[Closed] Veggie kiddies

One of my nephews who's a vegitarian (parents didn't give any choice) is actually allergic to nuts and to lentils - which leaves him with a very limited diet. He eats a lot of pasta...

One of my nephews who's a [s]vegitarian[/s]meat eater (parents didn't give any choice)...there fixed it for you

I'm enjoying how often the "average" man on the street or "average" meat eater is being slapped around on this thread... It means I am above average and therefore superior because I'm capable of eating meat [b][i]AND [/i][/b]thinking at the same time...

Go me...

Junkyard - already looks like he's headed that way as I know for a fact he consumes the occasional McDonalds burger - and not veggie ones either.

no you missed my point it is that
veggies make their kids veggies
Meat eaters make their kids meateaters
Some meat eating kids end up as veggies
Some veggie kids end up as meat eaters

no you missed my point it is that

You had a point?

My kids are omnivores, which looks to be the way we were designed.

Sheesh, must we go through this [url= http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/something-for-the-veggies-to-chew-on ]sooooo often[/url]...?

To quote:

bananaworld - Member

Two facts remain:

1) Some people eat meat and will justify doing so in whatever way they see fit, even if it's simply a case that they like it. Fair enough.

And:

2) Human being really don't need to eat animal products to live healthily.

Some people will never see how a person could live without meat, and some people will never understand how meat-eaters can reconcile the cruelty and waste involved in animal rearing. It's a funny old game.

Add Junkyard's post:

Junkyard - Member
no you missed my point it is that
veggies make their kids veggies
Meat eaters make their kids meateaters
Some meat eating kids end up as veggies
Some veggie kids end up as meat eaters

...and that is, quite simply, the end of that discussion.

Now back to ideas for food for a farsighted child who wants to be vegetarian.

How does this work for a family meal then?

Do you cook twice? or all eat veggie? or pick out the meat?

My daughter said this at around that age. We told eat what you want but you get what your given (which is a healthy balanced diet including meat)

eat meat myself, but vegetarian food is cheaper, not less healthy, [u][i][b]just as tasty[/b][/i][/u] and better for the environment

no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no
NO!
Never ever ever going to be true. Ever. ok?

Boxelder,
Why?
If it's because fish can't feel pain, they can, research suggests: here.
Never understood that whole I'll only eat chicken or fish or whatever.

I'm not veggie for sentimental reasons - I've killed and will again.

I don't like meat, and it's more efficient not to eat it - only around 10% of energy gets passed up to the next trphic level on the food chain (very basic, but basically true)

How does this work for a family meal then?

Do you cook twice? or all eat veggie? or pick out the meat?

At the moment, we just pick out the meat from her food, but we're trying to make it so that what's left is balanced.

So, last night we has a sausage and chickpea casserole with broccoli and roast potatoes and she just didn't eat the sausages.

Now back to ideas for food for a farsighted child who wants to be vegetarian.

Thanks. I couldn't care lass what anyone else eats or what they think about vegetarianism.

So, last night we has a sausage and chickpea casserole with broccoli and roast potatoes and she just didn't eat the sausages.

That sort of diet is probably just fine I would have thought. Sounds just like the sort of stuff my vegie mates have.

Still I would have given it all to her and said leave what you want (which I would have then eaten most likely)

robdob what are you talking about? Depending on how well you cook of course it can be just as tasty.

Of course if you aren't able to cook then a simple piece of meat comes flavour-packed with nothing needed except seasoning and heat.

I can cook though.

I can cook. I've eaten vegetarian food made by great cooks.

Still though, it wasn't as tasty. Sorry. I guess it depends on what kinds of flavours you consider tasty.. I for example can't stand mayonnaise.

I bet the tastiest veggie food is better than the most poorly cooked meat. In other words it is perfectly possible to get well over the tasty acceptance level, and the inclusion of meat is no guarantee of eatability.

FFS surely we can agree that taste is just a matter of erm [personal] taste 🙄

Hi Miketually

My 7 year old daughter has never eaten meat or fish. If she wanted to, we wouldn't stop her - but she won't ever get it in our house. I stopped about 30 years ago.

Because kids can be a bit fussy (our girl is actually getting loads better these days) , we got very good at deviously slipping in extra nutrition without her realizing. Particularly handy when she was a baby/toddler.

For instance, always 100% wholegrains and organic if you can justify it (I always can). She then won't expect bread or rice or pasta to be white. Get a little grinder and add in ground nuts or seeds (almonds or sunflower are great) to loads of things. You can even loose them on a slice of bread beneath the honey :). Shelled hemp seeds are a brilliant thing to keep also, we never eat "just" rice, but I throw in a sponfull of shelled hemp seeds into nearly any rice dish or pasta/pesto. They disappear amongst mottley brown rice and add a lot of essential ois and minerals.
Pasta is never wheat, but always Quinoa, more protein and less wheat to eat (which we get plenty of as it is).
You can use almond butter on her rice cakes, she might enjoy dipping her bananas into tahini. Lots of good fats and oils that way. Also keep a bottle of flax oil in the frige to get her omega 3's. Get her to enjoy salads by dipping her lettuce into dressing (nice olive oil and balsamic). Don't over prepare anything, they'd rather eat a raw carrot then a cooked one, and it's better for them anyway. Same goes all other veg.
Soya yogurt avoids excess dairy if that's your thing (cheese is handy stuff, but we do keep the dairy at sensible levels). She has always only had rice milk for similar reasons. (And don't let the Milk Marketing Board blind you with their calcium nonsense).

Lentil burgers kind of sum up the sandal wearing thing, but take them very seriously, and anything else to do with pulses. My little girl loves a great pile of kidney beans with a strong dressing of ginger and garlic.

For conveniance foods, which you do need sometimes with a child, most supermarket brands are awful, so don't bother at all. One to look out for is "Taifun" brand, they make really good smoked tofu, brilliant sausages (for school dinners etc).
Avoid processed cereals by letting her make her own. We got a oat flaker recently, and the novelty of turning a big handle and rolling her own oats has meant that "oats and raisins" is now a great staple. - It avoids obvious processed/salty/sugary alternatives (breakfast cereals) and gets round the museli problem (not many kids would eat museli - at least not ours!)

Nett effect is one very fit happy little vegetarian cyclist.

Well you're the one that has been free with the judgmental comments junkyard, but now its a FFS matter all of a sudden! 🙄

mountancarrot thanks for the useful post - I'll be taking a couple of notes from that for ideas for my kids.

I bet the tastiest veggie food is better than the most poorly cooked meat. In other words it is perfectly possible to get well over the tasty acceptance level, and the inclusion of meat is no guarantee of eatability.

You could paint a beautiful picture without using red, too - but you're limiting your options.

Sure, but what some people seem to be saying is that pictures are no good if they don't contain some red every time.

The logical conclusion of what you're saying is that any diet should include as many different things as possible. But some people choose not to eat certain things, and remain perfectly happy and healthy. So what's the problem?

I do eat meat myself, but its just me and the dog that do in my house. This evening however I will be having some of the spiced chick pea stuff that's in the fridge. I might have a poached egg with it. Yum. Parp.

good grief! - it smells like someone's been reading the Guardian in here.

The logical conclusion of what you're saying is that any diet should include as many different things as possible. But some people choose not to eat certain things, and remain perfectly happy and healthy. So what's the problem?

None at all, I can't stand fish for example. And I'd be happy with a spiced chick pea thingy too. I was just objecting to the idea that a diet that excludes any ingredient could be tastier than one that doesn't - assuming, of course, similarly competent cooks.

Then you were objecting to the same thing that I was originally - robdob's rather extreme no-no's.

Quite hungry now.

My son is 18 months old and seems to be heading towards vegetarianism! We can't get him to eat meat/fish, all he will take is the odd bit of fish in a stew and occasionally a bit of sausage. I eat meat 2-3 times a week and my wife maybe once a week so nothing to do with us. He does eat mountains of carrots and pasta though!

mountaincarrot,

Has this ever caused problems when your daughter goes to friends or to birthday partys etc, either for her or for those doing the catering? I'd imagine there are far fewer vegetarians of that age and wondered if it's harder for others to cater for your daughter's diet? Any idea if she's ever chosen to eat a chicken nugget or turkey twizler 🙄 ?

But robdob is right! Yeah you can make a tasty veg only meal but you can't make veg only Beef Wellington, bacon sarnies etc etc.

Vegetarians will always (obviously) have a fav meal that doesn't include meat....

But how many meat eaters (who eat everything) would argue that the tastiest meal they eat doesn't include meat or fish?

To be honest I don't really think that vegetarians can comment on the topic of the tastiest foods!

im 34 and never eaten fish or meat in my life, neither has my wife or our children. we are all fine and healthy. TJ has it at the begining of the thread. protein and some vits need to be kept an eye on, and not to rely on dairy (ie cheese with everything). pulses, greens nuts and seeds play a big part.

why is it people have to be so militant about there meat eating option?

i don't eat meat - i used to. i almost certainly will again in the future.

i really don't care whether you want to eat a tofu burger or a raw steak.

To be honest I don't really think that vegetarians can comment on the topic of the tastiest foods!

I've got a roasted veg lasagne, with fresh pasta, that has never failed to score a hit with meat eaters. My kids eat blimin' kilos of it too.

There have been very very rare occasions where one of my girls has gone for tea with a friend and the mum has been confused about what to feed them. Some adults seem to think that vegetarians just eat plates of vegetables - quite funny really.

Hi Dr_Bakes

"Has this ever caused problems when your daughter goes to friends or to birthday partys etc.."...

Well not really. Kids parties are not generally known for their healthy options anyway. So if she comes away having eaten only white cheese sandwiches and crisps, that's something we have to put up with. I can't say it's a problem. She's often the one eating rather more of the grapes and carrot sticks than the others, but if she wants the turkey twizzlers she knows she's free to go for it (but she doesn't)- it's up to her!

Surely the existence of the bacon butty alone is enough to prove that veggie food can't be as tasty as "real" food... 😉

Certain types of food I prefer to be meat free - curries being an example. I tend to prefer veggie meals made with lentils to those made with nuts, but even lentils are improved by some meat (lentil and bacon soup for example).

I'm not veggie for sentimental reasons - I've killed and will again.

I don't like meat, and it's more efficient not to eat it - only around 10% of energy gets passed up to the next level on the food chain (very basic, but basically true)

Good for you, and apologies for thinking it might be . Actually, having started the bashing (maybe) I will say that a balanced diet is what it's all about.
I'll keep eating it because I like the taste of it - I don't eat snails cos I don't, and I don't eat celery for the same reason. If there's a name for that then I'm it!

judgmental comments junkyard

"Has this ever caused problems when your daughter goes to friends or to birthday partys etc.."...

Most people are usually apologetic for not catering for vegans [ or they ask what it means] and we just ask what they are having and take something similiar /suitable along.

Druidh

Find me the "science" which came out with that number[5 a day]

Five A DAY is based on advice from the World Health Organization, which recommends eating a minimum of 400g of fruit and vegetables a day to lower the risk of serious health problems, such as heart disease, stroke, type 2 diabetes and obesity - they actually recommended between 5-10 a day

Up to 2.7 million lives could be saved annually with sufficient fruit and vegetable consumption.
• Low fruit and vegetable intake is among the top 10 selected risk factors for global mortality

Sorry junkyard, I think I must have scanned the thread a bit too quickly and attributed some earlier comment to you when it was actually made by someone else.

Obviously taste is personal - my point was that some people make their minds up about the taste [i]before[/i] they taste! Nothing will shake their prejudice, which does no harm to anyone else I guess - except those same people are usually rather quick to judge on that ill-informed basis. Not you though - got the wrong person.

Veggie food is inherently low in protein, unless you eat eggs all day.
It might tell you pulses or legumes have a high protein content but this is not the full story.
What you need to be aware of is how much of the protein can be utilised by the body, and there are books on just this subject.

Now, I’m dredging my memory from 25yrs ago when I used to fling weigths about, but most athletes and anyone looking to build their bodies needs quality protein.
My concern would be that what little protein is consumed will not satisfy a growing child’s needs very well.

Example: One boy, 3 doors up from me here in my street went veggie about 18 months (?) ago, aged 10. He is still riding the bike he had many years ago, his voice is noticeably shriller than the other boys of his age group and he seems not to have grown at all.
At this age group, it’s something that becomes quite obvious.
This is not good news as the world tends not to be overly kind to small / under developed men as a general rule!

Just a cursory look at veggie food stuffs tells even the casual observer it’s quite often very high in fat too, be they veggie burgers or cheese, you name it, I suspect veggies typically consume considerably more fat in their daily lives than a fish / chicken / turkey / lean meat carnivore.

Just my £0.02 worth.

£0.02 is vast overestimate

The idea that protein types are a problem, and that vegetarians have to be careful about types of protein and combining them was a bit debunked a few years back.

The idea that vegetarian diets are typically high in fat and unhealthy is just crazy madness that you made up in your head and isn't supported by any data - because it is rubbish - all the data suggests that at worst veggies are equal in healthiness to meat eaters, and typically eat a lower fat diet..

Again, the idea that veggies don't get enough protein to grow or to do sport is also rubbish and not supported by evidence.

Like meat eaters, vegetarians need to get a balanced diet. But as with meat eaters, the thing people are most likely to be low on is eating enough fruit and veg - which is far more of a health problem for everyone than lack of protein.

About your anecdote about the kid who was vegetarian , i was that kid too - veggie since 10ish, perfectly healthy, and fine to get in at least 500 km of riding in the average month. I imagine I'm fitter than the average person, even if they eat meat.

GlenP Ta plenty of highly opinionated people on either side of the divide always amuses me that someone can get so worked up over what someone else eats or argue that either diet is intrinsically healthy /unhealthy. Clearly facts dont impinge on their opinions.
I would write some more but, as Ti29r noted my lack of protein means my pale emaciated 4 foot 2 body [high and wide due to my low protein high fat diet] needs more sleep now. Your cursory glance at veggie foods seems to have involved the cheese counter and the frozen isle rather than the veg and fruit isles. Carl lewis was turned vegan in 1990 and then broke the 100 m world record the next year aged 31 on a vegan diet. Guess he managed somehow with the limited protein.

TI29er - what a load of pish.

western man eats far too much protein on average, veggie kids of which I know a few grow up just fine. You can get plenty of protein from non meat sources.

My veggie nephew is over 6 ft at 19 yrs old and plays sport at a high level

Ti29er - how do explain my 11yr old daughter who is going on 14 year old height and weight? She wears the same size shoes as her mum and is only about two inches shorter? That's because she is unusually big for her age - the single example you gave may just be because that child is unusually slight for his age.

Anecdotes like that are the very worst in selective thinking - you are merely weaving a narrative of your own dreaming around scant evidence to suit your ready-made bias. If my daughter was your neighbor would you be using that one single example to make the opposite case?

Late to the party, but Ti29er - you get the prize for the biggest load of shite posted here. Well done, you have had some stiff competition.

Woah everyone! We've all been quick to judge Ti29er's post but there's a possibility we're overlooking:

Yes, it could just be a load of utter, utter rubbish, OR it could be a rather clever trolling, which we've all fallen for.

(Ti29er - better stick your head back in now and claim that it was, in fact, a trolling...)

My, we do have some blinkered, vitriolic posting here this evening.

Not surprising really since those with a vested interest in proving that their child is X or Y or that they can jump over the moon in one leap is proof positive of their own stance.

The evidence sported here is at best no more than a small sample, as was mine.

We're told once Carl Lewis had finished growing he was turned vegan, although my point was that not having sufficient protein during the formative age was perhaps a concern, so the Lewis story, whilst a very nice story is a red herring.

But he's slow by comparison to the carnivore that is Bolt, so do we all eat at McD'd before our Olympic races, of course not; isolated cases prove very little.

TJ's nephew: were not told when he went veggie nor that his parents might well be quite a bit taller than their offspring, so again, selective story telling par excellence.

Linda McCartney foods were lambasted for their high fat content a while back and the few meals I get in for the veggie staff (x1) here are high in fat.

So let's have some science:
Almond Nuts. 1 cup. 140 gms, 26 gms protein, 75gms fat, 2 gms carbs, 785 calories, 35% protein absorbed & converted to muscle.

Brown Rice, 1 cup. 150 gms, 4gms protein, 1gm fat, 38 gms carbs, 177 calories, 70% protein absorbed & converted to muscle.

Spinach, steamed, 1 cup. 100gms, 3gms protein, trace fat, 3 gms carbs, 24 caloriies, 48% protein absorbed & converted to muscle.

Red kidney beans, dry, cooked. 1 cup. 200 gms. 16gms protein, 1 gm fat, 39gms carbs, 229 calories, 48% protein absorbed & converted to muscle.

Lentis, 1 cup, 200gms, 16 gms protein, trace fat, 37 carbs, 212 calories, 48% protein absorbed & converted to muscle.

Chicken. white meat. 8oz. 227 gms, 40gms protein, 14 gms fat, 286 calories, 68% protein absorbed & converted to muscle.

Source: Dr Franco Columbu & Linda Fragomeni. ISBN 0-8092-5457-3

TI - my nephew was veggie from about 5. His parents are of normal height - mother 5'6" dad 6 ft.

Its a simple fact that plenty of protein is easily available in veggies and that western man eats far more protein than needed on average.

You would be suprised how little protein is needed for a healthy diet and how easy it is to get this.

i know numerous veggie kids including two taht are vcegan from birth - all healthy and well

You are talking utter claptrap