honestly don't understand why people think it's fine to drive around on summer tyres in cold weather and/or snow and then flash me as I'm zooming everywhere!

Ooooh I do, I do. See aforementioned fudd comment.

I have all season tires on my Multivan which came with the vehicle when we bought it. Compared with the winter tires on my old bus these seem like driving on summer tires in the snow. I'll be going back to two sets again once these wear out.

glupton1976 - Member
Not driving like a fudd makes more difference than any tyre could ever make.

Not sure that one is true!

Kingpin remoulds at pattern. Not that it helps you but thats what im on for this year
Y
Driving fast on winter tires on ice is not recomended - flashing you for good reason.

Reminds me of when i was decending a hill in low box not touching brakes - mr white audi flashing me and tooting me..... Went zoomingpast as soon as there was a space.

Bottom of the hill i found him parked on a banking - saw the skid marks from miles up the hill.

Drive to conditions. And in ice - when you figure out its time to slow down -'its too late

glupton - drive a car with decent winter tyres. If I want to do the speed limit because my tyres grip all day long and because I emptied my bank account to ensure that me and my family are safe then that's up to me. I'd rather be perceived as a fudd than actually be the fudd pussyfooting around at 20mph wondering what I'm going to slide into next.

So don't be a hero and think you can drive in any condition with whatever tyres, because you cannot.

Don't confuse so called 'all-season' tyres for pukka winter tyres - there's a huge difference between them.
I drive a big 4x4 (VW Touareg) which will go up pretty much anything in the snow on standard all-season tyres. The problem comes when you try to stop or steer the thing going down the other side 😯
I ran Vredestien winters last year and the grip you get when you stand on the brakes is remarkable. The look of confusion from other 4x4 drivers as you go off piste around the outside of their stuck car is priceless. (We had some pretty decent snow last year around Holmfirth/Huddersfield)
They're sat in the garage and will be going back on as soon as it gets frosty in the mornings. Ran them from early November to the end of April last year.

Ill repeat

Expensive winter tires or not - you will not grip on ice

My advice is to not drive like a fudd, and get winter tyres.

So don't be a hero and think you can drive in any condition with whatever tyres, because you cannot.

Don't be a hero and think you can defy the laws of physics...

only things that will work on ice are studs but they they are not exactly practical for the UK unless you know you will only drive on ice.

I found winter tyres will still make driving safer in ice as you seem to be able to regain traction that split second earlier and having 3 tyres with good grip in the cold and wet is useful when the 4th ends up on ice.

Have fun in the snow on winters but go back to pussy-footing around when it's icy.

I ran Vredestien winters last year and the grip you get when you stand on the brakes is remarkable.

[img] [/img]

once you have driven in winter on proper winter tyres the question is not should i use winter tyres, but why the hell wouldn't you. comical amounts of grip compared to everyone else.

using summer tyres in the snow is a bit like using slicks in the peeing rain. possible with extreme caution, but really not a good idea.

How often do you get the chance to drive on snow or ice that isn't slush full of grit? An hour/yr?

And do you trust the ability of other drivers, when it comes to them not driving into you, on snow and ice covered roads? I don't.

glupton that addressed at me? before we got winter tyres my wife and i couldnt get the cars off the drive and up the street to get to work whenever it snowed. generally happens twice a year, so 4 days wages which since we are contractors is significant. it's cheaper for us to have the winter tyres!
re the trust other drivers, no i don't, but i'm not sure of your point other than to say i was on the way to epping mtb'ing once on one of the minor roads which hadn't seen a gritter and had plenty of snow - eventually caught up with someone on a hill in an st focus who was sliding about all over the road. at one point he was sliding back down the hill towards me with all 4 wheels locked. i just reversed out of the way until he eventually hit the bank at the side of the road, and drove round him up the hill with no dramas at all.

i just reversed out of the way until he eventually hit the bank at the side of the road, and drove round him up the hill with no dramas at all.

Did you stop to help them? What would you have done if someone was behind you and you couldn't reverse out of the way?

couldnt get the cars off the drive and up the street

Did you try digging the car out? And what was it like getting back in once there'd been a bit of a thaw during the day and a refreeze as it got dark and you'd turned the snow to ice? 😀

How often do you get the chance to drive on snow or ice that isn't slush full of grit? An hour/yr?

Over the past three years, actually quite a bit during the two months a year my winter (not snow) tyres are fitted.

And do you trust the ability of other drivers, when it comes to them not driving into you, on snow and ice covered roads? I don't.

Not a lot I can do about that other than hide under the stairs.

I have had much use out of my winters and all seasons. Living in Scotland, and bearing in mind part of the advantage is in cold conditions, I have had weeks of proper use. New job, while not in the mountains anymore, does require travelling a fair bit all round Scotland.
Great value IMO.

I told the focus driver to try winter tyres because they make the road come alive

Glupton - you're clearly a bit of a tool, and obviously haven't tried proper tyres on winter roads.
Either that or you have god like car control combined with the ability to defy the laws of physics.

Winter tyres allow you to stop and steer when summer tyres will be sending you into the nearest hedge. And it [u]is[/u] remarkable how hard you can brake on untreated roads with a fresh covering of snow before the ABS kicks in. That doesn't mean you can drive like a Scandinavian rally driver, but it does mean you can get to work/drop the kids off/buy food without having to worry about getting back up the road to your house everytime there's a dusting of snow or hard frost. I don't get paid to sit at home every time we get a bit of snow, and it doesn't take many days wages before the tyres pay for themselves.

It also means when we do get some good snow I can get up into the hills and enjoy it, and there's no danger of bumping into dicks like you 😉

Roads like these are a lot easier with the right tyres

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Biscuits

Kettle's just boiled 😀

That wee block user tab that I have is coming in handy. 😀

Spoilsport

Did somebody say something? 😉

Winter tyres on Mrs GTI's Ibiza got me through snow like that pictured with no hassle at all - they're amazing.

Winter tyres (and M+S marked all season tyres) are brilliant. They should be a legal requirement, like they are in most of the rest of northern Europe.

Is this [i]the[/i] winter tyre thread for 2013/2014 then?

Most of my miles last winter were highland ones. Sensible driving + winter tyres is a good combination. I can't say I've ever felt the need to stop and consider "What would a surrey driving god do?" when i'm trying to get my car out of a road that hasn't been cleared at 6pm on a sunday night. In less harsh winter conditions when winter tyres aren't strictly necessary, they still perform better than my summers so it's a no brainer for me.

Winter tyres are compulsory where I live and if the police stop you and you don't have them on the car, you're fined. I have a complete set of alloys + tyres for my car which the garage keeps and swaps as needed.

I reckon I get 2 months of driving in winter when they're needed, snow, constant pretty low temps. Two winters ago we had a couple of months at -10 degrees C or lower where the snow never cleared. Obviously, though, the fact that pretty much everyone has them means you can be assured that a quick stop doesn't mean a load of summer tyred cars will be ploughing into you.

[b]peterfile[/b]
I can't say I've ever felt the need to stop and consider "What would a surrey driving god do?"

🙂

I could change god to deity and we'd avoid this issue altogether i suppose.

Not sure what i could change surrey to though which doesn't need capitals? "an area near the bottom of the country which has a disproportionately high number of demi deities and boutique razors"

winter round here means that all those without winter tires stick to the main roads into town - also means my route to work would take in north deeside road , north anderson drive and the haudagain

with winter tires on my 4x4 i can take the back roads direct route - slightly slower than normal mind you and not sit in traffic for 3 hours. (when the snows too deep to cycle) then i can also shoot up the ski centres without worry when the snows good

glupton1976 - Member

How often do you get the chance to drive on snow or ice that isn't slush full of grit? An hour/yr?

And do you trust the ability of other drivers, when it comes to them not driving into you, on snow and ice covered roads? I don't.

Glupton, you're either trolling or really not looked in to this.

It's not just about sbow and ice. Summer tyres dramatically reduce their ability to grip (wet or dry) below about 7-8 degrees. It is simply out of their designed temperaure opperating range. So yes winter tyres in winter (colder temperatures) give you significantly more grip whether wet/dry/frosty/snowy. Added to their significant more open tread pattern which disperses water quicker and allows them not to clog up with slush/snow.

I suggest you do some reading comparing stopping distance in circa zero degree tmperatures when using winter tyres against summer tyres.

Theres a lot of people on here who have a false sense of security for fitting winter tyres.

Peter that should be capitals for Surrey and God, if you can't manage two Capital letters then just for Surrey .....

Actually, it's only a capital G for god if you're talking about THE God. I'll not mention your 'Capital'. Or your five-dot ellipsis. (Whoops.)

If you're going to be a pedant, do it right! 😉

We just left the winter tyres on the car all year. It likely wears them out a bit faster but saves the hassle and cost of storing and fitting.

After many years of driving around Scotland in winter I'm kicking myself for not having tried them earlier, such is the improvement in traction and control.

I shall be enjoying my first winter in a rear wheel car, but have a set of winters already waiting for a change over. I've seen some pretty convincing video's of beemers/ rear wheel cars with winters vs 4x4's without trying to go up hills - would never have thought a beemer would outdo a 4x4 in that stake.

I've got a RWD car Sui and the difference is night and day.

Why is it that every year - normally more than once - we have so many otherwise intelligent people failing to grasp that winter tyres are for cold weather and not just snow?

MoreCashThanDash - Member

Why is it that every year - normally more than once - we have so many otherwise intelligent people failing to grasp that winter tyres are for cold weather and not just snow?

Because this is STW, and any motoring thread makes (relatively) normal people incapable of:

1. Reading any thread properly.
2. Reading the whole thread.
3. Using normal rational when deciding their view point.
4. Modifying their view point when presented with anyother (read wrong) view point.

and a few others I missed.

5. basic research before forming a view (rather than just going on their gut)

Why is it that every year - normally more than once - we have so many otherwise intelligent people failing to grasp that winter tyres are for cold weather and not just snow?

I dunno? Would it make sense to put just two winter tyres on the car at diagonally opposite corners to equalise the grip front and back? I know some people will point out it could lead to side to side discrepancies, but I'd have thought the diagonal thing would balance that out? Seems like a good way of getting increased grip without having to splash out on four tyres at once.

Left hand corner handling vs right hand corner handling as a start...

I have some winter tyres for sale if anyone's interested.

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/fs-nanking-snow-sk-2-winter-tyres

Would it make sense to put just two winter tyres on the car at diagonally opposite corners to equalise the grip front and back?

what could possibly go wrong?

[quote=BadlyWiredDog ]Would it make sense to put just two winter tyres on the car at diagonally opposite corners to equalise the grip front and back?
Don't be so daft.

Putting both on the same side would work much better 🙄

I run both summer and winter tyres on both my cars, one set on steelies and the other on a set 16 inch rims.

Currently running Michelin alpins and Goodyear ultra grip pro's

It's all about lateral grip and traction.

It's the best investment which can be made to the car.

Bwd - familliar with how differentials work ? If not go read up and then think about why diagonals might be. Bad idea 😉

From what I've read all season tyres seem to be a compromise. The main thing that stood out for me was that the summer tyres were much better braking in wet conditions than any others, and that winter tyres were definitely better in snow. Therefore given that we only suffer 4 snow days a year I think I'll stick with good quality summer tyres.

How many days of the year do you drive when the temperature is below 7C?

scotroutes - given that I commute to and from work in the dark from October to March, and my job takes me all over rural areas like the High Peak, I can be driving at less than 7C anytime from Thursday (looking at the forecast) through to May (thinking about this year)

Your driving requirements may be different of course.

MCTD - my point precisely. I'm trying to point out to Pieface that he, like so many other posters on this and similar threads, has misunderstood what winter tyres are for.

The main thing that stood out for me was that the summer tyres were much better braking in wet conditions than any others, and that winter tyres were definitely better in snow.

Incorrect.

Summer tyres are only better for braking in the wet when it's above 7 degrees (e.g. [i]summer[/i]).

Winter tyres are better are braking in the wet below 7 degrees, which covers all of winter and much of autumn/spring.

I'm not sure how people continue to argue otherwise for 50 pages every year.

[img] [/img]

Also... A premium winter tyre will out perform a cheap budget Far East summer rubber circle in the wet above 7'c.

Fact is, there's too many motorists in the uk who are happy to comprise safety for cost.

People who don't run or have never run winter tyres are the people who say they are not require.

The way I look at it is that, them 4 patches of rubber touching the ground is what holds the car to the road. So why would I put myself or family at risk?

What didn't come across clearly in my post was that all seasons seemed a bit of a duff deal. IMO you'd go for Winter and Summer tyres. However given my budget restrictions the summer tyres cover my requirements more.

What didn't come across clearly in my post was that all seasons seemed a bit of a duff deal. IMO you'd go for Winter and Summer tyres. However given my budget restrictions the summer tyres cover my requirements more.

Aye, sorry pieface, I didn't meant to have a dig at you personally, just more of a gripe at reading the same old arguments against cold weather tyres.

You're completely right, if you can only have one set of tyres, it has to be the one which is the best compromise for you, and summers will definitely win for many people (particularly those who don't live in more rural areas).

One thing I will say about budget though is that although you have to fork out for another set of tyres, your summers will last twice as long, so the rubber costs (almost) equalise. That said, the cost of steels/changing is obviously additional to just running summers all year round.

If I had to run one set of rubber, I would run a premium winter tyre all year round.

http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/Summer-VS-Winter-tyres-Warm-weather-performance.htm

Simple things- winter tyres can be worse than summer tyres in safety critical terms, but only when road conditions are at their best, which is when it matters least. Meanwhile they are better when road conditions are at their worst, when it matters most.

For me it was the incredible cheapness of used, decent condition winter tyres on wheels that made the decision for me, 4 barely worn snowproxes on (ugly as ****) alloys for barely more than I usually pay per corner. Sold. If you were paying RRP that'd be harder to justify.

I have all season Hankook Optimo 4s on my car and we have winter tyres all year round on my wife's car. I do 30k pa she does 6k pa.

When push comes to shove winters are a little better in snow but any sensible person drives with a bit of care in wintry weather.

I would whole heartedly recommend four season tyres, the Hankooks are great in snow, brilliant in the wet and very comfy AND hardwearing in summer.

I would echo jp-t853 above.
Our Touran has run Optimo S allround tyres for two sets / 45,000miles now. With out a doubt, in cold, wet conditions they are superb. Noticeably grippier and clear water quickly.
In snow they are *marginally* behind the full on winter tyres that the Yaris ran (Coopers and Hankook's) for the last three winters. Again, they are much better in cold and wet conditions compared to the (summer) low-rolling resistance Michelins my father had fitted before.
I do drive enough cold, wet days to justify the winter or all round tyres. The snow days are just a bonus. They stay on year round, and the Touran managed same miles on allround tyres as the previous summer Uniroyals.

If you could get a winter tyre with a decent efficiency rating (how accurate are these anyway?) I'd probably run them all year round.

More sipes and working edges = more grip = higher rolling resistance = slightly higher fuel consumption. I know I'd rather have the grip when it mattered than save a few quid on fuel.

If you could get a winter tyre with a decent efficiency rating (how accurate are these anyway?) I'd probably run them all year round.

My car is fairly thisty, but I only drop 2-4 mpg with the winters on. Some of that will be due to the cold weather anyway, but I suppose it will be balanced out by the fact i'm normally lighter with my right foot through the wetter months.

the optimo S are a good compromise - we had them on the golf - ground clearance stopped it long before the tires lost traction.

remember driving onto an unploughed carpark at the lecht to wait for the ski day to start- had a kip. while waiting a chaved up civic full of lads tried to do the same... only they drove on and instantly started to wheel spin - stuck half on the road and half off the road - used the golf to pull it off the road no sweat- lad was impressed and was off to buy some winter tires after that - seeminly they had had a few hairy moments on the way up - for me it was like driving on a damp day as oppose to a snowy day.

I run winters on the Van year round, I ran a BMW130i all last winter (RWD and 260+HP) on 17" Steels for that proper "Munich Taxi" look !!
We had lots of people that could not get off our estate for a week, I was up and down from Norfolk to Somerset and never had a problem in any conditions. Until you have driven on winter tyres in winter, you will not believe the difference in grip, stability and safety.
I sold the 130 and sold the winter wheels separately for what I paid for them 8000 miles earlier as they wouldn't fit the 5 series, so I have just brought a set of spare 18" wheels which will shortly be fitted with Conti Winter contacts for the late Autumn to spring period.

Total cost is about £800 with brand new premium winter tyres(£600), and they will last maybe 3 seasons and still be saleable for £350-400 at 4-5mm tread depth

Its a total no brainer, and I cant be doing with the hassle of sorting out a prang or taking time off work to dig the route out off the estate, which I wont get paid for.
I want my family to be safe driving around and know that they can get where they need to go and home again whatever the weather.