Haven't seen a thread on this one yet.
What do we think of
3.6 GW of turbines to be built there.
A thing I noted, this round of offshore is now meant to be lower cost to generate vs the wholesale cost.
All looks good to me
I think we are approaching ( and perhaps over in Scotland) where we do not need more wind power. Its all good tho that we have it as a part of the mix but FFS get the tidal flow on stream
Europe needs more windpower even if the UK produces enough for its own needs and being on the north west corner of Europe ideally situated to produce more. It could become a major export.
there is a plan for scotland to do exactly that via Norway which is going to build a load of pump storage. Still need tidal tho or something else for those pesky winter high pressure events or some form of storage thats high enough density
Scotland has something stupid like 1/3 of the EUs potential for wind and tidal
latest cfd round below market price https://renews.biz/55416/55gw-cfd3-jackpot-for-offshore-wind/
Have a listen to Radio 4s recent Costing The Earth. All about the Orkney turbines and the ways they are trying to work out ways to use the excess power. Big batteries, hydrogen storage. Interesting stuff.
the turbines are something else
Those things are engineering on a massive scale. Impressive simply for size.
I think you're right about exporting from wind power, the UK and Scotland have one of the best climates for wind power.
FFS get the tidal flow on stream
Problem is, nobody is biting. There aren't commercial units in any sort of meaningful development. Massive cost to install, very high maintenance. And the units that do exist are quite low yield (vs the amount of power in the wave itself). As a technology, I'm not sure tidal or wave is even where wind turbines were in the 1980s.
It's simply much easier and more cost effective to put a fan in the sky, or some PV panels on the ground.
Good investment return too. Lots of small funds covering a number of Windfarm sights and some direct investment in local communities paying a decent return on the build cost borrowing.
Also some Global Infrastructure/Clean Energy funds with a good return.
Wonder how long it's going to be before we're extracting too much energy out of the atmosphere?
It's definitely a thing - there's a finite amount of energy that can be mined out of wind before you start affecting global climate. (They should be called wind mines, rather than farms, because they extract rather than grow).
I'm all in favour, of course, but the only true renewable is solar.
Bring on the european supergrid 🙂
Wonder how long it’s going to be before we’re extracting too much energy out of the atmosphere?
A very very very long time. Wind farms are incredibly insignificant compared to the size of the globe.
Don't forget that you cannot destroy energy.... just convert it to another form - i.e. heat which goes back into the atmosphere to power more 'weather'.
The wind is also extracted at, for want of the scale of the thing, ground level.
But yeah, massive they certainly are, this test unit was knocked down near us recently, shame the nimbys won to get it shut down with support from the fake science community.
Wind turbines- I’m a big fan
That's good!
It would be a lot less windy if they switched all those big fans off.
Can they put solar panels on wind turbine blade? Given their scale now, surely it's feasible. It could supplement wind generated electricity during low wind speed days. They could create more glare I suppose so maybe better for offshore.
Can they put solar panels on wind turbine blade? Given their scale now, surely it’s feasible. It could supplement wind generated electricity during low wind speed days. They could create more glare I suppose so maybe better for offshore.
I remember reading about a reseach project ( MIT I think ) where they were trying to produce solar cells to fit in the edges of double glazing units ( or it might have been transparent solar panels )to effectively turn any double glazed window into a solar panel.
Seems like a great idea to me.
Just need a few hundred million to get going. Kickstarter?
You can get PV tiles these days. The government should force all new houses to have roofs made from these and have a power wall installed. Grants should be available for the rest. Home PV should be a no-brainier.
Spiffing opportunity for listening to some of Thomas’s magical music
Not really. In the south of England where you get a lot of decent light, yes but from about the Midlands and up the quality of light drops off dramatically. It also depends on whether the builder installs cheap crap or decent panels.
Further north wind makes more sense, I'd sooner see community wind farms. There are plenty other options to consider before solar as well, anaerobic digestion for heat and power being a main one.
If you want a "fun" maths challenge, calculate the torque produced by a turbine rotor whose blades produce 12MW at just 10 rpm......
(hint: it's a REALLY big number)
but FFS get the tidal flow on stream
Years away from commercial reality.
Have a read about open hydro, went spectacularly bust last year after burning up hundreds of millions of investment and funding.
Not really, meygen project in the pentlnad firth is grid connected and generating electricity. The problem for tide is that wind has become so cheap and govt expects them to compete on equal terms. However really we need diversity in supply and if one costs more it should still be considered.
Tidal range is a no-brainer from a generation perspective, just a shame the govt didn't listen to it's own experts review and support the Swansea project, although there were also unanswered questions about impact on fish
Wind energy is a form of solar energy
indeed, the atmosphere isn't a finite pool of kinetic energy, the sun's energy is what makes it all move
Ferrals - don't forget the access charges to the grid that means pentland firth tidal is uncompetitive
If the money wasted on hinckley had been spent on tidal flow in the pentland firth and the sound of islay hinckly would not be needed
Home PV should be a no-brainier.
Yes, but also maybe no.
Solar water heating is (IIRC) cheaper, no conversion involved, which means tap water no longer needs grid electric or gas to heat. From memory it's generally better value all round.
Having said that, I don't disagree. Every house has roof area that could and should be used more productively than simply to hang up a bunch of clay tiles that keep the rain out. PV certainly ticks that box and does something useful with the space.
FFS get the tidal flow on stream
But there are a number of technical, financial and ecological issues with tidal power.
I don't think we're anywhere near having enough wind power, unless we're about to massively slash our energy requirements by, say, wiping out 95% of the population. Which I hope we aren't about to do.
If the money wasted on hinckley had been spent on tidal flow in the pentland firth and the sound of islay hinckly would not be needed
Agreed the problems with tidal seem less than those associated with new build nuclear (or indeed old build nuclear decommissioning.).
Home PV should be a no-brainier.
Yes, but also maybe no.
Its not necessarily viable for existing homes depending upon roof construction and direction but what annoys me with all the vast amount of new build homes going up in the area I live is that the same old design of homes is still going up with no consideration to orientating homes to optimise solar and design of the homes to maximise the roof area for solar panels.
Solar water heating is (IIRC) cheaper, no conversion involved, which means tap water no longer needs grid electric or gas to heat. From memory it’s generally better value all round.
Not really. Solar water is a one-trick pony - heats water and that's it. In the winter it's not brilliant and in the summer there's excess heat to dissipate which means extra hardware required... plus the fact that you've got a [another] liquid system up in your roofspace isn't ideal.
PV will heat your water/air/floor, make your lights shine, power your fridge, etc. It's easier to handle, won't spring a leak and excess power can be exported to the grid.
At our other place the PV heats the water and once that's up to max temp it sends the spare generation to a dedicated heater to warm the air. In the summer this heater is switched off so the spare power goes towards the electric underfloor in the bathroom or just exported to make a little extra cash.
Overall it's better than solar water.
Its not necessarily viable for existing homes depending upon roof construction and direction
Really? We've got two PV installations. One on a traditionally roofed stable block that faces E/W and the other on a more modern truss roof facing South.
No issues installing either and the E/W facing roof produces very well as it generates power for a longer part of the day than a S facing roof - especially during the 8 biggest production months (in the summer it starts at about 5am and finished at about 9pm).
Shading from trees and other buildings is an issue though.
The problem with wind is you must have a reserve of other sources. almost certainly fossil fuel ( nuclear is hard to turn on and off by my understanding) Have too high a % of wind and then in a winter high pressure event then you need to be able to generate that amount of electricity from other sources PV wil not do as the sun is too low and its dark for too many hours.
This is why I am so adamant about flow tidal ( which is running on small scale and is ready to be scaled up) Flow tidal in those two locations gives a nice smooth baseload winter and summer ( smoothed by pump storage - the tides are 4 hrs apart)
The main block is that the access charges to the grid make it uneconomical and that westminster does not want it
Being energy self sufficient is the definition of Taking Back Control.
It should be the first objective of any government.
Aproximately, 12,740 Nm for a 2MW Turbine / generator.
this test unit was knocked down near us recently, shame the nimbys won to get it shut down with support from the fake science community
Looking at the way the blades crushed into [glassfibre?] dust on impact the nimbys may have created a pollution problem.
You may well be right about the blades however it had to be demolished as there was seemingly a risk attached to manual dismantling, possibly due to a rotor flaw.
https://en.wind-turbine-models.com/turbines/595-mitsubishi-mwt-sea-angel
hinckley
You keep mentioning this but for the life of me I can't find any reference to major energy projects in Leicestershire.
What was that app that showed how our energy was generated?
Its all somewhere far away down south squirelking. sounds the same, long way away.
More fun maths, the g-force at the end of a blade...
54m blade doing 12rpm, something like 28g
The problem with wind is you must have a reserve of other sources.
That's true of any source.
Did anyone else find the youtube clip of the turbine coming down very sad?
Did anyone else find the youtube clip of the turbine coming down very sad?
Aside from it being a waste in the sense it could have run on it actually fulfilled its purpose. It was only ever a land test rig and about half the power of the proper ones they stick out at sea. They never actually put that version into production either. They are salvaging as much as possible from the wreckage, I imagine it will have more usable parts than the one down the road that melted itself when the brakes failed in a storm a few years back.
It is getting weird around that area though, first the elevators disappeared from the railhead and now both turbines are gone. With the aforementioned NIMBYs protesting against any and all industrial development its looking like a bleak future for the area. Just another failed seaside town in waiting...
TJ you are teh worstest! 😉