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Ned, that's a fantastic pic. I need to book a holiday!
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Lots of nice blues at SC Flux. When I first started the narrow greens were the scary ones.
My transceiver recommendation would be the Barryvox Element or the Ortovox 3+.
The BCA Tracker 1 was an awful transceiver and I've heard mixed reports on the Tracker 2 (although I haven't tested one yet).
Looking at booking last minute for Morzine next weekend. I've never been so looking for hints and tips if anyone can help.
By the way, I left BASI 4 years ago because of a low tolerance of muppets, but what is going on at the moment? I cant see the members pages but the impression I'm getting from friends back home is, it looks like the jobs for the boys crowd are trying a coup and taking over. Anyone got inside info?
@cobraski - I used to be Morzine regular 25 yrs ago but not skied there since after company we used sold-up and after one year of dire snow (it is low) so perhaps not the most current recommendations 😳 Do a day in Morzine/Les Gets (IMO skiing better in Les Gets which is easy to get to) then get up to Avoriaz, cross your fingers for good conditions then take on the "The Wall" into Champery. The Coupe de Monde is quite a nice run down from Avoriaz. If the Ice Hockey team has a home match go along.
Returning to avalanche transceivers for a moment, any recommendations for me?
After trying several I went for an Ortovox 3+. It seems to be as good as any and is fairly easy to use. If you join the Ski Club [url= http://www.lockwoods.com/ski-club-of-gb-off-piste-safety-equipment-/ortovox-3-ski-club-/prod_5592.html ]Lockwoods[/url] will sell you one for £211, otherwise about £250. If you haven't had much practice its main purpose is going to be for finding you, not searching for someone else.
As for the shovelling, I've had to do it for real and it's really hard work. Fortunately everyone's heads were above the snow; I can't imagine what it's like if you're also worrying about putting a shovel into someone's face.
Someone mentioned the Peips Freeride earlier for a cheap "body recovery" beacon. But I have RECCO tags for that!
I think that was me. The problem with RECCO is that it may take a while to get a RECCO search device to the scene. And it's important to find even a body as quickly as possible even if it's just to eliminate the need to search further!
Digby, the longer trip I was talking about was also at Boulder hut! Rupert had never been himself so organised a mates trip. Great fun and awesome experience, shame the snowpack was iffy so end to stick to the trees and steer clear of all the movie slopes.
dp
Rio, I think Graham was assuming you were saying the Freeride wasn't very quick to search with, so was a cheap "corpse recovery", hence the reference to Recco. ?
nedrapier - I understood where Graham was coming from although I might not have put it very eloquently; the "corpse recovery" bit was meant tongue in cheek - I'd hope it might be useful for recovering live bodies as well!
[url= http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5503/11794205203_3a8a178a26_c.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/ukbikeskills/11794205203/ ]IMG-20140105-00295[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/ukbikeskills/ ]ukbikeskills[/url], on Flickr
Woo hoo! Snow looks good! Saw a friend's pics from yesterday and it looks like there's plenty!
Sooo good love the Powder
Thanks for the transceiver recommendations.
Ortovox 3+ looks like a good contender then 😀
Does no-one think the Arva Neo is a good call, or is it just because it is new this season so nobody has one yet?
They are both about the same price (~£225-230). Trying to weigh up the pros/cons as a complete noob is a bit difficult.
The Ortovox is a tiny bit smaller and lighter: 122x73x27mm @ 315 grams vs 123x74x31mm @ 385 grams
Big selling point of the Arva seems to be the 60m search strip versus the below-average "up to 40m" on Ortovox. That seems like a big thing to me as a noob - is it?
The ergonomics of the Arva also seem slightly better to me. The two search-mode tabs on the Ortovox look like they'd be fiddly to do in frozen gloves/mitts. Makes it harder to do by accident I suppose.
Feature-wise they seem to be on a par: both do multi-burial with flag button, both do group check, both revert to transmit. The Ortovox only needs 1 AA battery which is nice (vs 3 x AAA in the Arva) and it also has a built-in RECCO which is also nice.
Anything in particular that swings folk to the Ortovox, other than familiarity?
The other one I was considering was the Pieps DSP Sport, any thoughts on that?
Sooo good love the Powder
le tour?
Don't know anything about the Arva. I might be tempted to get something that's been around for a bit. Which it might have been, it's been a while since I looked.
One of the good things about the 3+ is that it can transmit on one or other of its antennae. The signal is strongest when the searching beacon antenna is aligned with the buried beacon antenna. if the victim happens to have ended up buried so that the beacon is pointing at the sky, the searcher, holding their beacon flat to the ground, will get a much weaker signal, and the flux lines will be harder to interpret.
The Ortovox can detect if it's buried vertically and transmit on the horizontal antenna to ensure the best signal gets to the searching beacons.
The Arva might do this too, though!
Got back from Arabba, Italy this weekend - they said they'd had at least a metre of snow over Christmas day / boxing day (causing lots of power cuts) and then we arrived on the 28th 8)
I love a bit of powder skiing but mostly stuff accessible from or between pistes and even there, avalanche warnings were everywhere. Supposedly people were having passes taken if they were found skiing off piste at all though I didn't see any going on. I still found plenty to ski - a lot of people there seem fixated on doing the sella ronda tour and missing all the nice quiet slopes. Slightly crusty "powder" still findable at the end of the week. Lovely !
(sorry flash, no pics)
Graham, just read a couple of positive reviews for the Arva. Looks good. Big search is definitely a big advantage in a big debris field.
Cheers ned.
Just saw a few more things that are swinging me back towards the Arva.
Firstly the results of this simple range test:
http://tetonsandwasatch.com/2013/avalanche-beacon-range-test/
This comment on the splitboard forum:
We just had a national practice session with all kinds of beacons (120 people showed up) and did in fact test how fast a beacon picks up a signal from a single buried beacon. The Mammut Element is very quick to pick up a signal, about 10 metres quicker than the Pieps DSP/tour. But the winner here was the Arva Neo. By a long ways. That thing picked up a signal before we even started the drill. 🙂...I will likely upgrade to a Arva Neo myself, as I really liked the design and long range of that thing.
Also this video of the 3+ shook my confidence in it a little (watch from 3:22 in):
jambo, yeah and spent today off pste at flegere
Hmmm interesting clip. I have recently bought a 3+ and tried it last week in Monetier Arvapark and I didn't have much success. To be honest, I blamed the transmitters in the park as I could find my mate's Zoom no problem. Will try again on the next trip.
One thing that was an eye-opener was how quickly I was knackered stomping around in knee-deep powder on a slope. Wouldn't be marching around like that bloke on the flat grass.
Probably said already but far more important than what tranceiver you get is knowing how to use it.
All of the modern tranceivers work well.
A multiple burial is a nightmare scenario and some deal with this better than others but if you're doing your backcountry travel right it should be extremely unlikely.
@GrahamS - whilst I agree that the behaviour exhibited by the 3+ in the Facewest video is cause for concern (or least worth taking stock of), did you see some of the other comments regarding it?
In particular the comments from Ortovox themselves?
[url= http://www.wildsnow.com/4127/ortovox-3-plus-review/ ]http://www.wildsnow.com/4127/ortovox-3-plus-review/[/url]
<snip>
I also reviewed the search on facewest.co.uk and my overall opinion is that the beacon worked as designed with one “flutter” at five (5) meters. The searcher completely stopped rather than continuing the search. The processor in any beacon needs information in order to perform calculations; this is accomplished by MOVING! Movement to adjust direction should be deliberate and ONLY enough to get the center arrow to turn “on”.
When I was researching beacons to replace my old F1, I tried to take as many reviews etc into consideration, but in the end my conclusion was that for any given price point, the key factor was [as others have also mentioned] that whatever beacon you buy, the chances of a successful search will be probably be more due to familiarity with your model and the only way to get that is by practice - until it becomes second nature.
Understanding the flux lines and how they might impact the signal(s) you receive [in your particular model] in addition to practicing multiple search scenarios should give the confidence required - so it helps if you've got access to additional beacons so you can practice (although a number of resorts now have 'Arvaparks')
We have three of the Mamutt ones and they are great, they have two modes, simple and advanced. Very easy to use and you can put it into advanced mode for when your skills become mere practiced.
I first used one in Canada, with heli/cat guides and they felt it as the easiest for novices to get to grips with quickly. As mentioned above, it's the digging where the big gains are in terms of time and you need a shovel and a probe for that.
On the shovel front, Costco (in Bristol) had them for about £25 for a pair the other day, I'm sure they are not the lightest but hey £25!
One thing that was an eye-opener was how quickly I was knackered stomping around in knee-deep powder on a slope. Wouldn't be marching around like that bloke on the flat grass.
Worse still if you consider that the slope might not be knee-deep powder, but a massive debris field for you to clamber over 🙁
@GrahamS - whilst I agree that the behaviour exhibited by the 3+ in the Facewest video is cause for concern (or least worth taking stock of), did you see some of the other comments regarding it?
Yeah I agree. It wasn't just that video though. The [url= http://beaconreviews.com/transceivers/Specs_Ortovox3Plus.asp ]BeaconsReview guy flagged up concerns in his 3+ review[/url] (though said he hadn't seen it himself).
And [url= http://splitboard.com/talk/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=15783&start=0 ]someone on this thread in the splitboard forum[/url] said:
Same with the 3+. Sometimes it has very long range, and other times it fails to pick up a signal unless very close. No reason for it, it just fails. I had another person come up to me with a 3+ sunday with the exact same problem, so I saw this myself. Of course it may be fine most of the time, but if i'm standing pretty much next to a buried beacon (my Arva was showing 13) and it shows me nothing i'm pretty much done with that beacon forever.
I agree it could well be nothing. Always hard to know on net reviews and forums. But it made me raise an eyebrow.
One thing I did see mentioned on a couple of forums was that Ortovox seem for sensitive to electromagnetic interference than some others. The main advice seemed to be that whatever beacon you were using you should make sure your mobile phone and any other electrical/electronic gadgets are OFF during a search.
As mentioned above, it's the digging where the big gains are
Aye. Possibly a good reason not to cheap out and buy the shovel from Costco? 😀
Incidentally it looks like they did a nice comprehensive beacon test in Slovakia in 2011:
[url= http://www.testvyhladavacov.sk/ ]A full report of the results is here[/url], but sadly it is in Slovak so I have no real idea what it says. Pretty diagrams though 😀
In an attempt to lighten the mood from body retreval here is a fun little video made in Avoriaz on Sunday.
Am off to Mayrhofen at the end of the month for 5 days boarding with a few mates. Never been anywhere apart from France before so am unsure what to expect.
Love Tignes/Val and Morzine but didn't like Les Arcs - think I'll enjoy it?
Sorry, my fault. That looks like some good times I_Ache, nice one.
@hughjayteens: I love Mayrhofen. It's a bit of a party town and can be a bit boisterous for some, but it is good fun and there is some great riding there. Take at least one day at the Hintertux glacier too.
@hugh - Austrian ski villages and towns are much more of the chocolate box image type - very pretty, also much more skiing in the trees (like Morzine). I'd say the après ski is generally more lively and for me the food worse. After goulash and schnitzel you've exhausted the menu. If you like Tignes and Val you should try St Anton, great mountain, skiing for every taste and wild après ski.
After goulash and schnitzel you've exhausted the menu.
Currywurst!
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And unidentified processed pork product we generally referred to as "pig foam"
I should hasten to add that I didn't make the film, I only wish I could ski that well.
Only 26 sleeps until I am in Morzine and trying to get to grips with snowboarding. The odds on me returning with something broken are quite high.
And Apfel Strudel, Kaiserschmarrn, ...
Off there this weekend. Quite like Zell am Ziller (usually empty), on the same pass as Mayrhofen.
Graham S - there was a recent recall on [i]some[/i] of the Ortovox 3+ transceivers - may be related to some of the comments above. A bunch of us recently bought the 3+ pack with shovel and probe for varying prices between about £260 and £280. Best price was the Outdoor Shop (with BMC discount) but not sure they've got any stock left... We've had no problems with ours in practice situations but still needs more playing / familiarisation.
Currywurst...
*Drooool*
Also, got to love that al fresco dining experience that comes with skiing. Order something lovely and warming, like a Tartiflette, and then have to wolf it down as quickly as possible before it gets icy cold! (Even on sunny days!)
Thanks guys - sounds like it'll be a fun trip if the snow's good!
Best price was the Outdoor Shop (with BMC discount) but not sure they've got any stock left...
Cheers dashed. I get 10% off a few places with [url= http://www.snowboardclub.co.uk/ ]SCUK membership[/url] so can pick up either the 3+ or the Arva Neo for about £205.
Was talking to my riding buddy last night and apparently he has a mate that can lend us two sets of shovels, probes and beacons for this trip so that may be the way to go for now.
Currywurst...*Drooool*
Wish I hadn't posted that photo - it's making me hungry....
there was a recent recall on some of the Ortovox 3+ transceivers
From memory I seem to think there was a firmware update for 3+ beacons in 2011 ... I'll try and dig out the info, but I'm fairly certain that when I checked mine (purchased in 2011) it was using the latest version ... probably worth checking again anyway.
From memory I seem to think there was a firmware update for 3+ beacons in 2011 ... I'll try and dig out the info
BeaconReview guy has the info. v1.1 released in October 2011
http://beaconreviews.com/transceivers/Updating_O_3Plus.asp
Incidentally that looks like a possible downside of the Neo. The [url= http://en.arva-equipment.com/fiche/neo.html ]Arva site[/url] says it is not updatable (though confusingly some reviews say it is).
EDIT: Looks like there is a 2.1 version of the 3+ software now.
http://www.ortovox.com/3454--softwareversions.html
Looks like there is a 2.1 version of the 3+ software now.
Thanks GrahamS! 🙂
Looks like there is a 2.1 version of the 3+ software now.
There is, but I've so far failed to find anyone who can update mine for me - there are no update dealers listed in the UK on the Ortovox site and when I tried one of the listed dealers in Verbier they'd never heard of it. Mine's apparently due a full service in 2015 which seems to require sending it off to Ortovox so I may wait until then.
The recent recall was for one particular batch of transceivers; you can enter your serial number on their site to see if yours is affected.
Any idea how to get the software update in the UK - I can't find anything on the Ortovox website?
These guys do (free) updates for the Ortovox S1. Might be worth dropping them a line to see what they say about the 3+?
http://www.snowsafe.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=22&products_id=534
Noble Custom are the Uk distributors for Ortovox ... not sure if they can do a firmware upgrade, but they might be worth contacting in the first instance.
[url= http://www.noblecustom.co.uk/ ]http://www.noblecustom.co.uk/[/url]
I was just going to swing by Zero G in Chamonix when I'm out there in March ...