Forum menu
You're sounding a bit desperate now, tbh.
🙂
A bit desperate!?
if you keep feeding him he will show just how desperate he can go for attention
Think of your mothers will you
#rapeybanhammer
no, because he wouldn't have known about these talks with Thatcher-
Well SF-IRA knew, didn't they - are you now telling me that [u]they[/u] didn't tell him they were speaking to government?
He was their best friend in London, and they kept that from him?
Doesn't say much about their view of him, does it? If they were keeping secrets like that from him, how on earth could he be involved in honest and truthful dialogue to achieve peace?
I wonder what else they kept from him or lied about?
On top of which, although the records were under the 30 year rule, senior Labour Party members all knew at the time, on a Privy Council basis, so how can you allege that he was acting on behalf of the party?
BTW - I'm still waiting for any proof of him speaking to the Unionists, you know, all this 'dialogue' in order to achieve the lasting peace in NI that he so cared about.
[img] http://www.scotsman.com/webimage/1.4441279.1494346142!/image/image.jp g" target="_blank">
Lock up your mothers.
He's on a roll again.
Cor, I think Ninfan has finally blown a piston.
only being ignored would really annoy him
I think very many people care about Corbyn's links with the IRA. However I suspect all those undergrads who signed up to vote don't much care or more probably even know what went on before they where born. Corbyn was a maverick peripheral figure with zero influence during the vast majority of his politcal career.
It's ironic that should Corbyn ever get into power on the back of this youth / student vote it is those people sho in rheir later years are going to saddeled with attempting to pay off the staggering debts built up and finding they have no state pension as the country can't afford it 40 years from now. No skin off my nose, I'll likely be long dead.
Oooooh...bitter lemon with your gin sir?
I always read Jamba's posts with 'interest'. His latest ??? is, IMO, bang on the money.
I suspect he and I are of similar vintage and have lived with/through the consequences of multiple govs; that brings a certain amount of......cynicism/experience/disillusionment/wisdom(????) - take your pick.
This is an unholy trucking mess with no clear way forward. The DUP are poisonous bed partners who will extract the maximum possible from May & co (in other words, us) - and sod the consequences; their focus will undoubtedly be £, the union and a soft border. Their sanctimonious statements about LGBT matters are nothing more than window dressing for some of their swivel-eyed loon supporters; money is what matters - grubby, dirty, venal cash.
My mother was Irish (Eire) and I have relations living/working on both sides of the border - some in 'mixed' marriages/relationships - so I have some understanding. None of my Irish connections would piss on a DUP MP if their arse was on fire.
On a different note, Johnson is a Roman scholar and is trying to play 'palace intrigues and plotting' - sorry Bozza, you're as transparent as a pair of wet white knickers.
If anyone wishes to rub their crystal balls and tell us what happens........
It's ironic that should Corbyn ever get into power on the back of this youth / student vote it is those people sho in rheir later years are going to saddeled with attempting to pay off the staggering debts built up and finding they have no state pension as the country can't afford it 40 years from now.
Says the guy who's backs Brexit 😯
Says the guy who's backs Brexit
Corbyn campaigned for Brexit since 1983
On his "working for peace"
Corbyn campaigned for Brexit since 1983
May backed remain
If you have a point, please furnish us with it
Corbyn apparently preparing his own Queens speech, if he doesn't need it now, he'll have one ready after the next election 🙂
If you have a point, please furnish us with it
The youth/ anti Brexit protest vote went to the guy who had been campaigning for Brexit since before most of them were born
The youth/ anti Brexit protest vote went to the guy who had been campaigning for Brexit since before most of them were born
Fortunately his manifesto was all about the soft Brexit (see excerpts on other thread)
As he's a man of honour (something so lacking in the Tories) you can take that to the bank......
However I suspect all those undergrads who signed up to vote don't much care or more probably even know what went on before they where born.
The idiots are probably thinking about the future instead if the distant past, I shouldn't wonder. What good will that do!
I suspect he and I are of similar vintage and have lived with/through the consequences of multiple govs; that brings a certain amount of......cynicism/experience/disillusionment/wisdom(????) - take your pick.
And I am probably of the same vintage too but I have an opposing view. I stay open minded and full of hope for a fairer system.
Taking my pick from your list of what happened to you I would say cynicism (adding a bit of selfishness) rather than experience or wisdom. Seems to happen to majority of people as they age which is why they swing from left to right as they get past 40. They have got what they want and want to keep it that way.
It's ironic that should Corbyn ever get into power on the back of this youth / student vote it is those people sho in rheir later years are going to saddeled with attempting to pay off the staggering debts
You see staggering debts, I see slight worse off rich people and better public services for all.
Maybe the young are just more open minded than you?
Like Kerley, I didn't see 'staggering debts' either; I saw a sensible tax and spend policy that ironically will hit me pretty hard.
But do you know what- I'll welcome it, because I've done pretty well- luck, mostly, if I'm honest- and that's the way it ought to work. I'll be ok, and now more importantly so might some other folk.
Endlessly harping on about Corbyn and terrorism, and how younger votes are invalidated by a lack of life experience? Remember what told us in Brexit, how we'd alienated the leavers by endlessly marginalising their choice, calling them 'fick', and that led to them kicking back? Well, all the Corbs-Terror-Yoof angle is going to do is alienate those who voted for him against you, too. Maybe you'll be happy with that, I don't know? But calling out that the younger vote is invalid just because they are younger and *possibly* less experienced- well, I think that will backfire in the same way that leaver-alienation did. A vote cast is a choice made, deal with it, as you reminded us many times. The young are bearing the brunt of austerity and I'd argue they know more about it than you ever will.
And if you hadn't already noticed- even if its true, it didn't work, so I think you'll need another strategy that's better than this ad-hom. Especially on the back of the DUP alliance 🙂
....that's got miles to go yet in the 'siding with terrorists' angle. Its a big big box of splashback.
🙂
The youth/ anti Brexit protest vote went to the guy
Can you evidence the anti Brexit vote went to Corbyn. Because he wasn't campaigning to stop Brexit.
Anti hard Brexit maybe.
Like Kerley, I didn't see 'staggering debts' either; I saw a sensible tax and spend policy that ironically will hit me pretty hard.
+1 though my folks just quoted some similar crap about tuition fee's. Massive hole in that argument but that's what you get for reading the right wing press.
Young people are not getting their information from the traditional sources, the influence of the mail/express/sun is falling. We have also been schooled enough in political debate to know when somebody is trying very hard to keep attention off them.
The young are bearing the brunt of austerity and I'd argue they know more about it than you ever will.
Quite, everytime somebody with a free education, nearly paid off mortgage and solid pension tells you that the current youth have never had it so good and if they just worked a bit harder they could afford the 500K 2 bed semi needing a lot of work it gets worse.
It certainly did round here. Bristol is staunchly remain and returned 4 labour mps. Our area specifically is one of the most pro remain in the country (86%) and labour took significant gains from the pro remain parties, the greens and lib dems.Can you evidence the anti Brexit vote went to Corbyn.
the influence of the mail/express/sun is falling
https://www.themediabriefing.com/article/youth-audiences-newspaper-old-demographics-advertising
Couple of years old and doesn't really single out the yoof but there's a few pretty graphs to look at.
Main thing is the Sun is still very popular amongst those that still read papers under 34
It certainly did round here.
I voted against Brexit in the referendum but didn't vote to stop Brexit in the election, if I did I'd have voted Lib Dem and certainly not for someone with a long track record of disliking the EU. Which was what I was really enquiringly about, there's an assumption it was a stop Brexit vote but I've not seen evidence to back it up beyond the anecdotal. And the commentary on this forum is hardly balanced.
Well you actually asked if the anti brexit vote went to labour, not if people voted labour to stop brexit. There's certainly evidence here that pro remain voted labour. Labour 22,900 to 47,200; Green 17,200 to 9,200; lib dem 12,100 to 5,200. Given we voted 86% remain a reasonable chunk of remain voters switched their vote from a definite remain party to labour. Its impossible to say[i] why[/i] they did that other than anecdotally but they did do it.Which was what I was really enquiringly about, there's an assumption it was a stop Brexit vote but I've not seen evidence to back it up beyond the anecdotal
I suspect you were both always right wing and are still both just right wing Just like i was always left wing and I am still left wingI suspect he and I are of similar vintage and have lived with/through the consequences of multiple govs; that brings a certain amount of......cynicism/experience/disillusionment/wisdom(????) - take your pick.
the rest is just an attempt to claim wisdom of age for views you have always had
Well you actually asked if the anti brexit vote went to labour
Coz I'm #difficultandwobbly
Can I haz a gold star for spotting the Labour resurgence?
[url= https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/has-corbyn-stolen-trumps-playbook-beate-kubitz ]Has Corbyn stolen Trump's playbook?[/url]
I am so excited about this election. Everything I have ever worked for (human rights, an end to stigma around mental health, sustainable transport) has been roundly trashed in the Sun. This election has shown that it is no longer 'the Sun wot won it'. Sure, it will have had an impact (otherwise there'd have been a Labour landslide) but Murdoch - and the other billionaire media barons' power is waning. Delighted that Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour Party have worked out a way round them.
piemonster
Can you evidence the anti Brexit vote went to Corbyn.
Thats a good point actually piemonster, and you're right- can we take it as a given that what's just happened was a vote against a hard brexit?
2 things:
1)Corbyn's views on brexit were well-known, and 'soft' would just about describe it, I would say. Not anti, not hard, somewhere middlish.
2)The right-wing press are saying it. If they've conceded it, then its over.
Clover - Member - Block User - Quote
Can I haz a gold star for spotting the Labour resurgence?
Great article 🙂
[img] 
[/img]
Baffled. Shadow chancellor just said on TV labour would end membership of single market when leaving EU.
Surely not that different to Conservative approach then?
Thanks... I've been on tenterhooks over this because I was convinced I was seeing something but then every time I saw a print headline I was worried that I was wrong.
I think the Westminster bubble in which the media and MPs reflect back on each other needs to burst. The Blair/Tory 'how to win an election' blueprint = win over Rupert Murdoch and you will win. Obviously that was never going to happen and I can see why Labour MPs were panicking about 'electability'. Hopefully they'll be less worried henceforth.
Interesting to see what happens next - whether Murdoch changes tone or whether he buys up Facebook. Hmmm.
Murdoch wont change tune and i think many would be disappointed if Corbyn cosyed up to him and I doubt he would- certainly affect his standing amongst his core voters
IMHO digger tends to just side with the winner - whilst being quite RW himself- as he wants/needs to have influence.
THe DM - much as i despise them - actually mean what they say and even Cameron asked for Dacre - head of the press standards btw - to be sacked/reigned in.
Double standards or what?
JC who stood by a grave & had a couple of chats with some shady Irishman? ABHORENT.
The Tory councillor who was an active member of the IRA & was at one time on the run with £20k of IRA swag & a loaded revolver? SILENCE.
Tell me - which one actually broke the fing law??
Laughable stuff from the Tory fanbois.
what were you expecting a principle above self interest 😉
Junkyard:
Murdoch wont change tune and i think many would be disappointed if Corbyn cosyed up to him and I doubt he would- certainly affect his standing amongst his core votersIMHO digger tends to just side with the winner - whilst being quite RW himself- as he wants/needs to have influence.
Yes, that's what I wonder. Just toning down the anti-Corbyn hysteria would be interesting and presumably not going to damage sales given the polls. Or there's presumably the temptation to double-down and up the hysteria (if that's possible) and try and buy social media.
IMHO digger tends to just side with the winner - whilst being quite [s]RW[/s] a **** himself
FTFY
mikewsmith - Member+1 though my folks just quoted some similar crap about tuition fee's
The tuition fee thing is mostly because the truth is quite complicated and unintuitive and the falsehood/misunderstanding is simple and "obvious".
I mean, it's my job so I know exactly how the numbers work but they still don't seem real. The fact that the last tuition fee increase is likely to lead to a net loss to the public purse because of rocketing nonrepayment, like a sort of tuition fee laffer curve, gives me a sort of divide by common sense error. My forebrain knows it's true but my limbic system says it can't be.
Just saw that the Welsh distillery Penderyn have a new whiskey out called Red Flag 🙂
I'm sure it's just a coincidence and not a political statement....
Some talking points for ninfan, jamba, big_n_daft, cranberry, chewkw, etc
https://capx.co/all-that-matters-now-is-stopping-corbyn/
Some more food for thought, I know you all love a bit of marxist analysis...
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/commentisfree/2017/jun/12/paul-mason-jeremy-corbyn-defeat-ruling-elite-antonio-gramsci
Oh - and the fact he mentions Boris for PM in that article just shows how out of touch he is with what really went wrong.
Good to see that they realise the tories have no viable candidates and are just hoping for something to turn up in next 5 years.
Baffled. Shadow chancellor just said on TV labour would end membership of single market when leaving EU.Surely not that different to Conservative approach then?
If you leave the EU, you leave membership the single market. Norway, for example, is not a member of the single market, instead it pays for access to it.