What I’d recommend DD is working out roughly how much you think you need to drink (say 2.5l), carry with you around 1l and then drink a bit at each of the feed stations from their cups (assuming they have them) and slowly work your way through your litre until you finish the race hopefully with your supply empty.
If that makes you nervous that you’ll get the amount you need wrong, take a soft bottle empty and can always fill it up at one of the later stations if you’ve got it badly wrong. Saves carrying a KG of unnecessary weight.
In other news, did Cork half marathon yesterday. Given that I did no training for it, just a couple of trail 5km to 10km runs, and one road run so far this year, I surprised myself by getting round in 1.46. Very chuffed. Though still dislike road racing with a bit of a passion.
I'd be tempted to just carry the soft flasks and re-fill them at the stations. 1.5 or 2kg is a pretty big saving on knees etc.
This Arran race, 26k and 6700' of climbing, recce last week showed I can get away with 1l in 2 soft flasks, there's a natural spring on the 3rd summit, about half way round, and a high up fast flowing burn about 4/5 of the way round.
Be reet. 😊
Thanks for the advice Spin and turboflard. You’re both probably right - I think with stations at 4ish, 8ish and 12ish miles, I should be fine with just the soft flasks. A lot will depend on the weather on the day I guess.
I bumbled my way around the Boar's Head last night - my first ever fell race. Not a biggy (12k ish and 400m climbing). Really enjoyed it! Legs feel it a bit this morning despite being too conservative on the way out on the climbs. I should have gone harder but, despite knowing the course, had never raced it before so didn't want to get carried away and blow up too early. I had no idea what to expect time-wise but reckoned 1:10 would be ok. Managed 1:09 which I was happy enough with for a first time, although I reckon I could shave a few minutes off that easily enough. Now off to look at the FRA calendar to see what's next locally 😉
Welcome aboard dashed!
It's my big day on Saturday - the Joss Naylor Challenge. I think I am ready. I'm certainly as ready as I'm going to be. Everything is hopefully in place with support etc. The elephant in the room is the weather. The forecast looks shite. Last weekend a mate had to bin his BG attempt after 22 hours of horrendous weather. I'm not going to risk anyone's safety and go ahead at all costs despite the 'pressures' of so much training, the number of people involved and the amount of sponsorship (nearly £1300). I am raring to go so let's hope it improves as we get nearer to Saturday. Wish me luck.
dashed- which route did you take after the Cage? I noticed a fair few people going straight across and I think up through the woods? I'd not seen that before in the previous times I've done it.
@MrSparkle - good luck. Not sure the weather is going to be kind to you on Saturday, can you postpone until Sunday?
Not an option, sadly. My support can only do Saturday so it's then or some point in the future, tba.
Good luck @MrSparkle- can it go back a week if the weather doesn't play nice?
Well, three days resting this hip this week. Was supposed to be my last 'big' week, taper next week, race on the Sunday. Feels like tendonitis in the hip flexor, if that's a thing. Hurts if I hop/bounce on the left leg, it did ease off after a while on my last big run but not going to risk it now.
I've found it odd that injuries come up almost consecutively - never had a run where nothing was sore! No sooner did the foot start to feel better than the hip played up. Compensation? Opposite sides, btw.
Is it necessarily a problem going into this event (43m 2800m) after 2 weeks' rest? I would be worried if it was a bike race, but my only objective is to get round within the time cut (thus giving me a soft target for a PB if I do it next year 😉 )
@mrsheen - yeah, I took that left option after the cage as I know the route pretty well. It's probably marginally more direct and a bit more of a gradual climb than the steep rocky path up the righthand side of Lantern Wood but it does add a nasty little dip and climb immediately after the cage. Swings and roundabouts probably.
I also took the steep, direct climb up the bankside at the end of the descent down from the deerpark before checkpoint 3. Doubt it was any faster but it was brutal on the legs!
One of the rules of my upcoming trail race is that competitors have to carry a “navigational device”, which thankfully for many people, can be a phone. My two training partners will have to use theirs, I have a Garmin watch which I’ll use (and carry a phone for back-up). One is savvy and on iOS (as am I). The other is not so, and is on Android. What’s the best app to use for navigation on android devices?
OS mate, 20 quid a year, it's brilliant. Download 1:25000 map before you head out for offline use, shows your position and you can download routes to follow as well, or make your own.
Viewranger is good too, but you have to buy credit and use that for maps, I eventually got a bit fed up of that.
Backcountrynavigator is good too, IIRC it's a tenner or so up front.
I forgot to mention that he’s quite tight too. 😀
I’d be tempted to just carry the soft flasks and re-fill them at the stations. 1.5 or 2kg is a pretty big saving on knees etc.
Bit late to this, but I'd do the same. Forget the big bladder, that's a lot of extra weight you don't need if you've got feed stations. There's a secondary advantage - if it's hot make sure you empty at least one between stops. It's easy to get carried away in a race and not drink as much as you need, and with a bladder it's very hard to tell just how much you've drunk. Making sure you've emptied a soft flask keeps you honest 🙂
first 10k race tomorrow night. be interesting....
also the 4 week email came through for the lairig ghru race.
"by now you should have done your longest run and be on the taper"
my longest is 24k/1000m climbing done 3 weeks ago - - offroad at least and it was back to back with a 15k..... ive worked out that gets me over the watershed and into the boulder field.
from there on its unknown in terms of running - although at least i know the terrain well from there down
Survival is the name of the game !
I know the title has the word "ultra" in but there is a lot of focus on road and Fell (Fell disproportionately IMO) but, unless I have missed it, not a single mention of track running. Or "proper running" as I like to call it.
Here you go, have a look at one of the best we have ever produced, in his prime 🙂
That's brilliant to watch!.
Track tonight, 8x600, 100 secs recovery.
Or 'horrible running' as I like to call it. 🤣
ooohh 600's. We used to do 600 in around 1:30 to 1:32 then a 100 m jog followed by 300 flat out. Only did 3 - 4 then often vomited on the side of the track... Happy days 🙂
The book about Coe and Ovett - ‘The Perfect Distance’ is a great read.
Now that would be a war of attrition.
"Ultra" track running.
Like that usa lassie that did the 24 hours of laps of the track. She must have been demented by the end of it. Be like a 24hr MTB race only more boring.
Sounds horrific!
There's a local race here this year, the K24, 24 hours of a 4km lap round a park in Kilmarnock. I'd rather talk politics with TJ for 24 hours tbqh.... 🙂
OS mate, 20 quid a year, it’s brilliant. Download 1:25000 map before you head out for offline use, shows your position and you can download routes to follow as well, or make your own.
Viewranger is good too, but you have to buy credit and use that for maps, I eventually got a bit fed up of that.
Backcountrynavigator is good too, IIRC it’s a tenner or so up front.
You can subscribe with Viewrange too, think it's about £25. I much prefer it to the OS app, which was really flaky on my phone (downloaded maps not showing up etc) but ymmv.
OS worked great for me - don't live in UK but I pay a month's subs so I can print maps while I'm there.
my longest is 24k/1000m climbing done 3 weeks ago – – offroad at least and it was back to back with a 15k….. ive worked out that gets me over the watershed and into the boulder field.
from there on its unknown in terms of running – although at least i know the terrain well from there down
Survival is the name of the game !
I'm in the same boat TR. Done some very very slow, hilly 30k runs (think: walking pace for some of yous), four days this week resting borked hip flexor / tendonitis which isn't getting better very quickly, race is Sunday after next. I guess my plan now will involve winging it and ibuprofen. My reccies have been at 8 hour pace, so there'll be a man with a brush following me round.
Good luck Mr Sparkle, hope the weather turns out better than it looks!
Yeah, good luck - forecasters always get it wrong 😉
Ovett was magnificent...
I've got my first track race next month - the MK 5000 http://www.mkac.org.uk/mk5000/ it's also the UK Athletics 5000m champs - although I didn't know that when I entered. I have absolutely no top end speed at all - my 10k PB is my 5k PB twice! So I'm getting my bum handed to me on a plate - I'll be complete dogs***. But I've got some spikes and some VERY short-shorts, and there's a beer tent so bring it on! And I get to watch some proper runners after my terrible race ;-P
Well that nearly killed me
Although I nailed warming up. 39 mins In zone 5 hit 211bpm and the remaining 4 minutes were z4
Landed 43:40 for my first 10k race. A clear 10minutes off my training on
80/20 does work
Great stuff Terry, just came back on to see how it went. 💪🏻
Is this @MrSparkle? Good arrows, if so.Well done fella.
https://twitter.com/CalFerguson/status/1137440569477750784?s=19
Hope so! Been checking in here regularly for updates as the weather in the NW was pretty grim yesterday!
Well, stalking MrSparkle’s profile suggests his first name is Simon so I’m betting that’s him. If so, awesome work that man.
EDIT: Yep, that’s definitely him. He may be having an extended snooze.
Very well done Simon!
I’m sure he’ll be along before too long. Quality effort on a pretty grim day (a mate did the first stretch with him). Nice work squeaking under the hour in that wind and rain! I was due to be helping on the final stretch of a Sandstone Trail double - he more sensibly bumped it to today! Just off now - hope I don’t need the headtorch 😀
Hello there! Yes, it’s me. So, after all the blathering on about it in here I finally did it. The forecast was pretty bad but it was the only time I could get all my pacers/helpers lined up so decision was made. Didn’t sleep much the night before with rain hammering on the roof of the van parked up in pub car park. To cut a long story short the weather was bloody grim for first two legs but I was going well. Leg 3 was claggy but the rain was stopping. The cumulative effect began to weigh on me and at Bowfell I had a low point and had to dig deep. After that it got to harder terrain and was a slog. Leg 4 heading into the finish and I was losing the very few minutes I was up in schedule. By the very last hill, Middle Fell, it was touch and go whether I’d make it. My legs and feet were ruined by now but my support were screaming at me to keep going. I managed to get to Greendale Bridge with 2 minutes and 3 seconds of my allotted 15 hours remaining. I was delighted to be welcomed in by Joss Naylor. I am in a bit of a state now but I’ll recover and it will be an epic day that lives long in the memory. I have also raised about £1500 for Prostate UK.
Excellent work MrSparkle.
Fantastic sparkles! 💙
Awesome effort MrSparkle - well done that man
Awesome effort! 🙂
Amazing achievements from many people on here, and the latest one is quite incredible.
The thread title does say "beginners" so can I add to the thread? Just would like a bit of advice if possible.
Been trying to run, off and on, for a couple of years now to help with fitness. Haven't been out since last year after I hurt my achilles and it took ages to heal and got annoyed with just general pain. Decided to go out on Saturday and did nearly 5k around the local park. Took it easy, lungs were fine, but my word, my legs didn't half give me some grief. Back of the calves didn't feel too bad while running, unlike the rest of my legs, but very tight today - they're not injured though, just shocked. Apart from what is mentioned below, legs just feel well-used today which is a good feeling, isn't it?
My main concern, and I got this before, is knee pain. Outside of knee (both this time), starts as a dull ache then slowly builds to a overbearing throb that means I have to stop, the alternative is certain death. I get it sometimes cycling longer distances, but not to the same extent, so it seems like a usage problem rather than impact. It will be fine if I stop moving, and ok afterwards if I'm still, but will hurt for a few hours after if I walk. Also hurt on Sunday walking a bit, but ok today (Monday). I can deep massage the tendon behind the knee and that seems to help. Is there a name for this problem and any way to alleviate it?
Maybe I'm just too old and knackered at 46 to start running more. It's a shame because it seems like a really good way to get some good exercise into a short space of time, and it's quite pleasant, if you can ignore the agony of the experience.
Please ignore if an irrelevant problem. Cheers.
Not at all, I was a beginner when this thread started, and in terms of some of the others on here, I still am!. And I was 43 when I started too!.
One of the hardest things for beginners is knowing when to run through it, and knowing when to stop. In my own experience, I had a fair bit of knee pain at the start - I'd had a meniscal tear repaired 3 years ago and that swelled up and gave me a bit of pain. I kept going and it eased off after a few weeks, but tbh I mibbe got lucky!
I reckon running is the best thing I've done for my knees, the strength that's resulted is definitely a bonus, all this nonsesne about running being bad for the joints is generally peddled by folks that don't run and need a wee excuse IMO.
Good luck, don't take my advice as gospel, just offering my experience.
The thread title does say “beginners” so can I add to the thread?
These are the posts I like the most here.
Starting at the end and working back...
Maybe I’m just too old and knackered at 46 to start running more.
Sorry, 'fraid not. You'll have to find a different excuse. :o)
Not sure what the pain you're experiencing is - maybe try a physio - I have a few male and female friends who seem to be suffering ITB pain - which sounds similar to what you're discussing, but beware of internet diagnoses. If it's giving you trouble and it's stopping you doing the shite you want to do, then go to a pro and get it sorted.
Depending on what you were doing before you took the year off, your legs may not have a good memory of something to which to return when you start again. So, as frustrating as it may be because you're generally fit, your lungs and brain are saying "5k yeah, pièce du pisse...", but your legs might be saying "Whoa there tiger, give us a chance!" Maybe take it easy for a bit. Do a bit of run-walk-run-walk. Always warm up with a brisk walk/slow jog (something I've had to force myself to do as I've aged). Avoid static stretching before a run...some dynamic stuff post-warmup-pre-run might be ok. It'll probably feel weird at the beginning because you want to do more, but just ease yourself in. By the end of the year, you'll be trying to figure out how to do a sub-20 parkrun.
Welcome to one of the best threads on STW.
Yip, Mr Darcy speaks sense, apart from the last bit....
Tis' the best thread on STW (and about the only one the bawbags haven't infiltrated yet!) 🙂
