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FFS!
I'd be sent a letter if I took my kids out of school, yet they can close it a drop of a snow flake.
We have had snow since about the 17th Dec, kids off for 2 weeks holiday + another today. The staff can't get to work.
🙄
The staff can't get to work.
clue in that last statement?
apparently there is more to consider than you think, the short answer is most teachers are lazy overpaid sods. 😆
What would you do if your littleun was hurt at school/on the way home or worse due to adverse weather?
I live 1/2 an hour from work but about 600ft higher - hence we have loads of snow and work has little, think about the distance and direction that the staff come in from. Some of ours travel in from 40-50 miles away
The rest of the local authority workers manage to get in & open their buildings - it's just teachers that have inane fear of it 😉
The school I work in is Oldham, I've been told there has been 9 inches of snow overnight. I can't speak for other schools, but how can you have a school full of children if the staff may not be able to get there?
Our school is shut due to a lack of man power to make the site safe for 1200 people between snowfall and -5 ground frosts. Possibly catering supplies are held up depending on where they travel from, when 70% of people on site use the canteen you can't send children to school and possibly not have enough food to feed them?
Schools are very rarely on main roads, so access roads generally are not safe enough for the volumes of traffic to safely enter and exit without the risk of accident and half asleep kids walking out into the roads.
If anything happened to your childrens safety, or they went a day unfed I'm sure you would not be happy about that either.
To reassure you, I am actually working from home planning lessons!
I did this one a few weeks back.
The problem seems to be teachers living too far away from work. I now assume this is the reason for problems on the roads throughout winter, people depending on a commute.
Staff wont make the effort IMHO.
"sorry there will be no fire service today as bruneep cant get to work"
Hmmm I can't see me getting away with that
I'd walk to work if I have to.
sour grapes!
school is not a life and death place, fighting fire is
I think they have this recurring nightmare about being stuck in the school with the kids 😀
school is not a life and death place, fighting fire is
The local leisure centre & library always manges to get in & open
I find giving the excuse that you live too far from work very annoying. That just makes you unreliable.
A serious case of sour grapes from people who don't have a clue!
Local authorities will cancel non-essential jobs to make best use of the reduced numbers of staff they have who are able to come in. In dire circumstances (84/85 winter) police etc used 4wd's to get essential staff to work down here.
Unfortunately high class sizes and the physical size of classrooms means that after a certain number of staff drop out of skool due to bad weather there is just no way of safely looking after your loved ones, let alone teaching them anything!
The local leisure centre & library always manges to get in & open
again, completely different situations from schools, why are people on here so simple-minded?
again, completely different situations from schools
go on then - why is it harder for school staff to get in?
The local leisure centre & library always manges to get in & open
...and most of the staff there probably live quite close by. No way I would put up with minimum wage 30 miles away from home for very long! You may find that the dinner ladies live within walking distance of your kids' school, the caretaker and classroom assistants nearby too. The headteacher may live miles and miles away as those sort of jobs do not just pop up on your dorrstep. Usually the case that the more specialised the job/profession, the further away the staff might live.
There was a headmaster on the local news last night who was asked why they'd closed the school
He gave a wry smile & said he'd rather not comment
Then the situation is simply not acceptable. The day closures could ammount to weeks over winter.
And yes you are going to get Daily Maul type grief from the punters when they get the Spanish Inquisition for taking a child out of school for one day, when the real threat to our childrens education is snow.
Surely it has to be addressed.
"sorry there will be no fire service today as bruneep cant get to work"
That will leave a lot of cats stuck up trees.
go on then - why is it harder for school staff to get in?
School, you have 1000 kids turn up, normally there is 100 staff to look after them, however, of the 100, if there is a risk that a significant number won't make it in then the school can't operate, it's better, when you are talking about the safety of young people to not take that risk.
Library, so what if only 2 out of 5 staff turn up, they can open if they want to.
Leisure Centre, maybe the swimming pool will be closed but the table tennis open if only a proportion of the staff turn up, or maybe they will close at lunchtime, at least they don't have a 1000 kids to get home in the middle of the day when the weather has got worse.
You need X staff to open a school. If only 90% of X staff turn up, you can't open. If X staff turn up, but not until later in the morning, you can't open. The decison has to be made before 6:30am, so parents can make alternative arrangements.
We're open.
I guess the ride in was better Mike?
I thought you must be closed as mine is still in bed & hasn't stirred yet, I'll start making a noise - see if that annoys her
That will leave a lot of cats stuck up trees.
ever seen a cat skeleton up a tree........
I think the key point most people dont get is that someone has to decide if he/he thinks enough people will get in, if the school is open and not enough people get in they will be in trouble. If little jimmy slips over and breaks a leg when he gets to school and the school doesnt have enough staff (even if the accident was entirely little jimmy's fault and couldnt have been prevented) that person will be in serious trouble. If the kids have to be sent home and one gets run over or goes missing (to build a snowman), things get much worse for the person. If some kids and staff cannot get home and have to stay in the school the staff will kill that person.
I guess the ride in was better Mike?
Loads better. A full day of proper traffic cleared some of the ice yesterday and the off road bits had a nice layer of snow on top so much faster than yesterday.
I thought you must be closed as mine is still in bed & hasn't stirred yet, I'll start making a noise - see if that annoys her
tell her to get her arse in 😉
If schools are closed there is less people traveling, so less congestion on roads. Going to work during school holidays is much easier than going when they are not.
tell her to get her arse in
she's moving now - so I guess she has a lesson 🙂
Parents need to realise schools are not there to look after your kids for you for the day while you go off to work. Schools are there to provide a safe environment for kids to learn. Therefore if its not safe they close. Parents only moan as this then disrupts their lives and they have to take a day off work to look after their own kids.
I thought the main reason was if almost all / the majority of the kids didnt get in it was pointless ?
I remember turning up to school in the 80's and all the teachers had got in but half the pupils hadnt.
We sat around drawing pictures for a bit and were sent home around 10am - 10:30am as it pointless us being there.
The teachers could nt teach any lessons as they'd have to repeat it the next day for the rest of kids.
I thought the main reason was if almost all / the majority of the kids didnt get in it was pointless ?
Most kids, even nowadays, live reasonably close to school. Most teachers do not.
All most all the kids are within walking distance, its the teachers in their huge rural houses that won't make the effort.
Ok, so can someone explain why my sons school (private) was the only school in the area to open on the last day of term last year, when all the state schools were shut?
Same roads etc.
Well we closed ours this morning, not enough staff able to make it in to give us the normal safe staff to pupil ratios. We buy in the gritting of playground service from LA highways dept and they have run out, and don't anticipate getting us any this week. The town was gridlocked all morning but is looking to clear now. Staff who do come in from out of town run the risk of crashing on the way, and maybe getting stuck here tonight. Oh and playing in the snow is fun.
Because the parents are paying and would therefore feel that they had a right to complain? Got to keep your customer happy...
miketually - Premier MemberI thought the main reason was if almost all / the majority of the kids didnt get in it was pointless ?
Most kids, even nowadays, live reasonably close to school. Most teachers do not.
Posted 2 minutes ago # Report-Post
bruneep - Member
All most all the kids are within walking distance, its the teachers in their huge rural houses that won't make the effort.
neither of these staements are true. especially so of secondary schools.
Unfortunately parents are not a teacher's customers. People keep churning out useless kids who are simply a drain on society and someone has to turn them into something useful like call centre workers or grit spreaders (both requiring a string of NVQ's even though a trained ape could handle the job). Teacher's provide a social service not a baby sitting service plus you suckers need us to look after your kids (kids not ids although I may have been right first time) while you save up for your new plasma tele and jumbo bags of wotsits.
I got in today, half an hours drive turned into a 1 1/2 hour dance with death. School closed. Closed tomorrow too. Get in!
So the kids can have snowball fights, go sledging and build snowmen of course.
Not to mention fall through the ice on frozen lakes, to keep the firefighters busy.
I used to be a teacher so I can see this from both sides.
On the one hand the comment about the staff to kids ratio is valid... should something like a fire happen and that ratio be incorrect you're going to have a serious litigation problem but on the other hand the reason the teachers can't get in is because of the extended travel times and there's no way you'd live in your catchment area.
That said... in the office today are the people who are interested... slackers will use any excuse to have the day off to sit on their arses!
everyone knows teachers cant drive for toffee, best they stay off the roads.
why are you bothered bruneep? surely you especially know that academic qualifications are not all they are cracked up to be
neither of these [u]staements[/u] are true. especially so of secondary schools.
🙄
So you know all about my local primary school catchment area.
Wow!
surely by having kids you want to spend time with them?
having an excuse to take em sledging, build snowmen and generally mess about and have fun with them is a good thing yes?
or have i got my priorities mixed up?
"sorry there will be no fire service today as bruneep cant get to work"
surely you mean bruneeps on strike?
why are you bothered bruneep
Why? Because when I wanted to take my kids off school for a couple of days, we were threatened with legal action as it was unauthorised absence. The Truant officer or whatever PC title they have now would be coming round to visit us to tell us the error of our ways.
Yet they can close the school at the drop of a snow flake and stick DVD's on for the kids to watch the last week of term.
My sons school is closed due to the heating breaking down, so they had they had no choice, as its a special needs school it was a tough call but because they have some major work going to replace pipes what else can they do, some parents don't seem to get this and coplain to the press and local authority FFS, these things happen get over it I say.
Most kids, even nowadays, live reasonably close to school. Most teachers do not.
Just because this statement is true doesnt mean the kids will make it in.
I talking about my primary school in Lichfield in Staffordshire 99% of the kids lived within 1 mile of the school, but they still didnt come in.
Maybe less mothers worked and just fancied letting their kids have the day off. Maybe they couldnt be bother getting through the snow I dont know.
question is bruneep have you managed to get in for your sceond job as life too cushy for a firefighter with just one?
how can I when I'm stuck at home 😉
Just a quick question, I could almost defiantly make more money as a teacher in my current financial position, but there is a little devil sitting on my shoulder saying if I took that root I have failed in my profession (industrial design) and I don't want to look back when I'm old and feel unfulfilled.
Do many of you teachers have that feeling, as a few of my teaching friends appear to have gone into teaching as a "easy" choice?
That will leave a lot of cats stuck up trees.ever seen a cat skeleton up a tree........
I thought that was because if the fire service was unavailable for such calls they brought the army in.
Erm, I remember in the bad winters in the early eighties, we had normal lessons cancelled and gert big lessons in the school hall, videos (really exciting then, hardly anyone had a video recorder) etc.
Seemed to work OK without closing the school down completley
The only time I ever had a forced day off school was teacher strikes
They never closed them for snow
To be fair, it's probably different snow these days
Erm, I remember in the bad winters in the early eighties, we had normal lessons cancelled and gert big lessons in the school hall, videos (really exciting then, hardly anyone had a video recorder) etc.
Perhaps the rules on staffing ratios have changed in the last thirty years?
snow = day off from capitalism. Enjoy it for ****'s sake!
It was -10 last night, -4 currently, nearly a foot of snow on the ground, teachers travel upto 30 miles here - and the school is open...
I have a nearly 8 mile trip up a icy (upto a foot thick of ice in places) road that has not been gritted tomorrow to get to work and 1000 feet up the hill. I expect to be walking/ski-ing/borrow the quad bike but I will be at work.
.
I think as a country we have all got into travelling long journeys to work, more of us travelling and the driving (skills and sense) and preparation is not there. It has really impressed me up here how life just carries on. Yes people are finding it tough, yes some people are not in work on time etc, but most are. People are 'hitching' a ride on the school land-rover or the farmers shuttling people around in landy's or tractors on the south lochside etc, but life goes on.
Erm, I remember in the bad winters in the early eighties, we had normal lessons cancelled and gert big lessons in the school hall, videos (really exciting then, hardly anyone had a video recorder) etc.Seemed to work OK without closing the school down completley
Yeah that what I meant about doing drawing, it was dead exciting for us kids as we knew we werent doing real work. I imagine it was the same for you. But what videos were you watching ? We're you actually learning anything. I would imagine the educational content was minimal* and they might as well sent you home. Basically the school was acting like a big cresh, frankly if I was a teacher I would nt really see the point.
*although I do agree doing things out of the ordinary does have educational content what ever it is for kids, hence why you should be sent home to play in the snow even more !
ah, rules is rules eh Miketually?
believe it or not, rules can be bent [i]in extremis[/i] to make things work 🙄
Sku98 - while the educational value might be less, I think in hindsight its fair to say that the teachers and the system recognised that the kids needed to be looked after by someone, and it was their duty to look after the kids at school, rather than leaving parents up and down the country to take on the impact of last minute child care arrangements, resulting in staff not going to work, nurses phoning in unable to get to work because they had to look after their kids and the whole country grinding to a halt - the knock on effect of closing the schools is far wider than children not being able to follow the national curriculum for the day.
no school
no work
YEEEAAAAHHHHH!!!!!
Snow ball fight !!!!!!
😆
Exactly Stan!!!!!
Its Amazing how self employed people have the ability to carry out there work despite the Snow... 😉 How is that i wonder..lets think... 💡
Oh and My milk man must have a 4 b 4 milk float and snow chains on as he has never missed a bottle...he is self employed however....
Ah thats it ive got it "NO MONEY"
We all travel/commute far more than we did 20/30/40 years ago, unfortunately while the government/public likes our 'flexible' attitude, it forgets this when inconvienient truths come through - eg co2 use, travel distances etc.
I guess teachers are no different to the rest of us, there is no job-for-life and they commute further than they should because they can't take the risk of moving nearer work as it can easily 'disappear'.
And from a management point of view, you have to take the whole picture at the time - if you are below the legal/relevent levels than you have to reduce the service - irrelevent what may happen later.
This is the perfect opportunity for kids to learn some proper life skills.
All the parents who are off work should take their kids to the school and then act as teachers. They can teach them how to fight, rip off the dole, get into a car that's not theirs, identify a drug dealer down the pub, know when they've had enough (sorry this is the UK isn't it, never), how to spot a dodgy note and how to download and burn ripped videos.
Way better than them learning about media studies.
Someone mentioned above that many teachers live far away from their schools as a deliberate policy! I was a teacher and my first job was very close to where I lived. Walking distance. I had kids from my school living all around my house and it was pretty awful at times. Once the kids know where you live you have to deal with the agro that goes with it. I had a young family. It was crap for us all. After that first year I left that school and got a job 8 miles away. Our lives improved dramatically.
They have just closed my sons school in Redditch, will be closed tomorrow as well, no buses running due to having about 2" of snow in an hour, how the **** are we supposed to just drop everything and collect the kids asap from the school office. The snow has stopped there now as well 🙄
Why are schools closed when there's the first sign of snow? That's easy!
Headteachers, just like any other person, switch on their TVs in the morning only to be bombarded with frothy emotive comments from ligthweight overpaid journalists, who'll bang on all day about a problem that actually doesn't exist. Journalists whip everyone up into an uneccessary panic. Shame on them!
The headteacher, scared by the notion that members of staff may not be able to get to work without risk of death, injury, or hypothermia, playing by the litigation fearing (welcoming) local authority policy, he/she has to play uber safe. The school is closed and millions of pounds is wasted on people not getting to work because they have to look after their kids.
Solution: Sweep away the pathetic news reporting one finds on channels like News 24 and then sit down with the council bosses and suggest a different approach to litigation - as in the private sector, fight a case, don't roll over.
Local authorities are happy to payout council tax payer's money because there's plenty more where that came from!! If councils had to generate business and didn't have money coming to them come what may, they'd understand it's value and would therefore do everything they can to hang on to the stuff.
Mark - Resident GrumpySomeone mentioned above that many teachers live far away from their schools as a deliberate policy! I was a teacher and my first job was very close to where I lived. Walking distance. I had kids from my school living all around my house and it was pretty awful at times. Once the kids know where you live you have to deal with the agro that goes with it. I had a young family. It was crap for us all. After that first year I left that school and got a job 8 miles away. Our lives improved dramatically.
Just wait until the STW'ers find out where you live.............
Don't blame teachers or the head, blame councils!!
[i]Its Amazing how self employed people have the ability to carry out there work despite the Snow... [/i]
The ones here didn't, they all came back after five minutes carrying their tools having abandoned their van.
[i]Don't blame teachers or the head, blame councils!! [/i]
Blame Council's insurance companies, bloody private sector.
Schools are closed by the local authority - NOT by teachers!!
Parents don't like it when the cheap child minding service is withdrawn. I think schools are closed when safety of the pupils may be compromised and NOT because teachers can't get to work.
[i]"They have just closed my sons school in Redditch, will be closed tomorrow as well, no buses running due to having about 2" of snow in an hour, how the **** are we supposed to just drop everything and collect the kids asap from the school office."[/i] - exactly one of the reasons to close the school!!!
Really just comes down to baby sitting hassle though doesn't it?? Not a lot of mention of missed education so far!
Schools are closed by the local authority - NOT by teachers!
So eldest son academy school is open, but youngest primary school is closed? They are less 1 mile apart. Same local authority.
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bruneep - Memberwhy are you bothered bruneep
Why? Because when I wanted to take my kids off school for a couple of days, we were threatened with legal action as it was unauthorised absence. The Truant officer or whatever PC title they have now would be coming round to visit us to tell us the error of our ways.
Yet they can close the school at the drop of a snow flake and stick DVD's on for the kids to watch the last week of term.
Posted 1 hour ago # Report-Post
That would only happen if your kids had triggered a level where they have x unauthorised absences and you had used up "holidays". Are your kids sickly or are you shit at writing absence notes?
bruneep - MemberSchools are closed by the local authority - NOT by teachers!
So eldest son academy school is open, but youngest primary school is closed? They are less 1 mile apart. Same local authority.
Are academies not controlled by the business that has invested in it rather than the authority?
No bin man for 3 weeks, no postman for a week, no milk man for a week - all because of snow. Slag them off instead!!
Are academies not controlled by the business that has invested in it rather than the authority?
Scottish academies are local authority run = Secondary school
Schools are closed by the local authority - NOT by teachers!!
Sorry, that's incorrect, it's the head teacher's decision.
[i]Are academies not controlled by the business that has invested in it rather than the authority?[/i]
Which is quite often a church and since snow can be considered an act of god, it's their fault!
Headteachers can only close a school with the approval of the local authority. Here in the Borders all schools were closed to pupils today by the local authority while staff were expected to attend.
ah, rules is rules eh Miketually?believe it or not, rules can be bent in extremis to make things work
Chile protection/safety rules?