As a priest once said to us in class "Swearing,it's just a lack of F***ing vocabulary"
😆 🤣
Dad to two 14 yr old girls. We never swear* around them and I have never heard either swear. I’d be surprised if I ever do and would probably be disappointed if I did.
* I will say ‘bloody bell’, but they say that in Harry Potter so, as far as I am concerned, it’s bloody okay to say it.
There’s definitely a parenting crisis in this country..
Always has been, always will be.
As far as swearing goes, language and how it's used evolves. My gran thought that "damn" was a serious curse word, she washed out my cousin's mouth with soap when she heard him swearing. A lot of words that used to considered serious swear words are now considered pretty mild, but a lot of racist expressions that used to be considered normal are now considered extremely offensive, which is good.
That makes them as complicit as the chav doing the swearing.
Tell us some stories about when you stepped in to correct a stranger’s approach to their kids, and let us know how it turned out.
Tell us some stories about when you stepped in to correct a stranger’s approach to their kids, and let us know how it turned out.
Boarding the Stena NI ferry this week saw two of the Stena staff firmly ask two fathers to stop effing and jeffing in front of everyone, and then one of the Stena staff did lay into them about their kids hearing it and what a poor attitude to have around kids.
There was much apologising, red faces and a hundred other ferry passengers both staring down the fathers and thanking the Stena staff.
https://freakonomics.com/podcast/swearing-is-more-important-than-you-think/
f*****g interesting article
@jondoh lol! Get real. My kids or their friends never swear in my earshot either! In fact I rarely swear in front of my parents even now and I’m 53. As dad to 2 teenage daughters a few years older than yours I think you might be in for a shock.
Winston beat me to it. Laudable aims, johndoh, bookmark the thread for 3 or 4 years time and I suspect you'll have been beaten into submission 😉 My kids went from butter-wouldn't-melt to vocab of navvies - all I can do is ask them to keep a lid on it when inappropriate.
I don’t swear at my kids or in front of my kids and I find those that do abhorrent. Both of mine have heard me use the F word once in a DIY incident and once in general speech during a few evening beers when speaking with Mrs K and I didn’t known Jnr snuck down to enter the room behind me.
But as they get older it’s naive to think they don’t hear it at school or in movies. As I say to mine, just because you hear it doesn’t mean you should say it.
When I got hit in the eye with a nerf bullet my son and his little friend learnt a whole new vocabulary.
@jondoh lol! Get real. My kids or their friends never swear in my earshot either! In fact I rarely swear in front of my parents even now and I’m 53. As dad to 2 teenage daughters a few years older than yours I think you might be in for a shock.
you misunderstand me - I meant that they don’t swear around us. I don’t doubt they will swear around their peers (well, one of them may not actually).
I swear in front of my kids all the time. My kids don't swear around me (and I've never told them not to, that would be a bit hypocritical). I guess they think it's just something their stupid Dad does when he's annoyed.
I do, however, jump down their throats* if they repeat something discriminatory which they've heard one of their friends at school saying but that's a fairly rare occurrence.
*Well, initial big reaction followed by a calm chat about why it was wrong to say that and narrow minded attitudes of some people in society.
There are worse things than swearing.
There are worse things than swearing
there are, yes, but it doesn’t make it okay to normalise it.
Yeah I swear like a sailor (because, well...) but my daughter doesn't. Around me. I'm sure she's said her and her friends have "tried it out" but didn't really get on with it so that's that. She's in P6 and has seemingly never even seen a fight, by the time I was in P4 or 5 I'm pretty sure I had a rich vocabulary, fights were commonplace and hedge porn was well acquainted. I'd say she's doing alright.
Most of my swearing was stress it turns out, it's easy to be judgemental when you have no perspective. Some people are just horrible though, I can't think the last time I swore prejoritavely at someone, the context is important.
That makes them as complicit as the chav doing the swearing.
Tell us some stories about when you stepped in to correct a stranger’s approach to their kids, and let us know how it turned out.
Kelvin - you would know, if you read my post properly, I was referring to others in the same group as the individual(s) doing the swearing so a failed attempt at misrepresentation on your part.
As you asked about getting involved to ask an individual or group to stop swearing - yes, I have in pubs and similar and generally it's been successful.
Staff are usually supportive if they're asked to have a word
I take it you're content to just sit there and pretend to not hear the swearing.
I don't see the need for swearing at all. At least not in normal conversation.
Just... why? It is by definition rude, crude and offensive, so what's the need for it?
Everyone does it, it's normal... so what? Make an effort to be otherwise.
I try to teach my kids this, if their friends swear, well, their friends might also smoke or bully, hopefully mine can hold to some values. We say it's good to pick up litter, "be nice, say hi" etc, why not behave nicer in everyday language? It's not much of an ask. Littering is quite a good analogy actually.
On the subject of great parenting... the other day in the post office a young boy (4ish?) was sitting in a pushchair crying away. The dad (huge bodybuilder type) leaned down grabbed the bars either side of the boy and shouted into his face through gritted teeth "STOP CRYING LIKE A F****** GIRL". It really helped 🙄
Yes I understand frustration. I have young kids myself. That's absolutely no excuse for taking it out on them in a harmful way (and yes I'm occasionally guilty too 😞)
there are, yes, but it doesn’t make it okay to normalise it.
Why not?
Studies have shown there is nothing wrong with swearing and it can have benefits when it comes to stressful and painful situations. Also, it's been found people who swear tend to be more intelligent.
But really, what harm is it causing?
If it's that people might get offended then that sounds more like a 'them' problem than a 'me' problem.
But like I said, my kids don't seem to be swearing despite me not trying to stop them so perhaps my methods are superior to people who try to get their kids to stop.
Why not?
Because it’s not nice, not necessary and not particularly clever. If you are unable to curb language around your family then fine - you crack on - I just don’t see the need.
Context is everything and a few examples above are more worrying for their agression (snarling at kids) than they are about the swearing per se.
Words are just words. It's the context you need to worry about (and teach kids about).
Because it’s not nice, not necessary and not particularly clever
Why is it not nice?
I'll give you necessary but then there are a lot of things in our lives that aren't necessary. Please and thank you serves no real purpose but I'm sure you use both.
It's not particularly clever, although I did read a study that said people who swore also showed higher levels of intelligence.
But yeah, why is it not nice?
“FOOOOOOKINNNNNNNNN!” is just British lower class punctuation. It’s like a verbal holding pattern which gives their brain time to produce the next one syllable word in the sentence.
I have a mate who falls into this camp. When sober it will happen two or three times in a sentence but when drunk it happens between the syllables of every other word. Makes it quite difficult to follow what he is trying to say to be fair.
On the subject of great parenting… the other day in the post office a young boy (4ish?) was sitting in a pushchair crying away. The dad (huge bodybuilder type) leaned down grabbed the bars either side of the boy and shouted into his face through gritted teeth “STOP CRYING LIKE A F****** GIRL”.
For me, the abhorrent bits in that sentence are denigrating half the human race and the shouting. The swearing is unpleasant but not really the problem here.
Effective swearing is a skill, and is one of life's pleasures. It also aids good communication when used sparingly. Swear words are extreme intensifiers, for which there are very few alternatives without becoming unnecessarily verbose.
This is a hill that I will f*cking die on.
However, routinely swearing at young children is wrong.
For me, the abhorrent bits in that sentence are denigrating half the human race and the shouting. The swearing is unpleasant but not really the problem here.
Granted. It wasn't really connected to the first bit of my post.
On the subject of great parenting… the other day in the post office a young boy (4ish?) was sitting in a pushchair crying away. The dad (huge bodybuilder type) leaned down grabbed the bars either side of the boy and shouted into his face through gritted teeth “STOP CRYING LIKE A F****** GIRL”. It really helped 🙄
If that sort of verbal abuse is happening in public, it's almost a given that worse is happening at home.
Am I the only one who has to tell off his parents for swearing in front of the kids, ie their grandchildren?
edit: OP, what you described is grim. Not typical but too common.
However, routinely swearing at young children is wrong.
I wanted to edit that. Routinely swearing at young children anyone is wrong.
Im a cub leader (& parent)
most of the parents i deal seem really good parents, we have a few who treat their kids like crap, it puts a different perspective on the kids bad behaviour
Context is everything and a few examples above are more worrying for their agression (snarling at kids) than they are about the swearing per se.
Indeed.
I wanted to edit that. Routinely swearing at young children anyone is wrong.
Swearing at or swearing in the presence of? For clarity...
Swearing at.
It's why people should have to have a licence to breed.
Mary Stopes was onto something after all ...
It isn’t typical, but does happen.
I think it happens enough that the pub story could be typical in some parts of modern British society. Some people on here lead very sheltered lives. But there is a difference between "swearing regularly in conversation" and swearing at someone - the words themselves are not important its all about context. So e.g.
- (to your friend/partner) this mash potato is f*ck*n sh*t,
- (to the waitress/manager) this mash potato is f*ck*n sh*t
- (to your child) your mash potato looks f*ck*n sh*t
- (to your child) eat the mash potato you f*ck*n wee sh*t
The tone really matters - go to Glasgow where the word c*nt can mean anything from a friendly "mate" to you better start running cos I'm about bottle you. Body language matters to, you can make any of the above sentences worse be suddenly standing up and shouting it.
I would avoid swearing if there were kids at my table, but there's an interesting question, if I've gone to the pub with my mates and someone else has brought their kids to the table next to me - how much do I need to moderate my behaviour. I think that depends on the pub, but there's certainly pubs round here that serve food and let kids in where especially later in the day, in my view if the parents don't want their kids to hear colourful language they probably shouldn't have taken them in that pub.
I don't think the cycling story is at all typical, but I think that is probably a shame. Far too few children are ever allowed out of their parents' sight. Phone number in the pocket seems like it wasn't totally un-thought-through either. Not enough kids get lost in the woods; ideally they'd have adventures without the quivering bottom lip bit, however I'm sure that's an essential part of finding your comfort zone. BUT what happens when we (as adults) get a "fright" is we react - not always in ways we would be proud of or that might be something you'd hope to do. Shouting at the kids you were worried had fallen off a cliff but are delighted to see are alive is actually a fairly typical response. I think if you perceive you've done something wrong (like let them go too far) you are even more likely to react this way - your anger isn't at the kid, its at yourself but it just comes out wrong. I'm not sure if his "didn't want to go up the hill" was an angry or jokey way - I'm likely to make a joke of stuff if I thought the other adults were overly concerned. Again you can say the same sentence, and direct it at different people with very different meanings
My last workplace c is a term of endearment and to signify someone is not a good person, usually prefixed with 'turbo' and/or 'shit'.
Swearing is used to convey the severity of a situation and to motivate people to carry out orders/tasks much fing quicker.
Oh how I miss those days.
I was in Barmouth briefly a few weeks back and the language I heard being said to small children everywhere was awful. I got out fast.
When we had kids we made a big effort not to at home or in front of them, my parents never did to me or my older brother or sister. My boys are 12 now and both say they are happy we dont at home generally. We get caught sometimes and they tell us off now. We say you can swear with mates in the playground, just not in front of adults etc.
I personally think it should be illegal to swear to a kid under say 10 in public
@frankconway why do you think that? I work in industry, same rules apply.
I personally think it should be illegal to swear to a kid under say 10 in public
And what would that achieve?
I personally think it should be illegal to swear to a kid under say 10 in public
Even if they’re being a little *ing *?
On the subject of great parenting… the other day in the post office a young boy (4ish?) was sitting in a pushchair crying away. The dad (huge bodybuilder type) leaned down grabbed the bars either side of the boy and shouted into his face through gritted teeth “STOP CRYING LIKE A F****** GIRL”. It really helped 🙄
And so the anger issues are passed on from generation to generation, like a family heirloom.
mandalorian – was that in the forces?
Aye.
I personally think it should be illegal to swear to a kid under say 10 in public
I agree. I'm just wondering what a reasonable sentence should be for that crime, though.
I mean, obviously they should lose their kids, but what sort of custodial sentence should the perps be looking at? 2 to 5 years seems like a reasonable guideline, doesn't it? We are talking about kids, after all.
Let's start writing to our local Tory MPs right away!
I agree. I’m just wondering what a reasonable sentence should be for that crime, though.
I mean, obviously they should lose their kids, but what sort of custodial sentence should the perps be looking at? 2 to 5 years seems like a reasonable guideline, doesn’t it? We are talking about kids, after all.
Let’s start writing to our local Tory MPs right away!
I'd stick with a community sentence, a few weeks in stocks on the back of a flatbed, being toured around local schools so the kids can throw things at the nasty swearer.
For me context matters a lot.
I've worked with blokes who used the f words more or less as punctuation: because it was so routine and so entirely devoid of any ire it was unoffensive.
On the other hand, looming over someone physically smaller and shouting will be intimidating whether you swear or not.
I personally try not to swear in front of my kids as a matter of course, but they've all heard me swearing. Life's rich pageant and all that. If it was especially audible I will usually apologize for using the word and note that it's offensive and we shouldn't be saying it, but at the end of the day you can avoid swearing as much as you like but at some point they'll be coming home from school having learned some pithy new phrases in the playground and there's not much you can do about that.
A few ritual executions should get the message across.
