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Your risk of having a heart attack or stroke within the next 10 years is:3.6%
How's that? I got 6.2 and answered "no" to all the negative health indicator/risk factor questions, have a BMI bang in the middle of the range, have always had blood pressure in the middle of the healthy range, and am aged (narrowly) under 60.
but am still not sure how I will tell if they are working other than still waking up alive in the morning as there appear to be no measurable effects
Agreed.. and this is the issue I often face in discussions! It's not like you get a letter through the door saying "you WOULD have had a stroke today, but the statin stopped it!"
Good luck in whatever you do...
DrP
Details of my concerned emailed to GP and will request an appointment next Friday when I have some time available.
johnX - The numbers I used were
53 age
Nothing wrong
Cholesterol 3.9
BP 95
Std Dev left blank as I don't have it
height 180
weight 97kg
I was playing around with the Q-risk calculator and found that I can reduce my risk by a factor of 6 simply by becoming 20 years younger! Why don't the doctors tell you that instead of just prescribing statins eh? Makes you think.
Q-Risk calculator
Interesting. I have long wondered, based on what is occurring, whether suffering from migraines increased the likelihood of strokes in later life. That is the first time that I have seen a stated possible connection.
My mum is pressing the neurologist on which drugs he could / should be taking, but I’m not sure if she’s being patient enough – anecdotal evidence from someone she knows is that the anti-seizure drug he’s on can take a few weeks to adapt to.
This is true, anti-seizure meds can take a while to get used to.
Also, serious events such as strokes and seizures in themselves are likely to make someone feel relatively more knackered and shit in the medium term.
However, if she feels that any medication is not working well in terms of side-effects, it's always worth a direct conversation. There are plenty of different types of statins (and anticonvulsive meds for that matter), one of which may work better for him. Doctors don't want prevention at the cost of an active lifestyle, as the second is just as important, probably more.
I was playing around with the Q-risk calculator and found that I can reduce my risk by a factor of 6 simply by becoming 20 years younger!
Getting old is rubbish, it's official.
Same answers at 64 and my risk goes up to 8.5%
Just a thought WCA your systolic reading is close to the low pressure end, could this be causing your white fingers?
I’ve been told by a doctor friend that whatever changes in lifestyle accounts for a very small percentage change, especially if you have a genetic issue which I have. My high cholesterol was discovered when I was just about in the fittest state in my life.
Same here, got detected after my dad had his triple Bypass, his lifestyle wasn't bad and neither was mine, probably also my fittest ever and there wasn't really much on the diet that would change as I wasn't really eating fry-ups every day.
Genetic dispositions can suck, I'd rather have to suffer the indignity of an elephant sized **** than flat feet and high cholesterol 🙂
I’d rather have to suffer the indignity of an elephant sized ****
This doesn't sound like the worst thing in the world.
Oddly as an aside Granny DoD lived to about 95 on a diet of Lard slathered on white bread and bacon and chips cooked in fat,whilst the male line seemed to die with Heart attacks etc, for me taking them is a bit of a no brainer, I suppose you should also take into account the family health history and weigh that up.
Whenever I hear about white finger it always reminds me of Vibration White Finger from a life and pension system I worked on waay back, it was a well grim system tbh.
No family history of heart disease. Mothers side women all lived to almost 100 and men died of lung cancer, possibly because they smoked 60 a day all their lives. Dad side the all seem to die of various different cancers or trucks.
Getting old is rubbish, it’s official
I know. And that 6.2% risk of heart attack/stroke in the next 10 years is salutory, with zero familial risk (bar my dad having a stroke at 85. You don't want to have a stroke btw so take the bloody statins) and no risk factors of my own. It's almost like the older you get the closer you get to death. Ha well.
I refused statins about 6 months ago, my GP surgery said that as I was over 60, and a diabetic in remission , my chance of a heart attack had gone up to 10%.
Oddly when I was 59 and 354 days old it was only 5%.
I blood pressure is good ( if not a little low) , my resting heart rate in low 50s.
But my cholesterol is 0.5 higher than where it should be (which is most likely genetic).
I said I would consider statins once a Dr discussed why they work and why I needed them. The first consultation was hopeless with a GP who knew less about them than I did. The next GP I had a phon consultation with talk about to pros/ cons, how they "might" work, and NHS stats that were driving the NHS to get me to take them.
She suggested we talked about it when I was 65.
My issue is statins is that I get shocking cramp - esp if I ride in the evenings. I take in salt, potassium, magnesium and drink loads. I try to stretch out and use a Theragun as well.
One side of statins is cramps - and she could not guarantee that any of the current option would not do this.
One side of statins is cramps
Very rare - as above the incidence of side effects with statins is vastly overstated - the nocebo effect
My thoughts are that at the moment I am relatively fit, healthy and have no unexpected pains so if I start taking statins and develop cramps and pains I can be fairly sure they are caused by the statins and either change them or stop.
Low dose statins here - genetics unfortunately. Absolutely no side effects. Atorvastatin 20mg
If you're prescribed a statin, you may be able to continue drinking alcohol. However, you should not drink more than 14 units of alcohol a week.
https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/statins/considerations/
I'm out then.
14 units is the recommended amount for everyone
My thoughts are that at the moment I am relatively fit, healthy and have no unexpected pains so if I start taking statins and develop cramps and pains I can be fairly sure they are caused by the statins and either change them or stop.
seems reasonable
14 units is the recommended amount for everyone
Shit, I'm under that most weeks. Better get back on the gin....
I love patients like this
I bet you do. For all those of you getting a holistic view then you are lucky as that has not been my experience with at all with wife or sister who have both used health "services" a lot.
I just take what the doctor tells me. Bit old fashioned but I tend to believe they want me to feel better and live longer so I’ll go with their professional opinion.
For all those of you getting a holistic view then you are lucky as that has not been my experience with at all with wife or sister who have both used health “services” a lot.
Would suggest that you accompany your wife to any medical appointments, a male witness can be useful.
I refused statins about 6 months ago, my GP surgery said that as I was over 60, and a diabetic in remission , my chance of a heart attack had gone up to 10%.
Oddly when I was 59 and 354 days old it was only 5%.
Obviously those things don't go up overnight but scales in line with your increasing age. I don't know precisely how QRisk works (CBA looking it up) but I'm assuming it puts people in age 'bins' E.g. 55-59 and 60-64. Your calculated risk probably compares an average 57.5 year old to a 62.5 year old. But you knew this.
I blood pressure is good ( if not a little low) , my resting heart rate in low 50s.
But my cholesterol is 0.5 higher than where it should be (which is most likely genetic).
I said I would consider statins once a Dr discussed why they work and why I needed them. The first consultation was hopeless with a GP who knew less about them than I did. The next GP I had a phon consultation with talk about to pros/ cons, how they “might” work, and NHS stats that were driving the NHS to get me to take them.
As DrP says, your GP is offering advice and won't lose sleep if you decline to follow that advice. There's no grand conspiracy where the man wants you to take mind-bending drugs. There's just some very good population data that says risk = w, and the cost of statins for people at risk = x. Meanwhile the cost of treatment and care for heart attack and stroke and lost earnings etc = y and the risk reduction of statins is z.
w * x < y * z
Obviously it's probably slightly more complex than that, but you get the gist.
She suggested we talked about it when I was 65.
She was fed up with the conversation, ticked the box on the form for QOF to say 'statin recommended', and moved on with her life 😉
As a doctor I'm always bemused by people that think they're doing me a favour by taking my advice. It's a weird culture that we seem to have developed in the UK - I'm not sure if it happens elsewhere (E.g. when people have to pay for advice / treatment). Conversely, I don't usually mind when people ignore my advice, either.
The problem with statins, I think, is that decision-making is clouded by a sense of youthful invincibility. People don't like being told they're no longer young, particularly if they've never been ill before. They don't like being forced to think about their mortality or nasty things like strokes, immediately after their big 60th birthday party (or whatever). So they make what are probably slightly irrational decisions to ignore the problem, or do some mental backflips until it no longer applies to them. All the while, their GP is nudging them to confront the issue and I guess it seems adversarial. I'd be interested to hear any strategies for dealing with this.
RE the Q risk..as you all spotted it gives a 10 year risk.. which can be skewed LOW if you're young...
Can ALSO play around with the LIFETIME risk, as opposed to 10 year risk...
I often talk about cholesterol and BP like a pension... "it's not the next weeks or months that matter greatly...it's the years and years away where it REALLY makes a difference.."
Thus a midly high BP for a short time isn't immediately catastrophic, but left like that it'll do long term damage eventually..
Statins and BP control aim to reduce this. But the benefit is years away...
DrP
A couple of people on here have said that getting old is rubbish. Be as it may, but it's the only thing keeping you alive.
Take the meds you've been prescribed and if you don't feel worse as a result keep on keeping on.
I'm quite enjoying getting old. 69th birthday this week which I marked by going out for a 69 mile ride (although a Strava error meant I only ended up doing 67) I felt fine next day so did a Pilates session in the morning and as it was breezy went windsurfing to use my birthday present - a big 7.8m triple cam sail. I enjoyed it so much I went again yesterday (even breezier).
Seems to be some debate about the value of statins for those at low risk.