I am also owned by a cat. That cat was going to be an indoor cat but it became really clear that he wanted to be out. I took him for a few walks with a harness, then let him go he stuck close by at first but then went further and further.. He's a much happier cat. (I know this doesn't apply for all cats)
Eg2, “dogs are often hit by cars.” The number one cause of testicular cancer is “having testicles,” what does the author propose as a solution here?
More cars.
As for house cats. Our previous three (four) had been normal cats. We got a pedigree that clearly wanted to be out as the existing cat was out. Unfortunately, ragdoll's aren't particularly 'bothered' about anything, and he got run over. Our rescue is kept in as he has cat flu, that can be spread to other non-vax cats, so we keep him in (his immune system isn't as good). Fortunately, since removing all his teeth - (gingivitis and ulcers on rescuing him) he's not been ill. MrsF and daughter had conspired to get more Ragdolls, so two kittens arrived soon after the rescue did, and a year later another (same parents) as the 'older cat' was getting old. We had 5 for a couple of years.
Pedigrees you'd usually keep in, depending upon the type, Ragdolls being a bit 'stupid' in they don't have the same natural 'oh shoot and leg it response' - they behave a bit more like dogs. The rescue get's out occasionally, but he's back within minutes. plus, the others having long fur, they'd come in tangled with branches.
I don’t particularly like injured or dead cats.
Me neither but I don't like imprisoned under-stimulated cats either. Cats need space. Seeing how much my cats like the outdoors I couldn't bring myself to lock them in all the time. I wouldn't want anyone to do that to me so I won't do it to them.
you absolute monster!!😉
mine just came back from vet yesterday after a £500 quid dental appointment. I wish I’d read that article before I burdened myself with the furry little money pit..
Intruiged as to why people (who have gardens and doors outside) have house cats.
we have 3 resuces, all were horrifically mistreated before we had them so have " issues" one is half blind and terrified of other humans, (he's fine with us having spent a lot of time working with him) the other 2 also have their foibles that mean that they would be lost/scared/dead in no time at all.
One of main requirements for taking them was that they were kept as house cats and we were specifically contacted by another rescue group to take on mike meowski (the one eyed loony) as our setup is so good and the best opportunity to try and give him a chance.
it takes a lot of time to make sure they have the stimulation they need, but it is perfectly possible if you know what you are doing.
people buy pedigree cats for entirely selfish, silly human reasons. Does not benefit cat-kind at all. Not a fan. Sorry.As for house cats. Our previous three (four) had been normal cats. We got a pedigree that clearly wanted to be out as the existing cat was out. Unfortunately, ragdoll’s aren’t particularly ‘bothered’ about anything, and he got run over.
if you live somewhere with really busy roads you probably shouldn't get a cat, because as said except in specific cases they like going outside! Was actually a factor in us rejecting a few otherwise nice houses when house-hunting! I guess if you have enough outdoor space you could build a nice enclosed "catio" 🤔Me neither but I don’t like imprisoned under-stimulated cats either. Cats need space. Seeing how much my cats like the outdoors I couldn’t bring myself to lock them in all the time.
Although (because?) I'm a fan of animals & have pets, I actually would not oppose a ban on private pet ownership if it were introduced (not that it would happen) as I think overall the animals would benefit.
2/3rds of the mammal population currently on the planet are bred so that humans can eat them.
I'm pretty sure that humans and rats are the most numerous species of mammal. I think you mean 2/3 of the mammal biomass, not 2/3 of the population.
I strongly agree with the article. I've been chased and bitten by dogs, they've terrified my children on occasion and we're constantly having to avoid their sh*t when walking, cycling etc. Working dogs fine but that's where I draw the line.
Regardless of empathy, I'm amazed people are getting dogs when there's a climate crisis on. The research I did a little while ago suggested that a dog has the same environmental impact a year as a Toyota Land cruiser, which is massive.
suggested that a dog has the same environmental impact a year as a Toyota Land cruiser, which is massive.
Ever tried cuddling a Landcruiser on a sofa? It won't end well! 🙂
Collaboration with animals is exactly what defines us as a species and how we evolved the way we did – we don’t need incredible hearing or senses of smell or fangs or claws- we can extend our senses with dogs, extend our speed and range with horses, navigate oceans with ravens….and ummmm open tins for cats.
Modern humans developed 300.000 years ago and domesticated animals fairly recently, well within the last 20,000 years ago if the current theories are correct. That's 200.000+ years of being a defined species but being without domesticated animals. What were we doing in that interim period? Trying to invent the can opener to entice cats into our camps?
Riding horses is a very modern thing, maybe 5000 years, and not everyone had access to horses - does that mean that those people weren't human? And, even if the raven navigation thing was true, the ravens weren't domesticated.
I’m pretty sure that humans and rats are the most numerous species of mammal. I think you mean 2/3 of the mammal biomass, not 2/3 of the population.
from 'our world in data': "Livestock make up 62% of the world’s mammal biomass; humans account for 34%; and wild mammals are just 4%."
It's a surprising statistic.... but yes biomass is correct, not population.
Global poultry now weigh twice as much as wild birds... go humans.
What were we doing in that interim period?
Killling and eating them - then we found out some of them could be friendly and some could be captured and bred from so we didn't have to do all that running around stuff.
Are we suggesting we wind back evolution?
Regardless of empathy, I’m amazed people are getting dogs when there’s a climate crisis on. The research I did a little while ago suggested that a dog has the same environmental impact a year as a Toyota Land cruiser, which is massive.
CO2e per annum for a cat is approx 310kg and up to 700kg for a large dog. The average per Annum for a human is 7 tonnes. (13 tonnes for americans) therfore the answer is simple
nuke America and have more fluffy things 🙂
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What were we doing in that interim period?</div>
Killling and eating them – then we found out some of them could be friendly and some could be captured and bred from so we didn’t have to do all that running around stuff.Are we suggesting we wind back evolution?
What a strange reply to a quote taken completely out of context.
What a strange reply to a quote taken completely out of context.
[i] That’s 200.000+ years of being a defined species but being without domesticated animals. What were we doing in that interim period? Trying to invent the can opener to entice cats into our camps?[/i]
Full context - you asked what we were doing for 200,000+ years. My reply seems reasonable, if light hearted.
What do you think we were doing with animals for 200,000 years?
What do you think we were doing with animals for 200,000 years?
Same as you. It's fairly obvious. I asked the person that I quoted that question because they had suggested without domesticated animals we aren't defined as humans:
Collaboration with animals is exactly what defines us as a species
The article seemed to be mostly taking aim at, essentially, farming animals to be pets. When it comes to rescue animals I don't think it had anything to complain about. Yes it was poorly written, but I think that main point stands. Full disclosure: I have only ever served feral or rescue cats.
mike meowski (the one eyed loony)
this made me laugh more than it should.
Schrödinger's cat theory revised :
The cat is both inside and outside the house until the door is observed.
Once I find out just who’s cat is shitting in our garden I’ll happily watch them picking up the poo instead of me, until then I will remain full of hatred and rage for the pet owners of the world.
Good luck with that, I have three or four different cats from different places that wander into my garden and shit anywhere they please, the lawn, flower-beds, the big terracotta pot I have my apple tree in… 😖
And no, I’m not getting a dog! Christ, it costs me on average £20/week on food for ‘the pets’*, as Joey used to call them, and I still do, bugger vets bills and having to take the mutt out for walks in all winds and weathers as well!
*They’re the hedgehogs, and the various birds that eat me out of house and home.
I seem to remember reading decades ago that globally as much gets spent on petfood as would be needed to feed the world . After lockdown I reckon they could throw in a pudding too.
What do you think we were doing with animals for 200,000 years?
Judging by the mass of Straight-tusked elephant bones discovered in Germany and recently analysed, the local Neanderthal population were eating them. Bearing in mind that, the now-extinct species grew up to 13ft tall and weighed up to 13 tonnes, their barbecue parties must have been quite something.
Me neither but I don’t like imprisoned under-stimulated cats either. Cats need space.
We have a five-bedroom house. We have three cats. With all the space at their disposal they use maybe a third of it, they only really use the spaces that we frequent.
If your cats are under-stimulated then that's on you, play with your cat. Look up Jackson Galaxy on YouTube.
Seeing how much my cats like the outdoors I couldn’t bring myself to lock them in all the time.
Generally, outdoor cats like being outdoor cats, and indoor cats like being indoor cats. Change is what they don't like.
I wouldn’t want anyone to do that to me so I won’t do it to them.
You're not a cat, dufus.
And no, I’m not getting a dog! Christ, it costs me on average £20/week on food for ‘the pets’*, as Joey used to call them, and I still do, bugger vets bills and having to take the mutt out for walks in all winds and weathers as well!
Might start leasing my dog out. Fully supported, just to help owners reclaim their gardens. 😂
globally as much gets spent on petfood as would be needed to feed the world .
The problem here is humans having children rather than too many pets. Less humans = less pets & farm animals.
Generally, outdoor cats like being outdoor cats, and indoor cats like being indoor cats. Change is what they don’t like.
Yep. We have a couple of rescue cats, we got them as young kittens. They are very happy indoors, they flee in terror when the front door opens, they show no desire to be outdoor cats. You could not keep a dog like that but cats are fine living indoors.
Next weeks story will be if we really want to save the planet we should all just kill ourselves and be done with it. Mother earth will get along fine without humans.
You may joke. Some of the lunatics that run this particular asylum were suggesting as much a few weeks ago....
I have a cat sat on me right now.
I think we're both doing quite well out of the arrangement.
Judging by the mass of Straight-tusked elephant bones discovered in Germany and recently analysed, the local Neanderthal population were eating them
Oh arse not eleburgers for tea again 🙂
You could make sandwiches for a pachydermed lunch.
I had a rescue cat until about 3 years ago. She was kind of a house cat, but only because she generally didn't actually like going outside!
We fitted a cat flap and she would nip into the garden to go toilet but that was about it. She didn't like the kids when they came along as they were too noisy and unpredictable, but when she went pretty much deff she suddenly loved the kids and started snuggling up with them as well!
We missed having a pet hanging around the house, but wasn't prepared to pay the covid premium for a dog and it was taking too long to get a rescue dog that was suitable for us. Its hardwork at the moment working from home and toilet training, but we'll be able to start walking her in a week or so.
I'm well aware of people not liking dogs or having had problems with them either biking or random jumping up at kids and stuff, it's happended to me on several occasions, I did really wonder whether to get a dog because of that, but she will be trained properly and my awareness will hopefully make me a better more responsible dog owner.
I wouldn’t want anyone to do that to me so I won’t do it to them.
You’re not a cat, dufus.
No, but I think that most cats feel the same way about the outdoors as I do. I honestly don't think even a spacious 5 bed house is a good environment for a predatory animal that needs to explore a natural environment.
Every time someone posts on here about being miserable and dissatisfied basically all the responses are telling them to get outside into nature. Why is that good for us? There are loads of studies about this, it's something deep rooted in our animal origins that we need greenery, blue skies and a natural environment. I have no idea why people think this is any different for animals, since they are much closer to their animal nature than we are (being animals, of course) and they don't even know how to use the internet.
How are they going to feel anything about something they have no experience of? Ours have never been out of the house aside from vet visits etc, they can no more miss the outdoors than they can miss Egypt.
Ah, you edited.
I would agree with you, if our cats were ignored all day. They aren't. They're stimulated, played with, exercised, warm, well fed, happy. I have one purring away on my knee right now.
Would they be happier out chasing real birds, pooing in other people's yards, picking up flea infestations, dodging cars and cutting their paws open on the broken glass the previous occupants saw fit to cement into the top of the garden wall? I honestly don't know, but by the same chalk nor do you.
the article does seem to have touched a nerve amongst the pet owners given the amount of willful misunderstanding. The fact your pet may have a great life does not invalidate the arguments, nor does taking exception to how they're expressed, nor do pictures of dogs.
(We've had cats for decades fwiw. So what?)
Well, that's not fair. It's touched a nerve mostly because it's spurious bollocks of the highest order.
Cats are territorial animals, it doesn't matter if the territory is your house and the surrounding gardens, or just your house. If they have the run of their full territory, they are satisfied. In many ways, just being indoors means they are not competing for territory with other cats, so may be less stressful. They do need some extra stimulation indoors though.
My two are happy as larry indoors, but would probably wander out for a look if I left a door open. Trouble is, once they've done that, the area they've visited gets added to the 'territory' list so they would want to be let out so they can check it over.
Downsides: I really, really want to open a door and send them out sometimes, plus litter trays can be vile.
Bonus: Lack of fleas, fighting, squashed kitties, and carnage for the local birdlife, and not falling out with my neighbour because they shit on his vegetable patch.
There are loads of studies about this, it’s something deep rooted in our animal origins that we need greenery, blue skies and a natural environment.
With cats it is much more than that. It is akin to us watching the telly, reading a newspaper, or catching up with some gossip down the pub.
When a cat pops outside for ten minutes it reads a story. The smells left behind tells it who has been around, for how long, and how long ago.
Every twig potentially provides a multitude of news which is why they are so delicately sniffed. Information such as "ginger from four doors down was here about an hour ago but he didn't stay long" or "Tabby met that black and white cat that I can't stand about 10 minutes ago" or "that fox has been loitering around here again" and so on.
That is why cats often want to come back in not long after pestering to go out - they have caught up with the latest news and will catch up again later.
They also like to spend ages staring at life in their patch - the dogs walking past, the birds in the bushes, the screaming children, etc.
If there is one thing cats are known for it is their curiosity.
Pets (well cats and dogs that do not work for a living) are quite frankly a pain in the arse for everyone - the environment, the local wild animal population, the neighbours, the owners and the pets themselves. They push tonnes of Co2 into the atmosphere (metaphorically), they kill stuff that probably should be killed and eaten by other wild stuff or left to breed, they cost their owners a fortune, shite everywhere, bark, need constant attention and then just go and die causing grief to children and emotionally stunted adults everywhere.....there is literally no logical explanation why they have become so popular.
...looks across the room to a reclining useless ball of ragdoll shaped fluff which is currently shedding hairs all over my expensive sofa and regrets allowing daughter to have a cat.....then goes and strokes it and feels blood pressure drop
no logical explanation at all
they flee in terror when the front door opens
Which proves how the outdoor environment is totally different to the indoor environment to cat.
Suggesting they get the same from indoors as they do from outdoors is clearly false. It is a totally different experience. And one which cats overwhelmingly love when they are slowly introduced to it. It is part of their growing up experience.
Forum appears to be broken for me at least in terms of posting and I can't see any actual points being refuted, so cba going on with this, but
It’s touched a nerve mostly because it’s spurious bollocks of the highest order.
starting at the beginning...
The animals are harmed from the outset, regardless of whether they are sourced from puppy mills, the wild, or artisanal inbreeders. Often African grey parrots and other “exotics” are captured from their habitats, and many die en route to the market. Puppy mills are plagued by high mortality rates for the young, while mothers are kept perpetually pregnant until they are discarded. Pedigreed animals, whose genetics are equivalent to the offspring of siblings, are often plagued by health problems during their truncated lives.
^^which bit of that is incorrect? That's not your pet or all pets but it is a reasonable proportion. And in terms of how it's expressed I quite like "artisanal inbreeders".
