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I, very recently, seriously considered buying an Alfa for my 18 year old daughter.
Still - it reduces the chances of her being involved in an accident...
I have always felt that having children is one of the most important/ significant things that you will ever do in life and as such you are right to be giving it all of the thought. I certainly wouldn’t suggest you are overthinking it.
I'm glad someone else wrote this because I was tending towards the "is it just me, or...?" bucket. How can you possibly overthink "having a child"? Overthinking is when you can't decide between two choices of pizza topping.
BUT do you think the situation you’re in is one of self doubt (both of you) as opposed to really not wanting children?
Exactly, this is my point regarding not doing something because it is scary or hard Vs not doing something because you fundamentally bad.
I’m glad someone else wrote this because I was tending towards the “is it just me, or…?” bucket. How can you possibly overthink “having a child”? Overthinking is when you can’t decide between two choices of pizza topping.
I get what you are saying but it's about letting go of control, or more accurately the illusion of control. I would say there is overthinking with respect to being ready , being to old , begin able to cope.
No one is ready, you could die tomorrow, no one thinks they can cope. It's the illusion that everything has to be in place to do something. The question is not am I ready but am I ready to try and keep trying, failing and keep on trying. This is in essence life, we try, we fail, we keep trying, if we knew how hard it (life) would be we would kill ourselves as soon as we be are able to!
How can you possibly overthink “having a child”?
Of course there are a lot of things to possibly consider, but like a lot of these decisions, if you take a cold-eye, logical look at it and did something like a multi-attribute-decision-analysis exercise (AKA over thinking it...) you'd basically end up doing nothing. The same with a lot of life's decisions. Take owning a dog... if you wrote down all the ways in which a dog will restrict your life (financially, time, holidays, visits to places etc) you wouldn't do it. Not for a minute. But ask most dog owners and they pretty much say just 'go for it', I assume because for most people the intangible benefits outweigh the logical negatives.
(For the record, I am not in anyway comparing owning a dog to raising children... but might be something that more people can relate to in terms of 'life' decisions.)
No body is ready to be a parent – no matter how many books they’ve read, or how much they feel it is their destiny.
I remember walking out of hospital with out first one in a baby carrier thinking – “what do i do now? i know nothing about this” but it soon falls into place.
This^^^ I'm still winging it and I have three of the wee buggers. But you find your way, you will never be ready, it will never be the right time, it will be hard work, but somehow it all feels worth it.
Having just re-read the OP, I have to say that it feels to me to simply be a case of panic - you had talked about having children in the past and you decided it was 'now or never'. Well there is your answer – it is now. I reckon that the suddenality of it happening has just shocked you and you're not quite mentally ready yet but I think that will come.
As I said previously, I am an older dad too but so what? I love my girls (12 years old) and I am immensely proud of their achievements - one is academically very bright and I get a thrill on hearing praise from her teachers (such as writing English essays in Yr 7 that the teacher said she would have been impressed with from a Yr11). The other is very sporting – she has represented her school at County level in running, is often 'Player of the Match' in netball competitions and at the weekend she came 4th in a Dressage competition when all of the other competitors were adults.
I am not trying to brag with the above but I am simply very proud of them – little people I helped bring into the world (along with the help of a great wife and a bunch of IVF doctors) are doing amazing things (as well as infuriating things, but there you go) and it's great to see them change, adapt and develop with every passing day.
One slight personal positive here is seeing so many people like myself with out kids. Like I say I've been feeling a little odd about it recently and often feel that I'm/ we're out on a limb on our own with our decisions.
However this threads shows a much higher % than I would of thought have made the same decision
All I'll say to the op is good luck on whichever option you take.
you had talked about having children in the past and you decided it was ‘now or never’. Well there is your answer – it is now.
Never is still an option. Later is probably an option too.
The right option is very much a decision between the OP and his partner.
It is a big decision, in a "know yourself" kind of way I reckon. It seems fine to have a good think about it.
As far as I can tell, for people who choose to have kids, the ONLY thing you acquire at the end, for all the well documented effort and cost, is your relationship with those kids. Great or terrible. There seems to be no other badge, award or material gain in it.
So I guess having faith in yourself to make a good go of it seems pretty important in the decision making. I can understand why people hesitate and it isn't selfishness in lots of cases.
like a lot of these decisions, if you take a cold-eye, logical look at it and did something like a multi-attribute-decision-analysis exercise (AKA over thinking it…) you’d basically end up doing nothing.
Reported to STW. "I'm in this post and I don't like it."
All I know is that I was always completely indifferent about the idea of having a kid. Then we had our daughter and it turned out the absolutely most amazing and significant moment of my life which turned me into a person who now wonders why some people choose careers etc.
Nothing has come close to the experience of being a father. That's not something I'd have dreamed of saying before it happened to me.
Lots of people have kids later now. OK so it's not ideal timing but there's never really a perfect time anyway.
As far as I can tell, for people who choose to have kids, the ONLY thing you acquire at the end, for all the well documented effort and cost, is your relationship with those kids. Great or terrible. There seems to be no other badge, award or material gain in it.
Having someone around to wipe your arse once you're infirm seems to be the other common one. Which kinda hinges on the 'great' bit there.
1. Stop being a shitebag and put on your big boy pants.
2. You think your life has purpose and meaning? Wait till you have a child. If you are a real man (I am sure you are, some are not like BIL) and step up to your responsibilities then your life has meaning and purpose.
I'm speechless.
He’s calmly talking about all these plans he’s got for whats apparently going to happen during his paternity leave.
Sometimes it all works out just like this for some parents Leaving the rest of us grinding our teeth in jealous frustration.
@Twodogs so am I!
Having someone around to wipe your arse once you’re infirm seems to be the other common one.
Interesting point. During a discussion many years with my mother about me wanting to be childless she brought that one up. Now she is getting old and infirm she does not want me - a professional arse wiper - to wipe her arse
But then I am now alone completely - friends and Infirm parents with some family abroad but no kids and grandkids. I'm 60
But I am also beholden to no one and nothing. I can do just what I want
I have thought about my decision to be childless over these last months and overall still content with it
I highly doubt that my mother would either. But as the world turns, it's a valid argument and I've got her back.
I think for my part, if and when I lose my marbles I'd prefer a stranger over a family member / friend to be on wiping duty. Though of course, someone needs to get me into that position in the first place. Eh, so to speak.
Aargghh.
I keep opening this thread as a distraction from work and replying to bits I think are worth replying to.
Then thinking it’s nothing to do with me and just keep out if it.
Then 3 hours later I open it again, and reply.Then think better of it.
Same here 😀
Interesting thread because of the way it’s made so many of us think about our ‘decisions’ and lives.
For me it all boils down to the two coasters I have at work.
Coaster 1 is from the Hughes Rally in 2004, a time when I was a historic rally navigator blasting around the countryside with a mate. Great memories.
Coaster 2 is one my eldest son made at school. It’s a pretty funny rendition of me, him and the ‘70s Triumph we used to drive around in. More great memories. One is about me, the other is about us. And it’s about his future memories of his childhood.
I get that having kids isn’t for everyone (I’ve a friend that had a vasectomy because he has the same mental health issues as his dad and doesn’t want to risk having a child with the same), but I’d be wary of avoiding it due to status anxiety.
Australia is an incredible place to bring up kids, but as someone else pointed out, kids just need love.
The pride in watching the kids grow is indescribable.
moved to Australia in 2008, didn't want kids, changed mind, had kids in 2014 and 2017. first at 38.
its great.
just building a house by the ocean and I have loads of bikes.
don't worry about the stuff that hasn't happened, focus on the good stuff.
they spontaneously generate mess, though.
The thing with "who will look after me in old age" thing is that.. well, you'll probably have more money and noone to leave it to so I'll just pay for someone to look after me. Get me one of those good nursing homes with the "Blow-J's, not Beatings" mission statements.
In somewhat related news, my uncle had his first kid in his mid-50s, that was 7 years ago. Wasn't together with the mum but had part custody. Totally changed his life around - he loves the kid so much!
Couple of weeks ago the woman says "it's not yours". DNA test.... it bloody well isn't!
I can't even imagine what this is doing to him. And the wee lad!
I was a first time father in my early 40s, after an entire lifetime being, at best, fairly ambivalent about the whole thing. Wife was also wavering, then decided it was time (she's 8 years younger than me). Unfortunately at a time where I was at my least ambivalent. So, around a decade later we have two. In themselves they're great kids, wouldn't change them for the world, one is set on a track to change the world. Either blow it up or invent something like antigravity. The other just has such an appetite for life it's unreal.
But I regret the whole being a parent situation in itself on a fairly regular basis. Our marriage has gone (divorced nearly 6 years now) that still hurts on occasion as we used to do everything together, race, train, cook, party, holiday, DIY, and we were together 15+ years.
My time has gone, my health is poor at best (stress, borderline depression, diseases the kids bring home from school including COVID, twice, lack of training time), comfortable income has evaporated (we're now running two homes, also had to turn down a couple of *very* lucrative jobs as they'd require serious relocation, can't even do what I did last time I was this broke, as the kids need proper food, clothing, heat).
Make do and mend doesn't work so well when you can't even afford the parts.
So, yeah. The kids themselves are awesome. Parenthood/life after kids arrive has generally sucked in my case.
@Twodogs I've come to see comments like the one you quoted as hand grenades. They are just designed to cause a reaction. There are a few of them on here. Still doesn't stop it being properly jaw dropping. You could have included the point about pets for me too.
As for all those who have felt pressure from relatives to have children, homosexuality is the answer!
I can only ever remember getting two comments from family. One that it's probably best that I don't have kids. They'd get picked on, you see. The other that I couldn't have kids because it was biologically impossible for me and my then partner.
Overall I've no regrets on that front. We used to get taken out on the most terrible trips when I was a kid. Drives in the country with Grandma, trips on steam ships, trips on steam trains, church every Sunday, choir practice every Friday evening, watching father play cricket (mother was charged with helping make the teas)... There were good ones too of course but I've always thought if I did have kids then it would be lovely to get them into biking if that was their thing, especially when I saw families out on their bikes. I could never shake off the thought that perhaps my enthusiasm for it would stop me recognising that it wasn't their thing and they'd turn round to me as an older person and say: "Not to mention those f-ing biking trips you used to take me on!"
I can only wish you luck, OP. I don't envy you having such a big decision to make but there's pros and cons whatever you decide I suppose. Best of luck.
As for all those who have felt pressure from relatives to have children, homosexuality is the answer!
I've heard some pretty hurtful things thrown around on that score too.
"The gays are an affront to nature, we were put on this Earth to reproduce, their life is meaningless!"
"You know my (then-)girlfriend can't have children, right?"
"Oh... well... that's different..."
How can you possibly overthink “having a child”?
Because having a child is generally unknowable. Most of the folks I know (including myself) come to parent-hood by accident. You find out on a wet Wednesday evening after your partner pees on a piece of plastic, and then mostly, You have a cup of tea...and get on with it. If you're lucky; friends and family will rally round, and before you know it, sterilising bottles and a run to the all night supermarket for nappies is a thing you do. Choosing nurseries and negotiating with your boss for half term leave is a thing you do, running behind a wee person wobbling down the street on a bike is a thing you do. Driving half way across the county in the rain for football is a thing you do.
It doesn't require you to overthink it, it just requires you to do it
Ah, also when you do become a parent, I've found you start to cry at anything.... hopefully this isn't just me. But I've found myself sobbing quietly within an instant at the silliest of things.
Because having a child is generally unknowable.
There are what you think are known knowns which are actually unknown knowns, there are unknown knowns which turn out to be unknown unknowns and no known knowns after all
Who knew? 😀
I’ve found you start to cry at anything…. hopefully this isn’t just me.
No, it's not just you. My daughters properly ripped the piss out of me after I blubbed like a baby during a Disney film. I did inform them that this was entirely their bloody fault, as before they turned up I was happily mooching along with a heart of stone, comfortable in my cynical indifference. Now I'll burst into tears at a photo of some kittens
Ah, also when you do become a parent, I’ve found you start to cry at anything….
Thank the lord, I've found my people!
Put me down as another weeper. 😭
You find out on a wet Wednesday evening after your partner pees on a piece of plastic, and then mostly, You have a cup of tea…and get on with it.
This. We only realised my partner was pregnant very late on, then the boy arrived two months early! Was tough but a mercy in a way as it avoided lots of agonising.
I cry at anything and don't have kids. Makes you think, or something.
I cry at anything and don’t have kids. Makes you think, or something
That you need to man up, eat a bacon sandwich and father as many kids as you can to toughen you up a bit?
Also, get a haircut you bloody hippy. 🙂
I cry at anything and don’t have kids.
Well there's another myth debunked. #science
Sounds about right.
I do need a haircut actually, I'm less Dave Grohl and more Frank from Shameless these days.
My daughters properly ripped the piss out of me after I blubbed like a baby during a Disney film
I am unable to watch that opening sequence of "Up" for a similar reason!
Ah, also when you do become a parent, I’ve found you start to cry at anything…. hopefully this isn’t just me. But I’ve found myself sobbing quietly within an instant at the silliest of things.
Yep, side not but I think two things really changed my emotional state, one was a friend dieing at 30, another was having kids. I still refrain where possible but I definitely feel more emotional.
I just found my (childless) girlfriend crying to Love is Blind (Japan) on Netflix as one girls strict family said her man was a "nice guy".
My spidey-sense for danger is tingling. I don't know what form it's in but I am alert. She's probably up the duff or something.
Goodness - lots to unpack here. Not in any position to give advice, so just my own experience. Being a parent of grown up kids has been, at different times, the absolute best and worst experience of my life. I love them both so much it hurts. It's a massive change, but I wouldn't change them for the world.
45 isn't that old. My best man had his first at 50, and his second is due soon (he's 51 now). He's a great Dad
@mert - thanks for being brave enough to post. It's a fairly taboo subject, and it's not often you hear the other side.
First time dad at 49, never really wanted kids but time felt right. Massive change to my life, less riding, drinking etc God its tiring and was a massive decision but don't regret a minute.
Sounds like you have loads to discuss and not an easy decision as both outcomes will change your life in one way or another.
Ah, also when you do become a parent, I’ve found you start to cry at anything
Yep, me too.
Watched Encanto on Sunday. That set me off! Wtf happened to me
So we're agreed. Kids ruin your life. But in a good way.
I think I'm a better person for it.
I've definitely learned more about myself from them.