Forum menu
It was Schu & Co, the only ones who could beat Adrian Newey designs. Other combinations didn't or couldn't advance their set up into such a high level.
These days Vettel / Newey Co bully all others.
All the happiness in life can be taken away in a single moment no matter who you are.
Get well soon Mr Schumacher as your family needs you and we need you to spend your money. But avoid dangerous sports if you want to stay alive like stupid celebrities. 🙄
I liked Schuey early on in his career, when I still watched. Mainly because of the utterly heroic driving in second-class cars - Benetton wasn't it? IIRC there was one race where he was miles out in front and his car got stuck in 5th gear or something, and he still managed to win. And many other instances of brilliant driving such as sudden heavy rain on the wrong tyres, or staying out on dry tyres in the rain.
The infamous cutting up incident - well I thought that was 50/50 to be honest. Although hard to know how impartial I was being at the time. Hill though was a bit of a snivelly git though I always thought.
Woppit - first of all he arrived in F1 as a young German without a lot of the media training they have these days and without a great grasp of English. So when interviewed he answered in a very direct Germanic style which came across as arrogant and conceited. Then there were a few questionable episodes in his first & second careers which also didn't help.
But regardless of that he still won 7 world titles, was a key part of the Ferrari team and worked tirelessly with them & all their suppliers to maximise every possible aspect of the car's performance, gave brilliant technical feedback (apparently, never told me anything!), could deliver pace on demand, took driver fitness to a new level and generally defined an era of F1. IMO the positives far outweigh the negatives.
Whether you like him or not, there's still a man fighting for his life and anyone with an ounce of compassion would be willing him to pull through.
ETA - it was never 'just the car' either. His performances in the RoC have always been great, I saw him destroy a field of other drivers in a kart race etc etc.
thepurist, you're selling the Ferrari era a bit short there given that when he arrived it was to drive this pig:
[img] 
[/img]
He was a breath of fresh air when he arrived, I'm sure we'd heard about him, Frentzen and Wendlinger as the new next-big-things from the Sauber sportscar programme long before he hit F1, think I saw him at Silverstone and he looked a bit special there - then he jumps into the Jordan 191 at Spa of all places and sticks it on 7th first time out, just a fantastic display of natural talent. Gutted he killed the clutch on raceday!
IIRC there was one race where he was miles out in front and his car got stuck in 5th gear or something, and he still managed to win.
Correctomundo, Barcelona - he even had to stop for tyres, stuck in fifth, and managed the take off, which is pretty nuts, really. I'm sure I heard that no-one believed the team when they said about it afterwards, they had to dig out the telemetry to prove it. 🙂
Whether you like him or not, there's still a man fighting for his life and anyone with an ounce of compassion would be willing him to pull through.
The bottom line, for my money.
Let us hope that he should recover.
did he or did he not crash into damon hill after he slid off the track.damon hill just needed to finish so schu just rammed into him o both did not finish and schu won the championship.i may remember it wrong though
Maybe it's just me then, but I can only see eveything that's wrong with it, and I'm not the 'offended' type!
What is the "everything" that's wrong with it though ?
I've looked for something wrong with it, but I honestly can't find anything.
I must confess at least a slight moue of distaste at JC making brain injury jokes when Schumi is still hanging in the balance.
Obviously as a friend of Schumacher, he would probably know better about what's acceptable.
Edit- Plus it was followed by ....
In other words, it's possible after even a big brain bang to go back to exactly how you were before.
What is the "everything" that's wrong with it though ?I've looked for something wrong with it, but I honestly can't find anything.
I can only say what it seems to me; I can be a sensitive soul though 😀
Timing - less than 24hours ago & the guy might still die.
Context - as a tweet, there wasn't any. If at the end of a more sympathetic sentence or spoken word then it would have been completely different and probably worth a chuckle. As a blunt 'tweet' it just looks like a flippant and tasteless attempt to look funny.
Again though, just how it struck me, we all interpret things in different ways!
Obviously as a friend of Schumacher, he would probably know better about what's acceptable.
He certainly knows better what [i]he[/i] thinks is acceptable, just as I know better what [i]I[/i] think is acceptable. That the two might not be the same doesn't really matter, in the larger scheme of things.
Agreed bn
Context - as a tweet, there wasn't any
Which is the problem. I suspect you had to be able to link it to Richard Hammond's head injury after the dragster crash and his recovery from that.
I suspect you had to be able to link it to Richard Hammond's head injury after the dragster crash and his recovery from that.
No, I did get that link 😉
did he or did he not crash into damon hill after he slid off the track.damon hill just needed to finish so schu just rammed into him o both did not finish and schu won the championship.i may remember it wrong though
Was more 50/50 than that imo.
Hill should have waited and not gone for a gap that was bound to close. Check out how far Hill's car is alongside at the point of contact.
Anyway, hope he recovers soon - Come on Schumi!
he rammed a few to make sure he won
He had a win at all costs attitude that was less than endearing
Hope he recovers though
People seem to forget schumachers early career and assume he was royal trained to Ferrari and into the best car in the field. The reality is he fought tooth and nail early on and deserved his later success. Of his 7 championships I'd say only three maybe four were won in a car that was the best in the field. His first two with Benneton we're won in a v8 powered car when most of the rest of the field were running v10's, so it was way down on power and outright speed. And Schumacher had to exploit the manoeuvrability of the car to its maximum to win. Then he moved to Ferrari, a team that hadn't won a championship for many years, he built a team around him and turned the team around practically single handidly. I think that at least the first 2 championships for Ferrari, certainly the first, we're won before the car came properly good, and certainly not the best car in the field. You can see this in the relative results between him and Barrichello. Early on when the car was a bit of a pig Barrichello was nowhere as Schumacher was winning, but later on as the car came good and easier to drive, Barrichello was suddenly snapping at his heals.
The only thing for me that prevents him winning the best driver of all time accolade is the fact that Hakkinen and Alonso were able to take two championships off him a piece where to me he seemed to fail or was unable to step up and successfully defend, so he wasn't unbeatable.
And of course there were a few incidents where he behaved in an unsportsmanlike way, but he was punished for that and I can forgive sportsmen for that to a certain extent. The desire to do anything to win, even if it distorts their judgement from time to time, is to be expected. Yes, he did crash into Hill, twice I think. First time it was successful, the second time it wasn't as he didn't damage a Hills car enough to stop him continuing. However this behaviour certainly wasn't new to the sport, both Senna and Prost had done similar things in the past, as well as other unsporting behaviour, and it hasn't ended up defining their records. People tend to remember those drivers for all the fabulous driving they produced over their careers rather than the two or three moments of desperation. I hope Schumacher's career will ultimately be remembered in the same way.
I Hope he makes a full recovery.
Yes, he did crash into Hill, twice I think. First time it was successful, the second time it wasn't as he didn't damage a Hills car enough to stop him continuing
The second one you're thinking of was Villeneuve, at Jerez, I think.
Wobbliscott - you forget the custom Bridgestone tires no one knew he/ ferrari had until recently. 😉
Petit arguments aside, I've been deeply moved by this. Sincerely hoping Schumi battles thru this.
Context - as a tweet, there wasn't any.
There was some context provided in his next tweet.
Although that's a problem with twitter in general, not enough space for full explanations so things get misunderstood.
he rammed a few to make sure he won
He had a win at all costs attitude that was less than endearing
Sounds familiar?
Incidentally, never a fan but best wishes to Schumacher for a speedy and full recovery.
Don't give a toss what he's done in the past wether I agreed with what he did or not, hope he pulls through. Some one's dad, husband, son lying their.
Lost a close relative a few months ago,after suffering similar brain trauma,after been punched and hitting his head while out cold.images of him in intensive care, pre and post brain surgery will stay with me for life.
Hope he pulls through and positive thoughts to his family too.
Best wishes to him. Not a good situation.
Love him or hate him as a driver (bit of both from me) this is tragic lived life in one of the worlds most dangerous sports and came out the other end 'relatively' unscathed, to have this happen on a family holiday, my thoughts are with him and his family
Heard an interesting interview with Murray Walker earlier on the radio where he talked about lots of former world champions who exited the stage earlier than expected after coming through such a "dangerous" sport unscathed.
I'm not enough of a fan of f1 to have a strong opinion of him as a driver but it seems lots of folk who had personal and professional dealings with him speak highly of him so that's good enough for me to wish him well. It would be a pity to lose someone like him at 44.
I'm not enough of a fan of f1 to have a strong opinion of him as a driver but it seems lots of folk who had personal and professional dealings with him speak highly of him so that's good enough for me to wish him well. It would be a pity to lose someone like him at 44.
A few years ago I was lucky enough to spend a few months staying at a nice hotel where I frequently met an 'old' guy whose son was very good friends with MC (lots of photos shown & stories shared etc). From what I gathered he is a very nice but more than anything, ridiculously generous and kind chap.
[b]Mr Woppit[/b] - Member
So - Why don't people like Schumacher? Is it because he kept winning all the time?
I will answer / bite
The ramming incident mentioned above meant Schumacher won the world championship instead of Hill. Schumacher had a handy lead in the last race but damaged his car in such a way as he wasnt going to be able to finish and Hill who was behind went to overtake and Schumacher rammed his car into Hill as he made the pass. The incident was investigated but the stewards waved it off (bottled it totally) as a "racing incident". That would have been a maiden world championship for Hill (fortuntaley he went on to win one). So German rams Brit to deny hi.m World Championship isn't going to win you many supporters in the UK.
The news from Grenoble seems to be more negative in the French press than the UK. It is a terrible irony that he excelled at one of the most dangeros sports there is and suffers such an injury whilst skiing. Thoughts and prayers with Schumacher and his family.
Skiing itself has proportionately fewer fatalities than cycling or swimming, says Dr Mike Langran, a GP who founded the website ski-injury.com. The figures he cites suggest that the death rate for skiing is 2.07 deaths per million people skiing, compared to 29.4 per million cycling, and 72.7 per million swimming.
Interesting stat from BBC website.
I am not worried about what he did as a driver, in his job, yet he ends up in this situation doing something that he loves.... sound potentially familiar?
As a keen skier, biker and someone that loves to see people out there pushing their limits I am wishing him all the best.
Wobbliscott - you forget the custom Bridgestone tires no one knew he/ ferrari had until recently.
And the traction control he had at Benetton...
He was good but also lucky. Had Ayrton lived he would have taken the next two championships (at least) and if Mika hadn't had his massive crash his career, while brilliant, would probably have led to more championships. Add to that he had a team mate who wasn't allowed to race him and had to pull up to let him pass on occasion, plus the infamous ramming incidents and parking the car into the armco at Monaco... That's why he's not in my top three.
Also saying Ayrton performed similar ramming incidents is a joke. Sure Ayrton was a spoilt brat but he was usually fair and as we all know the situation at Suzuka was hardly that.
French TV tonight
Impact broke helmet in two
He was skiing fast (tv images suggested he was on a fairly flat section)
Surgery didn't achieve everything hoped for (suggesting additional operation may be considered)
JCL +1
Benetton argued that although traction control (remember it was a MASSIVE advantage has shown) was found on their car- it was disabled/they couldnt afford to remove it. They were let off! Ayton was passionate about safety of others.
I wonder if one day someone within F1 will turn out some of the secrets.
DD heres one that sticks in my mind. Dodged alot of death in the early years off F1 to die 3months later
www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Hawthorn
Jackie Stewart beats them all.
It is a terrible irony that he excelled at one of the most dangeros sports there is and suffers such an injury whilst skiing. Thoughts and prayers with Schumacher and his family.
Is F1 one of the most dangerous sports there is? I know it was, but the last 18 years or so (ie post Senna)?
From what I gathered he is a very nice but more than anything, ridiculously generous and kind chap.
I recall reading a first hand account of this on here. Someone ended up attending an end of season curry or something with the UK based members of one of the teams. Schumacher unexpectedly turned up, joined then for the meal and then quietly settled the substantial bill. Something like that anyway.
Njee makes a fair point. I guess the trouble is that there isn't a very big sample - 20ish drivers, 20ish races a year is only 400 events per season. Even if we take the 20ish years since Senna that's only 8000. I expect that there are sports offering higher than 8000:1 odds of dying.
Anyway, back on topic, I hope he recovers. Sports and sporting infractions are pretty petty against real world life and death things.
Good write up from DC :
www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/motorsport/formulaone/michael-schumacher/10543292/I-only-hope-Michael-Schumacher-pulls-through-so-that-he-can-see-all-the-nice-things-people-are-saying-about-him.html
Benetton argued that although traction control (remember it was a MASSIVE advantage has shown) was found on their car- it was disabled/they couldnt afford to remove it. They were let off!
IIRC it was never proven that they used it - not sure it counts as a let-off if no-one can say you did anything wrong.
Jambalaya, did French TV give any more details of where this happened. If off piste, I guess that is the stuff that is on the RHS of maudit and comes down to the road between mottaret and Meribel?
Must have been some impact to shatter a ski helmet in two? Scary thoughts. Big debate round lunchtime table yesterday with three families where all but the 3 dads wear helmets!!!! Schu's plight plus the death of the 16year old twin in Lech pre Christmas makes you count your blessings.
He was good but also lucky. Had Ayrton lived he would have taken the next two championships (at least) and if Mika hadn't had his massive crash his career, while brilliant, would probably have led to more championships.
That's outrageously speculative.
Add to that he had a team mate who wasn't allowed to race him and had to pull up to let him pass on occasion...
Prost, I think, was the only team mate on a par with Senna, and Senna was not above vetoing his team mate if he had the power to do so. When he went to Lotus, he wouldn't let them sign Derek Warwick, I think it was.
Also saying Ayrton performed similar ramming incidents is a joke. Sure Ayrton was a spoilt brat but he was usually fair and as we all know the situation at Suzuka was hardly that
I don't know of another driver who would nerf an opponent off at 140+. Don't get me wrong, I'm a bigger fan of Senna than I am of Schumi, but I think it's unfair to suggest that Schumacher is the only driver who went over the edge of what's acceptable.
Is F1 one of the most dangerous sports there is? I know it was, but the last 18 years or so (ie post Senna)?
I spent time at a conference with [url= http://www.mark-gallagher.com/ ]Mark Gallagher (Cosworth, Red Bull, Jordan)[/url] a few years ago. As the only Brits there, we stuck together for a while. He was fascinating on the conscious decision post-Senna's death that F1 would never lose a driver racing. There had been a time when the chances of death ran at 25% - so if you made it through season 3, you retired.
But that's going OT. Much like everyone else, I hope MS pulls through this for himself and his family.
@teamhurtmore - they had video of the crash site and the helicopter leaving - it looked like a flattish/shallow area between the pistes and reasonably low down, ie definitely not up top in the couloirs. The film was credited as BFM which is a cable news company, they might have posted it online. It's 10 years since I was in Meribel so couldnt place it exactly. Its my supposition he was going quick over a flattish bit to ensure he didn't stop and has been very unlucky.
I watch french news too and they said that speed was definetly a factor in the severity of the accident . There is not as much snow as usual and 20cm fell the night before hidding rocks .