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For those who stopped voting Labour under Corbyn this could be very influential
Let's hope. Johnson loyalists are saying it makes them cleave harder to him - which is what we want: the idealogues to seal themselves into their bunkers.
Though personally I'm disconcerted by such big shifts - tory to libdem I can get, or lib to lab - but if you're an MP you've some roots in a party and its way of thinking. And I'm about to be told it's not a big shift, I don't doubt. But it is.
(Oh and Starmer has forensic skills; is not a forensic lawyer. Neither very relevant to his leadership of labour. And criminal lawyers don't necessarily have criminal skills, though I guess they might. That's the life kicked out of that one and I promise to score no further points.)
You want Labour sealed off from people deserting the Conservative Party? There is no better signal to people who have voted Tory that they can now reconsider voting Labour than MPs crossing the floor.
The Tory party are sinking in the polls and you want to attract Tories to get more voters?
Call me old fashioned but maybe Labour could party could have decent ethical MPs and maybe just sell that to the public?
Once a Tory, always a Tory? Please don’t tell people who vote Tory that if you want them to reconsider their vote in future.
Don't be daft. There's an enormous difference between voting for a party/candidate and standing as one. Those who put themselves forward for office are subject to a much higher standard of consistency and probity than those voting for them.
Call me old fashioned but maybe Labour could party could have decent ethical MPs and maybe just sell that to the public?
You missed my late edit. I agree really. But I really want to see labour in power and a bit of teeth gritting may be required.
Yep, you're old fashioned rone.
I suppose the Labour Party could have rejected his application? I wonder what Jeremy would have done? Though that's a very hypothetical question.
Though personally I’m disconcerted by such big shifts – tory to libdem I can get, or lib to lab – but if you’re an MP you’ve some roots in a party and its way of thinking. And I’m about to be told it’s not a big shift, I don’t doubt. But it is.
Most people think this. And it's what Labour need to change. They need more than for people to abandon the Conservatives and look to vote elsewhere, or not to vote at all... they need to normalise switching your vote from Tory to Labour. I can think of no better tool to help voters to begin to think that way then to have a MP visibly make that shift themselves. I genuinely hope there are more crossing the floor in future.
I can think of no better tool to help voters think that way then to have a MP visibly make that shift themselves.
'Here are my principles. If you don't like them, I have others.'
This is what we need more of in politics?
I wonder what Jeremy would have done? Though that’s a very hypothetical question.
Not that hypothetical. Corbyn would have told him that if he wanted to be a labour MP he should resign his seat and tory membership, join the labour party, and go through the same selection processes that other prospective candidates do. Why should Wakeford be given a free pass to be a labour MP ahead of all those who have served the party for years who have similar ambitions?
How this utter scumbag
Why is he a scumbag?
Call me old fashioned but maybe Labour could party could have decent ethical MPs and maybe just sell that to the public?
Good luck with that
https://order-order.com/people/keith-vaz/
Why is he a scumbag?
Sorry if it offends but anyone who stands as a tory MP, votes for the things he has, and then cynically jumps ship as soon as he thinks his job is under threat is by definition a scumbag. I can think of much worse names to call him TBH.
Sorry if it offends but anyone who stands as a tory MP, votes for the things he has, and then cynically jumps ship as soon as he thinks his job is under threat is by definition a scumbag. I can think of much worse names to call him TBH.
What specific things did he vote for that make him a scumbag (or worse)?
Or is this just generalised because you need to hate people
What specific things did he vote for that make him a scumbag (or worse)?
Take your pick..
Sorry if it offends but anyone who stands as a tory MP, votes for the things he has, and then cynically jumps ship as soon as he thinks his job is under threat is by definition a scumbag. I can think of much worse names to call him TBH.
Is it not a win for a liberal democracy and the system that someone agrees to work with other parties they once stood against, not just for the day, but pragmatically for the long term?
Why is politics meant to be some kind of binary, fixed for life opinion, bear pit of death or glory? Politics elsewhere, in the UK and Europe as examples, is much more about collaboration and negotiation - it is our Westminster that seems full of rats.
I have more understanding and respect for someone who decides not to align themselves with the current Governing party of disingenuous, self-serving and immoral members than I do with someone who changes their mind.
Is it not a win for a liberal democracy and the system
Nope. I would say it more makes a mockery of the the system and allows people to say they're all the same or it's all just a game to them.
Changing your mind is fine but he's spent the last few years slagging off everything about Labour and voting for the meanest reactionary crap the government has been doing.
Unless he's had some kind of road to Damascus moment and wants to show ultimate contrition he can get in the sea.
Take your pick..
Without seeing the specifics your source is just for virtue signalling. For example he votes with the whip to oppose a opposition amendment as the bill is going to be amended anyway taking into account the main thrust if the amendment.
I imagine a lot of opposition amendments (of whatever colour) are to help generate clickbait like this
Apart from anything else people voted him in as a Tory why should he get a free pass to represent a different party? Would we be happy if it was the other way round?
But hey he's drunk the yummy anti-Semitism flavoured Kool Aid
Wakeford said Starmer had “shown that integrity in the way he has led his party on issues that matter to me, not least the vital challenge of combatting antisemitism”
Looks like he's going to fit right in as a member of CFI (presumably there's a nice easy process to switch to LFI).
Mr Wakeford said he “never listened to the left wing tropes” about Israel as an apartheid state
Surely the obvious strategy is to accept them as they cross the floor and then deselect and replace with a genuine Labour candidate at the GE?
Put the defected Tory MPs up in safe Tory seats to see what they can achieve if they still intend to stand?
But hey he’s drunk the yummy anti-Semitism flavoured Kool Aid
Arguably a comment beneath you. He represents a constituency with a large Jewish community, as well as large Muslim communities. Getting his head around the issue will help understand the local tensions.
Or.... (Insert some remarks alleging he's been bought or something)
I think this guy called Labour a bunch of ****s!
Love it.
Starmer's party of ragtags and chancers.
I think this guy called Labour a bunch of ****!
The dangers of OTT use of social media, also not very professional in any walk of life
Would we be happy
I don’t think that’s ever going to happen.
Happiness is a bourgeois concept. A capitalist myth created to oppress the working classes
"Not that hypothetical. Corbyn would have told him that if he wanted to be a labour MP he should resign his seat and tory membership, join the labour party, and go through the same selection processes that other prospective candidates do."
Wouldn't he just......
He never missed an opportunity to look a gift horse in the mouth.
Insert some remarks alleging he’s been bought or something
By the Labour Party, or a Chinese spy?
Forensic does not mean "forensic science" Perfectly reasonable desciption of Starmer.
-
<li class="module--definitions__definition">Relating to, used in, or appropriate for courts of law or for public discussion or argumentation.
<li class="module--definitions__definition">Relating to the use of science or technology in the investigation and establishment of facts or evidence in a court of law.
<li class="module--definitions__definition">Belonging to courts of judicature or to public discussion and debate; used in legal proceedings, or in public discussions; argumentative; rhetorical.
I have worked as a forensic nurse - because i worked alongside the police triaging detainees. We have forensic wards in psychiatric hospitals
I’d rathered the lad resigned than swopped sides. It would be fairer to the locals and a by-election now would be fun.
Starmer has forensic skills; is not a forensic lawyer. Neither very relevant to his leadership of labour.
Where are his forensic skills? Can you give any examples of these forensic skills, which you claim he has, being put into practice?
He seems to think they were relevant enough to make a pledge about using them during his leadership bid.
I posted in the Boris thread about this. He won his seat with only 402 votes spare, a tiny majority. He is in a £80k or so job that he will lose at the next election if he stays Tory. They guy is protecting his income, nothing more complicated or noble than that.
I’d rathered the lad resigned than swopped sides. It would be fairer to the locals and a by-election now would be fun.
This is true, Johnson doesn't have a by-election campaign to fight. He's got to be relieved about that.
Plus they can probably bin one of the letters to the 1922, given he's no longer a tory MP.
Ernie - did you look at the definitions posted?
Belonging to courts of judicature or to public discussion and debate; used in legal proceedings, or in public discussions; argumentative; rhetorical.
I'm sorry TJ are you claiming that Starmer misused the term "forensic" when he pledged, quote, "Forensic, effective opposition to the Tories in Parliament"?
If so that's something that you need to take up with him, not me.
I have no problem with him claiming forensic opposition to the Tories, I'm simply asking where it is.
Sitting back waiting for the Tories to shoot themselves in the foot and score own goals doesn't sound very forensic to me.
Binners is that Inspector Clouseau searching for the posts which you have stopped posting on this thread?
Or…. (Insert some remarks alleging he’s been bought or something)
Making unfounded insinuations of anti-semitism/conspiracy theory should be beneath you.
As I've stated before, I just don't find it appropriate for our MPs to be part of lobby groups for the promotion of the interests of foreign countries, especially not expansionist/militaristic ones guilty of numerous serious human rights violations. Generally these are the same MPs who are part of a campaign to vilify Jewish Labour activists as anti-semites and hound them out of the party.
I guess Starmer has another ally in that campaign now.
It's scary to see who is allowed to join the Labour Party these days
On 30 Jun 2020:
Christian Wakeford voted to remove rights for unaccompanied asylum-seeking children, spouses, vulnerable adults and dependant adults to join a family member who is legally present in the United Kingdom.Show vote
On 22 Jan 2020:
Christian Wakeford voted against requiring ministers to seek to negotiate with the EU to allow unaccompanied children seeking asylum to join their relatives by moving from the UK to the EU or vice-versa, and instead voted to require the Government to set out its policy on this subject.Show vote
On 8 Jan 2020:
Christian Wakeford voted to remove a requirement for ministers to seek to negotiate an agreement with the EU to enable unaccompanied child refugees to join their relatives.
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/25874/christian_wakeford/bury_south/divisions?policy=1087
He really has an appalling voting record :
Consistently voted against measures to prevent climate change
Consistently voted against measures to reduce tax avoidance
https://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/25874/christian_wakeford/bury_south/votes
And welcomed with open arms into the Labour Party by Starmer?
Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. Way to go kier.
https://twitter.com/jessicaelgot/status/1483790215248556037?s=21
No Ernie - I am saying its a perfectly reasonable use of "forensic" Its a word often misunderstood and wrongly used.
So what's your problem?
Starmer claims to be both a lawyer and possess forensic skills, refering to him as a forensic lawyer is perfectly reasonable, in the same way that if he claimed to have horse riding skills refering to him as a horse riding lawyer would also be perfectly reasonable.
The only problem I can see is if he did not possess the skills he claims to have.
It is interesting to note that on the day that a Tory politician moves seamlessly from the right-wing of the Tory Party to the right-wing of the Labour Party, it is confirmed that a veteran Labour Party member and former parliamentary candidate, with more than 50 years of membership, is expelled anonymously by email without any hearing or right of appeal, because 8 years ago he criticised Israeli treatment of Palestinians
https://insidecroydon.com/2022/01/19/labour-centrists-expel-veteran-croydon-campaigner-white/
The Labour Party really has become quite a sinister organisation.
The Labour Party really has become quite a sinister organisation.
They are ...
That's why I said do not tighten the noose on yourselves.
Out of line then you're gone on whatever ...
They are influenced by mole of CCP perhaps? Yes?
All the time I have been interested in politics there always seems to be a significant part of the labour party at war with itself
This witch hunt is just daft tho - absorbing loads of energy to what end?
Wasn’t David White one of the people suspended for claiming that Hitler supported Zionism?
I have never known anything remotely like this. What is going on now is totally ruthless and unprecedented imo.
Wasn’t David White one of the people suspended for claiming that Hitler supported Zionism?
LOL White was expelled because he is on the left of the party, not because of what he might or might not have said 8 years ago. He was suspended in 2016 and then quickly reinstated when it was clear that there was no case to answer.
The difference now is that Starmer is the current leader and his right-hand man is David Evans. Croydon Labour Party is controlled by the right-wing which is responsible for bankrupting the council and guilty of disgraceful housing scandals which have made the national headlines, no one has been expelled for that.
Being on the left David White has consistently opposed the self-serving right-wingers in Croydon where David Evans is a central character.
Accusing a man who has spent his life fighting racism of being a racist because of pro-Palestinian comments 8 years ago and expelling him, whilst warmly embracing a Tory brexiteer who only a few weeks ago was voting against the rights of asylum seekers, as he struts around parliament wearing a Union Jack facemask, speaks volumes about today's Labour Party.
Are you describing the “Hitler supported Zionism” nonsense as “pro-Palestinian”?
Ernie - I remember the infighting in Manchester in the 80-s - pretty bad then with coups and counter coups and various factions fighting and lashing out at each other
It seems to be something on the "left" that they keep on forgetting who the enemy actually is and fight amongst themselves - and we also had the labour / tory non aggression pact in Scotland which gave May a majority ( with the DUP ) and the Bain principle and before that labour councils splitting on sectarian lines
Seems my entire life the left has been full of splits and factional infighting absorbing energy that could be more usefully spent actually achieving someothing
Are you describing the “Hitler supported Zionism” nonsense as “pro-Palestinian”?
If David White had made a racist comment 8 years ago he would have been expelled immediately then. I will remind you that the leader of the Labour Party at that time was Jewish.
So tell me Kelvin, what is your view concerning Starmer warmly welcoming a right-wing Tory brexiteer who votes against the rights of asylum seekers and likes to proudly display the union jack?
He sounds like the archetypal Tory MP which stw despises so much, especially when you throw in that he is opposed to measures to reduce climate change and tax evasion.
The Tories have division aswell. They are in power more so it doesn't matter as much.
It seems to be something on the “left” that they keep on forgetting who the enemy actually is
I would love to say that is hilarious, but binners is much better at comedy than you TJ, leave that sort of stuff to him.
I can't speak for anyone else but I'm willing to hold my nose regarding the defection.
The time to play nicely to get the Tories out has long gone. They need to go,I don't care about the niceties, the "moral" choices.
Get. Them. Out.
Anything, legal, that aides their demise is fine by me.
I'll worry about the the likes of Wakefield once Labour is in office.
I can’t speak for anyone else but I’m willing to hold my nose regarding the defection.
I very much suspect that you are not alone. Usually there is an avalanche of hatred directed at right-wing anti-asylum Tory brexiteers on stw, the silence in the case Wakeford says a lot.
What Starmer should have done of course was to tell him to **** off, not least because it makes no difference to the Tories huge majority, but also because it clearly is a stain on Starmer's party that a right-wing Tory should so effortlessly move into the Labour Party.
Although the reality is that there is probably very little difference politically between Starmer and Wakeford, which according to a few on here is apparently a good thing...... Labour becoming more like the Tories.
It seems to be something on the “left” that they keep on forgetting who the enemy actually is
so in Scotland we have labour aligning themselves with the tories and cheering on tory wins in the GE - against the SNP who are to the left of the labour party on most issues - and you think they have not forgotten who the enemy is?
We get the welcoming a brexiteer tory and spending gawd knows how much time and energy on infighting - rather than taking on the tories - and you think they have not forgotten who the enemy is?
In case yo have forgotten the enemy is the tory party 😉
Verbal and 'logical' gymnastics; so much dancing on the head of a pin.
Anything that moves the tories - and johnson specifically - closer to the exit gets my unquestioning and unequivocal support.
It's about winning - not taking the moral high ground, if there is such a thing.
Other than that - I'll leave you chaps/chapesses to disappear further down the rabbit hole.
The time to play nicely to get the Tories out has long gone.
By becoming them?
Can someone please explain what qualifies this person to be a Labour MP? Given that you can get kicked out of the Labour Party for having previously voted Green. It's utter madness.
So tell me Kelvin, what is your view concerning Starmer warmly welcoming a right-wing Tory brexiteer who votes against the rights of asylum seekers and likes to proudly display the union jack?
I’ve already said that I want more Tory MPs to cross the floor, and I want Tory voters to see that and consider voting Labour. I also want MPs and voters alike to reconsider their views on asylum seekers, immigrants, the low paid, the unpaid and others used as the targets by the Tories to gain power and divide and rule. I want them to change their minds, their attitudes, and their votes. Stop being Tories. Stop voting Tory. Stop blaming those in need. Start supporting those in need. Start voting Labour. Start supporting Labour.
TJ, I agree, outs abhorrent what Labour is doing in Scotland.
I very much suspect that you are not alone. Usually there is an avalanche of hatred directed at right-wing anti-asylum Tory brexiteers on stw, the silence in the case Wakeford says a lot.
I can't but agree, I suspect I wouldn't like to hear Wakefield's opinions on Brexit, immigration and a slew of other matters.
However, if he has the potential to be a nail in a Boris sized box I'll repent my sins later.
Labour at its absolute worst would still be better than this absolute shower of shysters.
@kelvin er...
In 2020, Mr Wakeford co-sponsored and voted for a private members bill that would "enable the recall of Members of the House of Commons who voluntarily change their political party affiliation; and for connected purposes".
These are my principles...
Ernie - we may be at cross purposes - I didn't mean the left of the labour party tho at times they spend more energy on infighting that fighting the tories - I meant the left in a more general way - so the labour party in all its broad church and including the various splinter parties. If they all got together and worked together we would never have another tory government but they waste so much energy and effort fighting each other that they give the tories a free ride. this thread shows my point exactly
I'm sorry TJ I thought it was an attempt at a comedy on your part when you accused the left of forgetting who the enemy is.
I had no idea you were being serious when it is so clearly the right-wing that is hellbent on treating Labour Party members as the enemy, instead of focusing on the Tories.
so the labour party in all its broad church
So broad it now encompasses the right wing of the conservative party.
“enable the recall of Members of the House of Commons who voluntarily change their political party affiliation; and for connected purposes”.
That would be great. What are we talking, a % of constituents petitioning for a bye election? Sounds great. Can it apply to those who lose the parliamentary whip as well? We could do with some bye elections this year. ASAP. The more the better. Especially in seats only narrowly won by Conservative Party candidates in 2019. Bring it on.
this thread shows my point exactly
Pages and pages of it. And it’ll never end while we have FPTP. Even the Democrats managed to briefly unite to win an election. Labour never will. It needs to split, but it can’t because our election system means they would then be even less likely to be in government then they do looking like cats fighting in a sack. “But it’s just those on the Left of the party who are the problem”, “it’s just the centrists that are problem” … it’s obviously both, as they battle over a party only forced to stay together by FPTP.
The point ------>>>>>>>>>
You
Inside Croydon, posted on the interweb, looks like an invaluable, independent and impartial news source Ernie.
Thanks for introducing me to that
Reading it, I’m absolutely amazed I’ve not come across it before
Do you know if they plan any expansion of their unique reportage beyond Croydon?
Palestine would be the obvious next step, but tomorrow? The rest of the Middle East? Surely the world?
Do you know if they’ve any plans to report live on the kidnapping of Pilate’s wife?
Oh… and as for my own opinions on what’s happened today, I won’t bother. I’ll just echo what Kelvin’s said. And I live in Bury (north not south, so I’m even more northern. Imagine that). It maybe looks a bit different up here than it does in London (or Islington North at least)
I want more Tory MPs to cross the floor
Hopefully enough so that Labour can form a majority government.
Or maybe Labour MPs could join the Tories? That would have the same effect, and it would probably be easier.
After all there's no point getting hung up on ideology.
The point
You were making out that he’s a hypocrite. Something very easy to do now I imagine. I was jokingly praising his support of a bill which I presume you think means he should now act as if it was made law, even though it wasn’t. Right now, I wish the bill had been passed, and I wish he was facing a by-election, and that it was only one of many by-elections such a change in the law would probably be delivering. That just because I think it would sink both Johnson and his party fast. My more considered long term opinion is that it would give the whips too much power. After all, it is subjective and on a case by case basis whether a party has moved away from the electorate in a constituency, or the candidate has, when an MP leaves a party.
Hopefully enough so that Labour can form a majority government.
That’s one unlikely way to get a fresh election. I’ll take a reduced majority and more of the public thinking about replacing their Tory MPs, preferably with Labour ones, but I’ll admit to not being all that fussy.
Or maybe Labour MPs could join the Tories? That would have the same effect, and it would probably be easier.
Only if you think a glass of gin with a splash of tonic in it is in effect the same as a glass of tonic with a shot of gin in it.
Doubt there will be anymore defectors now and personally I don't want any.
Wakefield is here though, it's done for good or bad and I'm content to let the other back benchers tear the Tory party apart from the inside.
If his move has caused more of them to defend Boris as a survival instinct (as reported), all the better. They get themselves further tainted by association.
Hopefully enough so that Labour can form a majority government.
Or maybe Labour MPs could join the Tories? That would have the same effect, and it would probably be easier.
After all there’s no point getting hung up on ideology
Or maybe you accept that now Brexit is apparently ‘done’, normal service is resumed and you can only win from the centre, as Boris is now finding out
Ideology is not really for most people, from whichever direction
Inside Croydon, posted on the interweb, looks like an invaluable, independent and impartial news source Ernie.
Yup, it is binners, fiercely independent and utterly merciless. No one can expect any favours from them.
Glad you found the link interesting, I'll post more if I see any that I think you might also find interesting.
Although now that you don't post on this thread anymore I don't know whether you will see them?
Or have I gone too far back and you've changed your mind since yesterday?
it’s done for good or bad
Including whether he is the Labour Party candidate next general election?
Blimey that was quick. It's not surprising that he was so keen to join Labour, specially as the seat will almost certainly go to Labour next election anyway.
Ah you were trying to be funny. 😂😐
I live in Bury
Is that what you call Ramsbottom when you're trying to sound more 'salt of the earth'? Even when you're not posting here any more.
Including whether he is the Labour Party candidate next general election?
Honestly not being argumentative here and really not shopping for a "fight" as I'm fully aware of my hypocritical position but also prepared to live with it at this juncture. Get them out.
Yep, if it transpires he is fighting the seat in 2 years I'm ok with that.
My single concern is that he must win the seat, no more. As long as that is the outcome I'll continue to hold my nose.
Blimey that was quick. It’s not surprising that he was so keen to join Labour, specially as the seat will almost certainly go to Labour next election anyway.
Bury South has always been Labour, but was quite unique at the last election.
It’s not referred to as Manchester’s kosher moat for nothing. It has an enormous Jewish population (one of the largest in Europe) and guess what… they weren’t massively enamoured with Jeremy Corbyn. Who knows why? It’s a complete mystery
I think the polling just published today is more reflective of the constituency than the result of the last election and you’re probably best looking at as more a judgement on local opinions to the labour party, pre and post Magic Grandad
I think the polling just published today is more reflective of the constituency than the result of the last election and you’re probably best looking at as more a judgement on local opinions to the labour party, pre and post Magic Grandad
I know you think that he’s the messiah and some kind of living god, but the Jewish population of Prestwich passed their judgement on Grandad at the last election and I personally credit their opinion more than the Corbyn fan club in North London
This is the extent of the magic grandad effect from the last election and now. Much as Boris has been a contributing factor, so has the beardy allotment dweller
Whichever way you try to spin it, there has been a big shift in the opinion of the large Jewish population of the Labour since Grandad has departed
Quite frankly IMHO they’re the only people who are qualified to pass judgement to pass comment on the Labour Party and antisemitism
https://twitter.com/electionmapsuk/status/1483774295956496389?s=21
Binners, please stop bringing up Corbyn, it’s 2022 now!
Thank you binners for taking so much time explaining in great detail how the seat might go to Labour next election, I guess my comment "specially as the seat will almost certainly go to Labour next election anyway" didn't provide clear evidence that I was aware of that.
Interesting comment about the "beardy allotment dweller" btw, I guess the great thing about Starmer is that he has neither a beard nor an allotment.
Binners, please stop bringing up Corbyn, it’s 2022 now
I’m merely explaining the unique position of Bury South at the last election
I live in Bury. I have lots of Jewish friends, who told me their opinions. I’m merely explaining the massive part Corbyn had in losing this previously safe Labour seat.
It may look very different in Islington, obviously, but I don’t have much interest in how it looks from down there. I’d rather deal with reality.
Yes binners you were pointing out that, according to you anyway, it's the fault of the Jewish community that Labour failed to win Bury. Presumably if it didn't have such a large Jewish it would have returned a Labour member of parliament.
But you ought to be careful though mate, you could get expelled from the Labour Party for blaming Jews for the poor election result.
I live in Bury. I have lots of Jewish friends, who told me their opinions. I’m merely explaining the massive part Corbyn had in losing this previously safe Labour seat.
Hard agree. I resigned my party membership appalled at the comments from the aftermath the EHRC, having concluded their inquiry: "“We found specific examples of harassment, discrimination and political interference in our evidence,” the EHRC said in its foreword, adding: “But equally of concern was a lack of leadership within the Labour party on these issues, which is hard to reconcile with its stated commitment to a zero-tolerance approach to antisemitism.” and of course Corbyn's obfuscation and vacillation over Brexit. I made sure that the person on the end of the phone at Labour HQ made careful note of my reasons for cancellation.
In January 2020, I applied to rejoin. I'm happy to report that I'm paying my subs again.
But you ought to be careful though mate, you could get expelled from the Labour Party for blaming Jews for the poor election result
Except I’m not blaming the Jews though, am I? I’m squarely laying the blame at the feet of Jeremy Corbyn who fostered an environment that made them about as welcome as a fart in a space suit
You can’t do that then be surprised when you lose the seat
I’m sure everything looks different from Islington North though. That being the centre of the ****ing universe, after all
Their opinions are obviously twice or four times as valid as us poor uneducated fools who actually live in places like Bury
What would we know? We defer to your superior, patronising, ill-informed condescension obviously more informed position