[Closed] Plumber asking for more money upfront ??

What materials is he buying?

Tiles, shower, bath, toilet etc.

Yep, ask for your deposit back and find someone decent.

Full payment on satisfactory completion of the job only.

The fact that he can't secure the materials on his trade account with the supplier stinks.

(I'm from a family of builders - plumbers and joiners)

Say no, see what he says. If he's insistent then as dmck16 advises.

Thing is, and it's not your problem, but maybe they got done recently on payment so are being more careful now. This might not be the case, but just positing a theory as to why they would ask for over 60% of the payment upfront.

Builders/plumbers etc usually have an account with a supplier.

Either he doesnt trust you to pay or the supplier wont credit him an account.

When we had ours done (complete strip back to brick so likely a bigger job) it was in two payments, one half way through the job and one at the end, they didn't ask for any money up front and if they had I would have gone somewhere else.

We had 3 quotes and the other two asked for 1000 deposits too.

This one asked for 250 originally but then dropped this on me earlier.

I might offer 500 and see what he says.

I've seen pictures of his work and it looks good and he also comes highly recommend.

Standrd practice for us.

10% upfront
Another %40 upon starting the job and the remaining 50% on completion.

I like to keep my suppliers paid on time and if Ive bought something on my account tend to pay before its due.

Just because he has a trade account has nothing to do with it. Why should he stand the debt?

Would you go into tesco and only expect to pay in 30 days?

Would you go into tesco and only expect to pay in 30 days?

When I go to tesco I like to pay a deposit in the carpark, half the bill when filling my trolley and then the remainder at the till. It pisses them off no end though.

This is new fluxh, to the rest of us at least.

Why are you doing it different?

I think I'd be asking for my £250 back.

You only got one quote? That's your first mistake right there.

Cougar..... As in my post above we had 3 quotes

Ah, fair enough. I missed that.

Would you go into tesco and only expect to pay in 30 days?

No, but I also wouldn't expect to pay for another customers shopping. If you have 30 day terms with your trade counter then why should the customer pay up before the materials are bought. Paying £1000 up front just means your helping the builder pay another bill, or he can't get credit, neither of which are very good.

I'd be happy to pay for materials as they're fitted, not purchased, but I wouldn't pay and labour until the job is done.

Cash flow can be an issue for small companies but getting someone to finish a job after they've had most of the money is an ever bigger issue.

Just had a bathroom refit including knocking two rooms into one. Total cost just short of £7k, the plumber refused to take any payment before the work was completed. At the end he just asked me to settle his account for the tiles, make payment to the tiler and finally pay him, his own share.

Would you go into tesco and only expect to pay in 30 days?

Yes. If I put it on a credit card.

When we had our bathroom refitted a couple of years ago, we bought the suite, tiles and shower. We gave the plumber a £200 float for bits and bobs. It was much easier for him to get what he needed rather than me to go to the DIY store and get the wrong stuff. He gave us the receipts and we topped up the float.

If you really must, give him another £600 once the sanitary ware is on site, but no more until the job is completed to your satisfaction.
Their cash flow isn't your problem.

I fit kitchens and bathrooms for a living, I'd not dream of taking a penny until completion.

Having said that a lot of my jobs are fit only, anything that is purchased/ordered and non refundable from my suppliers i'd expect to be paid for materials on delivery to site.

Anyone asking you to settle accounts on their behalf or pay other trades separately are probably trying to fly under the VAT threshold.

There is a trust needed though as the plumber needs to be sure you're going to pay him on time as he may well have a load of non returnable stock bought in for you.

i installcentral heating and gas fires.. only twice in 12 years have i asked for money upfront.. once hwen i knew no one in a two up two down could afforda 3 grand gas fire plus fitting and last month when a posh family wanted to spend eight grand on radiators.. they happily went to the merchants and paid cash..
if th guy was genuinely good i say id stand the materials by paying the merchants direct..
every day i see lads at the merchants refused extended credit as their accounts are overdue/overdrawen..

We had 3 quotes and the other two asked for 1000 deposits too.

This one asked for 250 originally but then dropped this on me earlier.

So how do you know the other bits of his quote are valid? Is the price going to increase?

If the up front costs are for materials then ask for itemised receipts. I'd be surprised if he wasn't putting s markup on materials - which is acceptable ish if he's taking the risk on buying them.

Proceed with caution.

Usually I would expect the tradesman to have an account, ie not have to pay for materials upfront. I would not be comfortable paying more than half upfront either. Could be he's just a bit short at Christmas time, suggest you have a chat to find out more and reiterate you'll pay promptly, worth waiting a week after job is done to ensure no leaks etc.

Would you go into tesco and only expect to pay in 30 days?

The point of purchase at the till is when the wanted goods are received, paying a deposit up front is like paying fir next weeks shopping this week.

Id be asking for the deposit back and looking elsewhere.
I also be looking into buying the sanitary ware, tiles, etc. myself and paying someone to fit them, once they were fitted of course.

But then I dont trust anyone...

Their cash flow isn't your problem.

Usually I would expect the tradesman to have an account, ie not have to pay for materials upfront.

Most do, but what happens if the customer decides not to pay or pay late? the tradesman still has to pay for the goods and if installed can't be returned.

I can see it from both sides tbh but I'd not drop a grand upfront.

I always ask for money up front but that seems a bit steep. I'm a different trade and would always say on my quotation 30% upfront, 30% when on site. 40% on completion.

It depends really.

Trades that we use in the house and elsewhere I trust 100% so wouldn't have a problem giving them the cash upfront, but then I know where they live etc and because we're known as good payers never have a problem getting someone in short notice.

Although we've had a granny annex built and that was paid monthly in arrears, in instalments as key points were reached. Still owing the last payment as waiting on council signoff (Mum's been in 3 months though...).

Based on the two other quotes also wanted large deposits I'd be inclined to ask them first why they didn't tell you. But be prepared to either pay it or pay for the material directly at their suppliers (on your account etc).

Remember, most builders merchants and [i]their[/i] suppliers will be closed until the new year. Plumbers merchants should be OK though, but maybe usual suppliers are shut?

This I assume is the guy with the suspiciously cheap quote? Its going to be a world of pain. No more money till the bathroom suite is on site and fitted is my advice

He should meet my electrician; the extension (with kitchen re-fit) has been finished for over a year, but he still hasn't put his final bill in. It was three months after completion before he put in his "interim".

He should meet my electrician; the extension (with kitchen re-fit) has been finished for over a year, but he still hasn't put his final bill in. It was three months after completion before he put in his "interim".

All plumbers merchants are open twixt xmas and new year.. if sanitary ware has to be ordered can be easily 21 days lead time rarely same day/next day.

Amount does seem to be too much for a deposit. I sometimes ask for upfront payments especially with bathrooms. That is often because the materials alone can be 4 to 5 K, and although I do have several accounts that amount uses up most of my credit limit.
I've also been taken for a 5 figure sum by someone so am understandably a bit wary and also struggling with cash flow a bit.
I think he is justified in asking for some money, however the amount should be less than half in my opinion.

Who pays for the 15% restocking charge at most suppliers if a customer pulls out after bathroom suite has been ordered and arrived at suppliers?

I install bathrooms up to £12-14k in suite and tiles etc alone, not including installation materials and labour. 15% of 14k is quite a loss to a one man band like me.

Customers can either buy their suite from my suppliers direct or they can buy through me with a 10% discount, either way, suite gets paid upfront. Or upon delivery to site if agreed beforehand.

Tradesmen will have a monthly limit on their account too, which may get stretched a bit at this time of year. Shouldn't be a problem with more well established companies, but most of the bigger companies i know (and used to work for) always ask for deposit.

If his work his good, it wouldn't matter a bit to me.

You can't blame small businesses for wanting to manage their cashflow better than all this nebulous 30 days rubbish.

We're not in the building trade but we pay our suppliers before their terms are up and we ask for deposits upon initiating our work.

Yep, ask for your deposit back and find someone decent.

Full payment on satisfactory completion of the job only.

The fact that he can't secure the materials on his trade account with the supplier stinks.

totally agree, worked for a chap a few years ago, he had just paid someone up front to fit and supply new guttering and down pipes, they called round while we where there asking for cash to buy materials, he gave them a few hundred quid and never saw them again.

If you like him and trust him offer to pay the supplier at the depot and get it delivered to your house, then pay for fitting when completed.Thats what we do.

or your payment may just be to pay of another supplier, also say you want your deposit back and see what he says.

Having dealt with lots of tradespeople over the years, the only ones who have insisted on big sums up front, then pestered for interim payments, have been wastes of space. YMMV and all that, but this has been my experience.

I now have a circle of trusted tradespeople. None of them have ever asked for a penny up front, I trust them to price a job properly and present me with a fair bill at the end with no surprises, and in return I pay them well within terms, and recommend them to people.

Would you go into tesco and only expect to pay in 30 days?

Would pay Tesco a disposit then pay them to order stocks in before you receive it.

When I had a boiler installed recently, I paid the merchant for the boiler up front. Then the plumber picked it up, and installed it, then sent me an invoice for the labour. No issues.

I'm sure if you went to a bigger company with more cash (and insurance against non payers or ways to retrieve cash in that circumstance) then you can pay it all on completion. But I suspect your guy is cheaper at least in part because he doesn't have that facility.

Cam you pay on credit card? That way you have some recourse.

Having dealt with lots of tradespeople over the years, the only ones who have insisted on big sums up front, then pestered for interim payments, have been wastes of space. YMMV and all that, but this has been my experience.

There's nowt wrong with asking, or indeed, getting interim payments during a long job, as long as the work invoiced has been completed.
There's one hell of a lot of trust involved, for both sides, when you get tradesmen into your home. Expecting someone to stump up for materials and then work unpaid for two or three weeks, or months, is unrealistic, but a few days really isn't.

Simple. Phone the plumbing merchant and pay for all materials to be delivered to your house. You pay him the rest of the bill on completion.

Would pay Tesco a disposit then pay them to order stocks in before you receive it.

Isn't that what happens in online shopping?

Isn't that what happens in online shopping

No. Decent sites charge at point of dispatch (they may well authorise at point of order but the money isn't taken to dispatch). Online food shopping is charged when the order is picked as the actual value can vary with substitutions.

Simple. Phone the plumbing merchant and pay for all materials to be delivered to your house. You pay him the rest of the bill on completion.

The best tradesman I've ever had replaced all the windows in the house built a porch fitted patio doors and did the gutters and fascia. Didn't ask for a penny up front and would only accept payment a month after to ensure we were happy with his work. He was a one man business. Needless to say he wasn't the cheapest 12k was the bill. He didn't advertise and only did work by recommendation. He was booked up 4 months in advance.

I'd be wary. I got stung by a plumber/gas fitter taking payment up front. Had already done some work putting a new boiler in for us which had been smooth then when fitting new shower room asked for a deposit then started work and left us 1/2 finished.

Got a couple of estimates for what he had already done and then chased him for the rest. Stopped him in the bookies, chased and blocked his van in on a Saturday night out with his girlfriend and went round his house. Got most of it back but was a right royal pain in the backside.

Offer to buy the materials then at least they are yours no matter what else happens.

No. Decent sites charge at point of dispatch (they may well authorise at point of order but the money isn't taken to dispatch). Online food shopping is charged when the order is picked as the actual value can vary with substitutions.

Ocado and Morrisons don't charge until after your delivery has arrived, and the driver arrives back at the depot and confirms delivery, then the payments are processed.
Sometimes payments arent taken until the following day if the driver is on a late shift.

(Not that any of this is relevant to paying tradespeople of course 😆 )