[Closed] The National Obesity Forum?

Muesli!

Isn't that stuffed full of sugar like most cereals?

I'd like to see a country where children get to attend their local primary school, the one that's within walking distance of their houses and the parents have enough time to walk them there. A small step that may start people on a lifetime of activity...

Good luck with that wish, our village primary has a queue of high end SUVs, with diesel engines running and stinking the place up where the doting parents have driven all of a mile to get there. I've even left our local station to walk my 2 miles home and seen people pulling out of the carpark and driving a few hundred yards up the road.

Not sure how anyone could deal with that level of it's my car so I will use it even if I turn into Jabba the Hutt.

Some of us burn a lot of calories exercising each week and simple sugars are perfect for fuelling that.
Some of us also have health issues that make consuming energy dense foods more healthy for us than what is traditionally perceived as a healthy diet - maybe you'll start providing coke on prescription?

Spot on, I don't do the miles of many cyclists and most of my rides are between 10 and 30 miles - simple sugary stuff suitable for the ride duration is perfect. As one of those terrible diabetics destroying the world I can't do the standard "healthy" diet to cope with exercise I have to eat around my activity levels. Simple sugary stuff staves off the hypos. I've maintained my weight pretty muc for that last 5 years now. Could probably drop another stone but the medical people aren't too concerned so I'm not stressing either.

There was a BBC article a year or two ago showing a mother who had stopped her kids drinking sugary fizzy drinks and was feeding them mahoosive plate of white rice. Having seen what white rice does to my blood sugar and for how long it has an effect, I would be avoiding that kind of thing, along with added sugar in cerieals and yoghurts that are perceived as healthy.

The only way is to make it socially unacceptable.

Most fat people have fat friends. Its self perpetuating.

that ain't going to happen whilst fat shaming is frowned upon - bring it back and some of the problem will start to dissappear 🙂

My biking has cost the NHS more than my fatness.

If every fat person took up sport and we had no more fat people there would be another group of scapegoats being blamed for the NHS shortfall.

These people eat more food than thin people, it is very likely they spend more on this food therefore pay more tax which should fund the NHS.

Definitely need to do something about the growing issue of obesity (not just mine!!) but never going to be a simple issue.

Not sure about this. Doesnt this penalise tall people as well?

do it based on their percentage of body fat - my scales at home show that.

Get everyone ot have to strip off and stand on the scales in front of everyone else in the queue in airport security to get a fat measurement, and that will solve the social acceptability of being fat problem as well, we can all point to the fatties and laugh - or people could leak the most amusing footage to youtube.

[url= https://www.newscientist.com/article/2075721-our-body-adapts-to-intense-exercise-to-burn-fewer-calories/ ]explanation of exercise adaptation[/url]

I'm amused by there being a thread about a drive through Greggs. It proves many of the points in this thread perfectly.

well, TBH, in a liberal individualistic society it pretty much is their "Right"

quite right too, as long as they are not members of some shared social welfare system where their selfish decisions are detrimentally affecting other people that might actually need support from that system.

Bring in compulosory BMI (or a better measurement) tests in order to remain eligible for use of the NHS.

Survival of the fittest...

explanation of exercise adaptation

That explains why you lose lots of weight when you start dieting and exercising for the first time, but if you fall on and off the wagon a lot it stops working as well.

Yay, an excuse! 🙂

explanation of exersise adaption

I'm amused by there being a thread about a drive through Greggs. It proves many of the points in this thread perfectly.

It's definitely going the wrong way, isn't it.

Start off by making children more active. Isn't it true that an active child is more likely to stay that way in adulthood.
Loads of P.E. at school.
Make being active more interesting/cooler than sedentary pastimes (no idea how to do this).
Stop ferrying kids here, there and everywhere.
......make bullying the fat kid at school acceptable again 😆

Apparently we do on average a marathons worth less activity per week than we used to do in the 70s.

Reintroduce ration books

After Brexit we may have to anyway

Get everyone ot have to strip off and stand on the scales in front of everyone else in the queue in airport security to get a fat measurement, and that will solve the social acceptability of being fat problem as well, we can all point to the fatties and laugh - or people could leak the most amusing footage to youtube.

Trouble is i am 16 stone, down from 18 stone as a ex-pro rugby prop-forward, my diet is pretty healthy, i always cook tea and get "my five a day", i cycled 9000 miles last year, BUT i still have a bit to spare round my waist which i can't shift.

One of my best mates is 6'4", skinny as a rake, used to steal the protein powder when he worked in hospital kitchen to try and put on weight, yet still has a chest that goes inwards and a body fat in single figures despite a diet of Stella Artois and kebabs.

Which of us is actually healthier?

Is it not the fat around organs and in arteries that actually is a bigger concern?

Is it not the fat around organs and in arteries that actually is a bigger concern?

In your particular example, then yes.
But not so much as a concern as the folks with 40+" waist measurements.

Reintroduce ration books

After Brexit we may have to anyway

I was thinking that the other day. If we go for a real 'hard' Brexit it may come to that....

fifeandy, you adapt to exercise, the body likes to stay the same as much as it can. As you start to exercise you will initially burn a shit-ton* of energy, if you do it more and more, you will learn to use less energy to do the same amount of work.

This is pretty well established.

* the SI unit of cycling /cake ratio

How about stopping home delivery on takeaways? Its so easy to live on takeaway without leaving the house and quite cheap too with the different offers available for different days, some people are so lazy the effort of going to a takeaway themselves would be too much, secondary improvement would be the reduction in emissions from all the cars and scooters hairing around delivering your calorie-fests. worryingly on this note I see maccydees are introducing delivery service too

And if, like me, you periodically do loads of exercise and diet hard for a while then do less exercise and eat more, you are screwed.

Is it not the fat around organs and in arteries that actually is a bigger concern?

Indeed it is. In answer to you question regarding you and your mate's relative healthiness, it's you who are the healthier, hands down.

The body is designed to store fat as a safeguard against "lean" times. To shift it you need to control intake and increase exertion. I was quoted 80% diet, 20% exercise.

fifeandy, you adapt to exercise, the body likes to stay the same as much as it can. As you start to exercise you will initially burn a shit-ton* of energy, if you do it more and more, you will learn to use less energy to do the same amount of work.

This is pretty well established.

* the SI unit of cycling /cake ratio

Could you explain why as a small 60kg bloke I need 2500-3000kcal/day to maintain weight then?
And maybe while you are at it you can explain to TdF cyclists that they dont really need 6000kcal/day, 2000 will be plenty right?

Other than compulsorily sending folk to fat camp or charging them to use the NHS, I can't really see an answer and anyway you'd have all sorts of issues, a pal of mine got told technically he was obese. I swear to God he was barely 85 kgs at 5'11" height, he was flabbergasted, spent ages considering it, then went back to the surgery and questioned it once more, it turned out the stupid nurse had made an error, but think of the consequences had that involved a mandatory penalty. The irony he'd gone to the doctors for referral for depression counselling.

fifeandy... how long / how much energy do you think it would take the layman to do a TdF stage?

Could you explain why as a small 60kg bloke I need 2500-3000kcal/day to maintain weight then?

Totally dependent on what your activity levels are. I'm maintaining my 85kg on <2000kcal a day.

Ban Jacamo and Evans.

I know this will impact on all the elite rugby players with high BMIs among us, but one should not be able to buy clothes in XXXXL.

Essential reading:

http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html

fifeandy... how long / how much energy do you think it would take the layman to do a TdF stage?

More time, similar energy. About an hour and a half more in the case of this layman.

Totally dependent on what your activity levels are. I'm maintaining my 85kg on <2000kcal a day.

fifeandy... how long / how much energy do you think it would take the layman to do a TdF stage?

Very much depends on the stage obviously, but around 10hrs for a flat stage, with a lower calorie burn (75Wx4x10hrs = 3000kcal) vs (250x4x4.5 = 4500).
Mountains would obviously even things up a bit.

I know this will impact on all the elite rugby players with high BMIs among us, but one should not be able to buy clothes in XXXXL.

I wish they would "formalise" clothing measurements, at 46" chest and 36" waist, i can wear a size large t-shirt most of the time, a XL MTB top, but if i dare to buy a road jersey from Santini or their ilk, even a XXXL is not going over my arms!

Remember that BMI is for [i]sedentary[/i] individuals not those with an active lifestyle. From Wikipedia (usual caveats apply):

BMI was designed to be used as a simple means of classifying average sedentary (physically inactive) populations, with an average body composition

So we can discount making people ride the TdF then.

You've missed me right C_G?

You know I have TSY! 😀 Hope you are well and riding lots?

To answer your points, in a nutshell whilst we have consecutive Governments in bed with both Pharma and the food industry nothing will change.

If you look back in history within the medical world women have always been second class citizens which has meant that their experiences with regard to their weight has been conveniently ignored.

The advent of the Pill was something of a revelation and many women leapt at this opportunity, myself included. What wasn't known however was the long term effects of taking such a pharmaceutical for potentially many decades. My weight certainly increased despite no changes in my eating habits.

Fast forward to HRT being touted as a wonder drug where a disruptive menopause could be a thing of the past. Again, my weight increased despite an active lifestyle.

I believe a large part of the reason why we're seeing an obesity epidemic is due to endocrine disruptors as well as an increasing number of people taking multiple medications. There has been a huge increase in the number of people developing a thyroid condition and, whilst the majority of sufferers are women, men also experience weight gain. Once you have one autoimmune condition you have a good chance of getting another.

In the past I'd discussed my increasing weight with various NHS doctors and without exception they talked bollocks. It's taken a private American doctor to get to the root cause.

With regards to food we need to get back to cooking lessons and nutrition being part of the school curriculum. It needs to be done in conjunction with health education.

Let's take a good look at what we're eating and start demanding that animals graze in fields that are strictly rotated and have not been sprayed with chemicals. Let's make sure their Winter feed supplementation does not consist of unnecessary additives.

The public should see where battery chickens are housed, in buildings with no windows yet outside there will be a truly pungent odour. The price of cheap poultry?

We should be eating according to the seasons and supporting our own farming industry.

To summarise I don't believe that obesity is always due to overeating and whilst they're vested interests nothing will change.

Sorry if this is waffly, hope it makes sense. 😳

We should be eating according to the seasons and supporting our own farming industry.

I refer you to my previous point that come Brexit, we may have to 😀

As a Brexiteer I'm happy with that ninfan! I try really hard to support local farm shops and not buy foreign muck. 😉

IMO the rise of obesity is linked to the rise in mental health issues, over eating is a way for so many people to cope. Address the cause of the mental health issues and the obesity problem will reduce.

You can do whatever to the availability of sugar, processed food etc and give out free gym passes and nutrition lessons, but with so many people suffering from mental illness it won't make a difference.

I wonder if there's a correlation between remain/leave and BMI.

IMO the rise of obesity is linked to the rise in mental health issues, over eating is a way for so many people to cope. Address the cause of the mental health issues and the obesity problem will reduce.

I'd say it's the other way round.

I wonder if there's a correlation between remain/leave and BMI.

I think the fat in their head is more of a concern for leavers.

In a very short (in evolutionary terms) period we've gone from:

[list][*]predominately physical jobs to predominantly sedentary ones[/*]
[*]active means of transport to motorised ones[/*]
[*]home cooked food to mass produced food[/*]
[*]active pastimes to sedentary ones[/*]
[*]increased labour saving devices[/*][/list]

Not all of these will apply to everyone and I'm sure I've missed something out but it does give an idea of where, as a society, we are heading. Behind each of these will lie several factors each of which need to be addressed.

Not too hard for an individual to work it out and sort themselves out but much harder to do it across a population.

We should be eating according to the seasons and supporting our own farming industry.

I refer you to my previous point that come Brexit, we may have to

Problem is once we've lynched / expelled all the migrants who do the actual work; who is going to do the farming on our farms? I can't see your average UKIPer digging up Turnips...

I'd say it's the other way round.

I used to think so, but consider the success rate for those who lose weight keeping it off long term. Something like 90%+ will put it all back on and often more. The feel good factor in losing the weight and the distraction from other issues whilst losing it (ie exercising, taking up new sport etc) rarely lasts. This is because the underlying mental health issues are never addressed and once down to a healthy weight the realisation that they are still not happy kicks in and the eating ramps back up.

but it does give an idea of where, as a society, we are heading

Problem is once we've lynched / expelled all the migrants who do the actual work; who is going to do the farming on our farms? I can't see your average UKIPer digging up Turnips...

I don't know what happened years ago when Brits did this work but what I don't understand is what happens when the seasonal work has ended. Sure there's some folk who do live a nomadic lifestyle, used to see them and new age travellers regularly in Hampshire living in traditional style gypsy caravans or buses etc. but all seem to have disappeared.

Is this due to lack of guaranteed regular work? Just don't know. Anyone?

Essential reading:

http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html
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Not read that before, how prophetic that man was. 😥

I agree with you, essential.