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1/2p has been utter garbage since his injury.
Hook returning to Ospreylia???
@aa my thoughts are he is not right physically.
@namaste fly-halfs Sexton and Ford (only 2 taken last time) ... lots of choices at 12. That's not impossible.
Given that Farrell went as a 10 last time, and realistically.... You could only make a case for Ford and Sexton ahead of him....I reckon that barring injury he's pretty certain to be on the tour.
Interesting to see what happens with bonus points.....last weekend in 14/15 (I think) when points difference was crucial we didn't half see a lot of points scored! Part of me thinks that they'll mainly affect games involving Italy though.
What has Sexton actually done recently to make him a nailed on test starter?
Hook back to Ospreylia would be good, they need a 15 and a 10 for when Biggar and Sammy Davies Junior are with Wales.
As dor Wales I think they should be looking at Patchel at 12 we need a centre who can pass.
If Russell has a good 6N he will make the plane. Bearing in mind the head injury he isn't that long back from, he is progressing very well.
Cips?
An in form attacking 10 "rested" from international duties?
I wouldn't bet against Gatland taking him tbh. He's less boring than Farell, kicks better than Ford, and does have a "Lions" spirit. Just don't take him down the pub.
I wouldn't bet against Gatland taking him
I would. £20 to charity of the winners choice (as long as its not UKips).
Russel,Farrel and Sexton would be my picks for outside half. Faz can also play 12 so will be useful on tour. Then pick 3 centres, 3 Wings and 3 fullbacks 1 of whom can cover wing too so Loopy Liam or Maitland.
^I'd be happy with that. Not seen much of Russel recently....I think he'll need a good 6n's to be in contention.
Who's favourite to be captain? Going by that 'has to be a nailed on test starter' rule, Murray?! He's about the only 100% certainty IMO, can't see him as captain though. If AWJ picks up some form next spring I reckon it'll be him.
Captain is tough maybe Best, maybe Itoje.
BBC reporting that Townsend turned down the opportunity to coach with Gatland on the Lions tour.
Can't help thinking that they'd benefit from an attack minded coach like him.
I think Best will be captain. Or Gavin Henson.
Hey the Lions will have Howley as attack coach!! Whats the problem.
Townsend would have been asking for a month off a week after starting the Scotland gig. Also the way he played is totally different to his approach as a coach. In Howley we trust!
Anyone who doesn't regard Farrell as a very. very good player has a fundamental lack of understanding of the game.
He is the starting 10 for the best team in europe.
Whether Gats will tour him is a different manner altogether, but to call him boring is [i]miles[/i] wide of the mark.
I had him down as a "coached" play by numbers player, but he's developed into far more than that. He's bloody brilliant nowadays as is pretty plain to see who know what they're looking at.
Just because Farrell is the starting 10 for the best team in Europe doesn't make him the best fly half in Europe.
He's a very decent player and a fine competitor, no doubt, but if he didn't kick at 85-90% would he be in there? If EJ thought he was England's best 10 - surely he'd be playing there?
If you removed place kicking from the equation he's not as good as Biggar, Sexton, Ford, Russell or even Cipriani.
However, as you can't remove place kicking totally from the equation, he's worth his place. But he's no Dan Carter.
Just because Farrell is the starting 10 for the best team in Europe doesn't make him the best fly half in Europe.
I didn't even remotely suggest he was.
If you removed place kicking from the equation he's not as good as Biggar, Sexton, Ford, Russell or even Cipriani.
Respectfully, that's rubbish.
I've never been a Farrell fan, but he does seem to have added a bit more attack to his game. As it stands, he's done pretty damn well as a makeshift 12. He's still young so has plenty of time to keep tweaking his game.
I think he'll make the lions because he can cover 10 and 12 and has a good kicking percentage.
If you removed place kicking from the equation he's not as good as Biggar, Sexton, Ford, Russell or even Cipriani.Respectfully, that's rubbish.
I know for starters Biggars kicking is at least as good as Faz. Faz has improved a great deal in the last few years, he is certainly a better 10 than Biggar now and Cipriani is not international class. Ford still doesnt convince me but could be a better player soon but he still gets his hand held too much.
Sexton is the best 10 by far in th the NH with Farrell and BIggar on the same level. Farrell is simplyu too slow between the ears to be a very top 10. What he does is fine - its what he doesn't do that folk do not see. He is not capable of the sublime touches of the others mentioned - even Russell is a better attacking 10 but too flaky to risk for the lions yet
Sexton for me. Biggar / Ford as back up. Farrell only goes as a utility back / 3rd ten if at all.
Sexton is the best 10 by far in th the NH
Sexton is too injury prone now and hasnt played at his best for some time. Sad but true
Sexton for me. Biggar / Ford as back up. Farrell only goes as a utility back / 3rd ten if at all.
We agree TJ 😉 (Sexton/Ford are the first choice imo)
Farrell isn't even the best 12 in England, he plays for his goal kicking and experience. Lions probably don't need either. Gatland only took 2 10's last time and could do so again as attrtion elsewhere will be high on an NZ tour
If you take 2 10's and one is Sexton you are ****ed!! Especially if the other is Ford who cannot be trusted to goal kick or punt for touch.
I know for starters Biggars kicking is at least as good as Faz. Faz has improved a great deal in the last few years, he is certainly a better 10 than Biggar now and Cipriani is not international class. Ford still doesnt convince me but could be a better player soon but he still gets his hand held too much.
Quite right. Not to mention that farrell is a more effective defender than Ford and Sexton and cipriani put together.
I seem to remember TJ telling us that Sir Johnny was shit too!
Never a huge wilkinson fan - again what he did was great and a great kicker - but not able to put the backs outside of him into space with sublime passing in the way real top tens do. Fortunately Englnd at the time didn't use the outside backs much. wilko was always best with a playmaker outside him
If Farrell had a Will Greenwood playing outside him then you would all be hailing him as the Messiah. Wilkinson was a fantastic kicker but a limited passer of the ball, certainly in his England days.
The problem with Russel and sexton is they will be heavily targeted.
Watching them play is like watching "escape to victory" except rarely do the goodies win.
Russell won't be going on the lions. too soon after the head injury, not enough time playing. Unless he has a fantastic six nations of course. He is not the sort of player Gatland likes anyway. Too mercurial ( flaky?)
Glad Townsend turned down the lions. Again not the sort of chap to work well with Gatland and I would rather he concentrated on Scotland
I'll say it again - if Farrell didn't kick at 85-90% he wouldn't be in any of these teams.
Actually England played some good 15 man rugby under Woodward and JW got a great backline moving very well. He had no pace but pretty much everything else.
I'll say it again - if Farrell didn't kick at 85-90% he wouldn't be in any of these teams.Actually England played some good 15 man rugby under Woodward and JW got a great backline moving very well. He had no pace but pretty much everything else.
....because under Jones (with Farrell at 12) our backs haven't had a sniff of the ball and tries are none existent?!
Dudley phillips dear god what have you been smoking?
Another Phillips had an evening to forgot at the AJ Bell tonight! I had free tickets.....thankfully i couldn't find anyone to go with so stayed at home!
That young fullback sale have is bloody good though!
Never a huge wilkinson fan
And as for that Carter bloke... 😀
Check out the video here at 56s for the most bizare reffing decision ever!
http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/38170449
I didn't like it or partake but mike phillips was jeered off the pitch last night. Stringer came on at at 39 showed how it should be done but we were well beaten in every aspect. Battered by the forwards and clueless in the backs. A few hours wasted. As a ST holder for the last 6 years that ranks as one of the poorest home games I have seen.
@aa I assume you are talking about the collision ?
Phillips. Nothing negative written on Planet Rugby, why was he so bad ?
His speed out of the ruck is glacial. I thought Cussiter in his final season was slow.
I watched it; thankfully from a comfy sofa with the wood burner on. I thought from that Phillips is bolwn. He looked tired and disinterested.
His speed out of the ruck is glacial.
I was shouting at the TV! Get the ****ing thing out! MacGinty was screaming for quick ball and MP stolls over, looks a bit, looks a bit more, puts his paws on the ball, looks again then telegraphs the most obvious pass he can make!
And he'll still likely make the lions with gatland picking.
Not sure I agree with the Cips comments. Not international class - but is Ford? Ford has to have a kicker in the team otherwise he's only 50% of a ten. Having said that, England use the FB (Webb?) many years ago as well as whats-his-face.
Cips may be all round more "average" than Farrell in Defense, but kicks better than Ford, is not always as flat as Ford can be, but has more attacking intent as runner. IMO he offers more indecisiveness to the oppo's team. He's more of a "one stop" 10 than Ford or Farrell currently, but fair play Farrell is developing into Gitaeu V2.
It all depends on whether Gats wants to play an all round 10 or place specalist kickers around the park - and with the players mentioned - Farrell, 1/2p at the very least there's plenty of those to go with the Lions.
Hmm, maybe I've talked myself away from Cips, who of course would also need some man-management attention from the coach which may be a distraction they don't want.
Johnathon Webb used to be the goal kicker in his day? As it stands I think Ford has more chance of improving his kicking than Farrell has of improving his 10 play. I do not believe Gatland will play Farrell for his goal kicking in the way England do. Gatland will find another solution.
Farrell vs Giteau is a very lop sided comparison imo
England's full back was the place kicker for many years, Simon Hodgkinson, Dusty Hare, Simon Webb, Alaistair Hignell etc.
aa I assume you are talking about the collision
Yeah, how can that try have stood. Both players were on their arse before the ball landed but in Dudley Phillips world if the player wasnt looking where he was going it doesnt matter if he takes out the full back..dire dire ref the Joke12 has plumbed new depths!!
Phillips is way past his best and even then having a rapid delivery wasnt a strength!! Stringer may be older but his game has been somewhat less attritional!!!
Farrell vs Giteau is a very lop sided comparison imo
It wasn't a comparison - I'm suggesting Jones is aiming to have a Gitaeu -a-like in the centre's and is moulding Farrell to that role. Of course, Daly can provide that more naturally.
Just an aside - anyone notice that Jamie George's stats (scores, carries, tackles) are better than Hartley's despite limited time on the pitch?
Moving on - predictions for England V Aus? I think either could shade this. Aus are improving, England are down some first choice players but still a good team, are playing at home but have a leaky defense. Hughes & Kruis need big games, and I think Englands bench may just have the final word. Farrell needs to make all his kicks and the ref could make the difference. Edge of your seat stuff?
Thats all from me as I avoid any form of social media until I return from seeing Santa with the kids and watch it 2 hours after the fact... 😐
England should mash them.
England Aus could see an upset, Aus will want to show well and have nothing to lose really. They can afford to take a lot of risks, I could see them playing a very open game.
How we are only 3 pts down at HT I'll never know.
The ref being a masdive homer is helping. England drop at least 2 scrums on their own put in which he let go and Vunipola rolling about offside led to the Joseph try.
May really has pace to burn
Aus have been raped by this ref!
Oh and Browns acting better than his rugby by far!!
Comfortable in the end and great character to come back after such a poor start. 13-0 for the year is pretty impressiv
Ford needs to work with JW on his goal kicking, horrible first effort and then dodged another two.
arsebisuits! I checked the TV schedule and it said 6pm.
So Ive been planning around sitting down and watching the match. And now my twitter feed is full of the result as apparently the match was on this afternoon!
f******** TV schedules!
😀
i was imaging you enjoying that AA!!!
😉
Brilliant performance and year
Wakey wakey and .... boom.
Unbeaten all year, stronger offf the bench, 2017 6n champs for sure. 😀
I too thought that we were a bit lucky with the ref, and certainly lucky to be within 3 at half time.
Game was won in the forwards in the second 40 though pure and simple.....can't remember Aus winning many collisions at all in the second half. Bodes well for England....How well is Ben Young's playing currently?!
2017 6n champs for sure
Got ireland away havent you? That will be a massive game.
It is. But we'll have several of the 1/2 team first team players we are missing back, id suspect we'd be the measure of them, although id predict a similar game to todays - ireland up in the first half England to dominate the second.
Hard to pick a poor England performance today. Hartley rhe worst of rhe best?
Indeed it will AA.
Australia came to win today, and started superbly. In some facets, the Aussies are amazing, but allround we have now bettered them 4/4. Not to be sniffed at. Considering 5 of the starters weren't first choice at the start of the campaign, it speaks well for our depth.
What has happened to Wales? Is it just a lack of form to key players at the same time, or is their star on the wane? Weren't they 6N favourites last year, with Eng underdogs in their first match v Scotland? What a difference a year makes.
With Eng & Ire looking very strong, and France starting to play good rugby again, it should be an interesting 6N this year, especially with the spice of a Lions tour up for grabs.
Don't peak to early 😆
What has happened to Wales?
Coach has ****ed off for a year and the team has regressed whilst others have improved.
The best thing about this England squad is they haven't played a complete game yet. At some point they are going to destroy someone. Every game I've seen has left massive areas for improvement, and inexplicable simple errors.
To get through this Autumn series, missing key players, playing a whole game with 14, starting poorly against Aus, yet remaining unbeaten, will be a huge confidence boost. Jones is certainly improving players. Yarde today played the best game I've seen for England. Youngs has come on leaps and bounds since he had his sweeties taken away. Lawes is back to his form of a few years back. The whole team looks really fit.
england were somewhat flattered by the scoreline given that two of their tries were dubious and on another day could have been ruled out.
Still - a win is a win
In other news both Glasgow and Edinburgh lost 🙁
England are probably the favorites for the 6N, but as said above Ireland away with the way they have been playing is going to be a massive game. I just hope its dry and allows for fun rugby (never thought I would say that about england - normally hope for a mudfest)
Will take that win. The first 20 were rubbish; they were out of the blocks so quickly, I started to fear the worst.
The forwards are looking good, even missing Itoje, Brand H and Billy. Lawes had a very good game and stepped up big time. Kreisler was very impressive given how long hechas been away injured. Wood did pretty well. Hughes had a good game but doesn't have the same power as Billy.
Thought the backs were a mixed bag; Brown and Yarde look a bit squiffy. JJ had a great game, T'eo made an impact. Ford needs to work on his goal kicking because it's rubbish. His passing and tactical kicks are good though. Youngs looks a lot fitter and is in cracking form.
Looking forward to the 6N. Ireland will be right up there and play such an accurate game, not conceding too many penalties etc. It's too early for predictions though because there's a lot of rugby to be played so injuries will have their say.
Ford needs to work on his goal kicking and catching because it's rubbish
FIFY
Yarde and Brown were all at see defending out wide.
See how many make the Lions squad that's a true indication of where they are ; Billy V, Mako,Maro,Hartley,Brown,JJ,Farrell -anyone else ? Haskell basically begged Gatland for a spot live on tele but he's not even the best flanker at Wasps.....
Youngs will definitely be going on the Lions tour if he keeps up this form. Ditto Lawes. Agree a_a that Yarde and Brown looked pretty ropey in defence....I must say that I'm really starting to warm to Jonny May, he's in great form and looks so much more solid defensively than anyone else in the backline.
Can't believe that the Saints management team are saying that North wasn't knocked out. He looked out of it after landing. It feels like he was kept on the pitch because they hoped he could win them the match. Their interests and not his now they're so desperate to win.
Video
https://mobile.twitter.com/DavejMurph/status/805129685558587392
Looks awful. George claims he lay still as worried about his neck.
Why did North leap so high with the ball? I'll probably get flamed here, but I think he was buying a penalty for being tackled in the air, or at the very least stopping the defender tackling him.
Removing dangerous tackles is a noble aim, but the defender (Williams?) suddenly found his target 3 feet in the air at the last minute.
Why did North leap so high with the ball?
Er he didnt leap with the ball he jumped to catch it so he could like you know play rugby!
Looked to me suspiciously like North was lying still because he was knocked out. Reminds me of the article that Topsy Ojo wrote upon retirement.
Looks knocked out to me.
Not sure what the defender could have done, North has jumped up but mostly laterally (ie along) with his knees up to protect himself (act offensively ?). If the defender had stood still with his arms behind his back North would have hit him whilst still in the air. Probably kneed him in the head.
A dangerous situation but one which North is 40% (?) responsible for
The indent in the turf shows that was a big impact with the ground, he must have been knocked out, he went limp as he landed.
A dangerous situation but one which North is 40% (?) responsible for
Which is why he got yellow carded....oh hang on you're talking shit again
A dangerous situation but one which North is 40% (?) responsible for
Eh? How did you figure that one out? Ah, yes: Victim blaming. Therefore, I assume you think players who have been spear-tackled are also partially to blame? How dare they be on a field of rugby and try and play rugby. They deserve everything they get. B******s
If the defender had stood still the outcome would have been much the same. We where all taught to jump to catch the ball and to bring your knees up to "protect" yourself / knee the other guy in the head / intimidate him. I played on the wing.
A spear tackle is where you are picked up and driven into the ground. Completely different @mikey
EDIT: Given the history it looks, sadly, very much like North has a problem. I didn't see how long he was down for but he should have some proper scans done.