[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-18096372 ]Tidal Turbine Trial[/url]
I've long thought that this is the way to go, I remember reading a report claiming that we could easily generate enough power for the whole UK with tidal turbines.
It's interesting to note that they mentioned the weather conditions which was always my doubt.
Its a part of the solution. Tidal could generate a significant % of the UKs usage - thats the nice thing about it - reliable and lasts all day ( tides at different times in different parts of the UK)
Capital costs are high and maintenance is not easy.
A friend of mine works for a company who also has a 500kW demonstrator up there which is working well/supplying to the grid.
I remember reading a report claiming that we could easily generate enough power for the whole UK with tidal turbines
That may well be true - much like wind turbines though, finding suitable/economic sites is the tough bit.
I suppose we could put some fatties in the water to generate waves to satisfy the demand during peak times. I think that's called a win/win situation. 😛
But if you removed all the energy that the oceans generate then the tides will stop and the moon will plummet to earth and kill us all.
The only problem is harnessing tidal power slows down the spin of the earth.
The moon is plummeting towards us all the time 🙂
The only problem is harnessing tidal power slows down the spin of the earth.
It's slowing down anyway due to the natural losses between the oceans and seabed in every tide. I'm not losing sleep over that, much bigger effect......
I dunno how practical it would really be in terms of timing. Unless you make barrages, there's a dead spot twice a day which isn't THAT different in terms of time from west to east in the UK. That is, when it's flat in the Irish sea it's almost flat on the east coast. At least I think, someone please correct me.
The machine in the OP's link - is there some kind of duct with that, or is it just a big open thing?
The fact that Kawasaki have stepped in with such an enormous investment shows that tidal turbines have a strong future - its beyond the level of small tech companies now.
No duct
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No molgrips - it is constant - there is enough time differnce. Teh two main scottish sites are the dornoch firth and sound of islay. Turbines generate on both rising and falling tides and these two sites have high tide far enough apart its almost a smooth output.
No duct needed on the turbine - it sits in areas of high flow.
If they can show reliability these things look like a really good answer
there's a dead spot twice a day
There is, but it's quite small, as either the shafts are braked or the blade pitch is variable so the machine produces a near constant power over a wide range of flow speeds. The small window of slack water, slow enough to produce no power, is small enough that regional differences in the tides would (potentially) lead to no net dead-time in a full UK-wide array.
TandemJeremy - Member
No molgrips - it is constant - there is enough time differnce. Teh two main scottish sites are the [s]dornoch [/s]Pentland firth and sound of islay
I'd like to see what could be done at Corryvreckan 🙂
😳
edit already covered above
Oh - just found some estimates for Corryvreckan
The maximum power is estimated as 2.3 GW during springs and 0.6 GW during neaps.The mean power available over a 25-hour period is calculated as 1.18 GW during springs and 0.30 GW during neaps.
The fact that Kawasaki have stepped in with such an enormous investment shows that tidal turbines have a strong future - its beyond the level of small tech companies now.
Yep, the company my friend works for started as a start-up of three working from one of their kitchens, now has a permanent head-count of more than 40, is wholly owned by RR and has letters of understanding for supply for 100's of the machines.
Tidal turbines - 29" of the renewable energy sector. Wind turbines are soooo last centuary 😉
Retro - by having another set 180 degrees out of phase. The two scottish sites are about 2.5 hrs apart on high tides so provide an almost smooth output.
which isn't THAT different in terms of time from west to east in the UK
even in Orkney tides are significantly staggered in different areas.
Yep, the company my friend works for started as a start-up of three working from one of their kitchens, now has a permanent head-count of more than 40, is wholly owned by RR and has letters of understanding for supply for 100's of the machines.
Ah, your friend is a client of the company I work for, I best behave myself...
I'm glad Marine Current Turbines have been taken under Siemens wing now too, they are a good bunch.
More of the BBC story here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-18100191
Ah, your friend is a client of the company I work for, I best behave myself...
Do tell..... 😉 I also chip in with technical consultancy for him - usually paid for in beer!
[url= http://www.withouthotair.com/ ]This is worth a read. It puts our expectations and current life styles and alligns them with different energy generation methods. In short we can't keep living how we live and expect renewables and/or conventional and/or nuclear to serve our needs[/url]
TandemJeremy - MemberRetro - by having another set 180 degrees out of phase. The two scottish sites are about 2.5 hrs apart on high tides so provide an almost smooth output.
I suppose that depends quite how flat the output is and how long the dead spot is; if bristolbiker is right then it sounds very possible.
How many areas have high enough flow? If it really were that easy why aren't there loads of them?
If it really were that easy why aren't there loads of them?
It's not easy though - think all the cost and faff of offshore wind, plus your mechanical and HV system is now fully submerged.
... so, jet skis don't actually need engines then?
This all sounds quite promising. Lets sell the rights to the tide to someone really cheaply. Then they can charge us a fortune for the power later on.
these have definilty got to be a better method than onshore wind farms. scotland already has lots of people who are experts at working in horrific conditions offshore so maintenance shouldn't be any worse than it is on oilrigs and the like surely? would be great to see these succeeding.
I beleive Rolls-Royce are doing R&D on tidal generation units.
I went to a [url= http://www.sut.org.uk/ ]SUT[/url] presentation on tidal power a few weeks ago. It really does have a lot of potential, its great that there are actually quite a few different ideas out there how to harness it, and being tested etc.
But the beuracracy (sp) to implement test rigs is enormous! Things like commisioning a 6-month birdlife review on the area of beach where the power cable will come back to land. Its not easy, but the guys with the brains who have the ideas are pushing forward regardless.
Could one be mounted in the pond by the 15th green at Donald Trump's golf pitch? Just to piss him off.
Anyone mentioned nuclear power yet?
Could one be mounted in the pond by the 15th green at Donald Trump's golf pitch? Just to piss him off.
He's more of a wind power man, I believe
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from my kitchen window i can see a 10m tide (swansea bay) i often look at the huge volume of water sloshing back and fore, and think one day.... anyway, turns out the powers that be are more interested in some kind of fracking under the seabed then using that lovely free energy 🙄
i really like the underwater wind turbine type ones as they stop commercial fishing so as a sideline produce a marine reserve - win win
Kit - MemberAnyone mentioned nuclear power yet?
I am sure Zokes will be along to tell us tidal does not work and nuclear is the only answer
here's an idea for wave power...
http://news.discovery.com/tech/aquatic-bike-pump-cranks-out-electricity-120123.html
Kev
There are two ( at least) different wave power generators being installed as well
Tidal barrage appears to be a much better solution.
The problem with the turbines is that they need to be in high current areas to produce enough power, then the installation and maintenance becomes extremely difficult.
Even the most powerful construction vessels struggle in a 6 kt current.
The River Severn is where its at.
We all could, of course, consume less. I know, it's all a bit off the wall, but hey!
That's the future.
Tidal barrages even more so rely on specific sites and have significant drawbacks - silting up, alteration of habitats and huge cost.
Tidal flow is good
There are two ( at least) different wave power generators being installed as well
A few more than that around the place so far, and more to come.
Tidal barrage appears to be a much better solution.
Huge issues surrounding tidal barrages - have a look into the proposed Severn one for examples. Someone pointed out the wildlife monitoring requirements for small turbine deployment sites - (big) barrages present a somewhat broader/different and larger scale set of issues.
In case of interest, here is a linky to a map of the Orkney developments, for some reason the crown estate don't have the west of scotland and welsh tidal developments on a map
I am sure Zokes will be along to tell us tidal does not work and nuclear is the only answer
You really can be a pillock at times.
Tidal power of the type being discussed here is great. My issues, as ever, are:
1) Will it be ready any time soon? (i.e. is it not still in the early stages of development)
2) Can it produce the sort of power, in a mix with other carbon-neutral options, that removes the requirement for coal (massively polluting) and gas (running out, fracking even more polluting), and nuclear?
If not, then nuclear is the least worst compared to coal. As ever, you obfuscate the argument to be nuclear vs renewables. It's not.
I [i]could[/i] use your argument and state that as Switzerland can't have tidal power, it's not a global fix, so shouldn't be considered though...
And lo and behold - here he is 🙂 Exactly as predicted.
