Smokescreen again to distract from failed policies?
Given Goldsmith was a Johnson loyalist god knows which of them is lying.
Quite possible Goldsmith got the choice of apologise or get sacked and chose to resign with maximum damage.
Then again Sunak trying to make good of the resignation is also plausible.
Timing does give a bit more credence to Sunak but not something I would put money on.
As for Rishi's big announcement today, am I right in thinking that he's essentially saying
"if we win the next election then at some indeterminate point in the future, we'll definitely put some money into actually training some healthcare workers, honest!"
I suppose they'll be to staff Johnsons 40 new hospitals?
Mythical staff for imaginary hospitals? I'm sure that'll be a vote winner
So his pitch is this time you really can trust us with the NHS, honest... Yeah, sure.
Goldsmith now saying he didn't refuse to apologise!
Given the disputes over pay in the NHS, will they be increasing salaries to attract these new workers? How many of these new recruits will be replacing existing vacancies/people that leave in the meantime? It'll be like the mythical 40 hospitals where they included revamps to existing ones
Backing himself into a corner… clearly scared of any scrutiny now…
https://twitter.com/benkentish/status/1674747356221194241?s=21
Sue Gray now cleared by ACOBA to start job with Labour in September – ho ho, rish!
But Dowden is depserately trying to organise a vote to declare she broke the rules, cant get much more petty than that
pretty obvious Sunak has lost control of his party, hes floundering badly
https://twitter.com/implausibleblog/status/1674793513870045189
we've still got another 18mth??!!? of this government to run
A 15 year plan for the NHS is a great idea. We should probably always have a 15 year plan for the NHS. It's just, introducing it when your party's been in power for 13 years slightly misses the point.
It's just something to talk about on the doorsteps and in interviews when confronted with the fact that the NHS is being run down into oblivion. Something you don't have to deliver for 15 years, with no measurable outcomes, is perfect for electioneering when you just need something to make it look like you're fixing stuff.
Fortunately he's given us the five-point plan which does have measurable outcomes and deadlines, none of which are going to be delivered in time to help him.
Classic jam tomorrow.
"No, honestly, vote for us in the next election and this time I definitely will sort out <insert issue we haven't fixed in over a decade>, I promise"
How can they possibly think that anyone believes them anymore???
The proposals are being ripped apart already, mainly about the fast-tracking and apprentice ideas. We may have 'more' doctors and nurses but they'll be undertrained and essentially crap.
Just think, if they had launched this plan on going into government, we could all be enjoying the results already, and only 18 months from its completion...(obviously, they would have had a chance to ditch the unworkable and unsafe stuff too).
Fortunately, they chose to do SFA instead (apart from introducing austerity, failing to keep staff pay in line with inflation, cutting us off from one of main sources of staff, and failing to prepare for a global pandemic.)
What do the tories do next?
The 15-20 odd poll deficit seems to be baked in now
None of their policies are achievable within 18months - there's not even much sense to anything they come up with
Do they try a leadership change-
At this point what do they have to lose?
This thread sums it up better
https://twitter.com/Sime0nStylites/status/1674727386070351872?t=arZeI6keJau5kvrc36HfWA&s=19
What do the tories do next?
The 15-20 odd poll deficit seems to be baked in now
Not much they can do, after 12 years of complete crap from them people have eventually sussed it out (11 years too late but never mind). However, Labour won't win by the amount suggested in the polls and the media will be out in force to attack everything they can con Starmer/Labour starting 6 months before the election which will narrow their lead.
What do the tories do next?
Free gladitorial combat and public executions
What do the tories do next?
Breathe a huge sigh of relief that Keir Starmer will be the next prime minister until their inevitable return?
They really have very little to fear. Unless you can think of something?
We haven't got a clue what Starmer will do have we as he changes his mind every 5 minutes, unfortunately every time in the wrong direction but maybe he will run out of going the wrong way and start to come back the right way?
Everyone who keeps banging on about Starmer is missing the point, we're a centre right country, the Tories have moved too far to the right and ended up in loony land. Starmer has seen the opportunity and has moved in to seize the ground the Tories have vacated. It's a shrewd move if you want to get elected. It might not be the screaming left wing, power to the people Labour the usual suspects in here want but it probably is what the majority of voters wants. Shame he doesn't have a bit more charisma.
Who knows what he'll do in power, I guess the first term will just be trying to stabilise the shift storm he's inherited. After that it will be slow and boring repair which we have 25 years of to get the cost of living back inline with real world wages. No politician is going to try the radical solutions the left want. The public proved that don't want that approach when Corbyn tried.
Anyway back on topic, there's nothing the Tories can do, the best they can hope for is 18 months of not shooting themselves in the foot and that won't happen with the remains of Johnson's legacy still throwing hand grenades from the side lines.
....maybe he will run out of going the wrong way and start to come back the right way?
Redistribution of wealth? Nationalisation of the utilities and commanding heights of the economy? Reversal of 40 years of neoliberalism?Withdrawal from NATO? Further devolved regional power and abolition of FPTP?
I think the Tories are as confident as I am that nothing like that will happen.
Edit: I am sure the Tories are confident that even this stuff on Starmer's website won't be implemented:
https://keirstarmer.com/plans/10-pledges/
The public proved that don’t want that approach when Corbyn tried.
Corbyn, it always comes back to Corbyn, doesn't it? Whether it is a Tory or a right-wing "Labour" supporter there is always the need to mention Corbyn to justify changing nothing and maintaining the status quo.
Yes it is strange how voters weren't particularly enthralled by the thought of having a Labour PM who was constantly being attacked on a daily basis by Labour MPs and accused of being a racist.
Despite the fact that Corbyn's first left-wing radical election manifesto in 2017 achieved the greatest increase in Labour support since 1945 and robbed the Tories of their majority.
Everyone who keeps banging on about Starmer is missing the point, we’re a centre right country, the Tories have moved too far to the right and ended up in loony land.
For the last few years we have been a centre right country in many ways.
But fiscally the state gets called on time and time again to prop and support the private sector, which can't exist without the state.
When times are good - low interest rates, liquidity, jobs etc everyone's trying to protect their capital - when times are duff we look to the state for a solution.
We are moving away from one economic model since the pandemic (and probably before) so people had probably do well to understand that things are changing and being centre right will likely come back to bite them certainly economically as victims are naturally gobbled up.
Also Starmer perhaps would do well offering solutions to the Tory disease if he wants to change things. There are plenty of things to shout about, and to fix - that might just be a catalyst.
Be the change you want to be and all that otherwise what's the point of screaming at Tory policy?
Running similar economic decisions from both parties have led us to where we are - hardly an endorsement for centre right solutions.
greatest increase in Labour support since 1945 and robbed the Tories of their majority.
Against the Maybot and they still didnt win and then Boris rolls up and annihilates Labour. And oh boohoo poor little Corbs, its so unfair, its not his fault. Dealing with the right wing press is something left wing Labour politicians have to deal with. Corbyn didnt, he utterly failed to get his message across to the voters, he was absebt and unrelatable for most and tgats on him. We all have to work in the world as it is not how we'd like it to be.
For the last few years we have been a centre right country in many ways.
As far as the electorate are concerned its been a lot longer than that, hence all the Tory governments since the war.
Against the Maybot and they still didnt win and then Boris rolls up and annihilates Labour
You are totally obsessed about Jeremy Corbyn, aren't you? And on a thread about Rishi Sunak!
As I said the go to tactic for Tories and Labour right-wingers when all else fails is to mention Jeremy Corbyn.
No party won the 2017 general election. It was called, totally unnecessarily, because people like you kept banging on that Labour didn't stand a chance, and Theresa May believed the hype.
Tories and Labour right-wingers had better luck 2 years later after Starmer had managed to convince/bully Corbyn in supporting a second EU referendum.
But well done you for giving all the credit to Boris Johnson's masterful political expertise and his ability to "annihilate" Labour.
Even though Labour managed to get a larger share of the vote in 2019 than it did under both Ed Miliband and Gordon Brown - it was the collapse of the LibDem vote and first-past-the-post arithmetic which gave the Tories such a disproportionately good result.
Obviously Jeremy Corbyn being a weak obsessively woke leader who tried to appease the extreme remainers did absolutely nothing to help.
Against the Maybot and they still didnt win and then Boris rolls up and annihilates Labour.
Yeah but he did achieve the second largest increase in left-handed Labour voters who don't like pickles, or something.
Everyone who keeps banging on about Starmer is missing the point, we’re a centre right country,
You keep claiming this but its not supported by the voting results. It only works under FPTP hence why the hard right media shit themselves at any thought of electoral reform since they know anything other than FPTP doesnt favour them.
Starmer has seen the opportunity and has moved in to seize the ground the Tories have vacated. It’s a shrewd move if you want to get elected
It relies on all the existing labour voters not deciding that a party occupying that ground doesnt represent them. Hence why we have all the more right wing labour shouting about a vote against the glorious leader is a vote for tories.
Despite the centrists gammon like view that they are the silent majority they really arent. They are a minority who have an outsize influence under the current voting system.
Its also badly flawed from a strategic viewpoint. We have already seen how chasing the tories (or republicans) turns out. If you "seize the ground" then its a victory for them since now it sets the baseline further right.
Yeah but he did achieve the second largest increase in left-handed Labour voters who don’t like pickles, or something.
And don't forget Jew hating racists, they were queuing up to vote Labour.
Everyone who keeps banging on about Starmer is missing the point, we’re a centre right country,
Perhaps England is, Scotland is not
Perhaps the regions are, London is not
kimbers
Full MemberWhat do the tories do next?
Smash steal and burn as much as they can before the next election then plan a comfortable exit for the next 1 or 2 terms til they can get back in and blame everything on Labour.
Seriously, the only saving grace for hte country is that they don't quite seem to have gone into "we are definitely going to lose" mode.
Smash steal and burn as much as they can before the next election then plan a comfortable exit for the next 1 or 2 terms til they can get back in and blame everything on Labour.
This is the way*
*Of FPTP.
“We’ve got to get far tougher on those university courses that are simply not paying their way, because we are spending your money to subsidise these courses, which are not producing the goods for people, right?
“So it’s great news for the universities largely full of, you know, people who don’t vote for us anyway.”
Tougher means cut the funding and make more students pay back more. That’ll teach those university educated but without substantial means types for not voting for Sunak’s party and Brexit.
....for not voting for Sunak’s party and Brexit.
Does he mention brexit? I saw his reference to "not voting for us" but I couldn't see any reference to brexit, which would be strange to say the least.
Perhaps the regions are, London is not
The interesting thing is that Labour is massively popular in London with recently a 40% lead over the Tories, double the national average:
However Sadiq Khan, the Labour mayor, doesn't match that level of popularity. In the last mayoral elections Sadiq Khan only managed to get less than 5% more than Shaun Bailey his Tory rival.
And Shaun Bailey was widely considered to be a particularly bad candidate for the Tories to choose. Many thought that the Tories didn't bother with a more serious and capable candidate because they knew that they really didn't stand a chance.
Today despite Labour having a 40% lead over the Tories in London half of Londoners believe that their Labour mayor is doing a bad job:
Obviously Labour wants to blame the current Tory government for Sadiq Khan's lack of popularity :
A Labour source said: “The Tories have delivered over a decade of austerity and continue to hold London back.
But for me it suggests that Labour politicians are not actually popular with voters.
It would appear imo that it is intense dislike of the Tories which is the primary reason for Labour's huge lead, and very little indeed to do with Labour politicians.
Which voters are popular with the voter, not many I would think. People vote for the party not the MP the majority of the time otherwise how could you ever explain people actually voting for the likes of Mogg, Dorries (the list goes on).
I vote green but I don't even know anything about the person I am voting for and whether they would do a better job for the constituency than the tory candidate. I don't want a tory government so I don't vote for the tory candidate.
That doesn't explain why Labour has a 40% lead over the Tories in London when Londoners are asked how they would vote in a general election, but only a 8% lead over the Tories when Londoners are asked how they would vote in a mayoral election:
https://www.onlondon.co.uk/poll-sadiq-khan-leads-london-mayor-2024-election-race/
For me the difference is that the mayoral poll focuses on an individual Labour politician. The Tories do remarkably well in that poll considering that they haven't even chosen their candidate!
It seems that anti-Tory sentiments taper off significantly in London when voters are asked to focus on Labour's most important London politician.
Edit; Depending on who they choose as a candidate it is quite feasible for the Tories to win next year's London mayoral election (Shaun Bailey only got 5% less than Sadiq Khan) which would be remarkable considering how deeply unpopular the Tories are in London.
This is precisely what concerns me over the next GE. General elections have more correlation to the leader's popularity than the party's. There's a lot of hubris over labour's expected results and we're a long way out from an election yet.
What’s the average age of a voter considering voting Tory? Well, here’s a genius campaign move to win them over and get them out to vote for you…
https://twitter.com/politlcsuk/status/1675224081447243781?s=21
For me the difference is that the mayoral poll focuses on an individual Labour politician. The Tories do remarkably well in that poll considering that they haven’t even chosen their candidate!
It seems that anti-Tory sentiments taper off significantly in London when voters are asked to focus on Labour’s most important London politician.
Maybe people don't care so much about the party the mayor represents as the party that is in power in the country. Or they really don't like Sadiq.
Has Dorries actually resigned then?
Of course she hasn't. What's even more surprising is that the Tories favourite sexual deviant Chris Pincher is still an MP.
God it's like bloody Eastenders, don't watch it for a week, come back and you have no idea whats going on, hahah!