@Coyote
"My experience and that of many others I know through running suggests otherwise. Please name your sources or quit with the potentially damaging advice."
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/06/130614100821.htm
Plenty more around.
N+1 is shoes is real.
First you have the various levels if wear (mile approximate based on feel of the shoe):
New - need to be worn in with some short runs and maybe some treadmill work
Prime - Between 50 and 100 mile old, in their prime
Wet - 100 - 200 miles, not prime but perfect for training and wet, long runs
Old - 200+ miles, relegated to muddy runs and shorter stuff.
Retired - Walking, gardening, casual wear
You then have the different usages:
Race - Fast shoes, currently a pair Nike Streak's with a pair of VaporFly's on the way. Plus some old Saucony spikes for track work.
Training - Cushioned shoes for weekly training and long miles. Nike Pegasus for me, mostly 36's, a pair of 37's and pair of ASICS Cumulus
Trail - Nike Pegasus Trail, fine for light off road stuff mixed with road work but not great in pure mud. The gravel bike of running shoes.
Mud - Kalenji trail things. A bit narrow for long mileage but grip like nothing else.
XC - Another pair of spikes, ASICS I think.
And then you need a lot of storage...
Nike Pegasus is a good shout as are New Balance 860 and 880. Both have good support, are quite light and provide a degree of arch support.
I definitely wouldn't recommend barefoot shoes if you're no used to running in them. The natural reaction to the increased impact of barefoot shoes is to run on your toes, which will cripple your calf muscles inside of 3km and you won't be able to walk downstairs for a week.
If you want to run barefoot style, the best thing is to practice landing completely flat footed in your standard running shoes, then progress to some ultralights, then onto something like VFF once you're certain that you can almost flat foot run.
It took me months and months to be able to run a 10k in VFFs, whereas a normal set of shoes was just lace-up and go.
paul_m mentioned saddles and this is the thing here, same with pillows, with mattresses; it might feel ok in the shop but how will they feel after time spent in or on them.
I have freakishly long middle toes and therefore, it seems, I need to both go up half a size in a normal size shoe, and have a wide toe box. I’m also tight and would rather buy bike parts, meat and beer 🙂
Worst running shoes I ever bought were full price Asics. I went to a running shop, did the gait analysis. They recommended the fit and size. My heels were ripped to shreds every time I wore them. Previously I'd been wearing some Nike trail shoes to run in, ran my first few 10ks and a half marathon in them but thought I'd better get some proper shoes from a proper shop. I was wrong.
Another one tried to get me to run on a treadmill to look at my gait for the shoes I'd chosen. They were fell shoes - Mudclaws. Not sure a treadmill can replicate a bog.
Anyway, since then I've been sceptical about the advice from running shops. I'm a convert to whatever Nike Pegasus is in the outlet shop, preferably 2 seasons ago as they're about £25-30. Brooks seem to fit me too so I bought some Cascadia's (old model obviously) for local off-road.
There is a lot of bollocks advice about running - gait analysis, barefoot shoes, massive Hoka things. It does seem like it's mostly a way to get you to buy stuff. I'd get some cheap-ish OK shoes, save the £50/60 and use that to enter some events - that'll motivate you to get out and run more.
Fair enough but I stand by my and others' experience. I started running and had a lot of problems. Only when I got my gait analysed and bought the right shoes did I start to make progress.
New Balance 860s are my goto although I picked up a pair of Saucony quite cheap. Once you know which shoes fit, then you can shop around.
I guess that some things work for some people some of the time? 🙂
The one constant is that I am currently using my NB 860s more than any other shoes, maybe the OP should get them.
I started like you with some cheap trainers but once I realised they hurt my feet I bought some generic Nike runners from THAT MAN for about £40. They were decent enough to be fair. Once they started getting tired my wife convinced me to go to a proper running shop to get fitted. Once there I didn't do any running or stuff like that, just had a chat with the assistant, she measured my feet with a thing that showed what sort of instep I had then I tried on trainers she recommended due to my fitting. Ended up with some brand I'd not heard of and spent £120 but by gosh they're comfy! Saucony are the brand I think?
My wife runs far more than me and has settled on Asics as her go to trainer.
Potentially opening a can of worms here… but anything ‘barefoot’ like.
Alway a bit misunderstood I think.
Big cushiony runners allow people to pound their heels into the road and get away with a poor running style. This causes injuries.
Barefooted trainers don't allow you go do this as much, you have to be a lot lighter on you feet with a forefoot landing or a quick heel tap and roll.
Here's the thing though... Get a pair of low of zero drop shoes.... But with 15-20mm of cushioning....aaaaand....
Learn to run properly!
It's easy to pound out grinding miles with a bit of training but it's not a good long term plan. Form should be top of the agenda and if you can't hold decent form then train this. It will involve more intervals, faster pace, gliding running, floating across the track. Low contact time with the ground, upright, high arms.
So many properties who train for a marathon are simply training their body to survive a marathon.
Bit of a rant but I've seen so many friends take up running and get injured through pushing on through bad form.
I’ve been running since my early teens and over 40 years later still run regularly up to 50k. The fastest way to injury is worn out shoes - replace them regularly eg 300 miles and ideally keep a couple of pairs going. If nothing else, start with a neutral, cushioned shoe like a Pegasus and see how you get on. Zero drop/ barefoot shoes would be a disaster for a beginner - rapid way to injury as it takes time to adapt / change running style - I got lots of niggly problems - went to Hokas and got fewer injuries and set PRs
Whatever Alf Tupper wore will serve you well. Likely pit boots or similar 🙂
ASICS gt1000 9. Just bought a pair to replace my sauconys. Reasonable at £63.
When I started using On Running shoes a few years ago they only made one model and I would be the only one on the start line wearing them. Now they make about 20 and everybody is wearing them.
This proves two thing:
1) they are great shoes - would recommend
2) I am an ITK progressive trend-setter.
In other news, I have a ridiculous single speed gravel bike, so that will be the choice of every other tubby, all-gear-no-idea sportive rider in 5 years time. Obvs.
massive Hoka things
Have to defend my Hoka road shoes - they might look massive but it's an optical illusion as they're featherweight, and only 4mm drop (I think). Lovely shoes.
Retired – Walking, gardening,
casual wear
Running shoes are never casual wear. NEVER.
@surfer
it is snake oil ... trying to control very strong forces such as pronation I think doesnt work well.
@hugo
Learn to run properly!
My experience, as a newbie runner, was that switching from normal trainers to more supportive shoes actually altered my running style.
My impact point altered and I started to notice more as I pronated because I could feel the support pushing back, so I tried to do it less. My muscles hurt in new and interesting places, but I avoided the Achilles/calf injuries that had previously prevented me from consistently running 5K.
So perhaps it is a bit of both? Perhaps the right trainers help you learn to run properly?
Running shoes are never casual wear. NEVER.
This is correct.
So perhaps it is a bit of both? Perhaps the right trainers help you learn to run properly?
I think it's even more complicated.
Over engineered efforts can alter the running style assertively.
Neutral but cushioned ones can allow a range of technique from good to bad!
There's an argument for using barefoot shoes to learn to run, short distances and technique, but then use the same technique with cushioning for win win.
I am sceptical of too much focus on form/style/technique I think training and repetition take care of this. I have ran against so many runners over the years who don't appear stylish and are very fast and those that do appear stylish and aren't. I think your body adapts and if you practice running lots of miles and running very quickly, your biomechanics will take care of the rest.
edit: when I say stylish even mediocre runners cant be too "ragged" if you are running close to 4 min milling for 800/1500 then you cant have "bad" style
