Listen to the sound on the vid in this ad:
I thought maybe a timing belt/valve problem, but it actually runs - but on listening closely it's misfiring occasionally so perhaps. In any case replacement whole engines are only £600. What could possibly go wrong? I've obviously done loads of car work but I have never opened up an engine bigger than 3.5cc.
My wife has always been dead against me getting a literal project car, but on the other hand her dream car has always been a blue MX5 and it's cheap enough that it might be a possibility.
Go for it, so long as there are pictures that is.
I can't see the video but there's loads of info about these cars and the duratec engine on this website http://www.duratecnc.co.uk/?p=52
The engines are notorious for munching themselves if you don't keep on top of oil changes. The standard oil gauge doesn't work so by the time you see the light it's too late. They also rust like it's their job.
I'd love an NC but I'd be buying the newest, cleanest one I could get.
I have always fancied rebuilding an engine. It looks like a fairly straightforward setup with enough space.
Easy enough to swap an MX5 engine in a driveway over a weekend. If I bought it I would do basic diagnostics, then pull the cam cover for a look, then probably swap in a known good engine. It sounds very mechanical, you might get a better idea in person, a screwdriver makes a ghetto stethoscope for trying to identify the rough area.
I would be more concerned about the MOT corrosion advisories on the suspension mountings, inner sills, chassis rails, floor, seatbelt mounting area etc etc. Also given its multiple shades of blue, has rear quarter damage, has been lowered, aftermarket wheels, ducktail and its poverty spec its really not such a bargain.
There are loads of NC MX5s for sale cheap, so you can afford to be picky. There are also loads for sale very cheap as MOT fails for rust, so you really want to be picky.
But if its local and you are bored no harm in making a cheeky offer. Stripping an engine is interesting if you enjoy playing with mechanical stuff, and great to learn on one that does not matter when you have time.
As long as you buy it expecting to swap the motor… I don’t like the sound of that at all.
But with a spare motor and a bit of effort… 🙂
and you might get lucky and it’s something and nothing
Oh, that's mucking mucked, sounds like big ends from that vid.
Be more worried about the rust in the (multi-skinned) front chassis rails. And the whole thing seems generally unloved.
But at that price, there's not much to lose!
I would be more concerned about the MOT corrosion advisories on the suspension mountings, inner sills, chassis rails, floor, seatbelt mounting area etc etc
Ah bollocks. I just ran the check too. I'm not going near anything rusty. Shame, as the engine was beginning to sound like a fun project.
My wife has always been dead against me getting a literal project car
Don't listen to the engine, listen to your wife 🙂
The cars a bit rough in general, add in the cost and hassle of an engine swop - how does it then stack up against other MX5's of similar age but in same/better condition?
Looks like about £2.5k for similar age and condition cars mins the clattering sound.
I’m agreeing with molgrips conclusion on this one.
Ah bollocks. I just ran the check too. I’m not going near anything rusty.
an engine swap or engine rebuild makes for a nice project if you’ve got a bit of time. A rusty chassis and body is a * *
What @bigyan says, mx5's rot for fun, that's why engines are cheap and plentiful, the car desolves around them.
These are famous for it and generally just not economic to rebuild, what with the ease of finding rusted out or crashed donor cars. Mine was a 2 litre, it had just a minor rattle off idle (they're quite low oil pressure at idle) but that was still enough to have got material all through the engine, and also of course assuming it was oil starved it's not just the damage you can hear, I had obvious overheating marks on the cam journals that would have happened at the same time. Repairable but just not worth it.
(it's not absolutely impossible that it's something simple like a pulley, but, it takes 10 secnds to check that so you should assume it's the engine nad that it's properly dead.)
As others say, buy on condition, a genuinely low rust NC is hard to find and I am very skeptical, the pics all look well used and not babied. Having said that the MOT history isn't an absolute showstopper, advisories can be all over the place. Mine was very scabby but not quite holed, probably one winter away from needing welded but even that meant a massive refurb job to stop it getting worse. Not cost effective to have a pro do it, it's so time consuming and leads to all sorts of complications like "the subframe is rusty and we could replace that except all the suspension bolts are seized so we have to cut all the arms out", I diy'd it and it took forever. Replacing the engine is way easier than fixing rust.
(and you can absolutely spend 10 times as much as this one and still find rust, or worse a beautifully undersealed underside hiding someone else's bodge. There's a good argument for "buy a somewhat rusty one and fix it" compared to "pay for a supposedly rust free one but maybe it's not")
OM NOM NOM 2.5 LITRE SNACKS
One million hours of wire wheeling later
OTOH they're pretty easy to work on, the owner's club and online advice etc is awesome and I'm still probably only into mine for about £4500 with allnew bushings, shocks, etc and just over 200bhp at the wheels. It looks like crap and tbh it sounds horrible, but it'll outlast petrol unless I drive it through a wall.
I don't know how to post images obviously.
Multiple MX-5 owner here. Bit late to the party but that ones buggered, yes. Big end oil starvation. Rings will be dead too.
You don't rebuild those 2 litres. You replace it with a 2.5.
Its also an SE and you don't want that as you dont get the 6 speed.
And finally, itll be completely rotten. I absolutely 100% guarantee.
So not only did they copy the spirit of 60s British sports cars, they copied the rust too.
Duff engine is calling out for the Rocketeer V6 conversion.
I wouldn’t class that wheel arch damage as minor either
Wrong version for the Rocketeer swap. Absolutely nothing shared with the NA or NB model.
To clarify my position... They are brilliant cars, especially with 180-200hp, trick suspension and setup, light wheels and sticky tyres.
See?
Just not that one you have in your link!
Or.......offer them a real low ball scrap value for it, chuck a replacement engine in it, slap £50 of Fertan and Dinitrol underneath it, roller paint it with Rustoleum or Raptor and rag the absolute shit out of it on trackdays.
I have always fancied rebuilding an engine. It looks like a fairly straightforward setup with enough space.
It's good fun. I rebuilt a mini engine on the kitchen table! Before the fancy fitted kitchen went in obvs.
Not read all the post but suspect someone has already flagged a key thing to inspect - sunglasses holder...and with that model, check for signs of rust in that as well!
One of the selling points of the Rocketeer was a huge power increase for minimal weight gain. Last time I looked they said themselves there was no point swapping an NC because the alloy blocked duratec is already much lighter than the V6. I didn't realise they'd changed their minds.
The best way to make an NC go properly fast is with forced induction. They also make good power and noise for a lot less money with ITB's.
I've had 'BBR MX5' as a saved search on eBay for about a year.
I had a passenger ride in one with Meister coil overs and a full alignment from Roddisons and I've been slightly obsessed with them ever since.
Rotisserie has been a God send and worth every penny. She did her Evo 5 on axle stands over a pit
Not many actual sports cars I fancy, a Honda S2000 is one and a recent model MX5 with a V6 engine swap. I would insist on it being the most recent body shape, because I struggle with getting out of many two-seat cars, a Mercedes SLK being particularly embarrassing, I literally had to crawl out on my hands and knees!
Having access to several recent MX5’s at my last job, I discovered I could not only get into the car easily, I could get out easily as well, which came as quite a surprise!
I’d need a hefty cash injection first, mind.
@sharkattack, agreed, the V6 doesn't make much sense to me either, Rocketeer basically went "we're not going to do it, it makes no sense" but people keep asking for it so they're just following demand. If I wanted to spend £15 grand plus on an engine swap I wouldn't do it in a bloomin NC that's for sure, wouldn't be shooting for 350bhp max either for that matter.
On the other hand, I've literally never heard a duratec in any format or in any vehicle that didn't sound like absolute shit, the V6 would have that going for it at least.
Ugh, this is what puts me right off petrol head stuff. I don't want moar power, driving fast on public roads is a shitty antisocial thing to do. I just want a nice handling open top two seater that I can cruise around Wales in flowing nicely through some corners. There's no way I'd lower a car or stuff a faster engine in (with the possible exception of a V6 for the Merc because it's smoother and comes with taller gears). I would even prefer a new model MX5 to the old ones which I understand to be heresy.
And stripping a car down, whilst fun, is sadly impossible with the facilities I have available to me.
There’s no way I’d lower a car or stuff a faster engine in
It would be worth a V6 on the MX5 for the sound it made.
And it's lighter - weirdly
I don’t want moar power, driving fast on public roads is a shitty antisocial thing to do. I just want a nice handling open top two seater that I can cruise around Wales in flowing nicely through some corners.
That's the approach I took - and despite everyone telling me to avoid them I bought a 22yr old MG TF 18 months ago. It's been bloody brilliant, parts are cheap and there and many specialists around. Headgaskets do go but they're not an expensive fix and once done properly they last a long time.
I've done 6000 miles in mine the 18 months I've had it - used in all weathers and lives outdoors. Previous owner had done 5000 miles in 10 years!
Project ones can be had for buttons, nice ones can be as little as £3k.
And they take you back to when cars where simpler things, without going full classic car mode. And 50mph with the hood down feels plenty fast enough.
It would be worth a V6 on the MX5 for the sound it made.
I don't like noise.
MG TF you say?
This failed its MOT on subframe rust, but I can remove and replace a subframe...
Looks like SLKs are the best VFM in this market segment:
Only problem with that is it's in Troon, with no current MOT!
If you are looking at SLKs I suggest to watch the episode of Flipping Bangers where they did one of those!...
I love that - quite exciting, and a real shared sense of joy when it finally works (spoilers!). But those two clearly aren't that good with the electronics - they should have started by plugging it in immediately, even before purchase in fact. A lot of what the electrician talked about I've already been through on the Passat.
Yeah - they're not at the Marc Priestly level of car mechanics, but they more relatable to most bodge-it home mechanics! 🙂
The one thing my MX5 gets checked religiously is oil! Duratecs have marginal feed to the big end and base of cylinder 1 if the oil pump is mildly degraded or the wrong gunk buildup occurs. This one has done exactly as my garage warns me to keep it tippy topped. Mine has just had the rusty sills and bits sorted too so I could do with the engine keeping going for a while.
Ugh, this is what puts me right off petrol head stuff. I don’t want moar power, driving fast on public roads is a shitty antisocial thing to do. I just want a nice handling open top two seater that I can cruise around Wales in flowing nicely through some corners
Last of the MR2s? Early Boxster? Audi TT? BMW Z3?
Well she's messaged me back and says that the rust has all been fixed. She said that the noise came on when she was doing a high speed overtake. Not sure if that means something's broken? You'd think that if it were big end wear it would have come on gradually - unless the oil pump has failed or something.
I don’t like noise.
I didn't say noise, I said sound.
One's banging pots and pans, the other is Anna Lapwood at the organ
+1 rocketeer is really for the epic sound rather than the power. Otherwise it would make no sense compared to just turboing.
Blue MK2.5 owner here 6 years in and MOT is still rust free, I got lucky (and keep drains clear and don't use it in the winter)
One’s banging pots and pans, the other is Anna Lapwood at the organ
Cars don't make music they make noise.
If I went to look at the car, presumably I'd be able to see the rust or lack of, from underneath? Presumably that's how the MOT tester found it.
EDIT well I've asked to go and see it, see if she lets me poke about underneath with a mirror...
For only a bit more cash I can get a fully working SLK with an automatic hardtop and automatic gearbox. Thing is, it's the blue MX-5 she has always wanted, which is the only reason I have any buy-in, but she hates driving manuals. But, would she even want to drive an SLK given it's not her dream car? Emotion is a factor here. The good SLKs I've seen are also not blue.
EDIT well I’ve asked to go and see it, see if she lets me poke about underneath with a mirror
Magnet? The bits that got welded on my 944 all started to rust again at the welds as they’d not treated the other side of the joint, out of sight out of mind. Granted it took a few years but it’s pretty thick/decent steel.
A MX5 is this week's Pistonheads shed of the week;
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=23&t=2105202
@Mol, honestly I didn't personally enjoy the testdrives I did in the gen 1 and gen 2 SLK but from what you described it could suit you really well. TBH even if you're not into power, the smaller engines just felt <wrong>, it wants to be an effortless cruiser and the little supercharged engine sounds lovely but it's always working, never cruising. Felt like 2 cars having an argument. If memory serves one of the ones I drove was the lowest power V6 in a gen 2 and that felt absolutely in keeping, not exciting but fine. A bit expensive to run, I think? Just swinging it through corners without hurrying was when it was best and it was properly good at that.
Meanwhile, the NC is actually a perfectly sensible car but the build quality just wasn't great even when they were new, they can be creaky and noisy inside and have next to no soundproofing and lots of not very well attached plastic. Soft top doesn't always age well and at best tends to be a little damp, very glad I have the PRHT even though it adds weight and complexity and rusty bootlids.
But also once they wear out suspension parts they often either get cheap polybushings (because oem rubber bushings aren't available, you have to replace whole arms) or more likely just ignored. And sorting it can be pretty involved. (mine needed actual warfare to get all the suspension apart even enough to do an alignment, and some of the bushings basically no longer existed, the car inexplicably still drove OK despite that but it groaned and shook and clanked and slammed. I think they were all original after 100000 miles and that showed both in condision and seized-in bolts and such. Once they're a few years old these just tend not to be babied and it really adds up by owner number 7. There are great examples out there and they start at 10 times what this one's for sale for and don't come with dents etc.
So literally none of the ones I test drove said "good cruiser", they all said "ratty weekend toy for ragging around and enjoying a bit of rawness". You can improve all that but only to a point. The 2 litre is fat enough to cruise around in OK, the 1.8 felt a bit empty to me and not in a nice way, it's fine when you really drive it but it <needs> to rev, the 2 litre likes to rev but doesn't absolutely have to. (compared to, say, the 1.6 in the NA which makes like 19 horsepower or something but it just suits the car completely, the 1.8 in the bigger fatter NC for me does not, it feels unsurprisingly like it belongs in a fiesta).
As far as this exact NC you're looking at, "the rust is fixed" could be good news or terrible news and tbh it's just going to be really hard to know because either way it's likely to have a load of underseal on, whether it's "repaired" or "bodged" or "just covered up". The great advantage mine had was that it wasn't in great condition but it was unmolested, I could see everything that was wrong with it. Don't rely on a mirror, they're quite convoluted underneath, get it jacked up, the seller won't mind if they're genuine and if they do mind I would simply not even go and see it
If it's had a proper and thorough job done then it could be a fantastic bargain but tbf I doubt it, it'd be a lot of money to fix everything that was mentioned to a good standard and nothing about the ad says "I've spent a lot of money on this", tbh the seller just gives me terrible vibes. "Practically no rust. The underside is structurally perfect" just doesn't vibe with either "it has rust but it's not problematic yet" like the mots suggest or "it had rust but it's all been properly fixed" as they're saying. If I'd spent a grand or two on welding and rust treatment I'd bloody well say so. (and if I'd done it myself I'd put an engine in it, nobody who can fix that rust themselves would shy from that). Best case would be pictures of before/after and work in progress, a good rust repairer will often do that. Or receipts, lots of receipts.
Rear of sills and wheel wells in general is the obvious one but tbh at this age will often have already been fixed at least once and honestly I wouldn't hold it against it if it had. The rears have a carpet-style liner which can hold water, as well as rust flashspots on every bolt and of course around the edge of the arch. Front can go too. Repairs should be fairly obvious unless they're absolutely drowned in underseal. They have full length plastic sill covers but you can see the seam and jacking points. Examine subframes, they're large and full of spots to fill with water or dirt. Don't worry about the braces and stuff except as indicators, but do check the bit that the central X-brace bolts to, it's really thin and also easy to ground out so it gets damaged. Tap it all over nonharmfully like you're looking for a secret door, and listen for differences, you can often hear or feel a difference between underseal-over-crap and underseal-over-steel.
Check boot floor right out to the edges (ie behind the wheels,visible from underneath), partly because this gets bad but also because people tell themselves it's "nonstructural" and it doesn't hit the MOT specifics for mounting points. Mine had no outright holes but it had sheets of rust like a shipwreck that just showered off it, the remaining metal is probably about a micron thick. Check for water in footwells and boot, it's not a problem to fix but it speaks volumes about the owner if the easy fixes haven't been done and of course it worsens rust.
But these aren't "the places they rust", these are "the places to prioritise", the entire underside rusts which is why "it's all been fixed" is so dubious. There are MOT fixes, there are bodges and there are full repairs, and you are in a casino.
But just on vibes, no. Everything says this is not an owner that does everything right and will tell you what sounds good, it doesn't make it a bad buy but it's probably not what you say you want.
There’s no way I’d lower a car
Why are you looking at buying a lowered car that has been messed around with then?
Mk3 Mr2s are less rusty than MX5s in general if you want other cheap fun options.
Also there's that whole "NC1 is an MX5 on stilts" thing, they are just very tall for what they are and a moderate lowering is totally reasonable considering that later cars were lower from the factory. According to urban legend they added extra ride height at the last minute for safety testing reasons, no idea if that's true or not.
It would be a very strange decision to spend £ks fixing the rust and then shop the car for bottom dollar rather than spending a few hundred swapping the broken engine. I would not trust what the seller is saying, personally
People do run out of money or love or realise they're in a sunk cost fallacy. But even then, if that happened to you, your ad would say "I just spent X fixing the rust"
