Forum menu
Vote lib dem get Tory
Have you guys seen the nonsense from Starmer and Sarwar about Scotland? Pure pish.
Have you considered voting Lib dem?
Same as voting for the tories IMO. Lets not forget the reason we have Johnson in power is because Swinson (who?) and the lib dems bounced Corbyn into an election along with the SNP for entirely parochial short term electoral advantage. And then there was the utterly unforgiveable betrayal in 2010 which has saddled my kids with a massive future student loan debt and damaged the lives of millions with their cut-throat austerity programme. Why the f*** would I ever vote for those principle free scumbags? TBH even if I lived in a LD-Tory marginal I would struggle to vote for them tactically as I can barely tell them apart.
Oh come off it Daz.. Swinson was a bit of a dick.. But she's nothing compared to the colossal dicks that are Starmer and Johnson.
If you really want a change.. Who will you vote for? Lol.
Don't tell me... Labour under starmer? Lol!
I should probably point out that Swinson is no longer in charge of the Lib Dems, and hasn't been for quite some time.
@kelvin Labour have proven over and over again you can't trust them.
The conservatives litteraly run on a manifesto of mis-trust and mis-direction.
So Who are we left with?
So Who are we left with?
Depends where you are on the political spectrum I guess, If you're "of the left", who is the alternate left wing party who'll get your vote if not Labour? In any other democracy in Europe the Labour party would be about 3 different parties (the same is true of the Tories for that matter) but we haven't, so it's Hobson's for every-one.
The referendum was brought about by UKIP forcing Cameron to appease the Leavers in the Tory party, or something like that.
The route to re-joining has to be the formation of a party that stakes its intentions to the mast to re-join the EU. Even on that single issue they would see a massive number of votes and may force other parties to sit up and think.
For sure. That's why my vote will go to the Liberal Democrats.
The referendum was brought about by UKIP forcing Cameron to appease the Leavers in the Tory party, or something like that.
Not quite like that. The first major party to support an in/out EU referendum was the LibDems, it was in their election manifesto.
When it came to the vote in parliament it was also fully supported by the Labour Party. The vote resulted in 84% voting in favour of a EU membership referendum. You would struggle to find many issues in which the vote in the House is so overwhelming.
The first major party to support an in/out EU referendum was the LibDems
I think we will need a citation on that, and the specific acceptance criteria, boyo....
The conservatives litteraly run on a manifesto of mis-trust and mis-direction.
So Who are we left with?
As that was asked of me... I'll give the simple answer first... in our seat we can choose to keep returning the Conservative MP (check his voting record if you think this is anything other than the worst possible outcome before us) or vote Labour. That's the choice locally.
More generally... in other seats it's an entirely different choice... because of FPTP. If you choose to ignore the regional variations, and just vote for the party you would most like to have a say in how our country is run... the chances are that you're just going to get a Conservative MP again, and then we're a step closer to another Conservative government. I'll be contributing to Caroline Lucas' fighting fund, as I have the last two elections, as losing her in the commons and replacing her with another Labour MP would be a loss. In other seats I might well vote LibDem, even in a Labour/LibDem marginal, depending on the candidates. Our voting system is what it is. Voting as if it was a fair democracy is only going to benefit the Conservatives. Voters need to wise up and vote accordingly.
×only if people think Labour is the only alternative.
When Labour are essentially the same as the Conservatives, it becomes a moot point.
When Labour are essentially the same as the Conservatives
If you honestly believe that (check the voting record of our local MP if you really do), then fair enough. You'll still essentially get two candidates to pick from at the next election... if you can't tell them apart on how they would vote, act and represent you... I'd be very surprised. That choice is probably years away yet though. That'll be happening in many, many seats across the UK... and not with the same two parties.
This 2 party lab/con BS needs to end. It's not helping anyone.
Voting in a way that gets you the same Conservative MP, again, isn't going to achieve that. But I agree. Both our "pick from the top two" voting option in so many seats, and the result of that... most MPs being from two parties (South of the border) and having to the tow the line of their party, and our PM always coming from one of those two parties, needs to come to an end. We should have more choices, wider choices, and all our votes should count even if our choice is not one of the two main parties. The only short term hope is a Labour minority government pushed towards voting reform by other parties. Longer term there are other ways (including Labour MPs and members pushing for it).
SO you'd suggest I vote labour then? really?
In Calderdale? Absolutely. Check out our MPs voting record. And when the time comes... pin down the Labour candidate (they won't hide away from questions the way Whitikar does) and ask them the difficult questions you want answered.
Not sure Mr Starmers position on Brexit is the best strategy... he has lost my support (not that it will make any difference)
We need to be a Norway. The rest of the world "trade" is bollocks.
We need to be a Norway. The rest of the world “trade” is bollocks.
Agree entirely. Somehow it's been framed that a Norway style agreement isn't Brexit. Bonkers isn't it. Labour MPs being whipped against it when the houses of parliament were looking for a future arrangement to replace EU membership was part of the big "bait'n'switch" of a vote to leave the EU being changed into a decision to end all Single Market involvement (apart from for NI). We've crossed and blown up that bridge now though. The damage was all done years ago. We're not going to be a Norway now, even though changes to RoW trade will never make up what we are losing in our big local market. Our balance of trade has gone the wrong way fast... etc, etc... but all this changes nothing politically for now. There is no quick route back (for England&Wales), if there is one at all. Of course, given the option, I would vote for that to happen... as would a small majority of Brits... but it simply isn't going to happen for decades, if at all.
The first major party to support an in/out EU referendum was the LibDems
I think we will need a citation on that, and the specific acceptance criteria, boyo….
It's up to you whether you support the claim or not.
The LibDems were strongly in support of an EU in/out referendum long before both the Tories and Labour.
In fact the LibDems were so strongly in favour of an EU referendum that their current leader was kicked out of the House of Commons for being particularly disruptive over the issue;
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2008/feb/26/liberaldemocrats.houseofcommons
A Liberal Democrat frontbencher was thrown out of the House of Commons today for protesting against the Speaker's decision not to allow a vote on a referendum on European Union membership
Ed Davey, the party's foreign affairs spokesman, was banned for the rest of the day from attending the Commons chamber and from voting after he refused to accept the Speaker's ruling.
The Lib Dems had tabled an amendment for debate today calling for a referendum on Britain's continuing membership of the EU.
The party claims a referendum on Britain's continuing EU membership would be in the national interest because it would enable voters to settle once and for all the question of whether Britain should stay in.
In Calderdale? Absolutely. Check out our MPs voting record.
Over my cold, hard, dead body. I'll be voting Lib dem in the next GE.
EU aren't going to let us back in if we have a referendum that comes out close again. Even if it isn't that close.
The only real way is to get rid of the Tories, accept brexit as it is and edge back into working more closely with the EU. Once the 'benefits' are more obvious then we can talk about joining again. So maybe this Starmer announcement makes sense from that point of view. Don't rattle the cagwe of the Red Wall that is flaky.
I'd love to rejoin tmrw but I really think its baby steps again.
What he said.
Brexit allowed a big swing in one direction... that can draw people into the idea that a swing a third of the way back in the same kind of timescale is possible... it isn't... everything from here on is going to be slow and incremental... there's no will in EU countries to do anything else, and no political route in front of us (or Labour) right now either. Not for those of us in England, anyway.
Helping Craig Whittaker to keep his vote on these issues in the House of Commons will only aid those who want a constant battle with the rest of Europe, while removing our rights and sending the country backwards. Please, check his voting record if you think that letting him keep his seat is a good outcome.
Well **** me then, you'll get the government you deserve, just don't try to blame the moderates for it. It's your shit pile, and you can flipping well eat it.
Bon appitete !!
Well, I fully expect to get another Conservative government returned at the next election... but I sure as dammit will use my tiny individual vote to try and stop that happening. Don't think the Conservative's "battle with Europe" is over yet. They'll keep it alive no matter what the damage to our lives. If your want closer ties to, or even just cordial relations with, the rest of Europe, you need to try and get this government out.
15000? 😁
Not sure Mr Starmers position on Brexit is the best strategy… he has lost my support (not that it will make any difference)
We need to be a Norway. The rest of the world “trade” is bollocks.
Mine too. All he's doing is tinkering (trying to)...there's no guarantee the EU will agree to any of his proposals.
Well, I fully expect to get another Conservative government returned at the next election… but I sure as dammit will use my tiny individual vote to try and stop that happening. Don’t think the Conservative’s “battle with Europe” is over yet. They’ll keep it alive no matter what the damage to our lives. If your want closer ties to, or even just cordial relations with, the rest of Europe, you need to try and get this government out.
with the best will in the world that's not going to happen if you vote labour or conservative.
1.Denial, to 2.****! what have we done?, to 3. We have to make the best of it, to 4. let’s have something like Norway, to 5.rejoining.
If this is based on the 5 stages of grief, does that mean Norway is depression?
Norway are gas rich, and already a NATO member.
Maybe if Russia calmed down with the genocide, people might cut them a bit of slack.
How close will starmer try and work with the eu?
Will he maintain this government’s hatred towards them?
How much of a **** will he be in an effort not to upset this country’s ****wits?
Can I join the starmer is a **** club?
the starmer is a **** club
It's a bit like McDonalds, the Labour party are not always doing business, but they are always open 🙂
If boris wanted to make Labour unelectable for the next twenty years.. He needn't have tried.
Starmer just did his job for him in a single day.
We all want Labour to come up with some policies "Anything Keir FFS!"
And then out of nowhere he comes up with this, he really would have been better saying nought.
Is he trying to be shit?
To the Blairites. This is the outcome of concentrating on focus groups and "listening to the people " you end up with a party that follows not leads and the follow those who shout loudest. The agenda ends up set by tories and their lapdogs in the press.
The situation labour is in now is a direct result of the way Blair changed the party.
Political cowardice and timidity
So you don’t want the Labour Party to listen? The 2019 manifesto won’t be repeated at the next election, otherwise the result would end up being much the same. That includes policy on Europe. Not that it was exactly clear what a Labour government would have been doing as regards our relationship to Europe if they’d won with that manifesto anyway.
Labour are a right wing, pro brexit party. That much is clear.
They may as well hire nigel farage and re brand themselves as UKIP at this point.
Labour are a right wing, pro brexit party. That much is clear.
They may as well hire nigel farage and re brand themselves as UKIP at this point.
And the overblown hyperbole award goes to...
Get used to the idea that, at least in the short term, we're not re-joining the EU. That path is closed to us for at least the next 10-15 years. Even the Lib-dems have said that while it's their long term goal, they don't support an immediate campaign to rejoin, and want to instead to do pretty much what Starmer said yesterday. Closet possible alignment.
Boris johnson: 'get brexit done'
Kier starmer: 'make brexit work'
Are they the same person?
kelvin
So you don’t want the Labour Party to listen?
Listen yes, but not to the reflected echo of the UKIP propaganda disseminated by the right wing media.
It's time to drive things with a more compelling vision of the future.
I quite like Starmer, especially that he's a proper legal heavyweight but I don't see him doing much leading and that's a shame.
So you don’t want the Labour Party to listen?
To the hard right press propaganda?
Not really no.
I want them to provide an actual alternate vision not just a watered down version designed not to upset the hard right loons.
The 2019 manifesto won’t be repeated at the next election, otherwise the result would end up being much the same
Wait, what?
I thought it was all Corbyns fault.
That path is closed to us for at least the next 10-15 years.
The longer you put off starting that journey the further away the destination is.
It's like someone in the Labour Party looked at the referendum vote and thought "52% is bigger than 48%, let's appeal to them" without realising that the majority of the 52% won't vote Labour in a million years.
majority of the 52% won’t vote Labour in a million years.
lots and lots of that 52% were Labour voters.
If boris wanted to make Labour unelectable for the next twenty years.. He needn’t have tried.
Starmer just did his job for him in a single day.
The idea that Starmer has made Labour unelectable for the next 20 years because he has accepted that the UK has left the EU, and it is not feasible to reverse the decision in the foreseeable future, is the sort of delusional Remainer nonsense that resulted in this :
Pitching herself as a candidate for Prime Minister at the head of an unlikely Lib Dem majority government, Ms Swinson said she would “revoke Article 50 on day one” and cancel Brexit.
The triumph of delusion over reality....... The delusion - Prime Minister Jo Swinson heads a LibDem majority government. The reality - Jo Swinson loses her parliamentary seat and the LibDems reduce their MPs by 1.
I realise that many Remainers feel very disappointed indeed but to believe that accepting brexit is currently a guaranteed vote loser, especially after seeing the 2019 general election results, is just bizarre.
I agree that Starmer gives very few reasons for voting Labour beyond the fact that he isn't Johnson, but it isn't his attitude to brexit that is the problem.
but it isn’t his attitude to brexit that is the problem.
Absolutely. Starmer ( to misquote JZ) has 99 problems, but Brexit ain't one. This is a the political reality.
Boris johnson: ‘get brexit done’
Kier starmer: ‘make brexit work’
Are they the same person?
Do you think "let's screw Britian until we rejoin the EU" would make a better slogan and have voters enthusiastically backing Labour?
Labour are a right wing, pro brexit party. That much is clear.
Thank you matty for confirming what I've long suspected about the ultra-remain delusional reality denialists. I have some friends like yourself who are still obsessed about something that happened 6 years ago. All I can say in the friendliest way possible is please move on. It's not going to do you any good. You can either move forward or remain (see what I did there) stuck in the past. I know what I would rather do.
As for the politics of it. Well it's really quite simple. If you frequent these threads you'll have seen me saying that we get the government we deserve. You are a classic example of that, so please think carefully. Your vote is only one in thousands so not very important at the end of the day, but it's about helping yourself and your family. If you can live with the fact that you haven't done your bit to get rid of the tories then carry on, otherwise the choice is obvious.
Well, let me put it this way... I was on the fence regarding tactical voting. But now there is no way on God's green earth I will ever vote Labour.
This isn't a Starmer issue, this is the problem that Brexit was by design, a way of making it almost impossible to join again without costing the UK even more money.
The UK spent 40 years in the EU building their place in the core of it, with France and Germany, we had so many benefits due to our place in world standings over the last 40 years and the funding we provided, but now those benefits have been dispersed to other EU nations, our veto in many areas is lost, our rebate, etc, etc.
To rejoin the EU it would have to be shown to benefit the UK, and that would be via negotiations and evidence of the benefit, plus the added issue of having the likes of France and Spain wanting to veto us rejoining!
I was on the fence regarding tactical voting. But now there is no way on God’s green earth I will ever vote Labour.
So politics has become a one issue thing for you - just like ukipers.
All other LibDem policies are unimportant and irrelevant, there is only one policy that matters.
But now there is no way on God’s green earth I will ever vote Labour.
And like I said, you'll get what you deserve. Don't ever come on here to moan about whatever the tories have done if you're not prepared to take the easiest and most consequential action you can to get rid of them. I don't like labour either, I despise the leader and the idiots he has around him, and have very little respect for much of the shadow cabinet. But I know they are nowhere near as bad as the tories. TBH who is in govt doesn't much affect me, but there are millions who are suffering at the hands of the tories, and their needs are much more important than your obsession with a debate that was decided 6 years ago, and my dislike of labour's right wing policies. If you're not willing to help yourself, then vote in the interest of the millions who desperately need help now. Your position is indefensible quite frankly.
I thought it was all Corbyns fault.
Personally, I'm happy to give Corbyn the credit for the positively received policy shift of the 2017 manifesto, and the blame for the negatively received policy drift of the 2019 manifesto. Being leader and all. The mess over Europe is blame that can be shared by all (including both the previous and current leaders) (whipping MPs against any compromises that would give us a softer Brexit, resulting in the last minute choice becoming hard Brexit or a vote on hard Brexit... not exactly bringing people together).
who is in govt doesn’t much affect me, but there are millions who are suffering at the hands of the tories, and their needs are much more important
We haven't hard agreed for a while. Quick... pub...!
We haven’t hard agreed for a while.
Despite what I say on here, I can guarantee you that we agree on almost everything. 😄
Parroting tory lies is doing Labour no favours. Even Jacob ress mog is amused.
How would you undo the damage of a Hard Brexit...? If you think it's just a matter of ticking a box saying "yes, we'll be in the Single Market"... then you're years out of date. The UK government choose the manner of our leaving, and the nature of our replacement arrangements... the EU aren't sitting there pretending we haven't left, and offering us what they were offering us before we left. We threw all the more pragmatic and economically and socially beneficial alternative options back in their faces when they were in a position to offer them to us. Now that's done. By all means hold a grudge with those that made those choices for us... but don't be under the illusion that those choices can be remade. This is one of the big reasons why I was against Brexit... it gave our government a one off one way opportunity to transform the UK's relationships with our partner countries, and to transform the UK... and even if you had major problems with the EU, looking at who would get to make those one off one way decisions should have pushed your hand straight to the "remain" box. It's done now. There are ways back to the Single Market for Scotland (and NI could also manage to stick with it)... but England isn't going there... the damage can not be undone for us. A big thank you to everyone who voted to put us in this hole. Thanks again. Labour can't bounce us out of it now though, they can only start the long slow journey to a functioning relationship with our neighbouring countries. First... stop the slide and the phoney UKvEU battles. If only for the people of NI.
First… stop the slide and the phoney UKvEU battles. If only for the people of NI.
And the first step to do that is to get the tories out, by any means necessary. Even if that means voting for Keir Starmer, as unpalatable as that might be. Are you paying attention matty? Every year the tories are in power is another year (or more) away from your goal of closer ties to Europe.
And the first step to do that is to get the tories out, by any means necessary. Even if that means voting for Keir Starmer,
Clearly that would depend on what his actual policies would be.
After all if he helps normalise their policies then it turns the extreme into the new normal for next time.
That may be true.
But for Matty... he can help to create a situation where there is one Conservative MP who loses his seat. Even if you want the LibDems to hold more sway in parliament, in our seat the best way to enable that is to vote Labour. That's the nature of our voting system here. Voting LibDem in seats where they'll come third (at best) or voting Labour in seats where they'll come third (at best) resulting in Conservative MPs being returned... will only help keep the Conservatives in office, and maybe with another majority... and then you won't get LibDem or Labour MPs making any decisions for us... they'll just continue "carping from the sidelines" as the Tories dig us a deeper hole.
Clearly that would depend on what his actual policies would be.
Not really. There is almost no scenario where a labour govt would be as hostile to the EU as a tory govt. Repairing the damage of brexit is only possible with a govt which is willing to be constructive with the EU, rather than constantly trying to pick fights with it. That can only happen with a non-tory govt, and that means a labour govt.
There is almost no scenario where a labour govt would be as hostile to the EU as a tory govt.
FFS stop treating brexit as the only issue. Especially as it's you that keeps talking about the need to move on.
IMO dissonance's point is valid, although I would go further and say that a Labour government can actually implement Tory policies with greater ease, ie less opposition, than the Tories themselves. Two obvious examples are privatisation and going to war.
There is almost no scenario where a labour govt would be as hostile to the EU as a tory govt.
They would be just as hostile if they thought that would swing a few more Tory voters.
For the first time, I think, ever, I'm reading DazH's stuff and nodding. You're clearly more of a pragmatist than you like to make out 😉
In any election, by and large, you have to decide the least-worst option. And in the next one, that's whichever candidate has the best chance of beating the Tory. I'll probably be voting Labour, for the first time ever, not because I think SKS is brilliant (I don't, my initial enthusiasm has slowly evaporated as his mediocrity has become apparent), but I think he'll at least be competent and honest, which is something that can't be said of this Tory govt. The Labour candidate is the only one that has a chance of ousting the Tory incumbent
FFS stop treating brexit as the only issue.
Odd comment as I've not done that. Brexit came up in discussion, so we're talking about it. Doesn't mean it's the only thing on the agenda. Personally I think Starmer was stupid for bringing it back up when the cost of living and the resurgence in covid are much bigger immediate issues. Labour are weak on brexit (as they always have been), so why he wants bring the focus back to it is yet another example of his lack of political nous.
You’re clearly more of a pragmatist than you like to make out
Sorry I let my guard down and some of the real life me has invaded my carefully crafted STW persona. 🙂
FFS stop treating brexit as the only issue.
He wasn't. He was replying to someone for whom it is clearly an important issue. He was trying to make the case for them still voting Labour in a Conservative/Labour marginal seat. Many of us think that having a Labour government would be better than keeping the current government. We understand that you do not. We get that point.
Starmers failure to address basic issues within this "policy" statement is remarkable.
The Labour Party needs to address the following
1. Housing- build build build - there is no downside to this - both social housing and private.
2. Transport - trans pennine - introduce German style ticket prices.
3. Energy - build renewables as fast as possible. This will fix energy cost eventually.
4. Food stop paying Farmers to be park keepers - grow food, automate, invest.
Borrow and spend **** the expense the Tories can wring their hands about that when they get back into power in 2 elections time.
Odd comment as I’ve not done that. Brexit came up in discussion, so we’re talking about it. Do
I'm not refering to you talking about brexit, I'm referring to you treating it as the only issue that matters when dissonance quite rightly, imo, says:
Clearly that would depend on what his actual policies would be.
You replied:
Not really. There is almost no scenario where a labour govt would be as hostile to the EU as a tory govt.
You presumably took it that dissonance was talking about brexit. I doubt it, but even if that was the case it doesn't detract from the fact that the next general election will not be a single issue general election, well certainly not about brexit.
It's time to move on - even Tony Blair the man who was so desperate to be President of Europe has accepted that fact and has said that the question has been settled for at least a generation.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2009/jul/01/tony-blair-european-president
but I think he’ll at least be competent and honest, which is something that can’t be said of this Tory govt.
Why do think that? There isn't a whole lot of evidence to back up that claim. Starmer hasn't exactly shone as leader of the Opposition so where is the evidence that he would make a competent prime minister? Once in government he would need to do more than wait for the Tories to shoot themselves on the foot.
And as for honesty Starmer made 10 profound pledges when he wanted to win an election which he instantly ditched as soon as the election was over, is that really the mark of an honest man?
There is probably a stronger case to be made that despite his incompetence and dishonesty Starmer would make a better PM than Johnson, although the claim would need to rely on faith more than evidence.
I’m referring to you treating it as the only issue that matters
Dazh has never done that. And he’s not been doing that today. He’s been doing the opposite… saying that other things matter far more.
dazh
…there are millions who are suffering at the hands of the tories, and their needs are much more important than your obsession with a debate that was decided 6 years ago, and my dislike of labour’s right wing policies. If you’re not willing to help yourself, then vote in the interest of the millions who desperately need help now. Your position is indefensible quite frankly.
Posted 7 hours ago
Not voting for Labour because they won’t now push for the UK to be in the Single Market makes no sense. It’s not an option. That door closed once the withdrawal agreement was signed. It’s not something the EU can now offer us on behalf of its remaining member states any more, now that we’re a third country. Labour should have pushed for staying in the Single Market before we left the EU, when it was a possibility, but they didn’t… mostly to satisfy Leave supporters like yourself. And look where that got them… you didn’t even vote for them. Along with millions of others. Because you all thought Brexit was more important than getting the Tories out.
The Independent: Keir Starmer backs snap general election and says government ‘collapsing’.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/johnson-sunak-resigns-election-starmer-b2116510.html
So Starmer wants a snap election, despite the fact that at the moment he only has a "clean slate".
How quickly can he think of some policies to offer the British people, bearing in mind that he doesn't seem to have done much policy-wise in the year and a half that he has been party leader?
Or perhaps he thinks that offering voters just a "clean slate" is sufficient and he'll think of something if he wins the election and moves into Downing Street?
Offering just a clean slate would obviously make it much more difficult for the Daily Mail and the Tories to criticise him, so he might be onto something.
So Starmer wants a snap election, despite the fact that at the moment he only has a “clean slate
Glad he'd got stuff ready to go.
I mean it's not like they haven't had time.
Perhaps he will leave the detail for another time and just focus on the general direction of his policies, eg, better education, stronger economy, more housing, etc
Or maybe just a quick easy to remember slogan such as "security, prosperity, respect”
That's the problem when you have a forensic mind which focuses on fine details - it takes a while to figure things out.
Or maybe just a quick easy to remember slogan such as “security, prosperity, respect”
That’s the problem when you have a forensic mind which focuses on fine details – it takes a while to figure things out.
I’m really not politically savvy to the level of the regular contributors on here, but do detailed policies really cut through with voters? It really seems like most can only cope with 3 word slogans.
When politicians are interviewed on the telly they generally need to provide a bit of detail to their policies. As they also need to when they are involved in face to face debates. It's all part of being a politician. Well usually it is.
no credible government, no credible opposition and a dumpster fire of an economy.
is this the get worse before it gets better part?
Sadly we still have a bit of room to fall further and no election due for 2 years.
I hope Starmer is just holding his policy cards close to his chest so that the Tories can't nick them, then he can play a killer hand when an election does happen.
The reality is neither party know how to deal with the economy.
Wedded to an impossible macro-economic policy that the market can solve problems they are struggling to move on from this logic.
Add to that fact that a series of very tricky black-swan events in sequence, the end is nigh for neoliberalism. They are struggling to get to grips with inflation, cost of living and a battered economy.
They simply don't have the tools to fix things as their beloved markets fall apart.
Well the good news is inflation won't last forever but will likely be replaced by deflation along with recession as we have all been saying.
It's going to take a brave party to step up and rewire the economy - the Tories simply won't do it but may offer up tweaks here and there (tax cuts). The BoE need to stop these ridiculous interest rate rises amd reverse them. I fact get shut of the MPC, sack them - their mandate of controlling inflation by interest rates is useless now.
Labour are in a worse spot as they have to be twice as imaginative and convince the electorate that we are in a difficult situation and therefore we need drastic measures of government investment.
It's not looking good as they simply don't have the minds or political will to fix things.
Biggest mistake? - assuming that coming out of the pandemic was just a return to normal and no government support was needed.
That was categorically stupid and unrealistic.
Ideas: long term get the massive green new deal project going, housing investment and financial support for people. Bring utilities back under government control. Government becomes an employer of last resort for GND.
Not easy to do when there's a supply shortage and all the other issues.
Short term: drop interest rates, government to temporarily subsidise fuel, energy etc - immediately at the very least remove vat/duty. Keep an eye on possible shortages of materials / resources and redirect incentives to alternative mechanisms. Are there under used resources? Incentive working from home via tax breaks for employer and employee. Incentivise people not to travel - redirect economies back to local options. Town centres need massive boosts to generate doorstep opportunities. Not crappy quangos either. Solid job opportunities.
All easier said than done I know.