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My head is an English teacher…
Once more into the breach, dear friends, once more.
Or fill up the wall with English dead.
As a teacher I find the guidelines pretty clear. The problem is the heads on schools are twisting the wording in the guidelines to get out of distancing measures.
Dont blame teachers if/when this causes a spike in cases. It's not our fault. Its management not following the guidelines and putting an unsafe amount of kids in our classrooms. 30cm between seats with no masks is not safe.
The problem is the heads on schools are twisting the wording in the guidelines to get out of distancing measures.
Do you mean the head of one of your local schools (or even the school you teach in) is twisting the wording in the guidelines to get out of distancing measures?
FWIW. I haven't yet heard from my head on masks. As is usually the case I suspect he is taking the time to consult the trust (who have a good history of a welfare first approach regardless of government guidance) and his SLT before making any decision.
Do you mean the head of one of your local schools (or even the school you teach in) is twisting the wording in the guidelines to get out of distancing measures?
Today they said there will be no social distancing in the classrooms and no reduced class sizes. No masks to be work either. I wouldn't want my kids there.
To be brutal, that's just following the government guidance. In the absence of firm national leadership, with schools deliberately left to their own devices, there are bound to be inconsistencies and poor decisions.
We got our policy today. We are not currently in a high risk area but staff can wear masks at all times if they choose to (the school would prefer visors and will supply these), including classrooms. Students can opt to wear masks in communal areas but not in classrooms but at the moment it's not compulsory for them. Not the way I would have gone if it was my decision, but a reasonable middle ground on top of our other mitigation policies and procedures.
Just because a school or college is in a low risk area doesn't mean all staff and all students are travelling from low risk areas.
It only takes 1 carrier...
We've had some interesting discussion today around what happens if a pupil or staff member gets a negative test result. Initially the school policy* was to say 'come straight back, whole family ends self isolation'. Then I pointed out the relatively high and very variable rate of false negative results and the fact that other members of the family might still have it. So now we're going to say something along the lines of 'come back if you're not experiencing covid symptoms and no one else in the family is self isolating etc'. Still not perfect but a bit less likely to result in infectious individuals coming back to school.
*And therein lies the real, problem, why are individual schools making this kind of public health decision? With the best will in the world it's well outwith our experience and mistakes will be made. Where will the buck stop?
This is Scotland btw.
Comments removed I've already been warned by hq Comms for speaking the truth.
*And therein lies the real, problem, why are individual schools making this kind of public health decision? With the best will in the world it’s well outwith our experience and mistakes will be made. Where will the buck stop?
This is Scotland btw.
And there's the rub.
Doesn't matter whether it's Scotland, England, Wales or wherever. The people now put in the position of making these calls are (with the best will in the world) ill-equipped to do so. Unless you happen to have a head who is a science teacher with a Masters/PhD in Virology. Much as I respect them, my head is a PE/Geography teacher...
The DfE strike again!
New guidelines published at 7.30 on a Friday evening. Bank Holiday weekend with many schools already back anyway.
Basically, even if there are new outbreaks, it's all on schools and local councils to decide which 'tier' of response (from fully open to only open to vulnerable students and children of key workers). One confirmed case and its likely that entire bubble (so could be a year group) isolate for 14 days with home learning. Teachers probably exempt from that. Tiers 3 and 4 seem to involve teachers both teaching live and remotely.
As ever, at first glance it looks less like a statement of policy and more like a deflection of leadership and responsibility. Way to go Gavlar.
Are the guidelines published online yet?
Spin, no idea why the school is making up its own policy on that. NHS Scotland provides clear advice to people who get negative results about if/when they should stop self isolating. There are various scenarios you probably haven't even considered. e.g. if I get a negative result after being a contact of a confirmed case, I have to isolate for 14 days from the original exposure. Are headteachers in a world of their own where they think they are the first people to consider this question since March? Many employers have been open throughout that time keeping the country running and all of them have been working quite effectively with the Scottish and UK gov guidance (e.g. https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/testing-and-tracing/what-your-test-result-means/) on when you do and don't need to isolate if you have symptoms, family members, test results etc...
The people now put in the position of making these calls are (with the best will in the world) ill-equipped to do so. Unless you happen to have a head who is a science teacher with a Masters/PhD in Virology. Much as I respect them, my head is a PE/Geography teacher…
The last thing you want is someone with a PhD in Virology - they probably think they know what they are doing and will make up their own rules. Any other professional would call their local authority, who have public health experts who can think of the question in a demographic scale rather than focussing on the individuals (assuming a quick google of the government guidance isn't sufficient)!
Spin, no idea why the school is making up its own policy on that.
Because schools haven't been given clear advice about how to deal with this or a number of other things. Instead heads etc are wading through info from a number of sources and trying to get something safe and appropriate in place. As a result I think my head had just overlooked this matter, something that will be happening up and down the land.
Because many parents don't go and read the government guidance on when to end isolation, they phone the school and ask so the school needs to know.
Because there are plenty of parents who aren't the sharpest tools and need things explained and there are some who will deliberately take the piss.
I expect many of the employers you mentioned will also have given staff clear advice on when to return rather than just assuming they'd read the official advice and done the right thing.
And finally, if you look at the link you kindly provided, the advice on ending isolation is pretty much what I said our school policy now was. It's almost as if we actually looked at it. 🙂
Perhaps my initial post was unclear. The school isn't making up a policy that's different from official advice, we were deciding what we should tell parents and the advice around a negative test had been overlooked.
I see our overlords have dropped more wisdom bombs at the 11th hour again, Dicks!
How can this possibly be OK? Just dumping the guidance on schools (late) and then changing it on the fly....
They spent the last six months looking for a fag packet to scribble it on.
Thanks colournoise… that PR headline though…
All possible measures to be taken before schools and colleges close
Yeah, right.
Both kids back in school this week, mixed feelings on it from a Covid point of view.
Youngest - Year 2.
In Wales under 11s aren't required to SD from each other or Adults, but classes are being kept in their own Bubble. Staggered timings means no mixing between years, despite a few little snags on Monday entry and exit working well. A few Mums had had to be reminded, firmly, there is a time and place for a chat, and it's not in the middle of a walk way etc. I can only dream they'll keep that up post-Covid.
Mostly they're working to try to avoid too many parents mixing before and after school.
Youngest is happy, so glad to see her friends again, loving packed lunches (Mrs hates them) - all is well with the world.
School are doing a great job.
Eldest - Year 10.
The rules say: Students and Teachers must wear masks between classes.
Students will stay in their form group at all times meaning 30 kids to a bubble, this does mean some subjects won't be taught right away, but needs must.
Students mustn't mix with other form classes at break time, so breaks and lunch will be staggered. Students must wear masks if they find themselves in crowds entering or leaving school, but really there's no reason why that should happen.
What's actually happening: (all info from surely Teenager so taken with a handful of salt).
Afternoon Day 1, An English teacher tells my Son's class "Masks are pretty useless anyway" stops just short of a full on anti-masker rant, teaches the class wearing a visor, but without actually lowering it.
Staggering class break times abandoned by the end of day 2.
School / Council / WAG / Westminster, pick your own whipping boy unable or unwilling to 'Police' mask policy in hallways, all the 'cool' / 'Hard' lads from the Rugby teams stop wearing them, all the other kids follow their lead, any kid seen wearing a mask now open to ridicule.
Teachers no longer wearing masks in hallways, too many kids without them to try to enforce it. Teachers telling kids, "it's not up to us make you do the right thing" mostly ignored.
Form groups and Year groups all mixing during breaks, it can't be easy to know which kid belongs to which group, but no one is trying.
However, they are ruthlessly enforcing 1 rule! The new "No headphone in the yard at Break time rule" on a few occasions a (mask-less) staff member has approached a (mask-less) student to demand they hand over their headphones, which can only be collected by a parent after school. It's not a Covid thing, they just seem keen to enforce that one - you know, focus on the important things.
At least it's only a small school, oh wait, no it's actually the largest school in Wales.
Still sounds better than here.
During my first lesson a student's computer would boot up. Something I would usually fix but I'm not prepared to get close enough to fix it.
During my second lesson I found I cant read the students monitors from 2m away. Again, I'm not prepared to get any closer so couldn't help them.
Just walked into a shared staff room and someone brought a student in there for a chat standing in the middle of the room. I couldn't get past till they had gone.
Some staff are not following any of the rules which is putting everyone at a higher risk.
I'm on the verge if quitting and looking for another job that I can do from home.
You want a school story? Primary school this one (a big one)…
Staggered drop off and collection times abandoned already, so adults all at the gates at the same time for collection… head goes out to shake the hands of grandparents collecting.
I don't see why the staggered start times shouldn't remain forever. It makes sense to reduce the burden on local streets and traffic and reduce the amount of parents on site. It has worked well at my son's school.
Parents have been asked to wear masks for pick up and collection. I haven't done a pick up/drop off yet but my wife says that adherence is good. The people who don't seem to be adhering seem to be those in the most at risk groups though strangely.
head goes out to shake the hands of grandparents collecting.
What a dumba**
It’s about ‘breaking down barriers’ and ‘getting rid of the fear’ apparently, not just a lapse of judgement. Primary schools are the heart of many a community, and the school gate chat a key social interaction for many people… and heads need a strong lead from the government on this… not left to invent their own approach for protecting (or not) those collecting the kids (IMHO).
@mjsmke our faculty has 9 in it, 6 would happily walk, 2 are actively looking for jobs outside teaching. If 2 go in our faculty it becomes pretty difficult to staff. There's already some massively stressed folk.
Remember... it's hard for teachers to "walk" in the state sector, and not see out this tricky term... there are pretty tight rules on notice periods... I suspect they will get tested this term though... (with help from the unions, despite the backlash likely from press and politicians).
Kelvin - what happens if they ignore those dates?
it’s hard for teachers to “walk” in the state sector,
Its really not. It might be tricky for me to get a new job in a school before xmas but if I had a non teaching job lined up I could give a month.
what happens if they ignore those dates?
Their career is over. In the state sector at least.
Edit: what AA says.
Their career is over. In the state sector at least.
Nah, with chronic shortages of science teachers I reckon I could get a new job before xmas, I've seen it done, claim stress get signed off, head would be happy to see me go and whilst I might not get a job nearby, if I was willing to travel a bit further I'd be laughing.
First confirmed case at our place. We made it four days!
Its going to hit the fan big time soon I reckon.
Staff or student?
Don't know - staff just got the same email as parents.
Start of term has been full on. For once I’m quite impressed with the plan our SLT have put in place. Now I hope we see it through for the long haul. Period 3 extended to 2 hours 5 mins so that each year group can have a separate lunch. Years 8,9,10 have a break in the middle of P3 year 7 at the start and 11 at the end. Year 11 finish their period 4 15 mins later than the rest of the school and buses and are then staying on for an extra hour to catch up.
Year groups in different wings of the school. Teachers moving every lesson except practical subjects. Unfortunately Science falling between practical and class based subject so there will be little practical work done this year. No mixing.Masks in communal inside areas. Clockwise around the outside of the school Building.
Staff are positive and actively engaged. Obviously not all kids are onboard. Unbelievable it’s still the first week back!! I’m cream crackered
First case at my wifes school, year 7 tested positive, elder sister came home from university after testing positive, despite this and showing symptoms youngest still sent to school. Looks like the bubbling is working, only 1 form group sent home (they took outside advice before making a decision). Can't we how the school can stay open if some parents are going to be this selfish. Should be reported and prosecuted for actively flaunting quarantine rules.
Looks like the bubbling is working, only 1 form group sent home
How does this show its working?
Re staff leaving. Here it's 4 working weeks notice for mere teachers.
In my old place it was one whole term. I have short notice was told that they would recoup costs my union went through the additional costs and school decided it wasn't worth it. Fortunately I didn't have to rely on the head's reference (we never go on).
Th amount of energy being expended in our school keeping bubbles going, staff moving around school, teaching in different classroom all the time, it feels like we are on a war footing! Staff are all pulling together really well, but it's not sustainable. Staff are exhausted already.
amount of energy being expended in our school keeping bubbles going, staff moving around school, teaching in different classroom all the time, it feels like we are on a war footing!
Combined with 240 000 break, lunch before and after school duties for all the different timings!
2 weeks in and there have been positive tests in 3 primary and 1 secondary school in my town already.
How does this show its working?
Because they reviewed the contact the kids had with staff and other kids, had this reviewed externally and acted appropriately. One teacher was also sent home as she for some reason had not been able to maintain 2m at all times. For year 7 in this school there is next to no movement, they stay in the same class room all day, even breaks and lunch unless they go outside. Even outside they've segregated the kids to specific areas. The infected child was also dropped off by parents so wasn't mixing on public transport.
TL:DR The teachers and support staff have working their butts off to make sure it works.
Would this have been the same for older kids who have to move around more for science lessons and other subjects that require specific classrooms, probably not.
I work in an independant boarding school, wife is head of SEND at the local college, and my boys both go to the local Primary.
We had a suspected CV19 case within 48hrs of the boarders being back, despite them all returning to school with a CV negative test result. Boarding house locked down, all lessons for those locked down delivered via teams, all meals in house etc (not easy when the house has no dining room). Full on war-footing in responding and dealing with the quarantine. Thankfully the subsequent test came back negative. It showed the system worked, but how sustainable this is long term is questionable. Its not just the teaching staff but all the support structures that are already creaking from the uplift in hours required. To top the week off my eldest got sent home from primary school yesterday - child in his bubble (2 year groups, so approx 120 kids) tested positive, so thats a 14 day quarantine at home. His brother is to continue going to school unless he shows symptoms. I can see the bubbles collapsing very quickly, its going to be a nightmare as we head into flu season - I can see us home schooling again for both kids very soon.
My wifes college is trying to run a hybrid (some virtual, some in person) timetable, but trying to convince 16-18 yr olds to maintain social distance and wear masks is like pissing in the wind.
Its a f-ing minefield out there & whilst I'm amazed at the positive attitude of staff, and the new ways of working that are genuinely better than the ones we had before, the majority of parents seem to genuinely not give a damn.
Would this have been the same for older kids who have to move around more for science lessons and other subjects that require specific classrooms, probably not.
Fair point, although with our classrooms is actually not possible to be 2m away from pupils with 30 in the room and unless they move in and out of the room one at a time, many others will be within 2m
The number of kids off with symptoms and getting trsted is very high, I expect all/vest majority will have colds but attendance is falling already. Teacher in my department was off for 3 days getting tested came back negative.
The number of kids off with symptoms and getting trsted is very high
Schools up here been back for 5 weeks now, attendance across Scotland on wednesday was 92%.