I'm aware of why Farrage quit UKIP, for the same reason as Marine Le Pen fell out with and distanced herself from Le Pen senior. They both know anti-semites and anti-muslims can't win elections and are likely to get arrested. Populists need popular support. Once in power they do what the hell they want.
And yes, I regard Farrage as having more right wing policies than the the BNP. Check out BNP policy on health (totally socialist) and Farrage (insurance and privatisation).
Consider for an instant what Farrage wil do on getting a majority in the house. An instant Brexit - no more ECJ, the ability to revoke the laws he doesn't like and make new ones. Once in power he can stop playing nicely and do just what he wants.
Because it’s apparently sold in the Polish parliament, it’s not a fringe paper sold on street corners.
I dont disagree with the essence of your argument regarding racism in European countries, just trying to keep you honest with regards to how you use your sources.
The article you link seems to show politicians in Poland are horrified that this happened, so hopefully this is not a regular occurrence.
You are right the the headline would not appear here, however I have never visited the Polish Parliament, but would bet that the papers it sells will be no different to those on street corners there.
Its circulation is relevant in determining the extent of the problem of racism in Poland.
The British people should be proud of having the most multicultural least racist country in Europe.
That's a blatant lie if Metro is to be believed.
https://metro.co.uk/2018/06/20/racist-countries-europe-not-actually-bad-7646762/
... Farrage (insurance and privatisation).
Privatisation ... look at EU countries from the guardian newspaper as sample.
The creeping privatisation of EU health care ...
🤣
The British people should be proud of having the most multicultural least racist country in Europe.
That’s a blatant lie if Metro is to be believed.
Nah, other comparable multicultral countries in Europe such as Italy, Germany, France, Austria, etc, are more racist than the UK.
Don't believe everything you read in the Metro. The best gauge of how racist a country is how people vote - in the privacy of your own polling booth you can be as racist as you like.
Fascists and neo-nazis have been trying to get a foothold in British politics since the 1930s, they have never succeeded. They've had more success in other European countries. And today Britian is the least racist it's ever been. It's less racist than it was 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 years ago.
There aren't too many things that Britian can still be proud of, tolerance is one of them.
The best gauge of how racist a country is how people vote
Brexit party, thirty something percent. Farrage
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/uk/nigel-farage-s-vile-anti-immigration-poster-criticised-1.2690915 and to quote George Osbourne
Farrage is 1930s Germany according to George Osbourne and many others.
There aren’t too many things that Britian can still be proud of, tolerance is one of them.
You're just trolling now, Ernie.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/oct/16/hate-crime-brexit-terrorist-attacks-england-wales
and compare those numbers with Holland taking into account population of course ( Holland is another multicultural society in which the multicultural model is being challenged so comparable).
You’re just trolling now, Ernie.
Isn't the correct response to ignore a troll?
Chewkw, yes. With you I'm selective, Ernie. On dirait que le service nationale t'as marqué à vie. Je parie qu'un parent n'était pas près à renoncer à la nationalité française pour t'éviter l'épreuve. Alors ?
On dirait que le service nationale t’as marqué à vie. Je parie qu’un parent n’était pas près à renoncer à la nationalité française pour t’éviter l’épreuve. Alors ?
In France it was military service, not national service - as in Britain where it could be completed working for a government department other than the military. You should know that, I take it that you didn't do yours?
Renouncing my French nationality was not an option as it was the only nationality that I had, and it still is. I am however for all intents and purposes British, and one day I will probably swallow my pride and swear allegiance to Elizabeth II and her successors, although I don't see why naturalized Brits can't be republicans. Although I am present in the same boat, so to speak, as some of the Windrush generation - like them I didn't know I was suppose to apply for permanent UK residency years ago. Not a problem whilst the UK remains in the EU. I am btw a strong leave supporter - I despise the EU.
Besides, although it was truly crap in so many ways I have absolutely no regrets about doing my military service. It didn't leave a negative mark as you suggest. I was happy to do my bit for the Glory of France, especially as it didn't involve killing anyone. Furthermore because I completed my military service I was afterwards prioritised into a French government training college, something which I am very grateful for and would never have had the opportunity to do in the UK.
Although I no longer consider myself French, ie, I wouldn't be able hold a conservation in French anymore, despite having reached the rank of corporal during my military service and going to college in France, as it's been decades since I've spoken it, I do still feel an emotional attachment to France, which is one of the reasons I get so pissed off with the rise of the far right and islamophobia. I've had relatives who fought against that crap.
I can't get my head round the thought that anyone who lives in a country that suffered under nazi occuption, and all its horrors, can vote for the far right. And not just France, Greece, Italy, etc. And Poland? Poland lost 20% of its population under nazi occupation, 6 million, 6 ****ing million, more than half of them Jews. And today in Poland they have newspaper articles such as "how to spot a Jew"? FFS
And there was me hoping you'd pick me up on a homophone rather than using your own words, Ernie.
I'd like to feel some empathy but can only say that someone with only French nationality supporting leave is properly masochistic. You really aren't for all internts and purposes British until you get a passport and the Brexiteers will make you very aware of that.
I'm in exactly the opposite situation, I was born in Brimingham but I've lived in France for over thirty years. Within a few years I had a business, properties, Madame had qualifications and a good job, junior was born here. I applied for nationality and went to a very nice ceremony with people for all sorts of places, the only disappointment being not getting to sing the Marseillaise.
When the Net came along I though I'd make the most of my duality and keep my English up to scratch on forums, then just one forum, this place. It's the best of the Britain I liked. Things move on, I've turned left while Britain has turned right and our courses have diverged. I feel Foreign in Britian but this place helps enormously with keeping my finger on the pulse.
I've benefitted greatly from freedom of movement, junior too, currently studying and working in Germany. I fully support the European project whilst recognising its complexity and failings. The alternative of no EU is economically suicidal and politically dangerous IMO. Quite apart from the loss of personal freedoms.
So in real life we would soon give each other a wide berth but on here we're still talking after all these years. mMkes you think, eh !
The alternative of no EU is economically suicidal and politically dangerous IMO.
And don't forget war. Just Britian leaving the EU could result in Europe descending into war. According to former British Prime Minister David Cameron
The overriding characteristic of the referendum campaign was that both sides talked shite.
Although in my opinion the result was correct.
I think the EU has already prevented war. We don't have a parallel world to compare with but I think that Putin would have been even more agressive were it not for having an adversary the size of the EU to kepp him in check. Do you really think the wall would have come down as easily and the eastern European countires been left to westernise without the Eastern partnership? Would sanctions have been imposed? No chance. Would the Ukraine have been completely annexed as opposed to pratially? Probably.
The overriding characteristic of the referendum campaign was that both sides talked shite.
Sorry but this is shite.
On the one hand we have future predictions. Normally done as a range from best case to worse case. Which is primarily what the remain campaign was guilty of.Choosing the worse case predictions.
On the other hand we have lying about what is happening now. Which is what the brexiteers were repeatedly guilty of (as well as also selecting best case predictions0.
Also, if you bother to read what Cameron actually wrote you will be reminded why newspaper headlines, as a rule, should be ignored.
Sorry but this is shite.
On the one hand we have future predictions. Normally done as a range from best case to worse case. Which is primarily what the remain campaign was guilty of.
Nah, if you make a prediction and it turns out to be a shite prediction it's still shite. Even if you want to claim that it was just an honest mistake. Although I see it more as a politically motivated "honest mistake"
As I said, both sides have repeatedly talked shite, one side didn't have a monopoly. And in the case of pro-Euro shite that goes way back. Before joining the EEC the europhiles claimed that joining would result in unemployment falling as it would lead to tens of thousands of extra jobs. It was almost certainly the single biggest thing which swayed people to support joining EEC.
What actually happened was that unemployment went through the roof after joining. And there it stayed, above the pre-EEC level, for 45 years. Until ironically this year, 3 years after Britain voted to leave, it has now come down for the first time to its the 1974 level.
And of course the present unemployment level brings me to more immediate shite. One month before the referendum the pro-EU British government claimed that a vote to leave, never mind actually leaving, "would represent an immediate and profound shock to our economy".
Apparently the economy would be tipped into a year-long recession, with at least 500,000 jobs lost and GDP around 3.6% lower, following a vote to leave. I'm sure I don't need point out that turned out to be shite too.
The reality is that you can produce forecasts to say whatever suits your political agenda. For example, remember the EU, well Germany actually, telling Greece that austerity, austerity, austerity, was the only solution? Well here's a surprise:
And here's how compassionate the EU is towards people on their knees :
I could also mention the politically motivated bollocks said by a Treasury concerning UK austerity and budgetary deficit, and I might if you want, but to get back to my original point concerning Cameron's melodramatic shite about the risk of war in Europe if Britain voted to leave in June 2016. I am indeed aware of what he actually said. He said :
"The serried rows of white headstones in lovingly tended Commonwealth war cemeteries stand as silent testament to the price this country has paid to help restore peace and order in Europe."
And :
"From Caesar’s legions to the wars of the Spanish Succession, from the Napoleonic Wars to the fall of the Berlin Wall.
The moments of which we are rightly most proud in our national story include pivotal moments in European history. Blenheim. Trafalgar. Waterloo. Our country’s heroism in the Great War."
He also went on to evoke the memories of Winston Churchill and Britain's "lone stand" against Nazi Germany in 1940.
It is the sort of mind-numbingly pathetic rhetoric that I expect from Nigel Farage. Shite in other words.
ernielynch
Member
Nah, if you make a prediction and it turns out to be a shite prediction it’s still shite.
And you think this prediction- that britain leaving the EU increases the risk of war in Europe- has turned out to be shite?
What actually happened was that unemployment went through the roof after joining.
The OPEC crisis and Thatcherism were not predicted before we joined the EEC… I'm not sure failing to join would have inoculated the UK against the unemployment caused by either.
Ernie, what year did you begin working in the UK?
You mean the OPEC crises of 1973 wasn't predicted in 1974?
And you're right, the EEC/EU didn't protect us from Thatcherism. I keep telling the europhiles that but they won't listen, as they repeat the "worker's rights" mantra. She was of course a firm remainer, a bit like you kelvin.
We joined the EEC before the OPEC crisis hit, in the same year.
Thatcherism (deliberately) raised unemployment… which has nothing to do with the UK joining the EEC.
Sorry I meant to say 1975, the year of the referendum. My mistake.
“worker’s rights” mantra
The UK adopting the social chapter post dates Thatcher, no? In fact, the lessons learned from what she did was arguably a driving force behind its creation.
Thatcherism (deliberately) raised unemployment… which has nothing to do with the UK joining the EEC.
Which of course makes my point. The answer is British government policy, not the EU. The EU is simply concerned that one country doesn't have an unfair competitive advantage over others. It couldn't give a monkeys how unfair a government is towards its citizens. The UK didn't have to ask permission from the EU when it decided that someone with less than 2 years employment could legally be unfairly dismissed.
Tony Blair famously boasted "we will still have the most restrictive union laws in the Western world", he was actually proud of that. Being a member of the EU didn't stop the most restrictive union laws in the Western world.
It may be a boast, but it isn't true, is it?
It couldn’t give a monkeys how unfair a government is towards its citizens.
Why doesn't it allow a free for all then, resulting in a race to bottom across the EU states and its closest trading partners?
There are reasons why minimum standards for workers rights need to be agreed between multiple countries (the EU spreads this to nonEU countries when signing trade arrangements as well as internally) and you can pretend all you like not to understand why that is.
And how about freedom of movement of workers?
When did you start working in the UK?
OK I'm going to leave it now. What started off as my take on the EU election results has now become a straight for or against the EU argument. It's completely off-topic and there is already a thread for that.
Junker's replacement currently being decided. Hopefully the Danish lady or Dutch bloke. I hope Macron can get the socialists on board.
