My misses has dropped a clanger - she's run up £25k on her personal credit cards. With little to show for it!!! She's now in a position where she's struggling to pay the monthly amounts and pay her bit into the family account. She's tried to consolidate the cards but has been refused. She's now asking if we can add the £25k to the joint mortgage and she'll pay the extra between what we're paying now and what the new amount will be.
I'm in a quandry. We've been going through marriage counselling so we're not that solid. If we transfer the debt to 'us' then it's not 'hers' any more. Do I 'let her stew in her own juices', do the honourable thing or is there an alternative?
Any advice would be great to get my head straight!
Cheers,
Stuart
Absolutely roll the debts into your mortgage, and do it right now, don't delay, her debts are eating your money.
Get her to agree to have only a debit card once the other cards are cleared.
"Stewing in her own juices" is eating your money. Don't feed the card companies. Just make sure it can't happen again.
If you don't "help her out" your relationship is over. Full stop.
If you split, she can force you to sell the house, or buy her out.
She'll then pay off her debts, and you'll have no home or equity yourself, shared or otherwise.
If your not as stable as you say keep the debt in her name, reduce her contribution to the household if you want to help out, but don't put your name to it,
25K is a lot with nothing to show for it 😯 it points towards larger issues I reckon..
£25k with nothing to show for it?!
The fact that she's done this shows your relationship is on rocky ground. Think carefully before taking on a debt that she might leave you with!
Not a good situation - I've been there - take care!
I think this would constitute "unreasonable behaviour".
I wouldn't be so keen to roll the debts into the mortgage unless you're very sure that:
a) the underlying emotional / behavioural problem is resolved (her spending)
b) the marriage will last
Otherwise you could end up with a £25k larger mortgage and another £25k of debt on cards in a years time; or divorced and paying off an extra £12.5 of debt you didn't accrue as well as loosing the house etc.....
Khani +1. We obviously don't know the woman, but as you've asked, I'd wonder about the long term future if my wife managed to spend 25k and I didn't have a clue. And if you do bail her out, how do you know that she can change?. If there is no kids involved, I'd consider the stewing option very seriously.
People with emotional / behavioural problems eg comfort eating / spending etc can't just stop doing it. They normally need a lot of help and therapy and slowly get better (or not). There's no quick fix to the spending issue.
£25k is a lot of coke....
This happened to a friend of my wife. Her bloke ran up £25k of debt and she took out a loan in her name to pay off the credit cards only to find out a year later that the **** had been seeing other women (and some of the credit card charges were for hotel rooms and gifts).
They split up and she was left with the debt.
Not saying that is the same as your situation but be careful.
The honourable thing would be to offer to pay for counselling for her spending problem, she has to help herself get better.
If she makes good progress, eg in a year or so, you could then offer to shoulder some of the debt burden.
The best situation, in the short term, would to to leave her so she can't get any more credit, as if she can, she will and will just increase the debts.
The underlying problem is a mental health issue, which has to be resolved first.
Seek out some debt counselling help asap, sounds like there may be other issues - £25k is a huge amount to just spend.
If Mrs Cat had run up £25k I'd be getting quotes for a new patio!!!
I'd only do it if she doesn't have any more credit cards now.
Are they all destroyed?
Do you really want to save the relationship?
What's she spent it on? Clothes and handbags? Or [i]other things[/i] ...
Surely there is only 'us' in a marriage? Perhaps the concepts of 'hers' and 'mine' are the root of the problem?
Its times like this that i'm glad we dont have separate money and account is therefore transparent, having said that my wife doesn't work and so couldn't contribute financially even if she wanted to. but i must say spending that amount without you noticing seems like a pretty rocky relationship and not open and honest. I'd question whether you will stay together before i got myself into more debt, if you are not 100% then i would probably look for her to take the loading on her half of the house equity ie get it in writing that you own technically more than half the house!. I'm pretty sure there is a legal way of doing this which should at least protect you from her debts!
Surely there is only 'us' in a marriage? Perhaps the concepts of 'hers' and 'mine' are the root of the problem?
I quite agree, and a partnership isn't all about money, but if one of the partners is running up huge debts one sided on things just for them, then you have to look out for yourself..
Thanks for all the comments.
We have one child and communication is our real problem. I reckon if we can communicate better we'll be ok.
£25k is a huge amount and she wishes she had a shiny car in the drive to show for it. My wife struggles with emotional issue and has secretly been going to cognitative behavioural therapy. She struggles with her weight. I think all the money has been spent in Starbucks, M&S and on cocktails.
I'm a saver. I would struggle to buy myself a new hack bike! It's left me flabbergasted.
p.s. sorry for trying to get around the swear filter in the original post!
Stuart
i wouldn't jump to the assumption that running up 25k in debt is a mental health problem.... if somebodies struggling to pay stuff off and keeps moving debt from card to card, incurring overdraft fees, late payment fees etc, it can spiral quite quickly... doesn't mean its definitely a mental health problem.
EDIT - explanation post posted 7 seconds before me!
Divorce is quite cheap, certainly cheaper then the interest on 25k.
Boot her.
My wife struggles with emotional issue and has secretly been going to cognitative behavioural therapy. She struggles with her weight.
I think this is the real issue which needs sorting.
rajboab - Member
She struggles with her weight. I think all the money has been spent in Starbucks, M&S and on cocktails.
Are these linked? Sorry, could resist.
Well if she's sneaking off to therapy and you've no clue she's spent £25k, you clearly have a communication problem. Do you even live in the same house?!
I can't add anything helpful so I'll bugger off.
if somebodies struggling to pay stuff off and keeps moving debt from card to card, incurring overdraft fees, late payment fees etc, it can spiral quite quickly...
That is a symptom of the debt.
The root cause for most of these situations is low self esteem and coping mechanisms of comfort spending.
Very similar to a lot of over weight people who get stuck in the trap of comfort eating because they feel fat which makes them fatter which lowers their self esteem even more, so they comfort eat more etc.
For richer, for poorer.
Really happy to help you. I won't discuss it on here. email me if you want correct advice.
email in profile
It sounds like she is communicating now, must of taken some nerve on her part to admit to this debt after years of hiding it. Roll the debt onto the mortgage, and cut up the cards, if a) you love her, b) you still want to be together, and c) you don't think she will run off as soon as the cards are clear.
Get her to contact Stepchange.
Www.stepchange.org
They will give free advice on managing debt and the best options available to her/you.
They will also deal with the credit card companies on your behalf if you want them to.
Yes, add it onto the mortgage - but, and I say this constructively as a word of caution, please make sure that you have a written agreement that it affects your respective shares in any equity in the house, as you never know what might happen in the future.
Dont know if this helps but was in a simlar situation.
The wifes ex was paying for a debt they had after they split up, till we got married and bought our house. He then stopped paying and the company came after our house for payment for previous debt.
She couldnt get a loan to cover it so i had to sign it onto our house. Ididnt want to its not my debt. but it was made clear one way or the other the only colateral was the house and they were getting their money.
She pays the difference but leaves her with little for herself so i cover everything else. Wich causes alot of arguments when the tight months come along.
Dont know the long term damage but it deffinantly drove a big wedge between us.
If you arnt getting along, the long term drag of it all will wreck what you have now.
Maybe time to sell up, clear debts, walk away.
I would help with debt counselling but their is no way i would put it onto the mortgage. Your wiife will not have learned anything as you have bailed her out,as with any addiction quick fixes don't work.
get her the best help you can now,
personally id suck the debt into the mortgage and make sure she only has a debit card from now on
my aunt had similar spending issues, symptoms of mental health problems that took years to uncover, exposing abuse as a child (not saying thats the case here!) shes in and out of institutions now and my uncle and cousins have been left devastated by her actions
Why all the enthusiasm for remortgaging incorporating the additional 25k?
is there equity, are there any prearranged agreements, how much longer on the mortgage, how much deposit was put down.
Could be really bad to incorporate this debt into the mortgage
has she thought about getting a trust deed (scotland) or an Individual Voluntary Arrangement (england and wales)to handle the debt. CAB should be able to advise
I wouldn't consolodate, that will just extend your problems
The root cause for most of these situations is low self esteem and coping mechanisms of comfort spending.
Dunno about 'most' but it's certainly not all.
I ran up 10k on cards a few years ago, which I'm now very close to clearing completely. On the whole, I don't believe I have mental issues (beyond the well documented ones). It's startlingly easy to do.
Holidays, little treats when I've had a shit week, emergency funds to cover disasters, buffer when out of work, work expenses going out on the card and back in to my bank account, baling (now-ex) partners out of the crap when they can't make ends meet, etc etc; even with ten quid here and twenty quid there it racks up surprisingly fast. If your balance is increasing each month, even slightly, it's a slippery slope. Then, woe betide if you get into trouble and start missing payments, it starts to snowball [i]really[/i] fast.
Credit cards are evil, it's too easy to view it as free money. We've got into a culture where we demand things [i]right now,[/i] and so long as you keep up the minimum repayments (all the interest plus about 20p off your actual debt) the card companies are happy to sit there counting the money, increasing your limit unsolicited if you start to approach the bottom. "Oh, it's ok, I'll just put it on the card." Too easy.
I don't envy your decision. Personally, I think I'd be loathe to tie finances together when there's a question mark hanging over the relationship. You need to address that first IMHO; once you're strong as a unit, [i]then[/i] look at joint finances. There's also the possibility that being in an unsatisfying relationship is in part causal.
If she hasn't already, she needs to talk to the bank. My experience (with HSBC) was that they were massively helpful if you communicated with them properly and complete bastards if you didn't. Might also be worth getting professional financial advice; might cost but will be cheaper than making a bad decision.
And, 25 grand at Starbucks? Get a coffee machine.
has she got a canoe?
End it, there are better people to be married to. Its not like she is the only woman on the planet. Life is short as it is, so dont put up with any crap, move on.
Offer the CC companies a full and final settlement of £8K for the debt.
If you get into negotiations with the CC companies they will often take a fraction of the total bill to resolve it. Debt resolution specialists can help with this but will usually charge a fee (which is often rolled into the debt).
End it, there are better people to be married to. Its not like she is the only woman on the planet. Life is short as it is, so dont put up with any crap, move on.
Not sure I agree at all, he chose to marry this woman, he can't just walk away over what is (in the grand scheme of things) a relatively small debt.
Your wiife will not have learned anything as you have bailed her out,as with any addiction quick fixes don't work.
Anecdotally,
A friend's sister married a wrong 'un. He hemorrhaged money on dodgy deals and god knows what, maxed out all their credit on ephemeral crap. Got to the point where the house was at risk.
My mate isn't short of a bob or two, so he baled them out. Wiped out the credit card debts, covered the mortgage shortfall, got them back on their feet.
First thing the husband did was go out and buy a huge TV on the now empty credit card.
He's baled them out like this two or three times now, and history repeats itself. I think he finally put his foot down, though.
I'd go for one of 2 options:
Option A would be to increase the mortgage but make sure that the increase is her liability if you split/comes out of her share of the equity. It shouldn't be that difficult to set up a legally binding agreement.
Option B would be if you think you can make things work; then reduce the amount she puts into the joint account/mortgage so that she has more money available to pay off the debts - the usual thing of paying off the most expensive debt first, as it's better for both of you that way.
Agree with Stevie750. I know someone in a similar situation but with 10 times that debt. Once the Trust Deed is set up you could be looking at a substantially reduced sum to pay back but you need to get advice from CAB or a reputable compay who manage Trust Deeds.
This is a familiar story to me a very close friend had something very similar.
He bailed her out three times to the tune of over a hundred grand. All ended in divorce.
I would check all the statements to confirm you are not being lied to as drugs could well be involved if alcohol is. If you are happy with what you see and can get the 25k ported over then do it as it's your money paying off the cards but make sure any payoff comes out of her half of the equity..
Obviously no more cards for the missus and you will need to check this regularly especially if she lied to you once. Chances are she will use the pay off to increase her credit limits, take a number of internet serviced cards (no paper trail or statement letters) and smash up the credit again.
It's a knotty one. If it were me I'd hoof her and go for custody to boot.
only you know how your relationship is..... if it were me, I'd tell her to sling her hook. If you do split the equity if you divorce and the house is sold it's better for you if you don't lump the debt on the mortgage.
Also, do you really want to be married to someone who ran up this much debt and kept it a secret? no bones about it, this is deceit.
