[Closed] This Obesity Thing

Eating Unhealthily - Easy and cheap
Eating Healthy - Hard(er) when you've done a full day's work, done the chores at home, sorted the kids/pets out, and are hungry and don't want to get to bed too late so you can get up at silly o'clock in the morning and not want to kill yourself or somebody else. And more expensive.
Exercising - See above. Often gets deprioritised when people have lives that are far too busy having to make enough money to make ends meet, and look after the kids, elderly/sick relatives, or whatever other responsibilities people have that they have to fit around work. (I do make the effort to cook from scratch mostly, but if I want to work a full day, go visit my dad, and do my share of the housework, quite often it's the exercise that gets sacrificed, over and above cycle commute to work anyway).
Sitting on the couch - sometimes all you can muster the energy to do after doing all of the above
Reading labels - Easy, if you have all the time in the world to shop and don't have impatient kids tugging at you, or a childminder to relieve, or any other time constraint - have you seen how small they print that stuff?
Interpreting Label information - see above
Giving a fat person a hug and saying "There there and have a pamphlet" - fairly useless.
Giving a fat person a severe talking to and making them aware that in no uncertain terms that they are killing themselves - also fairly useless
Driving to work/school - the norm.
Riding/walking to work/school - frowned upon, you might get hit by a car - how many times do we see stories just on STW about near-misses, accidents etc? Roads built for car drivers, not cyclists, and when people are in such a hurry everywhere, is it any wonder a red light or crossing means little to some people?

I blame processed food but then city lifestyle is a major problem in the developed world. i.e. stress due to work.

Can't think of anything more stressful than a famine. Surprising they're not all fat.

Hilarious. 😐

5thElefant - Member

Can't think of anything more stressful than a famine. Surprising they're not all fat.

I suppose if you have nothing to eat then you can be stressful too but in the developed world it is the opposite extreme. Too much eating due to stress vice versa. It also doesn't help when most food are so chemically processed ...

when ever i´m back in the UK it takes me afew days to stop pointing out all the fat people to my GF...

sure you get fat people here in Schermany, but there are noticeably fewer of them and they are not the norm.

i can only think of three people who are properly overweight amongst friends and colleagues. all of them are blokes. all of them drink lots (as is the norm in Bavaria) and one of them is English.

my mum is overweight. of her 7 sisters only two of them are not what you you call fat. one of them is seriously overweight, but i recon her fella is a feeder.

yes, the UK is fat.

[i]I wish TSY was here[/i]

😉

BMI developed for measuring whole populations not individuals regardless of their genetic hereditary Plus the goal posts were moved about twenty years ago downwards, putting a whole bunch of otherwise healthy people into the slightly overweight or overweight catagories

Can't be arsed to google it, but its out there .

alpin - Member

yes, the UK is fat.

I have to agree.

when ever i´m back in the UK it takes me afew days to stop pointing out all the fat people to my GF...

sure you get fat people here in Schermany, but there are noticeably fewer of them and they are not the norm.

i can only think of three people who are properly overweight amongst friends and colleagues. all of them are blokes. all of them drink lots (as is the norm in Bavaria) and one of them is English.

my mum is overweight. of her 7 sisters only two of them are not what you you call fat. one of them is seriously overweight, but i recon her fella is a feeder.

yes, the UK is fat.

I thought exactly this while on my European travels over the last 2 summers. How come Western Europe has nowhere near the amount of fatties as the UK?

Oh! One more thing, can we stop using body mass or BMI as measure of "fatness"

No I think we should keep it as it is a straightforward indicator that shows whether or not you need to look into something further. Then you can get the fat calipers out if you like. Complicated messages don't work which is why people aim for things like traffic light labelling even though there are obvious problems with that as well.

I thought exactly this while on my European travels over the last 2 summers. How come Western Europe has nowhere near the amount of fatties as the UK?

Based upon my trips to France, Germany and Belgium, because it's almost impossible to find a bloody supermarket to buy stuff.

yes, the UK is fat.

why? ❓

Maybe the Europeans hug their fatties moar?

I thought exactly this while on my European travels over the last 2 summers. How come Western Europe has nowhere near the amount of fatties as the UK?

Spain's not far off, at least in Madrid: most of the guys here in my office have a paunch.

No I think we should keep it as it is a straightforward indicator that shows whether or not you need to look into something further. Then you can get the fat calipers out if you like. Complicated messages don't work which is why people aim for things like traffic light labelling even though there are obvious problems with that as well.

I've heard people who don't eat particularly well and do no exercise saying "Well, the doctor said I was overweight but the BMI thing is unreliable isn't it, because it would say a professional rugby player was overweight even though they're fit".

It's a guide. It says "Given your height we would expect you to weigh Xkg, you're over/under this, why might that be?"

It could be that you're a professional rugby player, it could be that you've only got one leg, it could be that you've got a medical condition that means you gain weight, it could be that you're anorexic.

But for a lot of people it will simply be that because of their lifestyle they're outside a 'healthy' weight. Changing the lifestyle is the tricky bit, as is identifying what causes it & how much other 'players' influence it (food companies, govt etc).

For every person outside of their ideal weight, as a ratio to thickos with attention issues, is 1:15.

[i]Source: STW Forum (2014) 'http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/this-obesity-thing'. Pages 1-9.[/i]

Well if we're stereotyping....whenever i've been on holiday somewhere hot and seen a fat bloke in speedos they are invariably German!

why?

Because our nanny-state culture has led to a lack of individual responsibility of course.

We should look to countries that place a great emphasis on individualism as an example, like the US.

Are people in the UK intrinsically lazier or greedier than those in Europe, or in the UK before obesity was a major issue? I'd say not. So, something must have happened at a societal level.

Asking people, as individuals, to make major changes without addressing the root causes is not always going to be successful. We need to make large, national-level, structural changes if we're going to made a difference to a large, national problem.

Taking responsibility for yourself and eating more veg and fewer pies and moving about a bit more is fine, at an individual level. But, that advice isn't going to work for 40 million people.

Smoking suppresses appetite doesn't it? Is the decline in smoking related to the increase in eating?

I certainly put weight on when I gave up, but there were broader issues at work (no pun intended).

why?
Because our nanny-state culture has led to a lack of individual responsibility of course.

We should look to countries that place a great emphasis on individualism as an example, like the US.

Ah that bastion of personal responsibility, where there is blame there is a claim.

Obesity levels in France have doubled between 1995 and 2004 (to 11.3% of the population)

whatever is happening here, is happening there, too

I think it's shocking that we can't call a fat person fat. It's a fact, same way you can call a smoker a smoker and a cancer sufferer a cancer sufferer.

I also think it's shocking that some obese people sit and swear blind it's not their fault. Granted, they may not have been educated properly and not been made aware of how they should eat and live, but when you get to that stage you DO something about it. They put an enormous strain on the NHS to help relieve the symptoms of something they have basically done themselves.

Of course there are emotional issues and it's not black and white, anyone who feels the need to point out any such facts can save their energy. I just feel there should be much greater accountability on the people in question and a hard line of communication from medical professionals, family and friends rather than tiptoeing around the problems avoiding using direct language.

anyone who feels the need to point out any such facts can save their energy.

Yeah I hate it when people come out with inconvenient facts rather than just relying on lazy prejudices. I mean, you can prove anything with facts.

Dunno if my observations as a "portly" fellow are any help, but... I might be looking at it pretty simply, and I know that there ARE people out there who have outside influences that make the whole thing a lot more complex, but I kind of put it alongside the smoking thing. I knew smoking was really, really bad for me, but I did it for several years. Tried giving up with varying degrees of success for a number of years before finally getting it nailed - what it came down to, I think, was I really needed to WANT to give up in order to make it stick.

Weightwise, I've been slowly ballooning over the last six or eight years, to within sniffing distance of the dread twenty stone. Over the ten months or so up to my wedding in August of last year, I managed to shake almost four of them - since then, I've put two back on. What does it come down to? Well, the information's all out there, for those that have an interest - it's a matter of wanting to put it into action. Easier said than done, as I know well...

omfg........please stop arguing ffs.
you are like children, do you want me to slap the back of your legs and mate them smart?

Do you often miss the point grum?

How many calories for 10 minutes of smacking?

Do you often miss the point grum?

Was the point that you made up the idea that we can't call fat people fat?

I think it's shocking that we can't call a fat person fat.

I think this thread is pretty good evidence of what a load of bollocks that is.

I think it's shocking that we can't call a fat person fat

But you just did and nobody is knocking on your door to arrest you for it.

Of course there are emotional issues and it's not black and white, anyone who feels the need to point out any such facts can save their energy. I just feel there should be much greater accountability on the people in question and a hard line of communication from medical professionals, family and friends rather than tiptoeing around the problems avoiding using direct language.

As you point out, there are many reasons behind the increasing waistline of the country. Simply pointing at 40 million fat people and saying "Oi, fatty, sort yourself out!" isn't going to work. A more holistic* approach where we tackle societal issues as well as focusing on personal responsibility is needed.

*I apologise for using that word.

do you want me to slap the back of your legs and mate them smart

Chase me! Then we'll both see the benefit! 😉

you are like children, do you want me to slap the back of your legs and mate them smart?

Just don't smack their guts...

[img] [/img]

Jamie...where did you get my photo?

I just googled for images of black doctors.

Do that 2 day a week 600 calorie a day. Works great very easy probably psychology as I never have problem. Sack it when stopping with mother(not worth the ear ache) and anytime I am seeing daughters. So not overly rigid. Highly rated from a health point of view. Put on about a stone and half during 6 weeks in hospital and 2 months of the home help force feeding me full Monty breakfast! Have septic arthritis so difficult to get started on the bike again but managed in the end. Rugby is no chance. And now I am out of the habit of 60 mile pub crawls on my bike. Worse still I changed pubs to one that is only 6 miles away instead of the normal 12. Am nearly at my normal weight but have been for 6 months. Need to do that bit more exercise or look a bit more at my calorie intake. Have you noticed how they slag this diet down? Always on about the anorexia when the problem of obesity is many times worse. For the NHS (also known as the taxpayer) the cost are many times higher. Always the minority comes first.

A more holistic* approach where we tackle societal issues as well as focusing on personal responsibility is needed.

*I apologise for using that word.

So, to progress things, what do those in the "it's complex" or "it's social-level thing" suggest is done? Beyond appealing to personal initiative, what about subsidies, price incentives, removing tax on veg', and stronger regulation and legislation on the food industry? Clearly much of his would have to be paid for out of the public pocket. Is there appetite for this? 😉

So, to progress things, what do those in the "it's complex" or "it's social-level thing" suggest is done?

Fiddle about with VAT/taxes on 'healthy'/'unhealthy' food/drink;
Sugar Tax;
Prioritise active travel, including good-quality bike infrastructure;
Parking Space Tax for businesses;
Gritting of pavements and bike paths in winter;
Free (good) school meals, with a ban on packed lunches;
Discount cars/vouchers for vegetable purchases for low income families;
Better education in school;
Better labelling and food regulations;
1-to-1 support for people losing weight;
Car-exclusion zones around schools;
Road pricing to discourage car commuting;
Subsidised public transport;
Raise driving age to 21;

When the Zombie apocalypse happens you'll all be glad of the fatties as a food source

I bet they are even Paleo approved 8)

As a food source for the zombies you mean, whilst the skinny folk run for the hills?

Miketually has it.

Fiddle about with VAT/taxes on 'healthy'/'unhealthy' food/drink;
Sugar Tax;
Prioritise active travel, including good-quality bike infrastructure;
Parking Space Tax for businesses;
Gritting of pavements and bike paths in winter;
Free (good) school meals, with a ban on packed lunches;
Discount cars/vouchers for vegetable purchases for low income families;
Better education in school;
Better labelling and food regulations;
1-to-1 support for people losing weight;
Car-exclusion zones around schools;
Road pricing to discourage car commuting;
Subsidised public transport;
Raise driving age to 21;

pie-eaters wouldn't care, they would just eat more pie

[img] [/img]

It's somewhat shocking and saddening for me to see how little empathy there is for a significant proportion of the population.

I do feel sorry for those who have genuine medical reasons behind their weight, it's just those who don't even try and still moan about it that I have no time for. Again it's the laziness and excuse making I can't stand. Poor education on food is also no excuse, the majority of people have internet access to look up good advice. And eating healthy can be cheap. As an ex-fatty I know they love looking for excuses why it's not their fault or looking for something to blame it on, because I did the same before one day I decided to sort my ****ing life out. And yes current me is still very much disgusted by the old me 🙂

Imo sugar, "bad carbs" etc can't really be blamed either, otherwise how would I have managed to lose 2 stone/6" off my waist and go down 3 t-shirt sizes in a few months when my diet consisted of bread, cereal, microwave lasagnes and beer? It's because I was riding all day every day and expending more than I was consuming, simple as that!

It's somewhat shocking and saddening for me to see how little empathy there is for a significant proportion of the population.

Quite right too

I have no sympathy for smokers
I have no sympathy for fatties

Both are choosing bad health

Good list Miketually!

@ _tom_ I reckon most in the "it's complicated" camp probably subscribe more than they're letting on to the "put it down and get up and do something" view. That's not a surprise given that most of us are actually pretty fit and willing to get out there, whatever the weather. But, do you not think it is weird how [url= http://www.noo.org.uk/NOO_about_obesity/adult_obesity/international ]national averages are so different[/url]? Is this because our society's members are somehow weaker and lacking in will-power than people in other societies, or might different cultural histories, norms, food industry regulations and legal structures play a role?