[Closed] why are SUV's so much more popular than estates ?

Someone I know bought a range rover sport because he had just totalled his Jag XK by aquaplaning over a huge puddle on the motorway at 80mph+ and bouncing both ends off the crash barrier.

"It's much safer, its' a 4x4" he said.

I didn't have the heart to tell him that it would have aquaplaned just as well as his Jag in the same situation but at approaching 3 tonnes it would just have made a bigger dent in the crash barrier.

'It's much better in the snow" he said.

I didn't have the heart to tell him he may well have better traction in the snow on summer tyres, but as soon as he braked in ice or snow it would just be a nearly 3 tonne brick and hit whatever it was going to harder.

Oh., and it hasn't snowed since he bought it

However he is happy, so I keep quiet

Like, for instance, trying to park and drive something the size of a bus in a built-up area.

Apparently the only people who think SUVs are large status symbols are the ones who hate them!

We have an SUV thing, Kia Sportage, as the wife's company car (she works for Kia). It's also Kia's best selling model. I love the driving position and genetally prefer driving them to Estates. Economy is worse than an estate, but we don't do enough personal miles to really care about that. Next company car will also be a Sportage, the 2016 model (new company car every 4 months).

Konabunny, have you looked at an Audi Q7 recently?

You may be correct about things like Q3, Yeti, BMW X1 but Range Rovers, said Q7, Volvo XC 90 etc, the ones that actually have 7 seats etc are very wide and it is the width as much as anything that causes space issues on our narrow roads. I have a large estate but it is 160 mm narrower than a range rover and 80mm narrower than an X3

"Most SUVs"

Apparently the only people who think SUVs are large status symbols are the ones who hate them!

[url= http://www.macanownersclub.co.uk/forum/white-diesel-collected_topic490_page1.html ]Yes clearly that must be the case ;)[/url]

Ah, SUVs are for carrying SUV-buggies

And my offspring which are more important than anyone else's so need more space.

You're getting it now.

I like them personally. Makes it much easier to spot the fannies on the road

Wife just got a Peugeot 3008, her choice, she's happy so i'm happy.

Personally, i lean towards fast estates, Octavia VRS, S4 that kind of thing. I think now if you want to stand out, don't buy an SUV

If someone made a big estate that was as wide as an sub across the back they would sell loads. I was looking for a big 4x4 estate and was really struggling to find something that will swallow 3 child's seats across the back row. I don't like Audi or bmw (nor can I afford one), Subaru levorgand outback is too narrow, Honda don't make the accord anymore (not 4x4 I know), Skoda suburb is OK loads of legroom but not very wide. I can't stand people carrier type things, so I ended up leasing a. 7 seat X trail. I don't like it, but if meets my needs for the next couple of years until the eldest is out of his car seat and I can go back to normal estates.

In summary I blame car seats.

It's simple, they are way easier to load stuff in & out of..

After years of driving low slung estate cars I switched to an SUV about 5 years ago - probably never go back to a normal car, they are so much easier to use.

I don't get that hate, perhaps its just inverse snobbery & jealousy...

Yep, ease of use ain't it. We got our kuga when my lad was a couple of months old. We tested plenty of cars and picked the one that was easy to lug the child seat/cot in and out of. Decent boot with a flat floor and no lip, my wife feels safe in it and likes the raised seating, it's very comfortable on long journeys and being 4x4 is great in the snow which is helpful as the council can't be bothered gritting as far as our house. Not a great load of fun to drive but certainly not bad. Neutral would be a good description.

I fancy an estate when we change but it'll have to go some to be as practical.

I have a 3 series [s]estate[/s] touring, and my wife has a Freelander. The Freelander is bit more serious and capable than your average 'Softroader' but its not a million miles different. Whilst I love the 3 series and would always choose an estate over an SUV personally, the Freelander is a different beast and I can see why people like them. It feels different to drive, the driving position is more upright, it's easier to get in and out. I like it 🙂

So whilst I personally agree with the OP, I can understand why some people have a different opinion.

Marketing. Create a new car category and market it heavily until everyone realises they need it. Now you have created the new normal.

If you take a step back, it makes no sense to create bigger, heavier, less efficient cars for the modern UK urban environment (I know a few people have a pressing need to plough through snow drifts and drive across muddy fields in the country, but most of us simply don't need to do that).

Less efficient? CO2 emissions on Ben's Smart Forfour are 16% to 45% higher than those on the 1.5l diesel Renault Kadjar, a classic ****y softroader suv.

I've literally never seen or heard of one of those Renaults. Guessing you cherry-picked it as a particularly fuel-efficient example. Bulkier, heavier vehicles are in general less fuel-efficient - amazingly. SUVs tend to be bulkier and heavier than non-SUVs.

Never mind the fact that roads/parking spaces etc in most bits of the U.K. Just aren't big enough to accommodate them well.

Car choice is more about status and desired image than most things we buy. SUVs and the like are British-Keeping-Up-With-The-Jones on stilts...

When they first came through in the 90's there was a lot of resistance as on crowded and narrow UK roads and car parks they were clearly excessive and anti-social from their sheer size and physical presence. The dislike of them isn't jealousy or anything new - it's a pretty reasonable assessment IMO given the detrimental impact they have on the community, and at a time when we're poisoning our air (9,000 early deaths from pollution in London each year from traffic) and generally killing the planet... they're a pretty good sign that you don't think much about the impact of your behaviour on other people...

I'd like to see a study about the psychological effect of isolating yourself from the outside world in such a well-protected vehicle and the impact on empathy and concern for others... their sheer size makes it much easier to feel detached, invincible and likely to bring out the bully in most people

It's hard to think you're superior to everyone else in a Renault Twingo!

I'd like to see a study about the psychological effect of isolating yourself from the outside world in such a well-protected vehicle and the impact on empathy and concern for others... their sheer size makes it much easier to feel detached, invincible and likely to bring out the bully in most people

I'd say that there is some truth to this yes. More frequently than coincidental on road rides round here then the people we have trouble with are driving some form of flashy SUV or 4x4. Often it's as simple as an inappropriately close pass, on a couple of occasions it's been abuse hurled and deliberate blocking of the road, intimidation from behind or a cutting up.

That's not to say we're perfect cyclists - we're not. I'd like to think that the close passing is just a size thing, the fact that SUV's are generally wider/higher than some other cars. Sadly I thing it's more down to the type of people who drive these things who seem to fall into one of two camps:

It's either the 'look at me' and full of self importance and status brigade. Funnily enough these are usually not people of high status but often school mums competing to get one over on each other or frustrated short, small, older men with an angry temper. Or it's the people who are just bad drivers, they feel unsafe so they buy a big SUV because it makes them feel more protected on the busy road.

The practicality excuse is bobbins. Most family hatchbacks have more room inside than your average 'fashion' SUV. We brought our kid up during her early years in a 3 door VW Lupo. No problem getting her in and out of the car even with no rear doors and I'm so glad we didn't waste £30k on an SUV just to make this task a little easier!

I've literally never seen or heard of one of those Renaults. Guessing you cherry-picked it as a particularly fuel-efficient example.

The Kadjar is an X trail underneath, same engines and transmissions.

Being tall, I find it easier to put the kids in their seats in an SUV rather than bending down to put them into an estate type car. I like being higher up. I don't think it handles badly, it accelerates and does the speeds allowed on the roads I drive on. It's easy to load stuff into the boot (again, I don't need to bend down too much). Works for me.

Off roaders notwithstanding, for most uses an estate would be fine, of more likely a hatchback would work just as well. Either of which would be more economical. Choosing an SUV shows that you really couldn't care less about the world's problems, and you think slight convenience for you is more important.

^^^ hahahah this guy

Having owned and driven both SUV and estates, I prefer the lower sill of the estate for loading and unloading heavier stuff. Primary requisite being the boot floor is level with the sill.

There are of course other ways to say it...

It does also come down to what's available. I needed to replace a Forester. I need 4 wheel drive (really) and an estate would be fine, but the new Forester is more SUV then estate, so I had limited option.
I didn't choose an SUV, that was all that was available.

I guess its signs of modern times that people use their babies as the prime excuse for choosing their family cars. My parents brought me and my brother up in an Austin Mini and they certainly were not held back, somehow managing to ferry us all over the country on family holidays with a couple of week's worth of stuff. But these days it seems necessary to have a very specific car just to manage your kids for a couple of years while they're in a proper baby seats. I've fallen foul to the marketing chaps as I took the plunge with an SMax, but it has proved itself in a second life as a very effective MTB mule, being able to easily swallow 4 MTB's with nothing but their front wheels removed and 4 burly MTB'ers and all their gear for a long weekend of mountain biking, so my decision has been vindicated.

I'm a very average 5'9" and simply cannot believe claims that taller 4x4's are more convenient. Those claiming this must be taller than me. At my height I have to climb up into a big 4x4 like a Toureg to get into the cabin - not very convenient at all, and would have to lift a baby seat up quite hight to raise it up to the required level and then lean into the car to get their seats in - not a very ergonomically good posture to be in. And similarly the height of the boot with a big 4x4 means having to lift heavy shopping bags much higher to get them in. Again, I guess it depends on how tall you are.

but it has proved itself in a second life as a very effective MTB mule, being able to easily swallow 4 MTB's with nothing but their front wheels removed

Lol.. You complain about people using their kids as an excuse for an SUV then you do the exact same thing with your bikes. You can get four bikes on a rack with no bother. Used to do that in a Fiesta back in the day etc etc.

If you are in an SUV and the othercar in an accident isn't an SUV, you are something like 20 times less likely to be injured.

How much more likely is the person in the other car (or the pedestrian) to be injured, or does that not matter?

I've got a big old Hyundai Terracan, (mitsubishi shogun underneath) and my wife has a Laguna estate, on our one day of snow this year she asked to take my truck and I wouldn't let her, her cars far safer, has traction control and all season tyres on it, rather than my huge off road tyres which don't grip well on ice and snow. I like estate cars, I just use the Hyundai for around our farm and towing 3t trailers.

People don't mock SUVs out of inverse snobbery or envy, it's the sheer ridiculousness of the fact that most of them are just used to ferry small kids to school or go to the supermarket (where they often make adjacent parking spaces unusable).
I've also seen many an SUV swerving around puddles and potholes. I was on my way to meet friends for a bike ride, driving down a poorly-surfaced narrow road (with my MTB in the back of my Smart ForFour!) when an oncoming vehicle meant that the monster truck sized SUV in front and I had to pull over. In the limited space to pull over into, was a huge puddle half the size of my car, which the couple in the monster truck with massive wheels wouldn't drive into, but were happy to gesticulate and hoot their horn at me to drive into it in my Smart car 😀

Thatcher's children.

TBH a lightweight SUV Platform won´t be that polluting, like, a 1.5dci Nissan-Renault engine in a Qashcow isn´t going to behave much more differently to a 1.5 or 2.0dci in a Laguna or whatever the Nissan Estate is.... having said that the drivetrain, wheel and aero drags will all be a little higher.

To me, it just seems "normal" / car manufacturers have been pushing the "larger" car forever, it? just in Europe we resisted for a longer time due to MPG, handling issues etc. But now of course, with efficient engines, lower oil prices and large yet somewhat light chassis we are again falling to the mantra like so many other countries before...

Here it is, laid out in 1957(!)
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The last lines on the second image also start to talk about the "Premium" marketing method, which is also much more suited to the SUV product over the "bare bones" hatchback - if you're already spending more than the minimum, then the whole premium marketing opportunity opens up.

Personally, I'd say the above, plus the profit increase [from, say 5% to 15% plus increased cost of the product in the first place] explains it rather well.

Nissan, for example, has benefited hugely from the success of the SUV segment and employs a large UK workforce. So we're faced, again, with the Hobson's choice by the Industry.

Arse. I really need to change the world :/

Just switched from an SUV to an estate. Early days but enjoying the estate sooo much more. Easier to drive, much more economical and loads more space. Hasn't been through an IoM winter yet though, so might miss the 4x4 then.

I can confirm that you can squeeze 2 MTBs and 2 adults into a Smart ForFour, with room to spare for camelbaks, shoes, helmets etc 😉
You can do it even more easily in a fiesta 😀

Choosing an SUV shows that you really couldn't care less about the world's problems, and you think slight convenience for you is more important.

As does
- owning more than one car
- towing a caravan, rather than packing a tent/staying in a cabin/hotel
- travelling at more than the most fuel efficient speed for your car
-purchasing a new car without taking into regard the environmental impact of it's manufacture, rather than buying a secondhand one.

We've an XC90, Mondeo estate and Bongo camper, so most bases covered. Much rather be in the XC90 than the newer Mondeo.

This is a bunch of nonsense, as usual on here.

It's just a vehicle that you buy because you want. Talk of inefficiency, marketing and status is pure junk.

There are clearly decent SUV's and decent estates. To pick a category and lament it based on some else's needs is dumb.

I don't care someone else has an estate or an Audi or BMW or whatever. It's irrelevant too me.

I like the Yeti, nice drive and versatile and cheap. Like the high loading lip too etc.

Besides I'm not having kids so don't need and estate or mpv or whatever stereotypes are associated with them.

Inefficiency is not a useful barometer on its own as it depends on how much you use your car.

And as for marketing - did we not learn from 29/650 that it's just part of the industry we all purchase from?

If you're going to pick on marketing at least tackle perfumes or something where the marketing is so obscure it renders the product irrelevant.

Choosing an SUV shows that you really couldn't care less about the world's problems, and you think slight convenience for you is more important.

What absolute junk.

Taking one element in isolation of one persons life as a measure of everything is twaddle.

You have to look at the big picture. How much do you fly; how much do you drive; do you buy ethically; where do get your energy from; what you put back into your community; food etc etc.

I would say on balance even though we have two yetis our lifestyle is no where near the bottom of the heap.

People don't mock SUVs out of inverse snobbery or envy, it's the sheer ridiculousness of the fact that most of them are just used to ferry small kids to school or go to the supermarket

Totally, it's an image thing. Girl at work who always seems short of cash want's to trade in her perfectly good mini for a new R.Rover Evoke - in white surprise surprise. She doesn't go anywhere off road, not even a dirt track. She's 5ft 2", doesn't have kids, she doesn't ever need to carry anything large (e.g. bike etc). To her it's a image thing pure and simple - I think a celebrity she likes had bought one or something.

It's pure egoism.
I hate the things with a passion.
Infact, that goes for cars in general now, the South East of England has become a massive car park which happens to have houses on it.

I think I might be able to believe people who claim they didn't buy the Yeti for looks/status. Nearly as ugly as my Berlingo. 🙂

@molgrips if we all only cared about the worlds problems we'd drive small 1000cc cars, as above our parents did and our grandparents often had no car. Back in the day I borrowed my kids Yaris more than once to go riding, the bike went in the back easily, We'd also not take foreign holiday flights either etc and not heat our homes as mich as we do or eat as much meat etc etc

SUVs are customer choice, perhaps there's an element of marketing .. 650b anyone ?

Choosing an SUV shows that you really couldn't care less about the world's problems

Has to be a troll!!!

😀 😀 😀

@jam yes.

We all consume and none of us are hair shorted saints. But the issue with SUVs is that they use more resources for absolutely no benefit. It's just vanity. Which makes it the worst kind of overconsumption. Off road/heavy towing/poorly backs and whatever excluded so don't bother.