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Oo oo, on the tandem we have an old fashioned bulb operated air hooter. That (plus the tandem) makes most people smile and we rarely get any aggro. Annoyingly, it sounds like a strangled duck tho so we'll probably get the militant wing of the RSPB chasing us...
Is the term NED not a middle class term for people beneath them on the social ladder
Page 2, time for an STW argument. Happy Easter Monday...
Oo oo, on the tandem we have an air hooter. That (plus the tandem) makes most people smile and we rarely get any aggro.
Sounds like The Goodies tribute act, I'm not surprised you get smiles.
Sorry!
"Neds" surely you mean "schemies" ?
Arseholes are evenly distributed throughout the world and in all social classes.
"Class" is a quality that is never found in an arsehole.
There seems to be a real mix in the Surrey Hills but older women walking a dog on their own seem to be the worst. As soon as you approach, instead of calling their dog and getting hold of of it, they just start yelling at you to "mind my dog"!! Couples out together are much better but generally most dog walkers seem to just scowl a bit at us. We are the devil reincarnate though I suppose.
“Neds” surely you mean “schemies” ?
Ohhh - now thats interesting. Whats the difference? Schemie more pejorative?
From the south so don’t know anything about Neds, but the fact they were polite (& the fact you still have your bike!) suggests they weren’t really chavs, probably just normal children (who happen to dress a bit differently than you did when you were growing up)
Definite Ned. related to the Chav but not the same. Its a complete subculture. Not just a casually dressed youth.
Good to see a thread a that will have people losing their shit and smashing chocolate eggs in a rage today.
It's what he would have wanted.
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Page 2, time for an STW argument
Amazed it took til page 2 😂
most dog walkers seem to just scowl a bit at us.
Some of us ride bikes and also have dogs! As I have a dog, I’ll always talk to the dog too. The owners seem to like that.
+1 for using a bell.
I sometimes add a Hornit (140 dB electronic screech).
For some walkers - with or without dog - even an airhorn wouldn't be enough.
I’ll always talk to the dog too
The likely reason why many walkers scowl at me is because I only talk to the dog.
You really need to move out of town TJ. You keep telling everyone how wonderful it is yet you seem to have a stream of confrontation as a result.
Maybe buy a dog too.
I’ll always talk to the dog too. The owners seem to like that.
Another bit of good advice. As soon as you show the owners you’re not a threat to their pooch the situation de-escalates.
Anyway, in general,
They’re still smart enough to only give abuse to those they reckon won’t kick the shit out of them
These are true words.
I always thought NED stood for non educated delinquent, so quite a value judgement being placed on them.
Mind you, growing up around Stourbridge in the late 80's, you'd often bump into a Ned in the Mitre, Swan or JBs. Identifiable by their crimped hair.
Money, clothes and accents are no indicators of a person's true "class".
I always thought NED stood for non educated delinquent,
made up after the word came into usage. Its origins are unclear. Its a central scotland thing
I always thought NED stood for non educated delinquent
IDNKT. Thanks, new thing learned for the day. Now time for industrial levels of chocolate consumption...
Oh, and yes. Talk to the dog(s) as well tho not in a creepy 'do you want to come and run away with Uncle Boblo?' sort of way...😁
Ned does not mean that - tho its a common mistake
Yeah, regardless of the scowls I get sometimes, I make a point of being the politest I can be. Never fails to shut down arguments in an instant.
Same here. I very overtly slow down, and am always over the top pleasant. I suspect that most cyclists on bridleways aren't (also being a walker and runner) so I try to make up for the not so good interactions peds must have regularly, to give us as cyclists some hope...
I feel the bell - while only meant to be a friendly warning that a cyclist is nearby, and in no way a 'I'm here please make space for me' - that most peds take it intrinsically as a 'please make space for me'-ding, which gets their backs up as most people hate cyclists. Hence I don't use a bell any more I just slow to walking pace (often less) and politely make myself known
I try and ding a long way back and make it as soft and none demanding as can be. That followed by the sickening cheeryness usual stops all but the most determined mardy arse but sometimes, you just can’t win.
Yep!
There is no middle class, working class or lower class.
You're either working class or you're capitalist class.
You either need to work or you don't. (Whether or not you do).
made up after the word came into usage
Really,do you have any more details or did you just I imagine that.
After they apologised I would definitely said "No worries" and more than likely there would have been no issues.
You sound a bit entitled tbh. They didn't jump out of your way quick enough, the apology wasn't enough for you so YOU gave them the passive aggressive silent treatment!
made up after the word came into usage
Really,do you have any more details or did you just I imagine that.
Yep, I'm with tj. Reckon it's a backronym.
Is the term NED not a middle class term for people beneath them on the social ladder?
Hmm. Interested in other weegies' views on this. My understanding was that it was more to do with malicious intent, or at least the aura 0f malicious intent. A ned was someone more likely to punch **** out of you, preferably in a gang.
Fast Haggis
https://www.glasgowlive.co.uk/news/history/glasgow-ned-words-mysterious-19th-24599607
CTK = perhaps. its a path with high cycle traffic, I didn't get right behind them then ring my bell I gave them a polite ding from a long way back so they had plenty of time to react but didn't. They made no attempt at all to let me past. I had slowed right down.
Maybe I could have said no worries but it would have been wrong as they were not sharing at all. its a shared path. Its not they didn't get out of the way quick enugh - its they made no attempt at all and were taking up the entire 5m path.
reflective practice tho says you could have a point. I clearly triggered them as they went straight to abuse and the "apology" was very passive aggressive and that was the first words uttered
Just looked at the etymology of NED and you are correct, what confused me was the 'chav' reference which is definitely pejorative.
I don't really get problems either way where I live, Smallish town in the Dales of County Durham.
My reasoning being that -
You know each other, even vaugely;
There's a chance that one of you knows who the other one is;
Could easily find out who you are.
Anonymity means people don't care what you think of them.
it’s definitely a backronym. First citation in OED is from 1910. It’s also definitely pejorative, describing a ne’er-do-well/thug/petty criminal etc, same as yobbo or “feral youth” nowadays. Describing otherwise normal children as such just because they wear joggers/hoodies is [i]extremely[/i] middle-class 😉Yep, I’m with tj. Reckon it’s a backronym.
Maybe I could have said no worries but it would have been wrong as [s]they were not sharing at all.[/s] I'm not an Australian
FTFY
He should have said " Nae borra"
I have heard Neds self describing as such - does that make them middle claaaassss like me with my long "A" sound? 🙂
It is really a lazy pejorative stereotype but the Ned is not the same as the general joggers and hoody wearing youth. Its a distinct subculture
"Nae borra big man"?
these two interactions just brought the thought to the forefront. Its an observation of many years cycling and seems fairly consistent
With the common denominator being cycling (and TJ). Makes you think.
I'd agree with your observation TJ.
Fur coat and nae knickers types. Very closely related to the Red Sock Brigade.
Think they're better than everyone else, but in reality are internally miserable so hate to see other people enjoying things "differently" from their own version of "enjoyment".
I ran into one around Newtongrange a few weeks ago while out having an explore. As soon as I seen her, I just knew she was gearing up for a confrontation, but I wasn't in a rush, so took the wind out her sails by stopping and giving her a cheery hello as she walked past with her dog. I could sense her internal rage as she scowled on the way past.
Neds on the other hand are generally far more care free without any sense of entitlement. Some might be eyeing you up to see what they can pinch, but at least they don't pretend to be anything else.
probably. I know loads of middle-class kids who dress like “roadmen”, call each other chav/chavvie etc. they’re just following fashion/urban culture. They’re not actually drug-dealers/yobs/petty criminals.I have heard Neds self describing as such – does that make them middle claaaassss like me
It is really a lazy pejorative stereotype but the Ned is not the same as the general joggers and hoody wearing youth. Its a distinct subculture
This I think is the bit I don't get. Apart from their clothes, why did you label them Neds (and not general joggers and hoody wearing youths)? If your only interaction with them was as you described - them being polite - why do they get pigeonholed?
Genuinely interested, as I work with young people. Specifically, 17/18 year olds leaving the care system who get a lot of this kind of labelling. Some are what you would call a Ned (they would aspire to be roadmen) but the vast majority are kids that have had a shit start in life, who get lumped in to the same stereotype.
Ahem. As someone identifying as an ex 'Roadmen' I object to my group being brought into this discussion about errant/non errant yoofs. We have feelings too y'know...
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Just in case 🙃
Dunno sc xc difficult question.
Is it a bit -"you know when you see them" even if hard to describe why? . a bit like knowing its a sparrow or a meadow pipit ? The uniform is subtly different? I seem to be able to distinguish between what appears to be working class youth and the "ned" but how? and of course how accurate am I being.
Its not just this one youth - I have seen this many times.
Flipping heck - a lighthearted post turns into a deep sociological question 🙂
I am sure as you suggest that many folk see all sportswear wearing youth as "neds" but we know that is not so.
^ cheers TJ and genuinely not trying to start a debate, I guess we all have our unconscious biases and preconceptions - I know I do
Its a good question.