As for the "true meaning" of swear words,
Most etymologies have their roots in either blasphemy or sex, and their perceived vulgarity has changed over the years. No-one would blink at "cor blimey!" but it's a corruption of "god blind me," something seemingly so heinous that it needed a euphemism. I'm fairly sure that my grandparent's favoured exclamation of "bugger me!" wasn't actually a request to be taken roughly from behind in a manly fashion.
Conversely, the last taboo in British swearing is probably the C-bomb but historically it was just a regular word, there used to be instances of Gropec*** Lane throughout the land (named for exactly the reasons you'd expect) and IIRC it was a word Chaucer was partial to.
I think perhaps that getting hung up on their original meaning is a misdirection. Swearwords are swearwords not because they mean a lady's front bottom or the hot place downstairs* but because people think they're swearwords.
(* - sometimes the same thing 😁)
For those that don’t have the mag yet, the article referred to is the Rob Warner interview. We actually put an explanation/warning in before the start of the article, because usually we don’t include swearing. But in the case of a Rob Warner interview, editing it all out would make the article look like astronomy.
Honestly, that's fair game IMO. Gratuitous swearing in an editorial would lower the tone - which is the point of the swear filter here, to encourage a modicum of decorum - but if you're quoting what someone said then, well, it's a quote. If you review a new hub and write "it's a load of *ing *" then I'd think I'd just picked up a copy of Nuts, if you wrote "we asked Dave what he thought about the new hub and his reply was 'it's a load of *ing *'" then that's reasonable.
Aside, this might be an Aspie thing but I never worked out what the point of asterisking out letters was. Everyone much over reading age knows exactly what the word is, you're still swearing only using a different symbol to represent 'uc' and 'un'.
Language is weird. People are weirder. I never did get the hang of Wednesdays.
We're going to run a few clips of the raw interview audio on the members' pages for those who are interested. It's a great and entertaining interview. It's just that Rob Warner talks like an Australian and, as Hannah alludes, if we took all the swears out, there'd be little left...
Can anyone recommend a mountain biking priest/nun I can interview next time? I reckon that might be a fun contrast...
I don't know, I wouldn't want to risk you getting into any bad habits...
I have no idea why you would want to stop kids reading swear words. You cannot pretend they don't exist. Kids have to know about them so they know when and when not to use them. 'When not to use them' includes any time below a certain age, then above that age when no adults are present, and then finally above another age when adults you know don't mind are present.
But blacking them out of a magazine - seriously? What possible harm could come?
Can anyone recommend a mountain biking priest
Actually yes, we have one on the forum. He does swear though so be warned.
From what I’ve seen in mtb media, Warner (or modern Warner) is fairly tame.
For excessive casual swearing in the bike world, look to the Frenchies; who have learnt (or rather become fluent) in English as teenagers in the World Cup pits and have consequently a slightly different opinion on what words are appropriate in what situation than a native speaker.
Father of two boys here. Even at 5yrs old I think they would have been a) affronted, b) curious and c) thought I was being an utter knob if I'd redacted anything with a black marker that they were capable of reading.
FFS.
Can anyone recommend a mountain biking priest
Doesn't our Basque correspondent actually ride with a mountain biking priest?
I think Saxonrider fits the description.
IIRC there was once a baptist minister on stw.
I think this thread has to win best STW stealth ad of 2023.
It’s just that Rob Warner talks like an Australian
Oy! I half-resemble that comment.
Can anyone recommend a mountain biking priest/nun I can interview next time? I reckon that might be a fun contrast…
Christ on a Bike! (The Father Jack Chronicles Book 1) - may not be quite what you're looking for.
Frenchies? Add Swedes, Dutch, Ukrainians, Bulgarians, Romanians, Russians, Serbs and most other Europeans to that list. I think the first thing most folk learn in English is F*** as a utility word which leads me to conclude that most EFL teachers are probably Scots or have been taught by us at some point.
I don’t think it’s ok to think that it’s normal or ok to swear
Umm, you're entitled to your opinions but the facts are pretty conclusive for at least the former of those points. The latter is, again, a matter of opinion or context.
For those that don’t have the mag yet, the article referred to is the Rob Warner interview. We actually put an explanation/warning in before the start of the article, because usually we don’t include swearing. But in the case of a Rob Warner interview, editing it all out would make the article look like astronomy.
Indeed, imagine being the one that censored Warner 🤣
I wondered where the swear words were and then realised – Rob Warner interview 😂😂😂
Having spent a week in Rob’s company at the Vail World’s back in ‘94, that’s the least of his bad behaviour!
i have a suspicion that these words existed in the native language of britons prior to some takeover by an invading force and were considered inferior, less dignified than the language of the invaders and pushed out of acceptable use.
Not true at all. English has changed a huge amount ever since the Anglo-Saxons arrived after the Romans, the great vowel shift, as it’s called made a huge change, but Elizabethan English has offensive terms we’d barely even recognise now, the ‘c’-word is apparently derived from the root word from where cuneiform comes, which describes a writing form using papyrus reed which is the same shape as pubic hair. It’s a word I used to hear used regularly at work by several young female work colleagues, it’s like language has always been used, constantly changing in the way it’s used.
Get used to it, otherwise you’ll just be the same prudish pearl-clutching Mail reader that have a fit of the vapours over someone with a bunch of tattoos.
Plus it’s a bike magazine for adults. Or at least, I thought it was; I haven’t read it for years.
I think perhaps that getting hung up on their original meaning is a misdirection.
Euphemisms are interesting. For example, "toilet" started out as a euphemism for some other word (probably "outhouse" or something) that people didn't like to say out loud because it carried the connotation of excrement. But then "toilet" became the standard word and after a couple of generations, people forgot that it was a euphemism. So then they came up with new euphemisms to avoid using "toilet," "washroom," for example. Then those new euphemisms stop being euphemisms and are replaced by new euphemisms, and so on.
So, no, the original meaning of a word doesn't tell us what people today use it to mean. To my grandma, "damn" was considered a strong curse word. In spite of that, my father's favourite expression was "f***ing s**thouse c***".
STW guest editor?
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While there's some swearing experts about - does the Welsh language have swear words?
I thought it would. But I've been in pubs and cafes in N Wales where I can hear groups talking Welsh, but the swears are English. I can't imagine anyone Welsh preferring English swears over their own so I thought maybe the type of words didn't exist in Welsh, or the English swear words were so widely used they just became part of the language for them. Interesting anyway.
When the likes of Taylor Swift, Olivia Rodrigo, Ariana Grande and BLACKPINK all drop the f-bomb (lets face it who are their target audience?: prepubescent and teenage girls) if your boys are old enough to want to read bike mags then you’ll need to keep them away from all the (nasty) girls….
Like Cougar I never F’ed and C’d in front of my mum (or dad for that matter, neither of them really swore in my company) but a mate stored my contact on his phone as metal ****ing heart (well my real name actually) as apparently i said it every other word…😂
I used to laugh at how in work meetings when I hit flow people would give me ‘that’ look but by the next one they’d be f-bombing at me…
In my late fifties now and have actually (naturally) dialled it back… 🤷🏻♀️
Frenchies? Add Swedes, Dutch, Ukrainians, Bulgarians, Romanians, Russians, Serbs and most other Europeans to that list.
The joy of the immediately after the line Eurosport bike race interview - barely a week goes by without some Dutch or Belgian - 'Fo' sho', it was a proper ****ing hard day'
An interview with MTB's answer to Ronnie Pickering has swears in it? Remarkable.
How old are the boys and were you aware of the article before you let them read it?
pretty ironic when the forum is fairly tight on the swear filter
Which is also ironic given that the usability of the forum is one of the top 3 things most likely to bring on a frothing, expletive filled rage.
So how do I get hold of the latest issue? The latest issue I seem to have access to is 148. Did I miss the Rob Warner interview?
Frenchies? Add Swedes, Dutch, Ukrainians, Bulgarians, Romanians, Russians, Serbs and most other Europeans to that list.
Or just people.
My children are aware of swear words and do know that in many situations it is inappropriate to use them.
We know we can’t shelter them from everything and they have to learn the appropriate time and place.
The magazine arrived yesterday and I do the normal thing of a quick flick through and the words stood out at the top of the pages. I don’t open the first page and read that and then turn the page.
I have now seen the disclaimer.
Yeah the warning is at the bottom under the article of title. Page 3 of the article has a big F bomb at the top.
It’s a rare occurrence in the magazine to see the F word. I kind of see some of the points raised.
Frenchies? Add Swedes, Dutch, Ukrainians, Bulgarians, Romanians, Russians, Serbs and most other Europeans to that list.
It does make me smile when some Swedish morning radio presenter drops a string of swears at half 7 on a tuesday morning...
I've always been of the view that children should be aware of swear words and when it's appropriate to use them. It's worked fine so far. I know full well that my 11y old is aware of a LOT of swear words, but even if he's quoting something he's read or seen in a film, he'll paraphrase to remove the swear word. He may use it in private or with his friends, but never in school or in public. Perhaps if he's angry/upset enough about something, this would slip, but, well, that's kind of appropriate too.
I used to laugh at how in work meetings when I hit flow people would give me ‘that’ look but by the next one they’d be f-bombing at me…
Once on a Teams call with my old team at work, we were all (not unusually) giving it both barrels. My partner came home, walked through the door, listened for a few seconds, remarked "your team meetings are not like my team meetings" and left.
It does make me smile when some Swedish morning radio presenter drops a string of swears at half 7 on a tuesday morning…
Radio 4, safe cuddly middle-class Radio 4, early one afternoon post-referendum. The presenter was interviewing some Eastern European person about how they'd been made to feel unwelcome.
"And there's a Vote Leave poster in your staffroom, is that correct?"
Yes.
"And on the bottom, someone has written 'send the c**ts back where they came from,' is that right?"
Yes, that's right.
... I was driving back from lunch, I almost crashed the car in shock.
For those that don’t have the mag yet, the article referred to is the Rob Warner interview. We actually put an explanation/warning in before the start of the article, because usually we don’t include swearing. But in the case of a Rob Warner interview, editing it all out would make the article look like astronomy.
Yeah, but as the bloke above pointed out you've put a couple of the ****s in big bold print right at the top of at least one of the pages. Which is a bit lame really. Couldn't you have challenged yourself to find something interesting that he said that didn't contain a profanity for the soundbites?
Very good article though, great to actually find out a bit about who he was and is.
barely a week goes by without some Dutch or Belgian – ‘Fo’ sho’, it was a proper **** hard day’
TBH my French work colleague explained this to me as it’s not a swear word for them unless it was said in French.
In my favourite Spanish tv series ‘Elite’ they do tend to drop a few English words in which always confuses me.
I thought it would. But I’ve been in pubs and cafes in N Wales where I can hear groups talking Welsh, but the swears are English
This is called selection bias. If you don't speak Welsh you wouldn't have been able to pick the swear words from the normal ones 🙂
Yeah the European thing is they really don’t class English/American swearwords as properly rude.
when my god fearing middle class Dutch Father in law first met my very English middle class parents for lunch he embarked on a ‘funny’ getting to know you story about some incident that had happened to him earlier in the week and literally peppered it with the F bomb. Thing is he almost never swore in Dutch and would certainly never do so in front of strangers or in a public place. To him the f word was basically the equivalent of flipping heck.
This is called selection bias. If you don’t speak Welsh you wouldn’t have been able to pick the swear words from the normal ones 🙂
You'd have thought most of us Welsh people - even English speaking ones like myself - would be aware of Welsh swear words but I don't know any. I worked in West Wales years ago, where everyone spoke Welsh routinely and remember asking someone for some Welsh swear words but he couldn't tell me any. I shall ask my wife later. I'm guessing that I'll draw a blank.
@johnhe - the new issue is officially out today. You have two months to get hold of it. The shop here sells individual copies and some bike shops do stock it too.
Thanks Chipps. My issue is that I’m a subscriber and I can’t find the issue to download in the downloads seçtion.
🙂
My lad has grown up at motorbike trackdays and now DH races, he never swears in front of me. But I bet he knows them all. He's 14
Not really. Takes a dive in to religion
like it or not the majority of our moral compass (or what remains of it), not just the sanctimonious parts, comes from religion. Christianity, in the case of the “West”
You’d have thought most of us Welsh people – even English speaking ones like myself – would be aware of Welsh swear words but I don’t know any. I worked in West Wales years ago, where everyone spoke Welsh routinely and remember asking someone for some Welsh swear words but he couldn’t tell me any. I shall ask my wife later. I’m guessing that I’ll draw a blank.
And I've asked her, a Welsh speaker from birth, and she doesn't know any. 'Go scratch' was the best she could do. 😀
Cont y môr, jellyfish in Welsh. That's a good one.
When my lads were pretty small we used to watch the Dakar footage every year. The year Lyndon Poskitt did loads of footage I watched a really good vid of his which showed how hard it was. He spent a lot of time crashing and picking up his bike and swearing about it a fair bit. Having watched it already I remember Mrs Reeksy and I prepare the boys on the sofa.
“In this video the man’s working really hard and has a lot of difficulties. Sometimes he’s so upset he uses some really bad words that you really shouldn’t say.”
Reeksy Jr1 aged about 4 years at the time in a matter of fact way, “You mean ****?”
