[Closed] MOT of Doom pending. Thoughts on this Land Rover 300tdi Defender.

I'd go for the defender over a discovery every time if you are just using it as a workhorse mainly as you won't be getting wet feet......from my sisters experience 😆
The discovery I found horrible to drive too......more basic= good In my books!

doors are ****ed - both - passengers sides split and by the looks of the inside to out corrosion at the waste and bottom of the drivers its not far behind.

other than looks good. bulkhead footwells and top corners look decent,m the battery box looks good.

just check the seat belt mounts on the front and top of the rear tub bulkhead

look inside the rear crossmember and pay particular attention to the first 6 inches off the bulkhead on thedrivers side where the loom exits.

on the bright side the 300tdi and your disco engine are exactly the same....so pull your engine before you scrap it.

check the tub cappings - they are well hidden in the photos by the rag top and pricy to repair.

for an L reg defender thats in fine fettle - now it depends what his reserve is ..... its crazy season.... ive seen folk asking for 8k on a non galvy chassis 200tdi.... the snow hasnt hit yet FFS

The bodywork looks pretty abused for an L reg. By contrast the rear crossmember, grab handles, hinge bolts and towbar look almost new so I would be questioning the "never had any welding" bit because it could have had a new 1/4 chassis. The front bumper is new as well. The mileage is completely irrelevant; changing the instrument pod and speedo takes a few minutes. Can you inspect it before bidding? Land Rovers can be built from bits and there's nothing wrong with that as long as it's been done right and there are no major mechanicals looming.

chassis had a few licks of paint. its not the original paint.

How much for a galv chassis for the disco?

itll be the body work thats rotten on the disco no doubt. boot floor/innerarches F+R sills , seatbelt and body mounts....

The chassis is still very good on my Discovery. It's really the floor that is main issue. I replaced pretty much everything on the passenger side from the footwell back to the rear of the rear wheel arch in to the transmission tunnel last year.

I think that side is more prone to rusting with puddles on the roadside.

I will have a poke around tomorrow in daylight to make a more informed decision before the MOT tester does.

Discoverys rot dreadfully, I'm of a similar mind that I'd rather have a defender or for range rover classics don't rot as bad as discos.

its crazy season....

By contrast, I've seen some decent looking ones at seemingly reasonable prices on Gumtree recently; for example [url= http://www.gumtree.com/p/land-rover/land-rover-90-1987-200-tdi-conversion/1088816285 ]here[/url] and [url= http://www.gumtree.com/p/land-rover/land-rover-90-1984-b-reg/1088451861 ]here[/url]. 90s seem to be a little cheaper than 110s at the minute.

The second one in particular looks very interesting. Dodgy petrol engine notwithstanding, you don't often see them with a galved chassis for that price.

Thanks for that Duffer, liking the look of the petrol 90. I emailed the owner for more details. How powerful are those old 2.5 petrol engines? How big a job is it to retrofit a 300tdi to one? Are the engines and gearboxes interchangeable? What sort of fuel consumption could one expect from it with the petrol engine?

A 2.5na to 300tdi is bordering on realms of hard work..... Modifying crossmembers , seatboxes , engine mounts.

The gear box wont take a 300tdi so you need to fit the r380 with the engine. A disco one will not fit neatly.

2.5petrol -vwere comparible with a v8 about 16-18mpg...

Retro fitting a 200tdi would be a lot simpler, but then you'd have to source one.

Defenders last forever when you throw the contents of your wallet at them.

Look at Toyota's?

Hora - stick to something you have half a clue about . Something like subarus 🙂

For 3k a year id just fix up the petrol engine. Or drop in one of the v8s/lt85'si had lined up for my 90 🙂

Defenders last forever when you throw the contents of your wallet at them.

Look at Toyota's?

The problem with a hilux is they can't tow anything close to the weight of a Land Rover. I suppose a Land Cruiser might but they are way too expensive for my needs.

I'm open to suggestions though. I had a good experience with my old Shogun but I doubt I would be able to find one without chassis rust.

 

My Surf has not missed a beat and looks like new ( ish ) But max towing weight is only 2200 Kg ( does that mean that a Discovery/Defender weighs 3.5 MT ? assuming an experienced driver should not tow in excess 100% of curb weight of the vehicle ? )

just did a 400 mile round trip and packed with gear and it was a pleasure.

[url= http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/utility-vehiclefinally-bought-one ]This one[/url]

[url= http://www.hiluxsurf.co.uk/showthread.php?t=3788 ]People have towed over 3000 kg with the surf[/url]

I will get another Landy one day !

I don't know anything about the petrol engines, other than what i've read on t'internet. LR specialist Glencoyne Engineering seem to rate them quite highly:

For extensive off-road use with lots of short journeys, I would most probably recommend a diesel, but for some other applications the diesel's noise, harshness, lack of power and short service intervals may count against it. I am particularly enthusiastic about the 2.5 petrol engine when converted to run on LPG. This engine produces about the same power as a 2.5 turbodiesel, it is smoother, quieter, easier to start in cold weather and, running on LPG, the fuel bills are about 15-20% lower than a diesel 110.

[url= http://www.glencoyne.co.uk/buyguide.htm ]Sauce[/url].

I've been keeping a keen eye on that petrol 90; with the exception of the engine it's just the sort of thing i fancy. It's not the right time for me to buy, unfortunately.

Let us know what happens!

I had the 2.5 petrol in my 110. It was gutless and uneconomic (15-20 mpg). IMHO you'd have to be mad to favour it over a 200 tdi. I'd even consider a military spec 2.5 n/a diesel ahead of it.

If you thought the petrol was gutless then what makes you think the 2.5na diesel would be any better ?

2.5s both petrol/diesel are much more abundant in quantity than 200tdis.

Diesel na had 68bhp
Petrol na 83 bhp
Turbo diesel 85 bhp
200tdi 107 bhp

If you thought the petrol was gutless then what makes you think the 2.5na diesel would be any better ?

I drove an ex MOD 2.5 n/a diesel 90 after I sold mine.

This engine produces about the same power as a 2.5 turbodiesel, it is smoother, quieter, easier to start in cold weather

So its better than the worst engine LR ever fitted.

Makes no difference that its ex mod.... Same low power plodding engine,

And yes 19j = worst longevity.... But when new first landy to do motorway speed limit:)

Mines on 128k before i pulled it... Its breathing badly but still sat at 70 if you had your ear defenders on.

Petrol 83 bhp
Diesel 68bhp
19j 85bhp
200tdi 107bhp

Sounds like your timing was out or something on the 2.5 petrol

Maybe first [i]diesel[/i] LR to do motorway speed limit 😉

Aye my bad. Course thats what i meant 🙂

Any idea what the costs would be for an LPG conversion on the 2.5?

kit will be about 450 + vat from tinleytech.

fuel wise - it will get the similar mpg on lpg but cost wise it will seem like you get 10 extra mpg over petrol..

takes alot of miles to pay it back imo. but if shes a keeper....

although im of the opinion that it leads to early failure of valve seats and such like so i wouldnt be too keen on doing it in my own car...

There are some bargains still to be had, but prices are increasing due to the imminent end of production and 300/200tdi's with decent chassis seem to be the most sought after.

I picked this 200tdi up the other week. £2k. one owner for the first 20 years then has been used privately on a farm for game keeping since. I'm getting it prepped for MOT. Had discs fitted to rear. new calipers, discs and pads all round, new seats, new steering damper, respray at some point. Chassis, bulkhead and rear x-member are all sound.

[img][url= https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5607/15607861679_34c258e9c5.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5607/15607861679_34c258e9c5.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/pMdnvr ]IMG_20141115_120105604[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/people/42807838@N00/ ]iain-t[/url], on Flickr[/img]

[url= https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7564/15792131131_b1b69ff604.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7564/15792131131_b1b69ff604.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/q4uNoX ]IMG_20141115_134354519_HDR[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/people/42807838@N00/ ]iain-t[/url], on Flickr

If you want cheap, my advice would be to hold out for another 300tdi Disco. I sold 1998 one last year with FSH, solid waxoyled chassis and only a bit of surface rust for £1500. Or wait for the right 90/110.

mr grim..

thats made my mind up thanks....

im redoing mine in the original stratos blue - that looks nice - was tempted to go classic marine blue for old times sake.... our series III was that colour when i was a kid

300/200tdi's with decent chassis seem to be the most sought after

- this - they are the T4s of the land rover world....

dont still have the original lime stone wheels do you mr grim .... interested in shifting them ?

It is a nice colour, i like it anyway. Either that or BR green.

I do still have the wheels, all 5 of them. Tyres are mainly knackered. Drop me a mail if your interested.

will be in touch when i get back from my next trip.... i want limestone classic wheels - i only have 2 sets of disco steelies - but i dont have room for ANOTHER set of wheels right now.... not till i get the bulkhead finished and out my garage.

after that twit glenister ruined that series 1 with too much BR green calling it the "classic land rover colour" im against BR green as a re colour.....

id love to do mine Roan Brown but it would be a shame to remove every shread of its history - it was a blue car.... it should remain a blue car 😀

cool, they are just sitting in the garage not going anywhere, so get in touch if/when you want to collect. I'm in Kinross-shire.

That's a nice looking 90 MrGrim, did you find it locally?

There was a rough looking 300tdi 90 on ebay in Auchterarder. Chassis was shot, bulkhead looked ok. I was thinking about a new galvanized chassis, and possibly a galvanized bulkhead. Thing is even shagged 90s with a log book fetch over a grand.

Should anyone see anything at a reasonable price and condition please let me know.

peter -your looking at a really bad time for a defender.its winter - and ending of production next year.

would a 2.25 series vehicle really not meet your low milage and i assume low speed escapades ? series III can be had quite cheap compared to defenders

That's a nice looking 90 MrGrim, did you find it locally?

Yes, it was 4 miles down the road. I think I also saw the same 90 in Auchterarder, but if i remember, the guy was selling it fits galvanised chassis and then resells, so I was worried that if he hadn't done it and was flogging it on, it was maybe a lost cause.

As TR says, Defenders are going for a premium, I was lucky. Series 3 are still very cheap, but it is expected that prices will also rise. I still think a 300tdi disco that's been unabused and well maintained can be a bargain. It's just trying to find one. This is my old one:

[url= https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3930/15444728831_1c7bf14e8f.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3930/15444728831_1c7bf14e8f.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/pwNgN8 ]IMG_0146[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/people/42807838@N00/ ]iain-t[/url], on Flickr

I'll keep an eye out for you.

Thanks MrGrim.

Yes, the guy in Auchterarder does the chassis up rebuilds.

Do you stay on the Cleish road?

I think the Series Land Rovers would be too underpowered for the towing I do, I'd worry about the drum brakes too.

I really need something more modern and still DIY repairable.

This looks worthwhile, it's a long way away mind, but it only needs a couple of doors. It says it's already been rebuilt on a galvanized chassis.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111516858695?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

There was a rough looking 300tdi 90 on ebay in Auchterarder. Chassis was shot, bulkhead looked ok. I was thinking about a new galvanized chassis, and possibly a galvanized bulkhead. Thing is even shagged 90s with a log book fetch over a grand.

Should anyone see anything at a reasonable price and condition please let me know.

A chap i know buys and sells landrover as a hobby. I can ask him if he has got anything at the moment. What are you after?

be very careful with the county moont.

check the door frames/b piller VERY carefully they are scary expensive when they go.... ask stoner...

also check the seat box and cross member underneeth with a fine tooth comb.

finally - dont underestimate the cost of doors...

look on SLROC - usually a few 90s/110s that aint trialers pop up on there at fair price now and again.

Do you stay on the Cleish road?

Not far away. You sent me some of the Himalayan Lily seeds (thanks again btw). I need to remember to go out and check them in the garden.

A chap i know buys and sells landrover as a hobby. I can ask him if he has got anything at the moment. What are you after?

I'd be happy with way with a 300tdi 90 or 110. I use my current Discovery for towing a heavy trailer. I had a poke around the sill/body mounts on the Discovery that I didn't do last year this morning and they are going to need welding.

I don't do a huge mileage, around 3k a year, 2/3 of which are towing miles.

I've usually spent around £2000 on a 4x4 that lasts around four years. I've always managed to sell the MOT failure to our local breaker for around £500.

I think a decent 300tdi 90 or 100 is the way to go. I can fix them, they are old enough that the road tax isn't prohibitive. Paying a little more for a good one would offset the running costs tax/servicing of something newer and Japanese.

Ok. He normally buys ex military, mot's and sells them on. I know he has some ex BNFL l/rovers too.

I will be seeing him tonight in work, so i will ask.

Steve.

thing is .....
if you did those mounts.....

would it be solid for a few years yet.... ill bet the bits you did are still solid....theres only a finite of welding it can need - once its all solid again you should get another 10 years out of it 😉

I was thinking that Terry.

The rot looks localized near the rear sill body mount. There's a repair panel that is made for that section without having to replace the whole sill.

I'm going to take it in for the MOT test and see what else it throws up. The shame is that the chassis is perfect.

check the door frames/b piller VERY carefully they are scary expensive when they go.... ask stoner...

They're not that bad if you shop around. I just got a pair from britcar for £360, genuine LR.

kenneth... housings too cheap in dundee if 360 is considered "not bad".

Moonter, spoke to my friend last night, he has just sold his last restored one, but he has an ex military 110 2.5 petrol. He has only just bought it and it does need work. It's lpg but the lpg system is faulty.
Sorry.

MOT of doom results ?

MOT of doom results ?

It's got until the end of the month. I was oot harvesting today. Luckily the trailer tow ball is bolted to the chassis and not the body. 😯

Cheers Monkeysfeet.

Does it have to be a land rover? As a relatively recent ford ranger devotee, they are definitely worth a look. Not as capable off road, but for towing capacity they are as good - of course there are niggles which will have to be sorted, but they are cheaper to buy for a similar spec, and possibly more practical.

MOT of Doom sweepstake. How many fail boxes can a twenty year old Discovery fill. I had to use an exfoliating sponge to remove the accumulated tree sap to find the blue paint underneath. The drivers side sill is toast at the passenger door body mount. I wonder just how devastating the mot tester's hammer will be. I think mechanically, hydraulically and electrically it's ok.

Geoff I have a pal that rates his Ranger too. I been checking out 90s and 100s but it looks like a TD5 Discovery might be a viable replacement. Again I've got a pal who uses one off road and it has survived reasonably well. I should be able to find a decent one for between £2-3k. I think they'd be better value than a comparable Defender.

[img] [/img]

Update

I was less optimistic than Private Fraser going in for the test.

It only failed on the rear sill body mount. The tester said it was well worth replacing the whole sill as the rest of the truck was in good shape. The parts are cheap and a couple of afternoons should see it fixed.

no brake pipes ..... **** sake i lost the sweepy !

Result! And a clean car too...

McMooter, is passing a good thing or a bad thing? How much did you want the Defender?

McMooter, is passing a good thing or a bad thing? How much did you want the Defender?

The thing is, mechanically the Discovery is really strong, the chassis has so far been unwelded. It does everything a Defender could with a little more comfort. So if I make good the sill, it should be good at least for another MOT.

I've looked online a dozens of Defenders and 300tdi and Td5 Discoverys and it looks like a minefield. I will keep an eye open for something locally in future. Buying something blind would be foolhardy. I think Td5 Discoverys represent good value for money for the limited mileage I'd need one for.

just do the repairs well

keep her painted like a ship on the clyde

as the aussies would say sheee be reeet.

A stay of execution. I cut out and welded in a new sill and floor section on the drivers side. These include the new body mounts. An advisory said the rear brakes although meeting the meter requirements were just at their limit, so I replaced them too. I swapped a headlamp bulb that was giving a strange beam pattern.

A few afternoons work in the shed and the old Discovery is legal for another year. Job satisfaction rating? Off the scale.

Looking at the new MOT, I only did 1800 miles in it last year.

[img] [/img]

😀