Well I'm currently down near Exeter and at the two deliveries I've had to make, the petrol station and the shop I got my lunch from have all had near-100% mask wearing. A complete change from when I was down here last week where it was down to roughly 40%. Everyone giving each other plenty of space too so it seems that the message gas got through to most people at the moment.
Moderna reckon less effective vaccine. Just guess work at this stage?
I know we all need to exercise caution, stay chilled, and just be patient at this early stage... but the different noises coming out of Moderna and Oxford does seem odd. It is about the different vaccine technology used, or simply extra caution required for a vaccine supplier (rather than research body)?
I’m not sure why the moderna thing is news, I thought it was considered fairly much a given that vaccine effectiveness would be lower for this mutation…?
It is about the different vaccine technology used, or simply extra caution required for a vaccine supplier (rather than research body)?
I think the problem is that everyone is hanging on the data for this one (and theres a lot of partisanship regards covid) so anything said gets blown up way out of significance
Omicron evident in Dutch samples earlier than 1st official recognition in SA https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-59473131
be interesting to see what S-gene drop out looks like across countries over the last month
4yo daughter woke in the night with a constant cough so no school and we’ve just been for a ‘tickle test’ as we call it. Test centre busiest I’ve seen it by a margin. All mum’s with Little’uns. School cold and cough season in full swing I guess!
Was busy when we went yesterday morning - all those Sunday night pre-school/work LFT tests kicking in.
The press conference on Saturday said that it was only in younger children that rates were currently rising, and daughter said they were missing some Rainbows Thursday night, and some of the younger gymnasts she coaches on Friday due to Covid. I wonder where she picked it up from to test positive on Sunday night?
MrsMC and I have both had our negative PCR results through from yesterday's tests, nothing yet to confirm daughters result - wondered if it had gone for further omicron testing first?
reluctantjumper
Well I’m currently down near Exeter and at the two deliveries I’ve had to make, the petrol station and the shop I got my lunch from have all had near-100% mask wearing. A complete change from when I was down here last week where it was down to roughly 40%. Everyone giving each other plenty of space too so it seems that the message gas got through to most people at the moment.
A message that has not yet got through back here in the City of London.
Commute in this morning from the darklands of Essex, and I'd estimate the mask wearers accounting for about 1 in 5. Lunchtime stroll, passing through a few shops and it seems similar, if not worse.
In the bank today, someone was offered a mask by a member of staff, to which the response was "no thanks, I don't do masks".
wow – so did you have 2xvaccs, then a booster in May and then CV19(Delta) in August.
Sandwich Jr managed to contract COVID for the second time around the time he had his flu and booster jabs in Bristol. We managed to avoid catching it from him but Mrs S was pinged at the weekend for a trip to Stratford Westfield during her lunch hour last week on her one day in the office. We are awaiting her PCR result.
So here we are again. Bojo is stepping up to the Mic to sort all this out for us.
I've zero sympathy for him, at every stage of this I think he's failed to accept hard facts until it's too late, and don't suspect this will be any different.
But... I wouldn't want to be in his shoes right now.
Omicron is here, little pockets of it all over the UK, as ever, you never find out about new strains until it's too late.
The WHO are telling us not to panic, don't punish the Southern African Countries for spotting it first, wait and see.
The Boss of Moderna has said a material drop in vaccine efficacy is a certainty.
Prof Karl Luterbach who wants to be the next German health minister say it could be a Christmas Gift, a less lethal, but more contagious variant that out-competes Delta. Backed up slightly by data coming out of SAfrica that it's seems so far to be milder.
A Tory minster said we shouldn't mix un-necessarily at Christmas, but Boris shut her down saying, "no we're all going to have a great Christmas".
So... does he do the hard thing, impose restrictions until we know more, or bottle it, wait and see, by which time, if it is indeed more contagious, it'll be way on it's way to becoming the dominate strain in the UK and World, but does that matter? If it is, it will anyway.
Flu season officially starts tomorrow, yay!
A Tory minster said we shouldn’t mix un-necessarily at Christmas,
It was actually Dr Jenny Harries, a senior public health official. But I guess we've had enough of experts.
You have to remember it's Christmas party season for Boris, too, why should he miss out?
The Boss of Moderna has said a material drop in vaccine efficacy is a certainty.
That is not what he said. He said he though it was highly likely there would be a significant drop in effectiveness. Lets stick to what we know & what was said - otherwise we end up in Chinese whispers (no pun intended). Bancel may turn out to be right, but so far all he's said is "I think..."
"There is no world, I think, where [the effectiveness] is the same level . . . we had with [the] Delta [variant],” Bancel told the Financial Times in an interview at the company’s headquarters in Cambridge, Massachusetts.
He added: “I think it’s going to be a material drop. I just don’t know how much because we need to wait for the data. But all the scientists I’ve talked to . . . are like, ‘This is not going to be good’.”
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59426353
https://www.ft.com/content/27def1b9-b9c8-47a5-8e06-72e432e0838f
Forget Covid (for a second) has TiRed been undercover brainwashing other Elites into working for his Great Reset overlords?
We need to know.
https://www.ft.com/content/f159ffc9-65d8-4206-bf81-41b42689228b
For the record, I don't work on Vaccines 😀 . I was wondering this morning when the Sanofi/GSK Phase 3 results were coming. I have however spent the day looking at 1) omicron materials from lots of sources (no data, but LOTS and lots of speculation), and 2) Molnupiravir FDA Ad Comm (no efficacy in second half of the trial - they don't know why).
Prof Karl Luterbach who wants to be the next German health minister say it could be a Christmas Gift, a less lethal, but more contagious variant that out-competes Delta. Backed up slightly by data coming out of SAfrica that it’s seems so far to be milder.
I like this a lot, but the age distribution is younger in SAfrica, and of course it is summer for a likely seasonal respiratory virus, so we don't know about pathogenicity (or much else) really.
And now I am off for the Tuesday club ride. That's progress for me.
We need to know.
Indeed, those of us who don't subscribe to the FT need to know what the article says...
The thing that annoyed me the most in this evening’s announcement was “increasing the per-jab payment to pharmacists from £10 to 15, or £20 on Sunday’s. All the vaccinators in my local pharmacy clinics are retired nurses/pharmacists doing it as VOLUNTEERS! The bosses are trousering these payments whilst volunteers do all the work.
So… does he do the hard thing, impose restrictions until we know more, or bottle it, wait and see, by which time, if it is indeed more contagious, it’ll be way on it’s way to becoming the dominate strain in the UK and World, but does that matter? If it is, it will anyway.
We've had the least effective but least disruptive intervention so far. Anything else will have significant cost. It's already here, we can only hope to slow it's spread rather than eradicate it so nothing else will de done unless the healthcare system appears to be on the verge of collapse.
Lol, sorry, neither do I. Turns out I also don't check links before I paste them too.
Don't worry though, was just a little frivolity.
dantsw13
All the vaccinators in my local pharmacy clinics are retired nurses/pharmacists doing it as VOLUNTEERS! The bosses are trousering these payments whilst volunteers do all the work.
Sleaze from the top down is the real new, normal. I expect those bosses will buy them a box of Quality Street when they are on offer.
Indeed, those of us who don’t subscribe to the FT need to know what the article says…
If you copy and paste the FT headline into a general Google search it should throw up a result which you can click and open. The FT rarely makes it impossible to circumvent their paywall.... they're not that mean!
^^ Didn't know that.👍
And now I am off for the Tuesday club ride. That’s progress for me.
Great news!
Greece to start fining over 60's 100 Euro of they refuse the vaccine. The money to go to the healthcare system.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-59474808
Greece to start fining over 60’s 100 Euro of they refuse the vaccine
My initial thought was: that's nonsense, their impact will be more than average E100. But that's monthly, they are fining them E100 per month.
Agree with it or not, it's a different approach. We will see how well it works. Interesting that the French approach of having different tiers of opening/restrictions was very successful at increasing vaccine uptake and so has been adopted in plenty of other countries.
@batfink - any idea if your overseas visitors are still going to be able to come ... or is it too soon to tell?
@batfink – any idea if your overseas visitors are still going to be able to come … or is it too soon to tell?
Aha! Yes! Thank you for asking.
Mum's flying out (London via Singapore to Sydney) on Sunday, arriving Monday evening.
The only relevant change to the rules regarding international arrivals is that she now has to self-isolate for 72 hrs on arrival. Which (in the grand scheme of things) isn't too bad.
She has to have a PCR before departure, and then 24 and 72 hrs after arrival - but that's the same as it always was
Hope it all works out for you both Batfink.
the French approach
The Israeli approach. They were the first to use this approach. Hats off to the French administration, many (including myself) thought that vaccine uptake would stay slow there, and ultimately stay low, but they copied the vaccine passport approach, despite the expected political backlash, and it worked.
The Israeli approach. They were the first to use this approach.
My mistake. However I think it was the French data being so compelling (how many people registered for a jab in the 24 hours after it was announced? It was like an extra 3 million people or something) that showed people just how effective it could be.
True. And those countries that followed fast, like Portugal, benefited from the same effect. Those that delayed in Europe seem to have missed that boat. When countries introduced green card type access restrictions looks to have been key. Timing.
What’s the score down there?
Greece to start fining over 60’s 100 Euro of they refuse the vaccine
I'm really not a fan of this. The one thing that it does have going for it is that there's a logical 'your choice has an impact on the cost of healthcare so you should bear some of that cost' aspect to it. But it doesn't take much thought to figure out that:
(a) If that's the basis then where does this precedent lead? NI contributions scaled according to your choice of smoking or not, dietary choices, extreme sports?
(b) This would have the consequence that rich people can choose whether to have the vaccine or not, but poor people cannot.
Uncool!
I'm much more in favour of respecting the wishes of those with strongly held objections, and encouraging those who are wavering (or just can't be arsed) with facts and data, and then if that doesn't work then inducements like requiring passports to attend certain venues (where again there's a non-judgemental logic to it).
What’s the score down there?
It didn’t really work (is my impression). There might have been some small acceleration in the waning vax rate, maybe it just worked to gee-up the apathetic to actually get it done, but I doubt I’m convinced anyone who was previously against it (rather than ambivalent).
I know in Melbourne there was/is a more significant backlash, but I put that down to Melbourne just having more weirdos than Sydney.
I’m really not a fan of this
Much as it made me chuckle, I'd agree. I'd far rather see the fun restriction approach. Nope, you're not getting into a restaurant/pub/gig/gammon carvery.
Uncool!
Agreed.
I’m more interested to see what the big US insurance companies do. The cost of being hospitalised with covid out there must be absolutely eye watering. Wouldn’t be at all surprised if being unvaccinated (as a large chunk of the US population is) would trigger some pretty hefty premiums.
One struggles to sympathise
I’m really not a fan of this
Much as it made me chuckle, I’d agree. I’d far rather see the fun restriction approach. Nope, you’re not getting into a restaurant/pub/gig/gammon carvery.
Me too, sooner see the removal of the carrot rather than actual use of the stick, to stretch a metaphor too far
I have been looking for work again at figures.
There has been a steady decline in numbers in Scotland testing positive - first time in a few weeks I looked at the numbers. The younger (so fewer vaccinated, more interaction in school / college / uni) gang seem to be the majority of the decline in numbers. That said, it is hard to work out how much an impact they have as a proportion of citizens.
I also see our R-number is rising against cases dropping - so less testing?
I also note that the deaths and ICU the last few weeks has been older folk (again). Do we know if there are figures around correlation of vulnerable factors and hospitalisation/ICU/death? This was a 'thing' the news picked up on before, but seems to be less obvious at present.
In Eastern Europe younger people who've been manipulated by the anti-vax groups are buying vaccination certificates from dodgy pharmacists. You pay €20 and get "proof" of vaccination.
Why you'd want to do this when the bloody thing is free in the first place I don't know.
NI contributions scaled according to your choice of smoking or not, dietary choices
Aren't we already there with this? Tax on cigarettes covers cost of healthcare. Although arguably since smokers die earlier they should actually get a discount on NI...
🤔
Controversial opinion but fast food should have a fat tax on it anyway (and a litter tax, come to think of it).
I also note that the deaths and ICU the last few weeks has been older folk (again). Do we know if there are figures around correlation of vulnerable factors and hospitalisation/ICU/death? This was a ‘thing’ the news picked up on before, but seems to be less obvious at present.
The single biggest risk factor for covid complications/death is age. Even though we have triple vaccination in the oldest groups, vaccines don't work for everyone, so they will still be the biggest group hospitalised or dying in most instances.
This steady daily death count is simply the consequence of large numbers of cases throughout the population. It will regularly hit a person who was never vaccinated, or whose vaccine protection has either waned or failed.
Tax on cigarettes covers cost of healthcare
You mean for the individual? Certainly not for the nation.
Another truly-sincere, Gulfstream-razzin', lawsuit-poppin' US TV Evangelist antivaxxer went pop cos of the COVID. You can make your own minds up and head over to @Daystar on Twitter for maximum Lolz and meeemz.
Seeya Marcus.
In Eastern Europe younger people who’ve been manipulated by the anti-vax groups are buying vaccination certificates from dodgy pharmacists.
Germany too, there was a TV programme on it last night. The fact the QR codes worked surprised even the officials. 200e mind. In France there are six people including at least one phamacist being prosecuted for selling false certificates.
I think one has to accept that a certain amount of that is going to go on - I think the only question is whether the scale of it is significant.
NSW has 271 new cases yesterday, and zero deaths (24 total people in ICU). Meanwhile Victoria had 1,419 cases yesterday, and 10 deaths (41 in intensive care). We've had 6 case of Omicron in NSW, and I think we are expecting that to grow.
The messaging coming from our state government (NSW) is that we will not be locking down again, borders will reopen on 15th Dec...... we will "suppress the spread" of the new variant, but basically: suck it up, you're all freshly vaccinated and an (all age groups) booster program is in place at 6 months (although I suspect they will pull that fwd to 5 or maybe even 4 months).
I don't like our new Premier (a Conservative) but he is making the right noises IMO, that we need to stop focusing on the daily case numbers, and look instead at hospitalizations and deaths. Its going to be a hard thing for Australians to do - there are still some here advocating for lockdowns/border closures in order to get back down to (and maintain) zero cases. But (obviously?) that's no kind of long term strategy.
Mask wearing here inside (shops, public transport etc) is effectively 100%, but I think that's due to ease on 15th Dec too, which is when we are projected to hit 95% vaccinated. I'd like to see it stay for a while longer, just so that it doesn't coincide with the resumption of travel. Our mask wearing has pretty much always been 100% in NSW - try walking into a shop/cafe without one and you will be told in no uncertain terms to leave, and be subject to a torrent of abuse from the other patrons.
Vaccination rate in Australia is 87.2% and 92% (single/double, over 16s), but in NSW it's 93 and 95%. Even Victoria, with all it's protests and loud antivax contingent are at 93% single vaxxed (which might indicate their ceiling).
My guess is that 95% is probably as high as anyone is going to get once medical exemptions and rabid antivaxxers are accounted for, although the ACT (Canberra) have managed to get past 99% - but that's probably a factor of it's unique territory status.
12-15 year olds are at 66 / 76% (Aus), and 77 / 81% (NSW) - so it feels like that is going pretty well too. Looking fwd to the jab for the over 5s getting approved (my 5 year old starts at school at the end of Jan)
So yeah...... going ok here. The message re: Omicron is very much "calm-ya-farm, we don't know anything about it yet". But lets see what the next couple of weeks brings.
Mask wearing here inside (shops, public transport etc) is effectively 100%, but I think that’s due to ease on 15th Dec too, which is when we are projected to hit 95% vaccinated. I’d like to see it stay for a while longer, just so that it doesn’t coincide with the resumption of travel. Our mask wearing has pretty much always been 100% in NSW – try walking into a shop/cafe without one and you will be told in no uncertain terms to leave, and be subject to a torrent of abuse from the other patrons.
That's really interesting. The only places left in Queensland where it's mandated is hospitals and public transport (IIRC), but frankly even a lot of staff in the hospitals are half-arsed about it now. I saw an immunologist waving his around in his hand whilst talking to a colleague. But that's because there are no community cases within 100km of us i'm sure.
I've just been editing a presentation on my health service's preparation for border opening in mid-December. It's very much a case of preparing to live with COVID (weird that we haven't had to do that yet after almost two years of waiting for it to arrive)
Local vax rates are high, we've got a tiered structure of responses, including a virtual ward setup to manage community cases, and an infusion centre for treatment of mild cases and we're told our main hospital possibly has the world's best facility in terms of infrastructure to manage COVID patients.
... my main concern now is whether the rain and resultant flooding will stop in time so we can get away somewhere for a xmas break.
Local vax rates are high, we’ve got a tiered structure of responses, including a virtual ward setup to manage community cases, and an infusion centre for treatment of mild cases and we’re told our main hospital possibly has the world’s best facility in terms of infrastructure to manage COVID patients.
Nice one! Australia in general, but QLD in particular are enjoying the advantages of largely being able to set up all that stuff without also having to manage an ongoing pandemic at the same time - and also learning the lessons from other countries about what works/doesn't.
My main concerns are:
A pingdemic once the community transmission starts to rise - particularly relating to the kids daycare and (from Feb) kindergarden.
Public pressure once the cases start to rise - particularly in QLD, where you are used to maintaining zero cases. I might just switch off the news for the next few months 🙂
… my main concern now is whether the rain and resultant flooding will stop in time so we can get away somewhere for a xmas break.
Tell me about it! It's rained solidly here for the last 2 weeks, although we are finally seeing some sun today (currently 26 degrees). But I gather you've had it pretty bad up there. We are still reeling from earlier in the year when we had about 12 inches of rain in one 24 hour period!
Then there’s Tweed Heads / Coolangatta. What happens there?? (Asking from Yorkshire)
