[Closed] They only wanted a damm cake, But

I was pro-gaycake until I saw the image they used.
I do wish homosexuals would stop looking to find homosexuality in places where it doesn't exist, like Bert and Ernie or Top Gun.

I was pro-gaycake until I saw the image they used.
I do wish homosexuals would stop looking to find homosexuality in places where it doesn't exist, like Bert and Ernie or Top Gun.

+1

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I was pro-gaycake until I saw the image they used.

Was it puff pastry?

[img] http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQbqNkLYJa6J_uy8ArGompC55uq2xjapPSJARTIDNKBilNav5EF [/img]

2 Belgian buns, I think

heard someone on the radio who had a valid point

the bakery refused to make the cake (as it offended the owners) however they hadn't refused to serve the gay gentlemen in question and had previously and since sold them stuff from the bakery

they weren't discriminatory (in his opinion) as they were happy to sell other items to the gentlemen and the shop had a right to refuse to make a bespoke cake

Big and daft if you read the judgement there is a big section dealing with that exact point .

Worth googling Christian Concern - the group that financially backs legal fees for companies who'd like to use their Christian beliefs to discriminate. They're obsessed with gays gaying all over the place and the untold damage all their gaying is doing to families all over the increasingly gay world. According to them, Tom Daley only started all his rampant gaying when his dad died.

The Evangelical Alliance, that pillar of liberalism and progressive thinking is disappointed. I love anything that disappoints the Evangelical Alliance and their mates in the DUP that tell schoolchildren that gaying is an "abomination". ****ing backward weirdos.

a gay rights activist actively seeks out a bakery that will most likely not want to make a gay cake.

gay activist being a dick in equal measure, imo.

edit: i am niether pro gayers nor fairy believers.

It could also be seen as: Gay rights activists expose business using religious beliefs to discriminate.

Good on them.

Where does it say that they sort out that particular bakery hoping to make trouble?

In her witness statement the 3rd Defendant states:-
“.... We consider that it is necessary as Christians to have a clear conscience before God. This means that we must live out our faith in our words and deeds and that it would be sinful to act or speak contrary to God’s law.”

There is a long list of things in the bible that they should be doing or not doing if they live their lives by it...strange it seems they pick and choose

[quote=big_n_daft opined]heard someone on the radio who had a valid point
the bakery refused to make the cake (as it offended the owners) however they hadn't refused to serve the gay gentlemen in question and had previously and since sold them stuff from the bakery
they weren't discriminatory (in his opinion) as they were happy to sell other items to the gentlemen and the shop had a right to refuse to make a bespoke cake

So you heard someone on the radio get the law wrong then

FWIW i often wonder how the christians would react of folk were allowed to turn them away and discriminate against them

I suspect they would be as annoyed as a gay person in a bakery.

Correct decision as belief in a myth, no matter how sincerely held, cannot be a n excuse to discriminate.

"Where does it say that they sort out that particular bakery hoping to make trouble?"
Nowhere alpin made it up it was his local that he had used before they even agreed to make the cake.

Where does it say that they sort out that particular bakery hoping to make trouble?

I'm only going on memory here MSP, but I think it was apparent from the original story that maybe the customers had a fair idea that the commission might be refused by this particular bakery, if you know what I mean. You'd have to google the details from when the story broke (last year IIRC). I don't think it was ever expressly written anywhere (when I read about it anyway) but I did get the feeling at the time that it might have been an action to provoke a reaction and a subsequent court case. NI is not an easy place to be LGBT - with the nutters in the DUP doing everything to allow discrimination to continue, like say, wanting the ban on gay men donating blood to continue ad infinitum.

EDIT: in view of crankboy's answer above, really, I might be mis-remembering it all and making all the above up. I have committed the mortal sin of not researching Google throughly before posting. 🙂

Isn't that long list of stuff in the Old Testament things that the Israelites/Jews were supposed to do or not do?

I have committed the mortal sin of not researching Google throughly before posting.

DD - I don't think you're misremembering, there was something like that brought up first time round, I recall it too. I don't know whether it was on the original thread or elsewhere that I read it though, nor whether the source of it was credible.

Great that this has happened in NI, of all places.
I look forward to a run of requests to Catholic bakers to produce cakes celebrating the Battle of the Boyne.

I have committed the mortal sin of not researching Google throughly before posting.

and not copy and pasting long boring articles to support your view, then slagging off people who donmt agree with you, but thats just a generalisation of the general way stuff degerates sometimes on here.

I'm frustrated by this story: Where are the details about the cake? - raspberry sponge ? Fondant ? I need to know!

Hail TJ Full Of Win
The Sturge Is With Thee
Blessed Art Thou Among Plastiques
And blessed is the saddle of thine grand tandem.
Holy TJ, father of argue
Pray for us STWers
Now and at the hour of our FAIL
Amen.

x 3

For JY x

Great that this has happened in NI, of all places.

It's fantastic - it needs dragging out of the dark ages sometime. It's a good start, long as the road might be.

raspberry sponge ? Fondant ? I need to know!

It probably never mattered

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I welcome the verdict. Not for the belief that gay marriage is wrong, but that their beliefs cannot be above the law. Law being that of discrimination.

There is no religion or religious belief and teaching that can be above the law

This may have already been brought up, if so I appologise but what happens if the bakery is owned by Muslims and the order for the Cake is something that offends Allah or the Muslim belief system?

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[quote=Royston opined]This may have already been brought up, if so I appologise but what happens if the bakery is owned by Muslims and the order for the Cake is something that offends Allah or the Muslim belief system?
Same thing as here - its illegal

Or an environmentalist refusing to sell a product due to excess packaging?

Or a cake seller refusing to sell anymore cakes to a morbidly obese fatty?

his may have already been brought up, if so I appologise but what happens if the bakery is owned by Muslims and the order for the Cake is something that offends Allah or the Muslim belief system?

Well, it could be trouble if it was a small piece made by a close relative, 'cos that would be *coughs* aunty semi de cake.

/THREAD

Or a T-shirt seller refusing to sell Che Guevara tops to spotty students out of principle?

It may well be illegal but would the decision have been the same? or would there have been consideration of a possible radical reaction.

Were the Nation Of Islam float at the Notting Hill Carnival breaking the law when they refused to give me one of the leaflets they were handing out freely to BMR partygoers (I'm a honky). Yes this did happen pmsl

What I don't get is why didn't the shop just say no to the commission? Why mention the nature of the refusal? If a business says no to a request of mine, should I have them investigated in case they have discriminated against me?

Also, who asks for a pro gay marriage cake, if not to stir (mix?) things up at the shop? I'm pro many things, I've never had a cake made to demonstrate this.

They didn't just say no because they accepted the order then changed their minds so rang to cancel and gave their explanation in the call. The cake was for a party to celebrate a local councillor s election .those hosting the party and the councillor were pro marriage.

I was once asked in all seriousness by a work colleague if there was a time zone change when flying to Ulster. My reply "yes. they are about 60 years behind the more enlightened parts of the mainland".

Try the steaks, I'm here all week... etc.

My blood is boiling here, watching some **** from the DUP on tv claiming that Christians in Northern Ireland are now feeling marginalised.

To clarify, the DUP, the majority ruling party in Northern Ireland which is comprised of almost entirely fundamentalist christians (who have frequently stated they view homosexuality as an abomination) is saying that Christians are now feeling under threat in Northern Ireland because the owners of a multi million pound business obstinately, belligerently and calculatedly refused to bake a cake.

Incidentally, Ashers legal fees were paid for buy the "Christian Institute".

Would a gay baker be allowed to refuse to bake an anti gay marriage cake, if asked? Sexuality/religion of the requestor unknown.

Depends
You can discriminate against all - we dont do political cakes or we dont do religious cakes etc but you cannot pick and chose the ones you will and you wont do [ if that choice violates equality laws] as that is discrimination.

Tomhoward no he wouldn't the judgement makes that point very clearly . subject to a blanket no politics policy probably being OK.

The ruling makes the point really clearly:

"I do not accept the Defendants submissions that what the
Plaintiff wanted them to do would require them to promote and support gay marriage which is contrary to their deeply held religious beliefs."

The defendants say they don't want to promote gay marriage; the judge says fair dos, but that's not what you were asked to do, you were asked to make a cake so that someone else can promote gay marriage.

eatmusic - Member

In her witness statement the 3rd Defendant states:-
“.... We consider that it is necessary as Christians to have a clear conscience before God. This means that we must live out our faith in our words and deeds and that it would be sinful to act or speak contrary to God’s law.”

And in this case she was worried about the 3rd commandment, "thou shalt not bake really gay cakes." Seriously, where in the bible does it forbid this?

Also noticed "She had real concerns that the cake would have been identified as an Asher's cake as there is a logo on the box". So how does that apply to their apparent religious concern? It'd be OK to bake the cake as long as nobody could tell it was them?

"thou shalt not bake really gay cakes."

Got a genuine LOL from me with that.
Would these be allowed?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/fairycakes_93711

[url= http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2014/02/27/a-baker-refused-to-make-your-wedding-cake ]here's a suggestion for all the hatey, butt-sore, anti-gay bakers in Arizona: start an organization—The Arizona Association of Homophobic Bakers—and publicly identify yourselves as homophobic bakers. Put up a website with a list of bakeries that don't want to do business with LGBT people. Put signs in your windows that clearly state that gay and lesbian customers are not welcome and will be turned away.[/url]

This isn't strictly relevant, as NI's anti-discrimination laws are radically different to Arizona's. But lack of strict relevance isn't stictly relevant. 🙂