I hope I can say that without people misinterpreting, accidentally or deliberately.
I think you mean it's a tragic reminder of the importance of vaccination?
But yes, we've got a few cases of the Indian variant already identified locally, but I'll not get too pessimistic till I see admissions in vaccinated adults rising.
overlay of cases vs vaccination level in over 40’s does seem to correlate well
You would need to compare with cases before there was a wide uptake of vaccinations anywhere. My money would be on the same areas being the worst hit. Vaccination uptake isn’t really that much lower in the areas currently worst effected this time, and cases are mostly in age groups who until very recently weren’t being offered the vaccine.
do we not argue that it’s even more important that vaccination would be high in these areas rather than lower
A good point.
I’m not asking them to oppose it, I’m asking hem to loudly and publicly call for it when it first needs doing, like Starmer tried to do in October when Boris ignored the scientific advice, or loudly and publicly hold them to account when they fail to do so, pointing out the extra length, severity and damage (including lives) that their inaction has caused
The issue is it didn't achieve anything (lives wise) and quite possibly the inverse
The current "government" (which isn't because it is not accountable to Parliament) relies on fire-hosing and releasing confusing, misleading and simply false information
Wikipedia
Researchers at the German Marshall Fund suggest, among other things, being careful not to repeat or amplify the original false claim; repeating a false story, even to refute it, makes people more likely to believe it.
See challenging lies written on the side of buses.
The issue is it didn’t achieve anything (lives wise) and quite possibly the inverse
I'm not sure if you're agreeing with me, disagreeing with me or talking about something else.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-57199791
Spain has said it is officially lifting restrictions for UK travellers from Monday, when a decree takes effect.
They will not need a PCR test.
Try again with the graph...
MoreCashThanDash
I’m not sure if you’re agreeing with me, disagreeing with me or talking about something else.
In this context I'm answering why opposition didn't / doesn't question and hold "the government" to account over Covid responses.
The simple answer is because that would be feeding the misinformation... and it would most likely feed the conspiracy theorists anti-vax/Covid 19 is a myth... quite possibly (even probably) resulting in more deaths.
As Kelvin wrote
See challenging lies written on the side of buses.
So the facts were there.. actual facts. We didn't spend anything close to £350M even before you look at benefits. Even if we had noone in their right mind would think someone committed to selling the NHS is going to take the £350M and spend it on the NHS? (Would they?) but try writing the facts on the side of a bus.
The point really is it doesn't matter how often you show its a lie, you just spread publicity and this is just one lie of hundreds that require more than a soundbite to dispel.
Another view... if we were truthful then the risk of dying from Covid 19 for anyone not yet offered a vaccine is vanishingly small. Probably (just guessing really) way smaller than a nasty flu... but that isn't the point in getting vaccines.
The problem is, given the messaging that has already occurred... trying to explain that to those who quite correctly don't view themselves at significant risk will almost certainly lead to less vaccine uptake whilst reinforcing the earlier lies told by Boris about it being no worse than the flu.
if we were truthful then the risk of dying from Covid 19 for anyone not yet offered a vaccine is vanishingly small
Do we have stats yet on the proportion of people left with long covid? As an active person that's my main concern.
Do we have stats yet on the proportion of people left with long covid? As an active person that’s my main concern.
me too (and still waiting on my first jab).
know 3 people with covid caught march 2020 who are still not right, although slowly improving.
if permanent, thats a fate worse than death in my eyes, wouldn't be able to do anything I enjoy, would even have to become an ebiker in my 30s.
from a national perspective I could still work and pay tax, I imagine this is not the case for anyone whose job involves being on their feet all day, to say nothing of manual laburers.
Do we have stats yet on the proportion of people left with long covid? As an active person that’s my main concern.
Not sure how active I can claim to be but that's my main concern, though just had my second jab, so need to get that back into perspective. Based on TiReds experience and others at the cycle club I really don't want to risk months off the bike, having lost chunks of the last two years after a couple of accidents.
versus
Do we have stats yet on the proportion of people left with long covid? As an active person that’s my main concern.
ayjaydoubleyou
me too (and still waiting on my first jab).
I don't have the stats and I'd assume (though I haven't gone digging and don't watch TV) that there is a reason for that.
I completely understand your INFORMED opinion/worry... but that is not what the "government" are pushing and you are not the target audience.
It's thought to be 1 in 10 of the symptomatic that have symptoms that persist for more than 3 months (iirc). That ranges from those with loss of smell/taste through to the more serious stuff.
Do we have stats yet on the proportion of people left with long covid? As an active person that’s my main concern.
>Around 1 in 5 respondents testing positive for COVID-19 exhibit symptoms for a period of 5 weeks or longer
>Around 1 in 10 respondents testing positive for COVID-19 exhibit symptoms for a period of 12 weeks or longer
Do we have stats yet on the proportion of people left with long covid? As an active person that’s my main concern.
25% in this household. The concern is actually the number who develop symptoms after the primary infection. My consultant has noted this in her patients. Some had mild infections and recovery, followed by gradual onset. Her own sister is one such patient. I am of the personal opinion that the classic symptoms (fever, headache, URT cough) are all good signs of a successful immune defence. Absence (loss of smell for example) may be predictors of worse to come.
Anyway on the work front, the antibody I have worked on for a year now, was approved today by the EMA for use under a condition that allows agencies to make their own decision (called Article 5(3)). The UK is not bound by this decision.
Good news about sotrovimab - well done TiRed
Nice job TiRed, you said you'd been busy.
Although your absence from here in the last few days has been noted, and we'd appreciate if you could book your leave in future. This is not a formal warning but will remain on your record for six months after which it will be removed as long as no further digressions.
Yours;
Some argumentative virtual cyclists.
Re long covid - my MD was off for 6 months, back at work for 3 months and now on long term sick leave. He was fit, not overweight and had no other risk factors other than age (50).
Dying is not the only risk to assess.
yeah and count youself lucky as AWOL is more normally gross misconduct.
I presume we have him on flexi so he can fit it around the main job. My guess would be that he's pumped in the overtime on here for us over the last year so decided to cash those in for a much needed break.
Still rude not to tell us though... 😜
Given the amount of time he seems to spend on here rather than focussing on his work* I'd be hesitant to take that antibody... 😉
*Pot, Kettle, Black
Are we paying him yet?
Murrey
Re long covid – my MD was off for 6 months, back at work for 3 months and now on long term sick leave. He was fit, not overweight and had no other risk factors other than age (50).
Dying is not the only risk to assess.
That might even wash North of the Border but it isn't on the propaganda list down here with regards to the opposition in England.
"Deaths within 28 days of positive test" is what is on the soundbite menu.
Any attempt by Labour or a joint Labour+ would only result in being accused of scaremongering and "trying to sabotage the huge effort of the NHS and people through this difficult time".
I can see PMQ's and the line Boris will take.
Nice job TiRed, you said you’d been busy.
Although your absence from here in the last few days has been noted, and we’d appreciate if you could book your leave in future. This is not a formal warning but will remain on your record for six months after which it will be removed as long as no further digressions.
Yours;
Some argumentative virtual cyclists.
Who made you the boss? 🤣🤣
his is not a formal warning but will remain on your record for six months after which it will be removed as long as no further digressions.
Genuine LOL there! I have managed to maintain my SPI-M attendance and have automated analyses of the cases-admissions linkage for the local authorities. Not trivial because the ONS local authorities do not map directly to NHS trusts (well Bolton and Bolton NHS Trust do). Also made a few contributions of my own looking at mortality (all good at the moment actually) and European comparisons (UK still a great outlier).
Approval of a new COVID treatment is very pleasing, but this is, sadly, still early in the human-SARS-CoV2 tango, I am afraid to say. Vaccines are helping us catch up with the virus. Treatments might help us get ahead. Future treatments of note are favipiravir (oral, like tamiflu) and the AZ mAb for passive vaccination. If it's fifteen rounds, we're at about Round three.
Who made you the boss?
You take a numbered ticket and await your turn!
Meanwhile in France a 24 year old has developed a inter-connected IT system to track and use up vaccine doses.
https://www.theregister.com/2021/05/21/something_for_the_weekend_/
Just looked at the booster trial that is recruiting, annoyingly you need to be 84 days post second jab to be eligible.
Got 60 days to wait. Wonder if they will still be recruiting then
You take a numbered ticket and await your turn!
Bloody hell, 17 years and my number still hasn't come up! Even the anniversary issue pointed out I'd failed to make the cut as a Big Hitter. Infamy! Infamy!
So Germany has put the UK on their banned list due to the Indian variants. That seems a bit rich politically as we are one of the few places actually sequencing our tests looking for variants at scale.
and yet...Spain will allow visitors from the UK for holidays without a negative PCR test for COVID-19 from Monday.
Is it naive to hope for a global standard on this?
Spain is simply an economic approach. They have many communities on their knees due to a lack of revenue.
Add a crap elitist Govt who are effectively insulated from the madness and this is what you get. They're not too disimilar to the UK in that regard...(Govt corruption, cartels in key industries etc etc).
Interesting that Chris Smith (the Naked Scientist) mentioned on the BBC this morning, that due to hardly any cases of flu around the world, they won't be able to make a proper judgement on the correct vaccine needed for this coming season.
They rely on the season from the other side of the world for the variant. There were no cases in Australia or New Zealand to get this information from. The reason hardly any flu cases - we have been washing hands, wearing masks and keeping distance (this is obvious).
Regarding the 'Long covid' sufferers, having had post viral fatigue syndrome myself (which lasted 5 years), with the extra additions of organs not working properly and other health problems, one really does not want to get this.
Imagine having a 'bank or energy', which can be used for eg - work, play or just normal everyday things, then having to decide where that energy is used up, then it gives a little insight as to what your life maybe like. With this added stress and quite often depression (especially with sporty types), then it's not a life. Not to mention the affects on family and loved ones.
Sorry to sound so depressing but I can't stress how getting Long covid will absolutely change ones life.
So Germany has put the UK on their banned list due to the Indian variants
Cant really blame them. Probably an over response but makes sense to err on the side of caution. If only we had done the same.
Who made you the boss?
There was a vote on the special forum. No, not that one, that's only there to divert people from the fact there's another one for the truly special 😉
Also, (mis)reading on a small phone screen, is it wrong to be a bit WTF at you being disappointed that you aren't being considered as a Big Hitler?
Jamze
Full Memberand yet…Spain will allow visitors from the UK for holidays without a negative PCR test for COVID-19 from Monday.
Is it naive to hope for a global standard on this?
Basically Germany can afford to do it and Spain needs the money. It'll never be a simple medical decision, no more than anything else in the handling of the virus has been, different countries have different requirements and constraints and will approach things differently.
It's the same reason the UK government desperately wants to reopen city centres fully and get people "back to work" ie back into the office, a horrendous amount of our economy is dependent on selling expensive average coffee to people in suits and sky high inner city rents, and our housing market and infrastructure is largely built around squeezing people into a couple of big cities. And nobody's got the imagination or competence to change that as we already knew from the last 20 years of continuing to focus on already-full London, so of course the only thing they can think of is trying to rewind to the end of 2019, even though that was a pretty absurd way to operate a country.
Every country has its own stupidities that they'll continue to protect.
There was a vote on the special forum. No, not that one, that’s only there to divert people from the fact there’s another one for the truly special 😉
Also, (mis)reading on a small phone screen, is it wrong to be a bit WTF at you being disappointed that you aren’t being considered as a Big Hitler?
I knew it!
I had to get a job in the Civil Service so I could be a Little Hitler....🤷♂️
due to hardly any cases of flu around the world, they won’t be able to make a proper judgement on the correct vaccine needed for this coming season.
This is a significant challenge. Vaccine makers chase flu around the hemispheres to make a call on the next big strain. When it's the wrong call, not good. They are normally pretty good, but this year is a problem. I'm also working on an antibody for influenza prophylaxis where vaccines don't work.
PHE Technical briefing document 12 is published here
Page 41 is the page on vaccine effectiveness that the media are excited by. That's good news, because Figure 17 (and my own analysis) shows that the Indian variant is replacing our own home-grown star performer at the same rate that the UK variant replaced the Wuhan (modified) strain. This is evolution in action.
And I don't understand Amber countries. Amber means Stop! in the UK. Not carry on through and hope to get across the junction. We won't be travelling abroad this year, with the exception of a trip to collect Son2 from Ireland next month.
TiRed - could you explain again (sorry) for the hard of understanding, what the actual vaccine is for SARS cov 2 please.
I tried to explain to a relative that they hadn't been given a dose of the virus, but DNA. As a lay person it was tricky for me to give her the info.
Thanks.
NB. As I understand a lot of vaccination/C19 deniers think they are going to be injected with the virus.
Basically Germany can afford to do it and Spain needs the money. It’ll never be a simple medical decision, no more than anything else in the handling of the virus has been, different countries have different requirements and constraints and will approach things differently.
As the famous vengaboys song goes ‘we are going to Berlin’
Yep, oddly though looks like all the flights from June 6 to murcia have been cancelled or fully booked
Amber means Stop!
Well, sort of. Depends whether it's safe to stop, or if its accompanied by a Red light which means prepare to go. 😝
Depends which vaccine. One type is the reverse RNA type; effectively you're injected with a template from which your body can assemble a protein that triggers the immune response. This is the new breed and very exciting development.
Other vaccines use a deactivated version of the virus (aka attenuated) or parts of the virus - there's different ways to do that but in the end it gives the body practise against a version of the virus that can't cause the full illness.
https://www.who.int/news-room/feature-stories/detail/the-race-for-a-covid-19-vaccine-explained
TiRed – could you explain again (sorry) for the hard of understanding, what the actual vaccine is for SARS cov 2 please.
I've used these pics before to refresh my understanding/chat with folks...
Thanks - theotherjonv and Jamze.
Well, sort of
...is the answer and how it's set up to based on "advice". You can book a flight, the flights are going / returning and you have to isolate during which one of Patels enforcers might knock on your door.
If gov.uk were serious they'd have stopped the flights for anything other than a green country, end of. #economy #airlines
If gov.uk were serious they’d have stopped the flights for anything other than a green country
Agreed. Or had the Police knocking on doors properly enforcing the isolation period, which would have put off a lot of the casual chancers.
That assumes that the Police have the resources, or maybe it could be delegated to Border force, assuming they have the resources. And before anyone gets upset at the idea of the Police enforcing laws, I don't care 😉
