[Closed] Van remapping, talk to me.

The bloke that originally had my van (82hp T5) got it re-mapped by Pendle (I think). It apparently has almost as many BHP as my Passat (about 120 something he said) and goes like a dream. Given that the base van would have been sluggish in all gears and would return about 30 mpg, mine pulls like a train and returns me an average of just over 40mpg loaded.

For comparison, another mate has a T5 that he remapped with pretty much exactly the same results. He's very happy with the results.

I'd say it depends on what you're remapping from. If you've got an 80-odd BHP van, it's going to be prety sluggish so it's worth doing.

I've got a 102 hp T5 which I sometimes think about remapping, but, to be honest, I've never been in a situation where i've thought "I wish this van was faster". It's not a rocket ship, but it's not sluggish.

Is there any downsides to getting it remapped? Wondering why don't the manufacturers supply the van with that mapping?

In a lot of cases, the engine is the same throughout the range of powers, for example 82, 102 and 130 bhp models, it's just the tune that's different. As far as I can tell, the other bits are the same (clutch, brakes, etc) so it may be that they just have the option for charging a bit more or less depending on the power that they put out.

My T5 is an 88bhp model. Running ~160bhp. Same engine as the 88, 102 and 140 models but the 140 has a 6-speed box. Its not a rocket off the line but once rolling it gets a move on. Debatable how good it is for a clutch designed to have less power running through it but if the clutch goes it'll get replaced with a better one...

willard - Member
In a lot of cases, the engine is the same throughout the range of powers, for example 82, 102 and 130 bhp models, it's just the tune that's different. As far as I can tell, the other bits are the same (clutch, brakes, etc) so it may be that they just have the option for charging a bit more or less depending on the power that they put out.

Think you will often find its also the turbos, intercoolers etc that are also different, Im talking generally, not just VW vans

OK, this is a car not a van story, but I was offered, by Huntingdon Audi (I know, I know) that they would remap an A4 I was buying from them a few years ago from 140 to 170. I didn't go for it, but it showed me that they were absolutely the same minus the programming, and that if done by Audi, wouldn't even invalidate the warranty. I belive that most VAG engines that have multiple levels of tune work in this way, however I would check brakes are up to it if you're planning to drive like a tit!

Good info, my google ninja skills tell me that it is a reprogramming of the cars / vans ECU. No other hardware apart from a chip needed.

The vivaro is sitting at 115 BHP so i don't really need any more power but thats not what its about. Economy and low end torque are what i am after.

The different models usually have different turbo's, intercooler's and sometimes different clutches, so I would check that a remap is suitable for your engine.

Downside is that you put more stress on engine parts, so engine life may be reduced (I've heard 10% reduction mentioned, but this will vary).
Clutch life will be the main thing to look at, due to the extra torque produced.

If your going to get a remap, get a live map on a rolling road, rather than a generic bluefin type 'chip'.

tinybits - Member
it showed me that they were absolutely the same minus the programming

Except they're actually different engines

mactheknife - Member

I was also looking online about the benefits of an engine remap. But I really don't understand how this can provide both more power, lower end torque AND better mpg.

Basically just gets everything working as well as it can- perfectly possible to deliver power and efficiency. It's not just throwing more fuel at the problem, it's making sure it's the right amount (and possibly ignition map as well) Was totally worth it.

On mine (a car, but same principles apply) it also improved low/mid rev drivability, which means I use the lower end of the range more, which also helps economy.

It's possible as it sacrifices safety margins for dodgy fuel, high temps and so on and also emissions performance and tunes it so it runs the way that is best for the engine rather than balancing performance and economy against emissions and safe robustness.

Often it's done by adjusting timing and turbo boost maps rather than just throwing more fuel at it, hence the reason you can get more power and better economy.

[i]The vivaro is sitting at 115 BHP so i don't really need any more power but thats not what its about. Economy and low end torque are what i am after.

[/i]

A 115bhp diesel van is not going to lack low end torqu, and you'll need a pretty impressive increase in economy to offset the £500-ish the remap will cost.

[quote=jairaj ]Is there any downsides to getting it remapped?Insurance premiums.
[quote=mactheknife]The vivaro is sitting at 115 BHP so i don't really need any more power but thats not what its about. Economy and low end torque are what i am after. I get between 40 and 45 mpg out of my 115bhp Trafic (i.e. same engine). How much more are you expecting?

This isn't my opinion as tbh I don't get involved in them anymore. If the van you bought hasn't got enough BHP then imo you bought the wrong van.

Anyhow, customer who bought a van elsewhere but brought it into us because it had a dashboard lit up like a Christmas tree has just made an installer travel from Glasgow to Carlisle to remove a remap they had done a day earlier.

Fitter came and removed remap that had caused problems in the ecu and got a nice bill for a replacement ecu 🙂 He also got a bill for the diagnostic time it took for them to find out what was causing the problems and I bet he got a right earful from our customer who lost a days work.

Now, I had had plenty of vehicles in without any issue but this was last week so it just hammered home the evidence that tbh it isn't worth the hastle.

My mechanic collared the guy who did the install and asked him a few questions about what they ahd done and how it works. He stated pretty similar to the above about taking away safety margins for fuels etc that the manufacturer builds in to protect the vehicle and meet legislation. My mechanic then asked why he thought his company/supplier was better placed to make that decision than a company that spends billions of pounds in research and development to ensure their vehicles run optimally. Guy didn't have an answer. He then put the guy right when he said they were essentially the 'same' engines throughout the range. The injectors are most definitely not the same and again, why does he think the manufacturer uses different injectors for the different outputs? Maybe they have researched that it will cause problems.

Anyhow, I don't get involved because these days I cant be bothered with it but if it was my own I would rather be a bit slower, worse fuel economy than land a bill for a new engine or ecu

timc - Member
tinybits - Member
it showed me that they were absolutely the same minus the programming
Except they're actually different engines

are they? How different are the 2008 2.0tdi in 140bhp and 170bhp variants? I honestly thought, that if a main dealer would be prepared to do it, that they were likely to be pretty similar! I didn't have it done anyway, the car was absolutely fine in standard form.

TheLittlestHobo - Member
if it was my own I would rather be a bit slower, worse fuel economy than land a bill for a new engine or ecu

Or premature Cluth / DMF / Turbo failure, totally agree with you.

tinybits - Member
are they? How different are the 2008 2.0tdi in 140bhp and 170bhp variants? I honestly thought, that if a main dealer would be prepared to do it, that they were likely to be pretty similar! I didn't have it done anyway, the car was absolutely fine in standard form.

I'll admit im making somewhat of a presumption but using other models in the VAG range, logic would suggest this is the case. 140/170 variants of Golf (GT/GTD) & various Skoda's are actually different engines, VAG do more than one 2.0 TDI unit.

Also when it is the same engine, its usually different sized Turbos & Injectors for the various outputs, its common across both petrol & diesel VAG engines.

IHN - Member
The vivaro is sitting at 115 BHP so i don't really need any more power but thats not what its about. Economy and low end torque are what i am after.

A 115bhp diesel van is not going to lack low end torqu, and you'll need a pretty impressive increase in economy to offset the £500-ish the remap will cost.

Yep, thats the conclusion i am coming to.

scotroutes - Member
jairaj » Is there any downsides to getting it remapped?
Insurance premiums.
mactheknife » The vivaro is sitting at 115 BHP so i don't really need any more power but thats not what its about. Economy and low end torque are what i am after.
I get between 40 and 45 mpg out of my 115bhp Trafic (i.e. same engine). How much more are you expecting

So far i have not got into the forties MPG but but thats going off the dashboard not actual figures. If i could get close to that i would be very happy. TBH it was just a thought really and thought i would ask and see if there was some real world advice on here as i do not know anybody that has done it.

My 09 plate vivaro was plenty fast enough. Even loaded to the gills it was fine. And remember unless you change its use on the logbook different speed limits can apply.

Penldle re-mapped by 08 104 T32 to a claimed 138. No way of verifying this, but the difference is remarkable - much smoother & quicker through all of the gears. No material difference in mileage & the only downside is that I could really do with a 6th speed.

This was 2 years ago.