Do you REALLY believe this and do you REALLY think it’s good idea to spread such shite? No wonder social media is such a cesspit…
I don’t think anyone has said these looters are stealing stuff from millionaires,
Well my comment was responding to this claim :
Looters dressed as fire fighters are looting the homes of the rich and famous apparently.
Also, they’re looting from active fire areas, wearing highly inflammable synthetics is stupid
I totally agree, it would of course be stupid. It does indeed make sense for the looters to take health and safety considerations seriously. I am just a tad surprised that they chosen to be fully kitted out with fire fighters PPE from eBay.
I am also a tad surprised that online orders are currently still getting delivered in Southern California.
I am just a tad surprised that they chosen to be fully kitted out with fire fighters PPE from eBay.
Perhaps you could contact the LA Sheriff who was on BBC 6 o’clock News a little while ago, who actually stopped and spoke to a fully kitted out firefighter sitting by the side of the road, he asked the bloke if he was ok, and needed any help, water or anything, then realised the bloke was sitting in handcuffs, he was a looter who’d been apprehended and arrested, the Sheriff said he looked just like all the other fire fighters.
Are you still going to argue the toss with a senior law enforcement officer with first hand knowledge? Seriously?
Perhaps you could contact the LA Sheriff who was on BBC 6 o’clock News a little while ago
Why, how is he going to make me less surprised?
FWIW firefighter kit is readily available to buy by the public in the US - many firefighters are volunteers for fire departments in rural areas and they like to purchase their own kit, particularly the latest fabrics/better protection. Consequently, there’s a healthy market in used stuff too. Lots of volunteer firefighters are coming from across the Pacific Northwest to help, so wearing a Hicksville, OR fire dept jacket isn’t going to look suspicious. I spent a number of years in the fire and industrial safety sector.
It’s an area that voted democrat.
During his last administration Trump intended to withhold federal aid to California after Hurricane Helene on account of state being democrat - and therefore people who didn't vote of him. The National Security Council had to look up figures, area by area, and demonstrate to the president how many Trump voters were amongst the victims in each 'democrat' county - they had to explain to him there were more Trump voters in Orange County alone - just that one county - than in the the whole of the state of IOWA. There are almost as many Trump voters in California as there are in Texas or Florida. It was only on that basis that he was persuaded to sanction aid.
I don't think it was Hurricane Helene, that was last year in Florida. There was another Helene in the late 50s.
FWIW firefighter kit is readily available to buy by the public in the US – many firefighters are volunteers for fire departments in rural areas and they like to purchase their own kit, particularly the latest fabrics/better protection.
Weirdly enough I have two friends in California. Both live in Orange County now.
One of them grew up in Bel Air, about 5km east of the Pallisades fire eastern edge. She actually runs a workwear company specialising in fireproof workwear (mainly for linesman i think). Ironically her previous warehouse burnt down!
Meanwhile Mr Luna, the county sheriff, said there had so far been approximately 29 arrests amid the fires, including a man posing as a firefighter to burgle a home.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cz0l4pkrrm9o
So as Countzero says some truth in it, although no reports they were carrying an 80" flat screen telly at the time
This is a very interesting article in the LA Times
I don’t think it was Hurricane Helene, that was last year in Florida. There was another Helene in the late 50s.
Sorry - mixing up my biblical plagues.
It was during the aftermath of Helene that the story came to light - Trump was accusing Biden of not aiding red states, doing his usual projection thing - thats when members of NSC revealed Trumps actions when in office - it was the 2018 wild fires in California that Trump was withholding aid for.
Given that California's GDP makes it the 5th or 6th biggest economy in the world I find this a bit strange
https://variety.com/2025/music/news/live-nation-fire-aid-benefit-concert-intuit-dome-1236272085/
Also, the earlier comments about people who have lost everything might be okay as they are in the US, Trump's politicisation of this will no doubt limit any federal aid for California (even though they should be able to pay for the recovery themselves).
It's awful
I find this a bit strange
Don't forget the arts, and an event like this especially, aren't just about money. It can also about people coming together. It can be about reflection on what has been lost. It can be a celebration of what still is. It can help people gain perspective, and hope.
it’s a country with the political and financial influence to have prevented (or slowed) climate change if it’d wanted to, and has the financial capacity to put things right now.
Nah, the USA is not like that. It's a juggernaut that's out of control. Just because it has a government doesn't mean anyone's in control of the country as a whole.
I’ve just read something about the extent of the fires so far, and done a quick comparison with somewhere I know that isn’t too far away, and it rather puts this into perspective:
LA fires - extent so far - 62 sq mi / 160 sq km
Eaton + Palisades fires 59 sq mi / 153 sq km
Bristol city and county 40 sq mi / 110 sq km
Just trying to imagine the whole of the city and county completely destroyed!
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Christ, it’s a great area than Manchester - 45 sq mi / 116 sq km
Not bigger than Greater London. Yet.
Yup staggering .........a total of 121 sq miles, that is 77,440 acres !
Imagine though nearly nearly half a million acres going up in smoke:
"Since the start of September, over 180,000 hectares ( 444,789 acres) of dry forest and savannah have gone up in smoke around Cerro Chovoreca, a protected reserve near the border with Bolivia."
'The Earth is crying out for help’: as fires decimate South America, smoke shrouds its skies
Edit : Sorry my figure may have been somewhat misleading, the total area destroyed by fire in South America last year was over 212 million acres, although I don't think that the fires have all been extinguished yet.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_South_American_wildfires
Wow, you should probably start a thread about that!
UK ~24million hectares
Australian fires 2019/20 ~24 million hectares
South American fires 2024 ~86 million hectares!
LA fires ~16,000 hectares (currently) - but probably lots more humans directly impacted.
I think this is possibly the latest update from yesterday…
This bit caught my eye:
Crews from California and nine other states are part of the ongoing response that includes nearly 1,400 fire engines, 84 aircraft and more than 14,000 personnel, including newly arrived firefighters from Mexico.
It’s not obvious from footage and photos just how many aircraft are operating within LA airspace, 84 is astonishing. Then all the other emergency teams.
but probably lots more humans directly impacted.
I'm not sure about that. I think the difference is more that unlike Hollywood which everyone knows about most people probably haven't heard of Porto Velho
For Porto Velho’s 500,000 residents the blazes have been suffocating. “We’re breathing in so much detritus,” said its health secretary, Marilene Penati, a pediatrician.
And hopefully the L.A. fires won't exceed the 148 confirmed dead in the South American fires.
Sounds serious, maybe you should start a thread if you want people to hear about it.
Nah, it's not very important. Just an observation about the size because a comparison was made with Bristol.
My wifes cousin live in Altadena, we have been getting regular updates from him. He can account for 42 of their friends who have lost houses.
He is saying that there is incredible energy and optimism to re-build and, in some cases, insurance companies have already been wiring money through. That is all lovely but how on earth do you cut through regulations, find trades people and building materials to reconstruct a minimum of 10k properties in just that one town? And, even if you do re-build, who on earth is going to be able to afford the future insurance premiums? A huge amount of businesses have also stopped trading and unemployment is going to be a big issue. Not everyone in the area are super rich celebrities.
Good time to be a carpenter, plumber or sparkie.....!
It might not be. There is already a huge surge in demand so materials will be incredibly expensive if they can get them. Even the US struggle with this. Take into account that this has been a very bad year for hurricanes, severe convective storms (tornadoes, huge hailstorms, straightline wind), floods etc
Tradesmen will be on the phone 90% of the time and not actually working and restoring properties.
Theyll end up bringing in cheaper labour from Mexico to get through this surge of building. I'm sure Trump will be delighted, or block it.
Another factor is that those with insurance might be stuck as insured amounts may not cover the full cost of rebuild due to increased prices.
Another factor is that those with insurance might be stuck as insured amounts may not cover the full cost of rebuild due to increased prices.
By coincidence, I’ve just finished reading an in-depth article on precisely that subject! And the prospect isn’t good. It being America, everything is profit driven with lots of people seeking to make as much money as they can without actually doing anything to help the people in need. It’s complicated, but worth reading, and it might be an indicator of how the situation may change here. Insurance premiums are rising now, it’s unlikely to change for the better.
That is a good article. Insurance in the US is a basket case. Florida has very similar problems to California based on crazy legislation, practices and increases in hurricane and flooding risk. Also the NFIP flood program is not fit for purpose and the appetite to provide solutions isn't there even at State level Dept of Insurance.
Add climate change to the heady mix and it's not looking good. It matters as insurance increases societal resilience to bad stuff, if the sector is declining then that resiliency is being chipped away. Insurance is a global industry so it will have an impact across the globe if they fail in the US.
Add climate change to the heady mix and it’s not looking good. It matters as insurance increases societal resilience to bad stuff, if the sector is declining then that resiliency is being chipped away. Insurance is a global industry so it will have an impact across the globe if they fail in the US.
I was assuming that, I don’t understand how such financial institutions work, but I’d guessed that it isn’t just Californians who will be hit financially, the companies will be looking to claw back money to boost profits for their shareholders, so everyone else sees higher policy costs. *sigh* If it ain’t one damn thing it’s another!
On another note, here’s a nice little article showing the work of the water bombers from British Columbia who’ve been working so hard trying to control the fires - I hadn’t realised they mostly fly at night, about 70% of their runs are in the dark, if I understand correctly, which makes things even more dangerous.
There’s a short video of a Chinook doing a run with onboard cameras.
One of the biggest issues with the insurance sector is that they tend to write insurance policies on a one-year or multi-year basis. We are all familiar with the concept of home insurance or car insurance for one year. More forward thinking insurance companies will provide multi-year, as in three to five year policies, for commercial or industrial risks but they rarely do this for residential properties.
Perhaps the underlying issue is that in large insurers it is the underwriters who express their appetite for risk in the way they cover certain policies. The underwriters are often remunerated via commission based on total premium, so they will often take on extra risks hidden underneath the urge to diversify the portfolio of risk, however these risks can back fire at times. As the underwriters are basically hedging their bets and some years it's okay but in other years. They often move from one company to another company every couple of years therefore they could be actually taking on toxic risks but nobody finds out until it's too late by which time they've made lots of money and left/moved to another company continuing their short-sighted practices.
Fortunately the mortgage industry is a much larger part of the financial sector and within the mortgage industry they are now starting to take things like climate change very seriously as the risk could change over the 25-30-40 year lifespan of that mortgage and they do not want to be caught with their pants down. We are all aware of the toxic subprime loan scandal which was the catalyst for the 2008 global financial crisis. There is a possible future where climate change can have a similar impact due to misplaced hedging on risks which are relatively safe today but will become toxic in the future.
It's not all doom and gloom though many large organizations and banks and insurers have a chief risk officer - it is within their duties to determine the risk to which the company is exposed to on a holistic basis not just simple nuts and bolts things but big picture stuff. Their job is not day to day cashflow risks but the big stuff that affects solvency of their organisation or the sectors.
subprime loan scandal which was the catalyst for the 2008 global financial crisis
ironically, the main subprime lender had offices along the I101 in Calabassas, Agoura Hills, Thousand Oaks, Simi Valley.
