[Closed] Where do all the people work?

What do they all do?!

post on here about their retirement plans...

You assume they work.....

They work inside the hollowed out moon carrying out the nefarious orders of their reptilian overlords.

post on here about their retirement plans…

🙂

Windsor resident here. I work in London. It's a big place though. Previously Uxbridge, but we've relocated to Brentford if that matters. I've been working from the spare bedroom since March. This morning I traveled as far as the dining room for the different scenery - with another monitor.

Ways of working are already changing prior to office return. The company has already offered formal remote working with options from 1-5 days in the office. I could move back home to Gods Own County (Devon of course) and carry on as I am.

You can't come on here and tease the mammals with talk of spare bedrooms, dining rooms and the like.

They'll get ideas above their station and, before you know it, they'll want their own hollowed out moon.

I struggle to believe all these people are commuting into London

Why would you? Just because people live in the south doesn't mean they work in London. A lot people who make good money own a small business (or partial own maybe a medium business) or above rather than work in a well paid job. This is where the lie that getting a good job is worth while. Its owning business even a small one that's more worthwhile.

On top of that there are lots of decent business employing people at good wedge outside London.

And if you want northerners to engage, it's that London

What do all these people do?

Drive to the station and commute into London.

I usually wonder what people do when I am in places I go on holiday, like part of Cornwall, the Lake District or out in the French country side or up in the Alps where there isn't any obvious signs of big industry anywhere near close. Would love to live in a beauty spot like that, and who knows with working from home it might be possible to do it within my current job, though WFH revolution is driving up house prices in more rural and remote areas so I suspect I'll be priced out of the market.

I often look at rightmove for say Esher Cobham etc, I know the latter is footballer territory now, and wonder who owns these 5m houses.

My first job was in the head office of a national company, md was a serial entrepreneur. Office was near epsom.

Anyway, bored last year I looked up where the directors lived, omg, crown estate oxshott, Esher, ashtead...3-4mn each easy. These houses were 500k is the early 90s.

Money finds money, a zone 6 London flat has quadrupled in 25 years, a mansion has gone up 10x.

All the people seem to be on the motorway on my way to work, WFH my arse

There are lots of big employers on the edges of that London too, but in locations where it's almost expected that you drive rather than traditional commute-by-train.
It's still surprises me just how many people are in the corporate centres. (If you anthropomorphise covid, it's rubbing it's sticky little hands together at the prospect!)

Off the top of my head, thinking of SW London and a little further out...
BP in BP Village near Sunbury - about 4000 employees?
British Gas/Centrica, again thousands of staff in the big offices around Staines Campus, and Millstream Windsor.
SKY Tv, again thousands of staff at Isleworth
Glaxo/GSK, again thousands of staff at Brentford/Isleworth.

Bound to be loads more,

They’ll get ideas above their station and, before you know it, they’ll want their own hollowed out moon.

They can stay in the loft conversion - Son2 is locked inside a hall of residence in Ireland so it's going begging.

I usually wonder what people do when I am in places I go on holiday, like part of Cornwall, the Lake District or out in the French country side or up in the Alps where there isn’t any obvious signs of big industry anywhere near close.

In quite a lot of areas, they work in tourism as an alternative to farming. But as a tourist, you won't have noticed that 😉

I usually wonder what people do when I am in places I go on holiday, like part of Cornwall, the Lake District or out in the French country side or up in the Alps where there isn’t any obvious signs of big industry anywhere near close

We went over to see a friend in Northern Italy. Her dad had a gorgeous villa on the hillside overlooking Lake Como. He was a self-employed plumber.

I've often wondered the same thing tbh.

He was a self-employed plumber.

That's just what he told you...

Really the Godfather of the local plumbing mafia...

Maybe they stay in the London flat during the week?

I'm on what most people would consider good money, and have a nice 4 bed house (in an unfashionable part of the borough so cheap), to be able to afford the luxury properties in South Manchester would be lottery money but there's enough people on that sort of money.

Also don't forget those at the top don't have to commute into the office at the same time every day, and ironically may have the company pay for them to stay in a nice hotel for a couple nights.

Used to have an arse of an MD who would work from home Mon to Wed (London based) fly up to Manchester to be in the factory Thursday morning, stay over Thursday night and fly home Friday afternoon. All at the company expense and we paid to have his home office set up.

'Signor, we have that problem with the Camorra.'
'Eh, call The Plumber.'

I'm North East of London in Essex but still commuter belt.

15 houses in road
9 retired (one semi-retired company secretary, works from home occasionally London)
1 taxi driver
1 builder
1 IT project manager
1 non-IT project manager
1 ops manager
1 random household in their 20s who appear to do nothing

My mum is in a road near a major station and if anything has a higher % of retired residents (notwithstanding 70+ flats that are going up soon).

A friend is in the nearest big estate where it's £1m to get anything on there, they have 10+ in their road and every single one is retired bar one which is an MP (and he rents that out to live in his constituency)

Maybe they stay in the London flat during the week?

I guess the slice of people I'm most interested in isn't the level of those who can afford to do this (or have the company pay) but those who have all these 4 bed family houses, Volvo (or X Brand). Probably bought their houses in the 90s for £400k or something, but now its sky rocketed to the 700-800k or so.

They're probably not millionaire-rich, but have enough to pay for the 70k vehicle. One assumes they'd need a job/family income to facilitate that.

That’s just what he told you…

Really the Godfather of the local plumbing mafia…

To be honest, we stayed there for a week and none of the sums seemed to add up. Nobody seemed to do anything apart from sit around drinking coffee and eating amazing food all day, while living in the middle of one of the most beautiful places in the world

I usually wonder what people do when I am in places I go on holiday, like part of Cornwall, the Lake District or out in the French country side or up in the Alps where there isn’t any obvious signs of big industry anywhere near close. Would love to live in a beauty spot like that, and who knows with working from home it might be possible to do it within my current job, though WFH revolution is driving up house prices in more rural and remote areas so I suspect I’ll be priced out of the market.

Devon here. Out in the sticks 25-30% retirees and the largest employers are the public sector eg NHS then the tourist industry. Fishing and farming don’t employ huge numbers. Very little manufacturing industry but similar small businesses to most places. Lots of old money about with large houses, estates and second homes (driving up prices). It’s an amazingly beautiful place to live and quality of life is fantastic but it’s pretty limiting in terms of career choices and my 3 children who grew up here now live and work in that London as a result. In fact I’ll be heading there as soon as the pandemic wanes as want a change for a couple of years after 20 years of walking over the hill to the beach 😉

I live in Sw London near some the places described. Lots of multi £M houses round here. Plenty of people around here work in the city, are in highly paid professions or have family money. Although they are a minority, The majority are normal people in normal size house but they don't get our attention.

To be honest, we stayed there for a week and none of the sums seemed to add up. Nobody seemed to do anything apart from sit around drinking coffee and eating amazing food all day, while living in the middle of one of the most beautiful places in the world

Classic mafiosa, did you miss the tell tail signs like drinking Chianti from the skulls of his enemies?

The armed guards patrolling the estate?

The basement you were never allowed to visit?

Off topic, but https://www.geoguessr.com/ sounds right up your street OP

So I spend a lot of time just mindless browsing Google Earth

What a time to be alive btw, for the nosy bastards! google earth, online planning applications, faceboak, rightmove house sold prices, it's like hardcore porn for yer average blind twitcher!

I guess the slice of people I’m most interested in isn’t the level of those who can afford to do this (or have the company pay) but those who have all these 4 bed family houses, Volvo (or X Brand). Probably bought their houses in the 90s for £400k or something, but now its sky rocketed to the 700-800k or so.

They’re probably not millionaire-rich, but have enough to pay for the 70k vehicle. One assumes they’d need a job/family income to facilitate that.

What sort of income are you imagining is required to support the lifestyle you describe?

Off topic, but https://www.geoguessr.com/ sounds right up your street OP

Exactly what I was going to say - a brilliant way to spend a few hours

I live just outside Guildford in the Surrey Hills near Shere. Not the middle of nowhere but certainly not built up - a small village location. I usually work in Richmond where our offices are (I commute by motorbike), but haven’t stepped foot in the office for nearly a year. I work for a large US consumer goods company heading up the commercial function.

My job covers Europe, Africa, Middle East, Australia/New Zealand, so usually I would mix office time with travel. Obviously haven’t been on a plane for a year either and have been working from home for the duration.

Our office is split between townie commuters who live in London and country commuters who live out this way. During the last year I would say that half of the townies have moved out.

Can’t see me going back to commuting to Richmond 5 days a week after this, but definitely want to get back to overseas travel.

They’re probably not millionaire-rich, but have enough to pay for the 70k vehicle. One assumes they’d need a job/family income to facilitate that.

I assume all those cars are just rented, something like 95% of car sales now are on a finance package. Probably costs £500/£600 month, might even be a company car.

Car ownership is no longer a measure of wealth. In fact it’s kind of an inverse relationship.

‘New money’ = flash car (usually leased)

‘Old money’ = old dog stained estate car (usually owned, but they have better things to spend money on such as education and maintaining their old money).

‘No money’ = can sometimes also mean flash car but not much else given how cheap leases are.

Gross generalisation I know, but wealth, just like class is increasingly difficult to measure by material appearance. Look at the likes of Jeff Bezos. No flash watch, jeans and a shirt. How would you know if you didn’t recognise him?

hundreds/thousands of huge properties easily £1m plus.

Sadly with average house prices in London having reached £0.5m, £1m houses in the south east isn't much to brag about & could have been relatively easily achieved though a combination of luck, age and financial acumen.

I've often wondered this when in Scotland in the middle of nowhere, but quite a few houses dotted around in the distance (Kinloch Hourn springs to mind, 50+ miles from fort bill). What the hell do these people do to earn a living?

someone in Windlesham surely isn’t doing that commute?

Windlesham is practically Suburban London. At certain times of the day trains from the South West are standing room only by the time they get to Basingstoke.

Some of my colleagues commute in from Brighton (which apparently is a REALLY shit journey)

The Census colelcts data on this.

latest dataset is from 2011 as ten yesrly census is due this year.

North of Reading there is area of maybe a good few hundred houses all well over £1m. I once heard that a lot of them were from people who owned shops in the town and long since sold up.
Also, house price to income 50 years ago are now completely disjointed. A terrace house bought for 500 in 1963 sold last year for 365k.

Nobody really works in the South East.

We just sit in our lovely big houses and leafy gardens, counting our piles of money and bathing in milk and honey, whilst we exploit the grafters in the North who do all the work for us.

The areas you are looking at are basically known as stockbroker belt.

Despite what it may look from Google Earth the commutes can be faster than places much closer the the centre of town.

Loads of people in banking jump straight into property in zones 1/2 at start of career, then move when they have family after property value soars.

In addition to the usual you also have footballers. E.g Chelsea training ground is around that area.

You would also be surprised at the amount of science and tech. From gaming to recently IPO’d US startups in the dead zones you are looking at.

Isn't it something like 1 in 5 of the UK population that's retired?

That's got to part of the conundrum... especially in certain areas of Surrey, Kent, Cumbria, Devon, Cornwall, Cotswolds... just look for nice areas to live in that return Conservative MP after Conservative MP...

Bound to be loads more,

Indeed, and then there's the other companies that you've not heard of. e.g. what used to be Foster Wheeler (then AMEC, then Wood) in Reading was 3000+ employees across three office buildings pre-crash. Similarly, BG Group (the offshore part of the old company, not the BG that sells you gas and services your boiler) was based locally before merging with Shell and closing down. I don't actually know anyone that commutes into London.

Also, I suspect a lot is down to the growth in population and massively above inflationary rises in housing prices. A detached house on the outskirts of Reading is now £500k. So that's probably the ceiling for most professionals, you pick the suburb/village with the compromise you want and that's the best you'll do. 40 years ago in the '80s older YUPPIES and younger Boomers were probably buying those £10million farmhouses in the Chilterns for the equivalent of £500k thinking they were making a compromise having to stretch themselves to such a big mortgage (when everyone else was buying much cheaper suburban detached houses) but also having to live outside of town.

We keep looking at North Yorkshire, which is probably at a similar house price level to Berkshire 30 years ago. Loads of housing around £30k-£50k, some new suburbs, and the nicer villages around 3-4x that. Then a big jump to a handful of £500k-£1m properties. I worked with people who were on the same rates in the office there as Reading. They just didn't spend even half as much on their houses because they didn't have to. Except for the odd one or two that decided to have 1h commutes to big farms houses up on the moors.

Nobody really works in the South East.

We just sit in our lovely big houses and leafy gardens, counting our piles of money and bathing in milk and honey, whilst we exploit the grafters in the North who do all the work for us.

Well if they would actually graft. We had our last Northerner flogged to death by his Polish replacement. They work so much harder and don't complain about 47 hour days.

Not just London suburbs but some London areas have done really well. Hackney for e.g., I knew a few people there in the 90s they were almost ashamed to admit they lived there. My mate inherited a 3 bed terrace there, probably 150k mid 90s, 1mn plus now.

Ditto Hackney, kennington, Clapham, balham. All neighbouring fashionble areas with hindsight it was bound to happen.

I’ve often wondered this when in Scotland in the middle of nowhere, but quite a few houses dotted around in the distance (Kinloch Hourn springs to mind, 50+ miles from fort bill). What the hell do these people do to earn a living?

Came here to say this. Done a bit of touring round Scotland and you'll come across a decent sized town in the middle of nowhere - not touristy, not industrial, few thousand houses and I just can't figure what all those people do.

heroin</trainspotting>

Most of it is age - the people in million pound houses didn't buy it for that. We are currently in the process of buying a house for a fairly decent budget, but looking at the house price, the people they we're buying it off brought it for half what we're paying about 10 years ago. Salaries haven't doubled in that time. It's not fair, but it's life I guess - I know people in their 30s on large salaries (100k plus) who live in 3 bed semis and people on more normal salaries who live in million plus houses, just because they're 60 and brought at the right time.

Cars are a terrible indication of how much someone earns! I have apprentices at work who have nicer cars than me because everyone rents the car these days.

We keep looking at North Yorkshire, which is probably at a similar house price level to Berkshire 30 years ago. Loads of housing around £30k-£50k

Where in North Yorkshire is that?????? I can't think of anywhere in North Yorkshire where you could get anything for less than £100k.

A brother in law bought a house in North London for 450k 10 years ago, now it's a million give or take. He smiles a lot.

Wind?

I don't wonder what the OP wonders about down south, there seems to be a lot going on for those people to work in. I do wonder it about some of the surprisingly large remote communities in the Highlands.

Edit:just seen the other similar comments!

We could do with moving to a three bed house, but I have no idea how. Unless we move to Stoke or a ropey estate there’s little chance of it happening. I need to befriend a lonely widow

I totally hear the comments of cars not being representative of wealth due to lease etc -

but ultimately you still need to pay the monthly repayment whether its lease/pcp/whatever. For some 60k+ cars that can be 500/600 or more a month which baffles me. I earn 'quite alright' by any measure but the thought of paying 500 quid a month on a car seems mental. So surely they've got the income to support that...

I earn ‘quite alright’ by any measure but the thought of paying 500 quid a month on a car seems mental.

But some people think that dropping £8,000 on a pedal bike is mental. Fortunately we aren't all the same.

We keep looking at North Yorkshire, which is probably at a similar house price level to Berkshire 30 years ago. Loads of housing around £30k-£50k

Where in North Yorkshire is that?????? I can’t think of anywhere in North Yorkshire where you could get anything for less than £100k.

They must be looking in Hull 😉

As well as all the headquarters for large multi-nationals in the area the OP pointed out, there is some manufacturing around Reading etc. Heathrow is a huge employer in that area too, directly employs about 80,000, including service providers they quote 120,000, then there is the BA/IAG headquarters and all the immigration services and logistics companies in the same area. Who then need services, sparkies and plumbers, schools, hospitals, communications and utilities, some of whom will be on good salaries and may have bought their houses 20 years ago.

But some people think that dropping £8,000 on a pedal bike is mental.

Most proper riders do as well TBH.

But some people think that dropping £8,000 on a pedal bike is mental. Fortunately we aren’t all the same.

Yeah - this. The grads / apprentices i mentioned above all like cars, so they spend 250-300 a month on them. Other than tax, I think I spent less than 250 quid on my car in all of last year. Will probably spend even less this year as nothing has worn out. The difference is I don't care that I drive a 14 year old shitbox.

But some people think that dropping £8,000 on a pedal bike is mental.

I think even the most seasoned riders think spending £8k on a bike is mental, difference is we absolutely love riding.

I don't think that many people are absolutely in love with a Volvo XC90 yet you see them everywhere.

I suspect a lot are company cars. We have a brand new car sat outside, but only because it's the wife's company car.

I think EXACTLY the same thing when I'm in the middle of nowhere and go past random houses seemingly with nothing nearby, what do they doooooooo?!

I know one person may not be representative of the whole population in the South East but it does at least serve as a data point for you OP. Well, my sister works for a website called onlyfans.com most days. Seems to do alright by all accounts. Nice house in Dorking. Owns a fast car too.

In my neck of the woods, an average former market town in north Wiltshire, it’s not difficult to find a sixties-seventies or even newer regular three/four bed house fetching north of 1/4 million pounds, there’s a lovely thatched cottage in a nearby village, said village is the setting for the Agatha Raisin comedy-drama series, that recently sold for a shade under £1million, £1/2 million houses are common. Thing is, many people have owned those houses for years, the current value doesn’t reflect what the owners may have paid for them. My 3-bed semi is valued at around £200k - I paid £30k for it.

Kinloch Hourn springs to mind, 50+ miles from fort bill)

my friend lives right at the end of that road - two hour round trip to the nearest shop. In his case living there is his job.

In the SE We're basically all working on Cross Rail and HS2 so the "London commuter Belt" can expand and include, well all of the UK... You lucky people!

The truth all of those big conurbations you see on the maps outside of the M25, they're just like any other town anywhere else in the UK, there are industrial parks and retail centres and local government authorities and petrol stations, schools, hospitals and pubs, etc, etc. They all employ people, mostly from the surrounding area pretty much just like you do oop North.

Anyone who bought a 3 bed semi in central London 40 years ago for about 100k will have found themselves with a property worth millions.

I would have assumed many ordinary folks doing not massively paid jobs in London decide to escape with a huge wedge of cash from selling some shithole in Wimbledon and buying some multi million pound house in countryside, morgage free.

Certainly that's what I'd be doing.

Born & raised in Guildford - my parents' first house (bought the year before I was born, they were in late 20s) cost £12k iirc. 3 bed Edwardian semi walking distance from the train station. Now sells for £550k upwards - can't imagine young couples affording that now so no idea who's buying then!

They sold the family home (4 bed detached) on the outskirts of Guildford 2 years ago and upped sticks to the Malverns into a bigger place for the same money, both now retired. I think most of the similar size properties in the area are owned by similar people.

If I'd had the nous to buy in my early 20s instead of spending my money gigging, pubbing and clubbing then I'd have bought something at £100k that's now worth £400k, more fool me. As it is, self and OH both work in engineering (me for an EV R&D company, her as a manager for a bus manufacturer) and live in a modest 2-bed terrace on the Surrey/Hants border. Our 1970s estate is mostly £450k+ detached, seem to be split between older families (parents in their 50s) and retirees. The fewer smaller places like ours seem to be young professionals, a few builders/plumbers/etc. Just normal people.

@Peekay
... on the flip side, you live in the South East of England.

This is a very strange thread.

Basically, in that area you are within communing distance of a huge numbers of employers: anything in and around Guildford, staines, farnham, Farnborough, aldershit, fleet, basingstoke, bracknell, reading, slough, and then most places in S and SE london.

I've commuted to Southampton every day from that area too: 45 minutes each way.

For example, almost the entire British pharma industry is in that area (apart from a few outliers).

@idiotdogbrain: My grandmother lived on Guildford park road until she died - right opposite the station entrance, I shudder to think how much that place must be worth now.

Anyone who bought a 3 bed semi in central London 40 years ago for about 100k will have found themselves with a property worth millions.

Really, your figures seem a bit out. There aren’t really many 3 bed semis in Central London (Westminster, the City, pretty much zone 1) if you mean Greater London the vast majority if not all still won’t be worth millions. Anything with multi millions in Wimbledon now won’t have been affordable to the reasonably paid forty years ago either.

The father in law is a good example, he bought his village house back in the 90’s, £290k, now worth well over £1m. He is the owner of two medium sized business and countless smaller ones. His neighbours are all very similar to him, business owners at close to retirement age and lived in the village for a long time. Only one person I can think of who recently moved into the village commutes to London, he’s quite senior in a technology company.
Father in laws main business is owning large petrol service stations with mini supermarkets. Also leases two of his out to a well known retail chain for ridiculous sums of cash, 20 year deal and he doesn’t do anything apart from take the yearly payments from them.
My wife recently joined the family business, she looks after his property portfolio. Nothing major, 5 flats and 3 houses.
Father in law also has a house in Florida, on what is known as Millionaires row. His neighbours are an ex Olympic athlete, a former politician and a casino owner.
As a bit of an interesting aside, the father in law comes from money but he did everything of his own bat. Wouldn’t take any family money. He’s East African, was sent to the UK in the 1970s during the Idi Amin troubles, aged 12 with no direct family over here. Was looked after by the African community in North London. left state school at 15. Got a job working in a petrol station at 16 and vowed he would one day own one.

I usually wonder what people do when I am in places I go on holiday, like part of Cornwall, the Lake District or out in the French country side or up in the Alps where there isn’t any obvious signs of big industry anywhere near close

Generally they are commuting into London during the week from their houses in the Home Counties. Second and holiday home ownership takes up a lot of property within the Lakes. Most of those 'residents' in village cottages are visitors. Then you have a lot of people who retire to the Lake District. The people who work in a National Park don't always live in it - too pricey.

Awesome story wOOdster.

I'm another Guildford resident, albeit in the crappier part (OK, it's not inner city Tottenham but Guildford does have rubbish areas and sink estates too)  I guess I'd count as one of the lucky ones; my first house in Woking cost £68K that I had a 5% deposit for, I sold that 5 years later for £170K and then bought a do-er upper for £210K, so my mortgage at that time was £130K to give the funds for the doing up.

It's now worth around £400K. The problem I have is that I was (mis?)-sold an interest only mortgage and standalone endowments so my interest at current rates is about £100 a month. My endowments however are also crap and so any disposable income I have now goes into paying down the capital. I still owe about £65K with 10 years or so to find it, so although we live OK, we're not exactly rolling in it - 6 year old average car, my bike cost me £1000 not £8000 (and it's also 7 years old, etc.), we did save up for a decent holiday 2 years ago but equally having to pay for private counselling and medical for my son costs a lot.

On paper I'm + £300K but no means to access it, and if we looked at moving/remortgaging I wouldn't get the same rates and my repayments would go up substantially, leaving me in the same position as I am now doing my own repayments but paying a chunk more interest. Only way out is when the kids move out, we can sell up and move away, or just wait to die at which point the insurance pays it off.

(not a bad option for the wife - then the insurance covers the house and my death in service benefit and the endowments not being needed for the mortgage - she'd be sorted. How much does it cost to employ a food tester?)

Ace story w00dster

Off topic, but https://www.geoguessr.com/ sounds right up your street OP

That’s the rest of my day gone.

As a curtain maker I have for many years gone into these sorts of properties to measure up for quotes.
Many are owned by business men/women. Many were owned by surgeons and dentists, many homes were either passed down or bought with inheritance. Many are owned by footballers, famous people (high earning actors or popstars), some by retired people who had good jobs and bought at the right time and never sold up when their children left.
The biggest property I made curtains for was an old hall hall near Knutsford, Cheshire so in a rural area but still not far from Manchester, the owner was some big business man.
There are plenty of houses I used to visit in the golden Cheshire triangle (Wilmslow, Prestbury, Alderley Edge) all huge and some owned by young couples and with the younger owners I never really got to know what they did.
Luckily for me these people were rich enough to keep having me back for more work over the years.

WFH revolution is driving up house prices in more rural and remote areas so I suspect I’ll be priced out of the market.

Before the violins start, could I just point out that the same WFH rush is actually pricing almost every young person who lives in these places out of the market too?

Wish I had the grit to start a business like that! I wouldn't even know where to start let alone actually be able to run a business to success.

Well, my sister works for a website called onlyfans.com most days. Seems to do alright by all accounts. Nice house in Dorking. Owns a fast car too.

Very interesting website thank you, I spent a good afternoon doing research and my bank account seems to be £500 lighter.

Jokes aside, seems the themes are:

1 - They're all old(er) and bought the houses for 200k in the 80's. The cars are all on lease because they cleared their mortgage years ago, so £500 a month for an XC90 is ez money.
2 - They do all commute to London, after all
3 - Theres a bunch of industry i'm not aware of in these areas eg, Pharma.
4 - They've all started their own businesses.

Seems I'm on completely the wrong track. That said I don't miss driving 30 minutes each way to get to work. Maybe I'll stick to getting the tube...

I think even the most seasoned riders think spending £8k on a bike is mental, difference is we absolutely love riding.

But some people do spend that money on bikes (and they also love riding).

I don’t think that many people are absolutely in love with a Volvo XC90 yet you see them everywhere.

I think you might be surprised then. Just like some people like to spend lots on nice bikes and love them, some people spend lots on nice cars and absolutely love them – if they love cars like XC90s so what?

I think it's an incredibly fair hypothesis to say "More people are in love with cycling than there are people in love with Volvo XC90's"

I think it's another incredibly fair hypothesis to say "The Volvo XC90 is not a particularly popular car among car enthusiasts".

It's a very safe, very capable, alright looking car. But enthusiast or cult vehicle it is not. I don't see people meeting up in Tesco Extra carparks on a Sunday night to meet other Volvo XC90 enthusiasts.

Yet, you see them everywhere. Ergo, you can reasonably assume those who buy XC90s are not buying them out of love or enthusiasm like you might an £8k road bike. Therefore you extrapolate that the money they spend on a monthly repayment is not significant enough to represent an 'emotional purchase'.

If it was an RS4 or BMW M4 I'd totally see your point. But you're arguing for a Volvo XC90.