MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
We will be in touch
greyspoke - that is correct as I see it
The Yes side wanted a split of assets and liabilities along population lines. Westminster s=said no to this hence starting the row about debts ( to oversimplify greatly)
I don’t understand why folk have a problem moving straight to the Euro on joining the EU
Because that is not an option, iS could start to use the Euro, not the same being part of the Euro zone and as has been pointed out numerous times above joining the EU isn't like joining a Gym where you rock up with some id and a deposit and you get a membership card.
Hence the idea of using the £ in transition.
personally I like the euro option but its been so demonised in the right wing press that its a hard sell
As for the rest of it? I suggest you do two things. Read up the debate from last time and read up on statements from the EU about iScotland
I asked for a clear explanation not Brexit level tripe
If you can't explain what currency you will use for your "virtually instant" EU membership then clearly it's on a par with Brexit.
If you can't register that EU membership means a customs border with England demanded by the EU you are a Govite fantasist.
If you think you can walk away without carrying some of the national debt without consequences you are descending into comedy.
SNP can't even get Social Security Scotland up and running, how they get away with claiming a smooth iS transition is possible in their hands is beyond me.
Hence the idea of using the £ in transition.
It's not an idea, it is a fantasy. EU will never let you join with a third party currency. Find any credible EU reference that it is possible, if you can't it's a Brexit style say anything to get the vote strategy
Because that is not an option
It's not a 'current' option, but that means nothing - so back to my question:
"I don’t understand why folk have a problem moving straight to the Euro on joining the EU."
Why have folk a problem with adopting the Euro - what's the problem?
Its not up to me what currency is used there is a lot of info out there about the options. I have told you what I think - use the euro and what the YES position was last time - £ as a transitional currency. Floating a scottish poound is another option. I do not make that decision. Its a decision for the scots government
On the debt - I think you really do need to read up on it. there is no question of a default as the debt legally would belong to rUK as the successor state
Really - there is a huge amount of good info out there. there is nothing further I can say
I DO NOT MAKE THE DECISIONS
“I don’t understand why folk have a problem moving straight to the Euro on joining the EU.”
Why have folk a problem with adopting the Euro – what’s the problem?
It ties you into a currency that works for Germany (low value so exports not impacted) with all the risks of Greece and Italy (and others) structurally tied into it
Why have folk a problem with adopting the Euro – what’s the problem?
Sovereignty. The right-wing, media and politicians, have been pushing this as a problem for years. It's related to the UKs overblown idea of where it sits in the world order.
I DO NOT MAKE THE DECISIONS
Yet you have such a clear opinion on what is possible without any recognition of the contradictions
With the "transitional" £ you can't "virtually instantly" rejoin the EU
Yet you don't campaign for immediate adoption of the euro to enable the "virtually instant", why? It's a vote loser.
Reminds me of a recent campaign where messages ignored the contradictions to get votes.
Let me think what was that much maligned campaign.....?
I still reckon King Charles III's mug will be on the £ soon & people will feel less attached to it
Floating a scottish poound is another option.
Without reserves you will be at the mercy of the markets, walk away with no debt you don't get any reserves and you already run a deficit. Your bond rates will be eye watering
I still reckon King Charles III’s mug will be on the £ soon & people will feel less attached to it
We will be significantly cashless by then so who will see it?
Sovereignty. The right-wing, media and politicians, have been pushing this as a problem for years. It’s related to the UKs overblown idea of where it sits in the world order.
Makes you wonder why the progressive paradise north of the border can't see through it.
Why isn't it SNP/ green policy to adopt straight away?
It ties you into a currency that works for Germany (low value so exports not impacted) with all the risks of Greece and Italy (and others) structurally tied into it
Remind us how much 'value' Sterling has lost against the Euro - I'll help, it's over 25%.
So you're saying that Sterling works for Scotland (as opposed to the UK), or that it doesn't?
Add in that the SNP defence position isn’t compatible with NATO membership (no nukes and <2% defence spending).
quite a lot of NATO countries don't have nukes. Only USA, UK and France do.
quite a lot of NATO countries don’t have nukes. Only USA, UK and France do
But they all allow nukes on their soil. SNP policy is no nukes in Scotland
So you’re saying that Sterling works for Scotland (as opposed to the UK), or that it doesn’t?
I'm saying you can't join the EU with sterling whether it's "transitional" or not.
It's perfectly reasonable to join the euro but there are downsides as well as upsides
Just like being in the EU single market as a member has benefits but means a EU imposed hard border with England
Indeed it is. (SNP policy) Where is rUK going to put the subs? play hardball and get two weeks notice to quit. We do not want hukes on our soil. Like many other countries around the world and as above - retaining NATO membership was pushed thru by Salmond against long standing SNP policy
We ( generally) do not have the delusion of grandeur that little englanders suffer from.
Most of us up here would be happy with neutrality and certainly have no appetite to go around pretending we are billy big baws with our big weapons being thrust at everyone
But they all allow nukes on their soil. SNP policy is no nukes in Scotland
only a few NATO countries host American nukes (Belgium, Germany, Italy, The Netherlands, Turkey)
Most of us up here would be happy with neutrality and certainly have no appetite to go around pretending we are billy big baws with our big weapons being thrust at everyone
Your strategy on iS contributing to UN peacekeeping missions is noted
Putting words in my mouth again Big and Daft - you do live up to your name.
so you need to play at being Billy big baws to contribute to UN peacekeeping missions and be in nato as well?
Really - educate yorself on independence issues. Yo will find it enlightening
I never said it would be an open boarder. i said how difficult the boarder would be would depend a lot on rUKs attitudes as we see in the channel ports right now
Nobeer, yeah; thats what I was alluding to.
so you need to play at being Billy big baws to contribute to UN peacekeeping missions and be in nato as well?
I thought you wanted out of NATO and to slash defence spending? Or are you flip flopping to suit?
At least airplane spotting will get more interesting.
I never said it would be an open boarder. i said how difficult the boarder would be would depend a lot on rUKs attitudes as we see in the channel ports right now
So you are proposing a hard border for your relationship with rUK before EU membership? Bold!
I was talking about the EU single market border after your "virtually instant" EU membership. You have still to mention where the lorry parks are in Scotland for this.
Remind me what currency are you entering the EU with? Remember the "transitional pound" is Brexit like tripe and you really don't want to sound like that nice Scot Mr Gove....
And how long will it take to adopt it???
Big n daft...so do tell me, on all these threads you have a one eyed view of Scottish independence. So; what are the advantages for Scotland of the status quo. Go on; sell it to me!
It’s perfectly reasonable to join the euro but there are downsides as well as upsides
Hmm, so based on you saying it's kept low to help Germany export and that Scotland exports a high percentage than the UK does, as a whole - then this would mean that we'd benefit from the Euro.
Correct?
And defence spending of +2% - how can the UK afford to spend this?
If Scotland vote for independence they’re walking into the EU and the euro. Why? Because for the first time since the vikings the English will be surrounded. And the French are rubbing their hands. Geo-politically it’s a winner for France and frankly I’m for it.
With Brexit and the rise in support for Welsh independence over the last year and a bit its safe to say Westminster is spent both at home and abroad.
We received a Tory flyer through the door, no mention of policy, just repeatedly slamming SNP. They’ve got nothing.
I got that one too. A mate posted some FB nonsense from the tories about SNP not spending enough on business, funnily enough my reply of "something something **** business" went unanswered.
If Scotland vote for independence they’re walking into the EU and the euro. Why? Because for the first time since the vikings the English will be surrounded. And the French are rubbing their hands. Geo-politically it’s a winner for France and frankly I’m for it.
With Brexit and the rise in support for Welsh independence over the last year and a bit its safe to say Westminster is spent both at home and abroad
What a load of tripe, the only people rubbing their hands are the acolytes of Putin
Big n daft…so do tell me, on all these threads you have a one eyed view of Scottish independence. So; what are the advantages for Scotland of the status quo. Go on; sell it to me
The people with one eye are the Indy supporters who are impersonating Admiral Nelson. I haven't seen so much cake and eat it since the Brexit campaign.
The advantages of being a valued part of a G7 country, one where Scots and " people of Scotland" can have the highest offices of state. Where they contribute to something which is bigger than the sum of it's parts. I'm not going to put Scotland down, it's a great place (it even took TJ from England, not sure it's a a fair exchange for Michael Gove), but as throughout the UK it's poorly served by the political class. Brexit maybe a terrible mistake or just a reset, I don't know, I didn't vote for it. The parallels of the Scottish independence debate with Brexit are clear, creation of artificial division, contradictory positions, no plan that stands up to any scrutiny, and the selling of something that won't exist. Sound familiar?
Can Scotland be independent, of course it can. It's just a shame that it destroys something better on the back of lies and deceit, with the EU membership/ currency/ border fantasy as the outstanding example. Both England and Scotland will be the poorer for it.
@Bigndaft I don't think you have answered Duckmans question.
Aye, that was a Boris answer.
Not really mentioning any benefits there BND. What if we were sick of 400 year old promises that we could be "part of something bigger" And had the opportunity to do something about it?
No, a U.K. G7 seat is not a benefit when the Scottish electorates part of that voice is a small minority.
And seats within the U.K. government is also not a benefit.
Part of something bigger? What’s that then? The U.K. that many/some want to leave?
Aye, that was a Boris answer.
I literally read it as “waffle pish waffle”
Scotland is an altogether different matter. Its history is our history. Its contribution to the world through its literature and philosophy, exploration and art, is our contribution. Its departure — with no disrespect to the Welsh — would represent the end of the United Kingdom. The rest of the world would instantly see that we were no longer a front-rank power, or even in the second row. We would instead be one of the great majority of countries who are on the receiving end of the decisions made by a few, subject to the values of others. We would become another historically interesting case study in how successful nations can perform unexpected acts of national suicide.
George Osborne.
I think it nearly shows the still-colonial thinking and fear of diminished power we expect from the English nationalists. It also puts to bed the notion that these folk have the interests of the Scottish people at heart when discussing the constitutional future of the UK.
The National newspaper has some interesting articles today
Indeed, I think that gets to the heart of the matter of why so many English people seem so hell bent on keeping Scotland whilst at the same time constantly saying that Scotland is a drain on the UK coffers.
It's something I've never been able to get my head around but it's basically an anti-Brexit. Instead of 'Take back control' it's 'Keep control'. There's not really much more substance than that. It's pure ego stroking in order to desperately cling onto the idea that England is still a great power.
Maybe Brexit and Independence had more in common than I thought. Just not in the way the British Nationalists seem to think it does.
big_n_daft
...but as throughout the UK it’s poorly served by the political class.
The beauty of independence is we no longer have to tolerate that.
We can be a normal independent country, and change our politicians. At the moment we get the govt England wants.
,,,Can Scotland be independent, of course it can. It’s just a shame that it destroys something better
It's only better for England.
The National newspaper has some interesting articles today
About time.
The National newspaper has some interesting articles today
Oh absolutely. Because when a paper uses phrases long the lines of "We can exclusively reveal......" you can be 100% sure it's an accurate story and not just derived from a journalist being told "Well he said to him who told her who's cat heard it from a neighbour's budgie etc."
Not really mentioning any benefits there BND.
Because the trap is you logically imply Scotland can't do something or would do it worse and that acts as a rallying call for all the nationalists. The point is the whole is greater than the sum of it's parts.
Scots nationalism seems to be an exercise in whitewashing (or blue and white if you prefer) history. Scots and Scotland were not put upon by the English and Welsh, they were active participants sometimes leaders of both good and bad parts of our collective history. It's all the fault of this entity " Westminster" and "little Englanders" etc not the English as bring rude about them wouldn't be civic.
It’s pure ego stroking in order to desperately cling onto the idea that England is still a great power.
Fantasy tripe, we all know that UK forces can do little in isolation. That's the strength of being in a military alliance where you spend a decent amount on being able to jointly defend your interests. An alliance that TJ and many other pro iS campaigners want to weaken.
The biggest fantasy is that the pro independence campaign isn't similar to Brexit. The messages are vague about the future; pro EU membership, we'll rejoin "virtually instantly", not so sure, we will have a referendum on it. Trade will be without barriers with rUK and the EU and if we join the EU it will be the English with the lorry parks. Etc etc
There are only three currency options for EU membership, euro, Merks and bawbee's or an EU member currency. The pro Indy pro EU campaigners can't or won't answer it. Why? Because the realities of each option lose votes for independence.
Brexit all over again, lies, fudges, false division, grievance politics, othering.
Kennyp - the national does require a large pinch of salt when being read for sure but this is either a leak to put pressure on the leadership or a leak with the consent of the leadership IMO
The point is the whole is greater than the sum of it’s parts.
Which is why we want to be in the EU
It really does amuse me that no matter what I write you deliberately misrepresent it and falsify it.
We can be a normal independent country, and change our politicians. At the moment we get the govt England wants.
Not so long ago Scotland returned plenty of MPs that were in the UK government some have been PM and the other great offices of state the success of the SNP has been to separate Scotland from this former reality and to create the grievance.
Which is why we want to be in the EU
How? Your "transitional pound" is fantasy. Which of the three currency options are you taking?
How long is "virtually instant"
What will be your net contribution?
Where are you putting the EU single market border lorry parks?
Big and daft. How many times since WW2 has a majority of scots MPs been the same as the UK government? You many years out of that time?
Either you are trolling or you have a huge comprehension gap
I am giving up replying to you.
I am giving up replying to you
Because you don't have the EU membership answers?
The really simple questions that come from the Govite easiest negotiation, already aligned etc etc??
Because you are in denial that Scots have been at the heart of "Westminster" and all you hate? (Obviously I accept that some of them stopped being one of "the people of Scotland" when they moved within the UK as so many do)??
The fact the similarities to the Brexit campaign lies, deceit, misdirection, division, false grievance etc are so plain to see???
If the campaign was honest and said it will be a very hard transition to iS and in the short term people will be poorer and had a roadmap for EU membership or something else with clear answers on currency, borders etc based on a reality not a fantasy then great, it's not a Brexit style campaign. The arguments are easier to understand and an honest view can be taken whichever side you fall on.
Until then you are just the Edinburgh version of Michael Gove (lite) or that Wings over Scotland guy (and potential MSP candidate). Just English but not one of "the people of England" although we won't disown you.
What a load of tripe, the only people rubbing their hands are the acolytes of Putin
Boris Johnson? The disaster capitalists funding the Tories? Aye, as you wish. How about a reasoned and rational response rather then a reactive dismissal?
Big and daft. because you post offensive pish.
there is no similarity to brexit and what you ask for "If the campaign was honest and said it will be a very hard transition to iS and in the short term people will be poorer and had a roadmap for EU membership or something else with clear answers on currency, borders etc based on a reality not a fantasy then great," has been said.
As above - either yo are trolling or your comprehension gap / dunning Krugar is so strong that is worthless answering.
If Scotland vote for independence they’re walking into the EU and the euro. Why? Because for the first time since the vikings the English will be surrounded. And the French are rubbing their hands. Geo-politically it’s a winner for France and frankly I’m for it.
With Brexit and the rise in support for Welsh independence over the last year and a bit its safe to say Westminster is spent both at home and abroad
Planes and international freight shipping have come on leaps and bounds since the Vikings, there is something called the internet as well I believe, it magically crosses the world.
Scotland is also a bit of a dead end in that logic with it's only land border with a non EU country.
How about a reasoned and rational response rather then a reactive dismissal?
It's still tripe,
there is no similarity to brexit and what you ask for “If the campaign was honest and said it will be a very hard transition to iS and in the short term people will be poorer and had a roadmap for EU membership or something else with clear answers on currency, borders etc based on a reality not a fantasy then great,” has been said
You haven't said any of that, you talk about a transitional pound and no hard border post EU membership, easy negotiation, already aligned etc. When asked to clarify you switch direction
Misdirection, false grievance, etc etc
All in a day's work for Edinburgh's Michael Gove lite.
The beauty of independence is we no longer have to tolerate that.
Haaaahaaaaa -Alex Salmon!!!!!!
There does seem to be a lot of smoke and mirrors and inability to answer questions on here, and not from BnD. If you're pushing for the change it's up to you to justify it, just because the decision making becomes local doesn't mean better decisions will be made, it's still politicians making the decisions with all the constraints of living in an international community, EU member or not. This is the Brexit fallacy and it's shocking many of you who quite rightly saw through the lies of the Brexiteers can't see it with the SNP. Here's a thought, maybe being in the union is the best option available, this was the whole trap remain fell into with Brexit, it's difficult to big up the status quo where as it's easy to make unsubstantiated claims things will be be better with change.
There's so many parallels with Brexit here it's painful.
One final thought, in most cases these days nationalism is seen as backward looking, right wing and nasty, how come it's different for Scottish nationalism?
how come it’s different for Scottish nationalism?
It's civic
Welsh nationalism is OK as welll
English or British, or UK nationalism is nasty, racist, xenophobic, always without exception.
Well that's what the Scottish independence campaign tell me so it must be right
Stumpy john
Its best summed up by the bashir Ahmed quote
"Its not where I come from as a person, its where we are going as a nation"
Scottish nationalism is outward looking, internationalist and inclusive
I'll list some points of difference
Scottish nationalism wants to stay in the EU, English nationalism wants to be out
Scottish nationalism includes everyone who makes Scotland their home, English nationalism wants to remove furriners
Scottish nationalism wants to stay in the EU,
Does it? Or is it just a vote harvesting position?
I’ll list some points of difference
Scottish nationalism wants to stay in the EU, English nationalism wants to be out
Scottish nationalism includes everyone who makes Scotland their home, English nationalism wants to remove furriners
I hope you are suitably ashamed stumpyjon and either move to Scotland to take up the Saltire or burn anything with the cross of st George or Union Jack on it.
I am of course assuming English is shorthand for English/ British
To be honest I am pretty ashamed of English nationalism as I think it is pretty much as TJ describes, however whilst I do believe many of the more educated Scottish voters do believe in everything TJ has said I also think many Scottish Nationalists are no better than English Nationalists with the added unpleasantness of anti English sentiment as well. The whole hatred of Westminster does bleed into anti Englishness which and a lot of the it's not the English we don't like feels a bit I'm not racist but or some of my best friends are black.
Someone asked further up the thread why many English people who acknowledge the fiscal support Scotland gets from the rUk but still don't want independence. Simple answer is we'd rather be part of a bigger whole, don't like artificial division and believe that redistribution of wealth is a good thing. We also don't want to see our fellow countrymen making a massive mistake (in our opinion) And live to regret it.
many Scottish Nationalists are no better than English Nationalists with the added unpleasantness of anti English sentiment as well.
there is certainly that fringe but I would refute its "many"
I have a very English name, a very English accent but its something I really never see any more. The most unsavory bunch in all this are the Rangers fans ( unionists / sectarian) - but I do not consider them to be indicative of the unionist side
Its been changing over the years at least in part because of the leadership of the SNP who will not tolerate anti englishness. Of course back in the 70s I lived in Glasgow - now in the rather more gentile Edinburgh but my impression is the anti englishness is less year on year
The unionist side make a huge play on this but actually? Not a huge issue
We also don’t want to see our fellow countrymen making a massive mistake (in our opinion) And live to regret it.
That's very unselfish of you, but would you acknowledge that those folk have the right to make their own choice?
@Bigndaft I don’t think you have answered Duckmans question.
He didn't answer mine either, the one when he told us that the Euro was purely there to keep a low value currency for German exports. So I pointed out:
1 Sterling has lost value against the Euro since it was created
2 Scotland exports a higher percentage than the UK as a whole
That’s very unselfish of you, but would you acknowledge that those folk have the right to make their own choice?
I thought they had recently. How often do you want the choice, every year until you get 50% +1 vote?
. So I pointed out:
1 Sterling has lost value against the Euro since it was created
2 Scotland exports a higher percentage than the UK as a whole
Apologies, joining the euro is a perfectly decent choice, it enables early EU membership although I imagine that the EU might not be happy if you unilaterally adopted it. There may be export advantages etc etc.
I just wonder why it's not SNP policy if it is such a great idea? Are there any downsides? Why is it a vote loser? Or is that down to the right wing press and Westminster bogeymen?
TBH anything is better than the "transitional pound" taken into EU membership tripe.
Stumpyjhon - thats so kind of you to try to protect me.
That’s very unselfish of you, but would you acknowledge that those folk have the right to make their own choice?
I agree 100%. However in every election and referendum in history (as far as I'm aware) the majority of Scottish people have voted for parties in favour of carrying on as one of the partners in the UK. That may change, but at the moment history overwhelmingly suggests no appetite for independence.
However in every election and referendum in history (as far as I’m aware) the majority of Scottish people have voted for parties in favour of carrying on as one of the partners in the UK.
How many Holyrood elections do the SNP need to win?
history overwhelmingly suggests no appetite for independence.
History also suggests no appetite for a Labour government at Westminster. Should we give up on general elections too?
How many Holyrood elections do the SNP need to win?
I worded my sentence very carefully and stand by it. In every election single election the majority of voters have voted for parties in favour of staying in the UK.
History also suggests no appetite for a Labour government at Westminster. Should we give up on general elections too?
We should but for different reasons, and that's a whole other thread. My point is that the SNP are demanding something that the majority of Scottish people have never wanted. If that changes fair enough, but at the moment there's no evidence for it.
Westminster is doing exactly what the Scottish people have requested, which ironically is what the SNP always complain about.
the SNP are demanding something that the majority of Scottish people have never wanted
18 (or is it 19 now) opinion polls in a row say otherwise.
Ultimately Scottish independence will bring some challenges, none are insurmountable and but they will be there.
No point in denying that. And people should consider the challenges when the time comes to vote again.
Whether those challenges should influence a vote, is up to the person, there probably won't be definitive answers to a lot of them.
scotroutes and TJ, is it beyond your comprehension that someone south of the border might care about what happens to people north of it. Were not all imperialist colonials.
Of course people have the right to make choices, in the same way people have the right to make life choices that are astoundingly bad for them, like investing in a scam, i wouldn't sit back and say nothing in that situation either.
How many Holyrood elections do the SNP need to win?
And that's like saying everyone in the UK was desperate to leave the EU and screw the poor because FPTP gave the UK (that includes you) a Tory government.
Stumpyjon - the way you put it was incredibly patronising
Hpolyrood elections are (almost) proportional not FPTP the pro independence parties got a small majority of the seats with as kenny p points out just less than 50% of the vote. Under FPTP the snp get huge majorities - look to the Westminster election results from Scotland
18 (or is it 19 now) opinion polls in a row say otherwise.
Are you saying that opinion polls should be used to to decide government policy? If so then fair enough, but could you then answer this question. When the SNP were in power but opinion polls were showing the majority against a second referendum, why did the SNP continue to demand one?
The SNP demand that Scottish people be listened to, but when the Scottish people repeatedly vote for parties opposed to a second referendum then the SNP ignore them? Could anyone tell me why that is?
Oh and epicycle, before you say anything, it's not because MI5 and the KGB have infiltrated the upper echelons of DC Thomsons in an evil plot to have the Scottish tablet industry sold off to a sweetie shop in Colchester, or whatever theory is doing the conspiracy theory forum rounds this week.
Lolz @ Kenny.
TJ I should add, for clarity, I am very against FPTP in any election, regardless of whether the outcome suits me or not.
And that has just put me in the mood for a piece if tablet. I may not be in favour of Independence, but I am very proud of the contribution Scotland has made to fighting the dangers of overpopulation by producing delicious foods guaranteed to shorten lives!!
I agree 100%. However in every election and referendum in history (as far as I’m aware) the majority of Scottish people have voted for parties in favour of carrying on as one of the partners in the UK. That may change, but at the moment history overwhelmingly suggests no appetite for independence.
Eh are you sure about that, and if wrong will wholeheartedly support the ability of the Scottish people to select change if they wish? Because:
In 2015 General Election 51.3% of the votes cast were for SNP and Scottish Green, who both argue strongly for independence; I've not gone looking to see the opinions of the various "other" votes.
I was laughing at your epicyclo comment!
Eh are you sure about that, and if wrong will wholeheartedly support the ability of the Scottish people to select change if they wish? Because:
That's why I put "as far as I'm aware". If that was the case then fair enough, I stand corrected. But it is still just one of many.
I knew that TJ, the postings just got crossed a bit. Anyway it's wine o'clock now so whatever your views have a great Saturday night. I'm off to continue non-dry January.
The SNP demand that Scottish people be listened to, but when the Scottish people repeatedly vote for parties opposed to a second referendum then the SNP ignore them? Could anyone tell me why that is?
Kenny, if the people of Scotland really don't want another independence referendum, when balanced against all the other issues Scotland faces, they have a number of options in May. If the SNP and Greens can't achieve a majority at Holyrood the issue will be kicked down the road for another 5 years. In that regard, the same problem faces the Union in both Holyrood and Westminster - a lack of credible opposition to hold the government to account.
Kennyp: Are you saying that opinion polls should be used to to decide government policy?
Conveniently ignoring the current, populist shower in Downing Street are you? This is directly from their playbook - float an idea with Telegraph/Mail/Times from a "source at number 10" and see if it sticks.
so the stuff in the national was right
https://www.ft.com/content/842f20d4-1728-4e9f-8afd-f57228f01e8a
The trap has been laid for Johnson
You just know hes going to fall for it, ignoring the verdict of the court of session (should it go for self determination) is ambrosia for Sturgeon
Lol, 52/48. Those Brexit parallels just keep on coming don't they? 🙂
I'd rather it was a bit higher than that but I do not know how that compares to previous from the same pollsters. Others have been higher
its coming - make no mistake