It's all about the comprimise you're willing to make.
I'd rather drive to Scotland in my estate but when I'm there I'd rather have a van.
Vans are the ultimate MTB vehicle so long as you don't need to do many non MTB miles, and you don't mind the worse economy and comfort. I still reckon a van based MPV is the best of both worlds - the practicality of a van with the comfort of a car - just with the disadvantage of having to remove/store seats if you want to put bikes in the back/camp in it.
If we are going down the horsebox route, I'll trump that with a hot shower, central heating and a double bed 😉
Just being silly, but my bike does travel in there sometimes....
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52616144778_666d5224f3_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52616144778_666d5224f3_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://www.flickr.com/gp/85252658@N05/02554Y3907 ]2023-01-08_09-53-14[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/85252658@N05/ ]davetheblade[/url], on Flickr
It’s all about the comprimise you’re willing to make.
Nail on head.
I still reckon a van based MPV is the best of both worlds – the practicality of a van with the comfort of a car – just with the disadvantage of having to remove/store seats if you want to put bikes in the back/camp in it.
Not quite the comfort of a car, but good enough IMO. Depends how many seats are needed, but a double-cab/Kombi-style with 5/6 seats and the remaining space as a cargo area are a good compromise. I would say that though as that's what I have. Relative comfort in the cab, proper bulklhead, and a non-trimmed cargo area big enough for bikes so no worries about trashing the nice trim of a Caravelle/Tourneo or having to remove and store seats.
I'm happy to put up with the compromises on performance, running costs, etc for the benefits a mid-sized double-cab van provides me. Not everyone will be though.
Love the hot shower Dave.We are never that far that can’t do that at home. It’s horses for courses isn’t it (sorry) and I love the fact that it’s the only vehicle that any amount of mud and dirt etc actually makes no difference at all too.
I've never had a car that will reliably do more than about 42mpg in the real (or my?) world
any LWB van is the ultimate bike transport. providing you can afford the petrol. everything is just easier than any estate. I`ve an older 13 plate vivaro with a pop top and its great.
i can get 5 bikes and people in mine and it sleeps 4 comfortably. it will do 35-40mpg regardless of how much stuff is in it in fact the ride is much nicer when loaded. Its waaaay nicer to drive than any car i've had. plus the bikes are more secure.
I keep toying with selling it as i`ve a t2 van for local stuff and a bigger car as well but the vivaro just too bloody useful for ferrying bikes/paddleboards camping etc etc. if anything i should sell the T2 but i cant bring myself to (plus it needs some work!!)
I don't understand that mansion picture above - surely having something that size means you live in it so the suitcase is confusing me...suggests you don't stay in that permanently! 😉 That would be an ideal home for me I reckon, suspect the girlfriend and my child would have something negative to say about it, but that looks pretty perfect for day-to-day living for me.
Well seeing as we're here...
Just got a Focus estate but made the silly mistake of getting one with no tow bar, looks like that's going to be silly money to get fitted and programmed then I'll probably need to get a suitable 3 bike rack for probably one trip a year. Oh, and we have a dog so need to get him in and out the boot.
That's when you realise there's convenient and then there's just excessive.
I see a roof rack in my future.
It’s still only 35 quid extra a month if I’m doing 8k miles a year.
You do realise that's £420 a year?
Its waaaay nicer to drive than any car i’ve had.
What cars have you had? My mum has my dad's old 13 plate and it's definitely a van, no getting away from that. Auto box and no cruise make for occasionally tedious driving.
I don’t understand that mansion picture above – surely having something that size means you live in it so the suitcase is confusing me…suggests you don’t stay in that permanently!
Monday thru Thursday nights normally, go home Friday.
Suitcase normally has contents put in drawers or the wardrobe, sometimes not 🤣
As it's almost always solo travel for me my Fabia with a towbar rack is perfect. Tent in the boot for the summer, hotels with secure storage in the winter if required. Ultimate though would be a camper with bike garage, but the fuel bill rules that out for me.
I’ve never had a car that will reliably do more than about 42mpg in the real (or my?) world
I've had vehicles with a range from 55 to 14 (sub 10 when 'making progress'), not a single one of them a diesel.
Having bikes on the outside preclude "ultimate MTB transport"
What makes it ultimate?
Practical, ie: a kitted out Van:
or good for travelling to go riding: Pick your favourite shooting brake
Having bikes on the outside preclude “ultimate MTB transport”
bikes on the outside as the only option is a disqualifyer. Having the ability to, for shorter trips or if the boot is full of other stuff though...
Personally, no kids, no dog, need a vehicle for work, my priority list below.
1 - reasonable economical and easy to park vehicle that isnt miserable to drive for day to day.
2 - Bike transported fully assembled and ready to go/no post ride cleaning needed for winter rides (can be externally mounted)
3 - 1 person, bike inside with wheels off for after work rides
4 - 2 people, 2 bikes, camping equipment
5 - 2 people, 2 bikes inside for longer trips
6 - 2 people, 2 airline bike bags for trips to airport.
7 - 3 or 4 people, 3 or 4 bikes for trips with friends.
I have acheived points 1 to 4 with an Audi A1 3 door. Luckily my partners car ticks off points 5 to 7.
Van.
/thread
Personally, no kids, no dog, need a vehicle for work, my priority list below.
1 – reasonable economical and easy to park vehicle that isnt miserable to drive for day to day.
2 – Bike transported fully assembled and ready to go/no post ride cleaning needed for winter rides (can be externally mounted)
3 – 1 person, bike inside with wheels off for after work rides
4 – 2 people, 2 bikes, camping equipment
5 – 2 people, 2 bikes inside for longer trips
6 – 2 people, 2 airline bike bags for trips to airport.
7 – 3 or 4 people, 3 or 4 bikes for trips with friends.
I've quickly come to the conclusion that the traveller/Proace verso/tourneo custom will do all that. I too have no kids, no pets, very little 'regular' car use so I could probably go full van, but I do need to carry 3-4 people every so often. I don't need 8 seats but I do want the space a van body gives me.
That last one is the trickiest, but with 2x seats removed from the 2nd and 3rd rows you'll get 4x seats and a load space of 1m X 2.4m - so room for 3/4 bikes with wheels on.
The mwb traveller is only 10cm longer than my Skoda superb so parking should be no issue.
The only stumbling block is price - but you can get something with a decent spec for £25k +/- 5k.
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I haven't driven many MPVs - one time I hired a Ford Galaxy for a week and it was great. Better to drive than the many vans I've driven, I think.
The only stumbling block is price – but you can get something with a decent spec for £25k +/- 5k.
I'll say. Compare these two:
Van for £23k
Estate for £21.5k
The estate is a year older, a grand and a half cheaper, two-thirds the mileage, much more powerful, far better handling, much more comfortable and is still more economical. I know which one I'd rather drive through Wales!
Oh trust me, I know! 😬
To get something 2018 with a reasonable mileage you're looking at the best part of £30k for a van based MPV.
Vs a 2019 Skoda Superb sportline plus with 21k miles for 25k...
But... No matter how nice the estate is, you can't carry 4x people and 4x bikes with wheels on or off in any estate. Nor can you camp in it alongside a couple of bikes. So the comparison is meaningless, unless the estate does what you need.
the comparison is meaningless, unless the estate does what you need.
I don't think about how nice an estate car I could have for the cost of my van!
I’ve quickly come to the conclusion that the traveller/Proace verso/tourneo custom will do all that. I too have no kids, no pets, very little ‘regular’ car use so I could probably go full van, but I do need to carry 3-4 people every so often. I don’t need 8 seats but I do want the space a van body gives me.
I'm sure you will have, but I assume you've considered the halfway option? A Transit DCIV? If you don't need more than 5/6 seats it's worth looking at. DCIV hits your criteria without the worry of dirtying up a nicely trimmed interior or indeed having the bikes still visible from outside. DCIV is 5 or 6 seats with big, non-glazed cargo area, separated from cab with a bulkhead. Cheaper than a Tourneo. Main downside vs Tourneo is van speed limits but it's not a major one.
Cabin:
Cargo area:
HalfVan:
I’m sure you will have, but I assume you’ve considered the halfway option? A Transit DCIV? If you don’t need more than 5/6 seats it’s worth looking at. DCIV hits your criteria without the worry of dirtying up a nicely trimmed interior or indeed having the bikes still visible from outside. DCIV is 5 or 6 seats with big, non-glazed cargo area, separated from cab with a bulkhead. Cheaper than a Tourneo. Main downside vs Tourneo is van speed limits but it’s not a major one.
I had briefly - the main issue is I want to be able to camp in the van regularly, and at 6ft 3in (191cm) I'd need the L2 at 5.4m long to get 194cm room in the back. Which is half a metre longer than my estate.
Also, no windows in the back of the DCIV, which would make camping in one weird and very sweaty! Maybe the L1 would be an option if you take the bulkhead out of them... Then there's the van speed limits - not a major issue though really. Oh and they're a little spartan in spec, no leather, climate, sunroof etc.
Then there's the price, cheapest 2018 model with android auto, with less than 60k miles on auto trader is £28k. As a comparison the Peugeot traveller can be had for £25k for a 2017/2018 model with 50k miles.
So yeah, just a few things that go against it - 28k is probably my upper limit and the transit customs start at that.
The van lifestyle is optional though really. I mean I've nothing against it, but when I went to Scotland with 3 people, one bike, a SUP and inflatable kayak I used an estate, a bike rack, and we camped. I didn't feel the need for a van at all. So yeah, take your pick but vans aren't essential.
Pre 2014 Vauxhall Zafira. Drives like a car, has windows, can stuff bikes into it without worrying about scraping the trim. Poverty spec is fine but you can splash out on an aftermarket CarPlay stereo to make up for the fact you’re not driving a fancy Skoda estate/transit van or whatever.
Get 2 of them if you need more space @ta11pau1, leaves you £18k for C&H.
@ta11pau1, fair enough - just wanted to check you knew about the DCIV option. We considered a Tourneo but it was the too-nice-for-muddy-bikes trim, rear windows and cost that ruled in favour of a DCIV. I've yet to sleep in the back of mine but planning to do so: we've got a tailgate so will use a latch extender - keeps tailgate open a few inches for ventilation while still locking. Midges could be a bugger though. Reminds me I need to fit an internal tailgate release button. Ours is L2 and at 187cm I can only just lie down. I'm about to cut holes in the lower bulkhead but for subwoofers rather than feet to poke through.
Leather and only A/C in ours and I hate sunroofs! Leather specced for its wipe-clean properties (kids...) rather than plushness.
Ours is L2 and at 187cm I can only just lie down. I’m about to cut holes in the lower bulkhead but for subwoofers rather than feet to poke through.
Was fully expecting it to be for this reason! 🤣
Just seen the transit rear seats don't fold down either so that's another issue, too many things that I'd need to sort unfortunately.
And yeah I'll need to sort something to keep the mud at bay, however if I can find one with a towbar I'll keep my rack for proper grotty days. I've been trying to think about how to get a camping box/bed in there and I think it'll be possible with having one row of 2x seats in place in the 3rd row position which allows space for a table/cooker etc inside the van so even more practical as a camper.
Pre 2014 Vauxhall Zafira. Drives like a car, has windows, can stuff bikes into it without worrying about scraping the trim. Poverty spec is fine but you can splash out on an aftermarket CarPlay stereo to make up for the fact you’re not driving a fancy Skoda estate/transit van or whatever.
Get 2 of them if you need more space @ta11pau1, leaves you £18k for C&H.
Ha, tbh if was going the cheap route I'd just do it properly and get a Berlingo XTR/Teepee Outdoor for £5k. 😁
Looking at the empty JD bottles I now understand the randomness of @TheArtistFormerlyKnownAsSTR posts
😜😋🤪
Looking at the empty JD bottles I now understand the randomness of @TheArtistFormerlyKnownAsSTR posts
Haha - they were over a fortnight, just hadn't got round to chucking one of them away. Barely touched a drop through January, sat here with a Guiness Zero procrastinating whilst I pretend to do my accounts in preparation for another late tax return
Is it still considered camping if you sleep inside a vehicle?
If you believe facebook and instagram, parking your van by the side of the road somewhere nice and shitting in the hedge is wild camping.
my old zaffira is pretty good for lugging bikes about.
takes our 2 bikes with wheels still on with all seats down.
takes 4 bikes stripped down with just rear seats down and 4 people onboard.
leave bikes in the back overnight wherever we are.
not sure of the milage per gallon, but it isnt very thirsty on long motorway runs.
and it is sofa comfy to drive.
+ for MPV. Our Scenic becomes a bit of a van when all the rear seats are removed. Good cheap rear bike rack options not requiring a tow bar. 50+ mpg on longer runs, cruisy drive. Ideal for 2+ kids. Cool in a French way (90's).
Shuurely the ultimate MTB transport is a fully kitted out mobile workshop with professional mechanics making sure said bike is always pristine and waiting for you. Meanwhile you head to the trails via a combination of private jet and luxury Merc?
Shuurely the ultimate MTB transport is a fully kitted out mobile workshop with professional mechanics making sure said bike is always pristine and waiting for you. Meanwhile you head to the trails via a combination of private jet and luxury Merc?
So like an F1 race truck/hospitality truck with your own team of Jordi Cortes' on hand?
I've tried every possible combination over the years. Needs to fairly smart for work, still enjoy driving have 2 kids & dogs.
Nice van - Most practical but felt bad abusing it with muddy bikes & kit. Don't need something the size of a van most of the time, slow, not exactly fun to drive.
JDM minivan - Bonkers fun & practical but again felt bad putting muddy bikes in it. Mpg was also abysmal.
4x4 Pickup - Not much space for the size, wheels need to be removed to fit in the back.
Fun estate with towbar rack - best single vehicle compromise for me, muddy bike outside, good for daily use and family trips. Annoying having to change after muddy ride but can live with it. Fit rack and bike on takes seconds.
Car of choice & shitbox van - for me this is the best option but expensive and you need the space to park them. Van to abuse for mtb, get in filthy and not worry about. Enjoyable daily driver for the rest of the time.
Car of choice & shitbox van – for me this is the best option but expensive and you need the space to park them. Van to abuse for mtb, get in filthy and not worry about. Enjoyable daily driver for the rest of the time.
I think n+1 is cheating (or at least bending the rules a little) but you're probably right.
Of course alongside your nice car and panel van you'll want a raised 4x4 sprinter camper conversion for when you want to rough it in Innerleithen car park for the night...
So that's one of these
Plus one of these
Plus a rough panel van that you don't mind getting covered in crap.
Resurrecting this thread, had a look this afternoon at what £39k gets you in terms of newish van based MPV (21 plate) from the cheaper options..
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It gets you a lot of metal. But not much else...
Compared to the 21 plate Volvo XC60 my parents have just bought for 42k, with literally everything on it; air suspension, parking heater, heated everything etc etc etc it's a little depressing how little you get in a van based MPV.
Even going up to the 'nicer' tourneo only gains you a slightly nicer interior, with a softer place to rest your arm on rather than rock hard plastic. But you lose climate control, a sunroof, head up display, opening rear window...
There are options about around £28k though, 2017/2018 plate so more reasonable prices.
Different for everyone. I'd love a van for carrying my bikes, getting changed in the back, all that good stuff. But I don't want to drive a van, so that loses out on the transport side. So instead I have a big fast estate, which is great to drive, and competent at carrying bikes, and better than most but worse than a van for the end of the ride. that's pretty much perfect for me but it'd suck for other people.
had a look this afternoon at what £39k gets you in terms of newish van based MPV
£39k. 😱
Flipping heck, that's what or first house cost in 2000.
£39k. 😱
Flipping heck, that’s what or first house cost in 2000.
Yep, s**t be expensive now.
I've just had a look at the list prices of the brand new tourneo custom...£53k for the cheapest model. Want a decently powerful engine and a mid-level spec? North of 60k quite quickly.
That particular Vivaro Life LWB Elite spec in the picture would have been £47k brand new.
Given the money, I’d love one of these:
1975 Volvo TGB13 6x6 truck. Earlier versions had a separate box on the back, someone not far from me has had one, sans box, parked in the small front garden of their house, amazingly. Not there at the moment, probably getting an expedition back built up for it.
I had an ex Scottish Gas Vauxhall Combi that was brilliant for mountain biking. Only had two seats though. It's annoying that my wife won't drive a sensibly sized car (she likes her Fiat 500) so I could get myself another little van. 🤔
I'm also looking at my next vehicle to be my ultimate MTB van.
It's going to be a small van rather than anything like a Transporter.
I'm looking at Peugeot Partner or Rifters etc; I know theres quite a lot of Berlingo love on here.
The newer shape Partners are very comfy looking in the cab, and even the passenger seat folds down; take the bulkhead out and you could probably fit a bike lengthways in a SWB without taking the wheel out.
Can also see the appeal of the van-based MPVs; but as someone with no kids or dog it just looks like a situation where I need to find somewhere to put the seats I remove from it...
Ideally I want to fit one bike in with wheels on; or multiple bikes with front wheels off/1 bike plus me in the back having a kip. Just really torn on whether a van or an MPV is the right move. MPG is pretty good on those size vans, comparble to cars, and you can get them for under £15k used with full service history...
Won't help but I've the MPV version of the Partner...middle seat is only in for MOT as my bike tends to spend a lot of time there instead. I'll remove second seat to put another complete bike in or remove front wheels and can put 2 bikes in...bit tight but works.
So normally 1 seat to store with a second now and again.
Won’t help but I’ve the MPV version of the Partner…middle seat is only in for MOT as my bike tends to spend a lot of time there instead. I’ll remove second seat to put another complete bike in or remove front wheels and can put 2 bikes in…bit tight but works.
So normally 1 seat to store with a second now and again.
So the Peugeot Rifter? Or do you mean the crew cab version of a Partner? Is this the short or long wheel base one?
I notice on the Rifter/Berlingo/Combo the seats dont go completely flat like in a Caddy equivalent. I won't pay VW tax though; and from what I've read reliability is a nightmare
After looking at a couple of the stellantis group van based MPV's at the weekend, and realising that for £30-32k they're really nothing special, I'm now down the rabbit hole of going "sod it" and looking at tourneo customs and t6 caravelles...
😬🫣
Just working out if I can get the seats in a SWB Caravelle (no LWB in the executive spec) in a configuration to allow bike(s) down one side, wheels on or off, with seats down the other and a bed over the top of them. Looks like the 3 seater bench would have to go and 2x single seats down one side. Or possibly the 2 seat bench/bed from the California which I think fits straight into the caravelle rails... I'd then have a single seat in front of that and fit a bike down the gap where the storage box/cabinets would go in a California. Headache!!
The tourneo is much easier as all seats come out individually, and there's a LWB version so remove one, tilt the one in front and space for my Geometron to fit wheels on. Simples!
Interesting info on the Tourneos. Its really come down to how seats are managed when looking at MPVs.
Stellantis MPVs that are a few years old (but still new shape) can be had with full service history for £15k. Couple on Autotrader.
