Jeremy Corbyn

Which was exactly the point being made, as opposed to the suggestion those disagreeing with the leader should consider their position.

You were suggesting that the mandate came from the election manifesto. I doubt the people who voted for Corbyn back in May see it that way...

There's been a resurgence of the left in Greece, Spain and Italy. France has a socialist president. Corbyn's election would seem to be part of a wider European trend.

But in government they're behaving just like centerist parties.

You were suggesting that the mandate came from the election manifesto. I doubt the people who voted for Corbyn back in May see it that way...

I was covering two points together in those posts - (a) that the electorate put them there, not the labour party members and (b) they were elected on the basis of the manifesto not any subsequent change of leadership and policy.

Those two points mean there is no need to resign.

I was covering two points together in those posts - (a) that the electorate put them there, not the labour party members and (b) they were elected on the basis of the manifesto not any subsequent change of leadership and policy.

Those two points mean there is no need to resign.

I agree with your first point, but the reasons people have for electing their local MP are not necessarily to be found on a manifesto.

But in government they're behaving just like centerist parties.

Not really. In Greece, the government was crushed by more powerful forces. Podemos are in opposition in Spain. Hollande has raised taxes for the rich and liberalised minority rights.

they were elected on the basis of the manifesto not any subsequent change of leadership and policy.

Tony Blair didn't have any problem when he became leader and massively changed policy.

.

Those two points mean there is no need to resign.

But you said : "[i]that the electorate put them there, not the labour party members[/i]" so if the Labour Party has changed and they want to stick to the old election manifesto surely it follows that they should resign from the Labour Party.

What are they doing in a party that they don't agree with and which 'didn't put them there', according to you ?

[url= http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jeremy-corbyn-appoints-a-vegan-to-deal-with-britains-farmers-10500157.html ]He's taking the p*ss now.[/url]

I'm calling troll. It's the only rational explanation.

Fascinating stuff!

That's a pretty ridiculous piece of writing there dazh (not sure if you read through it or not...).

But the statement: "if she gets her way..."

MID POST EDIT: And gadzooks, as I went back the read the article the bit I wanted to copy and paste has been removed. 😯

Anyway, she's my local MP (and I voted for her). She's actually alright tbf...always responds to any question I ask her on twitter and I admire her stances on foodbanks and waste.

I had no idea until the last few days that The Independent was so anti-Corbyn...hadn't really been following their coverage of the whole thing but I'm seeing lots of anti- articles being linked to.

He's taking the p*ss now.

Would it have been better if he had appointed a vegetarian like himself because vegetarians eat eggs and cheese ?

In other news the transport minister Lilian Greenwood is a cyclist! Corbyn is clearly taking the piss!

[i]"my experience of cycling in Nottingham is that there are some really good off-road cycling provisions, although people still face the daily pressure of there being quite fast-moving traffic and it’s quite clear that car drivers sometimes haven’t seen you.

I cycle a lot when I’m in London. I’m a commuter cyclist in London, I’m more of a leisure cyclist at home, and I think the biggest difference is the sheer number of cyclists in London. Although there has been a big increase in cycling in Nottingham City, we’re not getting the weight of numbers you see in London"[/i]

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/cycle-deaths-in-nottinghamshire-lilian-greenwood-mp-qa-34660

Would it have been better if he had appointed a vegetarian like himself because vegetarians eat eggs and cheese ?

Lighten up, it was a joke. I think it's great he's put a vegan in charge of the farming/rural brief. At least she'll have a proper appreciation of what's involved as in my experience vegans are incredibly well researched. We might even get some proper opposition against the tories vendetta against badgers. I wonder what her views are on re-wilding? That really would be the icing on the cake.

He's taking the p*ss now.

I'm calling troll. It's the only rational explanation.

From Saturday onwards its been like a marathon episode of Yes Minister with a very far fetched plot.

I really feel for the serious politicians who are going to need to restore credibility once the clowns leave the stage.

Lighten up, it was a joke.

I'm not sure if my comment was aimed at you or the article in the Independent which you linked to, but thanks for letting me know anyway.

BTW my comment with regards to him taking the piss for appointing a cyclist as minister of transport was a joke too, so you can lighten up about telling me to lighten up!

At least she'll have a proper appreciation of what's involved as in my experience vegans are incredibly well researched.

Why thank you for your faith but honestly my knowledge of this issue is not great tbh. I think you can guess where I sit on its ethics.

FWIW its not like they always have a doctor for health or teacher for education so ignorance is clearly no bar to political office 😉

The BBC made a point of highlighting the vegan aspect. The mainstream media are certainly out to get Corbyn, it's sickening.

Does lack of meat in your brain render it unable to understand agribusiness then?

The BBC made a point of highlighting the vegan aspect. The mainstream media are certainly out to get Corbyn, it's sickening.

Target rich environment 😆

Well the PM and Boris are also cyclists. In fact the amount of cyclists on both sides in prominent positions is quite high, now if only they could all agree and force councils to improve provision of facilities and infrastructure etc.

The BBC made a point of highlighting the vegan aspect. The mainstream media are certainly out to get Corbyn, it's sickening.

I can't say it bothers me if she's vegan or not, but it might bother someone so I don't see the BBC are obliged not to report it.

Hard to imagine any reason why the BBC would be biased at all, let alone against the party who are likely to give them most funding.

but it might bother someone so I don't see the BBC are obliged not to report it.

The BBC can't be expected to cover every thing that may happen to bother someone, I can't think there are many people who would be bothered by the vegan issue. They included it in their coverage to try and play the "what a whackey shadow cabinet" angle they decided to take.

I should point out that Badnewz is known on here for his unpopular right wing views (who dislikes the current Tories for not being rightwing), so I'm not biased in Corbyn's favour.

The BBC can't be expected to cover every thing that may happen to bother someone

Nor should they be expected to hide it.

but it might bother someone so I don't see the BBC are obliged not to report it.

It might bother a hell of a lot of people that the shadow transport minister is a keen cyclist, are the BBC reporting that too?

Or is the fact that it was Ed Miliband who initially made her shadow transport minister not Corbyn mean that it's a different kettle of fish?

KMcC seems pretty good to me based on this fairly detailed email to a constituent when she was seeking election:

http://stephjb.blogspot.co.uk/2015/04/kerry-mccarthy-talks-about-humane.html?m=1

Bet not every MP would have bothered.

Isn't Hilary Benn a vegetarian and wasn't he made minister for environment food and rural affairs by Tony Blair? Maybe Corbyn's moving to centre already 😉

I always thought that she was a dim-witted racist, is this not the case?

Diane Abbot is not a racist.

Thats right, its just that white people really do like to play divide and rule...

The tories put a thief in charge of the economy, an idiot in charge of education (then replaced him with an apparent illiterate, who'd previously served as a homophobic minister for equality) a sick man in charge of the NHS, a sadist in charge of the welfare state and a racist in charge of immigration so having a vegan in charge of farming is relatively low key 😆

The UK now has no realistic opposition party any longer, not even a party one could class as a protest vote.

The Lib-dems broke my 18 year old heart in 1999 and I never voted again.

I might give it another try if it turns out there is an actual opposition.

The Lib-dems broke my 18 year old heart in 1999 and I never voted again.

Do you want to talk about it ?

Best one of those in a long time, cheers. Loving quantitative easing for the cabinet

@ransos I wouldn't be talking up the resurgence of the left in Greece just yet as the polls suggest Syriza are going to take a beating in the snap election. Yes correct the where faced down by more powerful forces, when you have no negotiating position it's best not to play hardball.

@binners as I understand it Diane Abbott did not want a major / front line shadow cabinet role, hence taking the lower key international development secretary position. Strange really as she wanted to stand for Lomdon Mayor but not be more actively involved in the front bench. I do agree though she adds a lot to the commons.

Oh jesus ****ing wept, another Downfall video? I thought all the meme generators for that would have been lost when the Internet Archive got fragged last year or whenever it was...

Yes correct the where faced down by more powerful forces

The powerful forces were just the people lending the cash, who just happened to be the EU.

Labour are going to be borrowing on the money markets with their 'print more money' policy.

What's that going to do to the interest rate we pay?

So the UK also has to placate more powerful forces, as does every other nation.

A fairly cynical, but well written article on Corbyn here:
http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-corbyn-supremacy

The BBC made a point of highlighting the vegan aspect. The mainstream media are certainly out to get Corbyn, it's [s]sickening[/s] quite a laugh.

It's ok, he's got a....

[url= https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5803/21245749570_087b4cccf9.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5803/21245749570_087b4cccf9.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/ynq2a5 ]Magic wand[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/jimmygrainger/ ]jimmyg352[/url], on Flickr

@ransos I wouldn't be talking up the resurgence of the left in Greece just yet as the polls suggest Syriza are going to take a beating in the snap election. Yes correct the where faced down by more powerful forces, when you have no negotiating position it's best not to play hardball.

The fact that Syriza were elected and Podemos now have 20% of the vote would have been unthinkable 2 years ago.

That's a brilliant article and just about sums it all up, for me. Is the rest of "The New Yorker" up to a similar scratch? I might have to start reading it.

konabunny - Member

Diane Abbot is not a racist.

Just a bit dim then.

I certainly know that at least one of her fellows finds her an embarrassment.

badnewz - Member

The BBC made a point of highlighting the vegan aspect. The mainstream media are certainly out to get Corbyn, it's sickening.

They're not doing a very convincing job.
I live in a Tory stronghold yet almost everyone I have spoken with has great respect for Corbyn, even if they do not agree entirely with his political beliefs.

I should point out that Badnewz is known on here for his unpopular right wing views

I should point out that the views of the STW hive are not indicative of the general population. 💡

Is the rest of "The New Yorker" up to a similar scratch? I might have to start reading it.

Agree re New Yorker. I found the metaphor at the beginning a bit cringeworthy but I stuck with it and I'm glad I did. I loved the understatement of "not one [a solution] that has met with unqualified success elsewhere".

If I were Corbyn's media adviser I would start setting up the media. Say something that you know they're going to try and distort to make him look bad, then reveal that actually it's perfectly reasonable. This way we could expose the media's bias and erode the public's trust in them (even more)

If I were Corbyn's media adviser I would start setting up the media. Say something that you know they're going to try and distort to make him look bad, then reveal that actually it's perfectly reasonable. This way we could expose the media's bias and erode the public's trust in them (even more)

Looks like Wednesday's PMQs are being crowdsourced:
http://www.labour.org.uk/page/s/what-would-you-like-to-ask-david-cameron-

The magic wand:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34244472

This way we could expose the media's bias and erode the public's trust in them (even more)

Studies have shown that, contrary to belief popular within "left" politics, what is printed in the likes of "The Sun" et al, have little or no influence on people's voting habits.

imo they need to quickly change they way they speak about economics.

The word 'anti-austerity' should be banned.

People voted for austerity, because it 'feels' like the morally right thing to do. In their heads anti-austerity translates as 'risk', 'recklessness', etc.

Labour need to call it what it is - not use the word austerity at all - rename it to something that doesn't sound quite as virtuous. Keep repeating who it serves.

Studies have shown that, contrary to belief popular within "left" politics, what is printed in the likes of "The Sun" et al, have little or no influence on people's voting habits.

Studies have shown that, contrary to belief popular within "left" politics, what is printed in the likes of "The Sun" et al, have little or no influence on people's voting habits.

Sauce?

imo they need to quickly change they way they speak about economics.
The word 'anti-austerity' should be banned.
People voted for austerity, because it 'feels' like the morally right thing to do. In their heads anti-austerity translates as 'risk', 'recklessness', etc.

Agree 100pc. I'm sure saw or read somewhere that the Tories coined the phrase "Austerity" for exactly the connotations you describe. In fact it's bollocks - we're over-spending to a laughable degree yet voters love the term because it makes us all feel we're going through pain for the greater good.

Anti-popularist-popularism. 😀

Studies have shown that, contrary to belief popular within "left" politics, what is printed in the likes of "The Sun" et al, have little or no influence on people's voting habits.

Has the ring of truth. Many people buy papers which support their pre-conceived ideas. If the paper tells them something they don't agree with they change the paper not their opinion.

How that £93 billion figure was calculated is farcical and clearly couldn't just disappear. As much of it is their either for government to pay for support services or to help companies invest in the UK as opposed to elsewhere.

Corbyn's media control seems a bit amateur at present. It will be interesting to see how it plays out in the long term as apparently there is a internal battle between Corbyn's own PR team and the Labour party PR team. Fun, fun 😉

I see a repeat of the referendum but on a much larger scale where it turns into a battle between the conventional media (newsparers, TV, etc) and the new media (bloggers and such).

Conventional media won on judges decision in Scotland but it may not go the same way in the UK.

People voted for austerity, because it 'feels' like the morally right thing to do.

The Tories played on that, being very disingenuous in the process. They realised they could let people think that government finances were the same as.domestic finances, because they want to shrink the state, and that provided a way of getting people to accept cuts.

It's this kind of duplicitous shit that people are hoping Corbyn won't try to pull. It's why we think of normal politicians as scum, why we don't trust them, and why many people don't vote.

media bias...
People presenting stuff that you disagree with

Studies have shown that, contrary to belief popular within "left" politics, what is printed in the likes of "The Sun" et al, have little or no influence on people's voting habits.

media bias...
People presenting stuff that you disagree with

45% disagreed with what they were presented with in Scotland.

mikewsmith - Member

media bias...
People presenting stuff that you disagree with

so 55% agreed, bout the same as the result.

Even when it's the other way round, it still stinks:

[img] ?w=620&q=85&auto=format&sharp=10&s=28390edd71bc19de80ac7f052aeab075[/img]

the tabloids in general on both sides report/exaggerate/sensationalise, they are nothing but comics, I could go and find some good Mirror ones.
They are guilty of making a headline that makes the most from any one story, a logical conclusion from JC not seeing any scenario where he would commit UK forces could be extended that we don't need an army.

As pointed out they are generally a place people go for confirmation of their beliefs.

The Daily Record have no choice but to love Corbyn since he's the best chance for bringing Yes voters back into the Labour fold.

so 55% agreed, bout the same as the result.

Yes, that's the point I was making. 45% believed the new media, 55% believed the old media.

Yes, that's the point I was making. 45% believed the new media, 55% believed the old media.

I don't see it as new v old media in those terms.

The old media is still creating the headlines, users of new media are more likely to see those headlines questioned and dissected.

print media self regulation is a joke

but digital is the wild west, im constantly having to smack down my sister in laws facebook posts from britain first-a-like 'news' sites

print media self regulation is a joke
but digital is the wild west, im constantly having to smack down my sister in laws facebook posts from britain first-a-like 'news' sites

This.

Papers are utter nonsense, broadcast media is a bit better. But new media is significantly worse than either.

Media coverage very poor and sensationalist - the Dirty Digger has laid out his cards clearly in both rags. "Kerching" for Jezza's media team who will have their hands full. Hire the same bloke as Salmond & Co - masterful spinning and positioning.

+1 on "anti-austerity" almost as much of a misnomer as "conviction" politician

I've yet to hear anyone say that a media outlet is biased in favour of Corbyn (apart from the Daily Record although they're not so much pro-Corbyn as they are anti-SNP).

Plenty are saying the opposite. Suggests to me that there's a sizeable percentage of the population being presented with nothing but views they don't agree with.

Plenty are saying the opposite. Suggests to me that there's a sizeable percentage of the population being presented with nothing but views they don't agree with.

No, I don't think there is, Bruce. 😀

print media self regulation is a joke

[url= http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society/new-regulator-leads-to-massive-improvement-in-press-behaviour-20150911101868 ]I think you'll find you're wrong[/url]

agree with vs truth? I don't give a shit if people agree with stuff, I care if the truth is being told.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-34218294
Full of lies?

I have absolutely no idea if it's full of lies, gospel truth, or somewhere in between.

I used to trust the BBC but after the referendum I couldn't give a shit what happens to it. It completely abandoned the idea of impartial reporting.

There are no sources of news that I trust. All you can do is read as many differing sources as possible (including the ones you don't agree with) and try to figure out what's going on.

Was it always this way?

One thing that seems to get repeated a lot is that it was the new (joining since GE) and £3 voters who swung it to Corbyn.

But the figures show that if you ignore all votes from members joining Labour after 2010 the percentages would still have been:
Corbyn 44% Burnham 23% Cooper 23% Kendall 10%

One thing that seems to get repeated a lot is that it was the new (joining since GE) and £3 voters who swung it to Corbyn.

Have you seen that in *any* mainstream media since the numbers were announced? Cite if you have.

I used to trust the BBC but after the referendum I couldn't give a shit what happens to it. It completely abandoned the idea of impartial reporting.

I know what you mean Bruce. It was shocking. Salmond was able to get away with ideas that currency = assets, that you could realistically have no lender of last resort; Eu shenanigans etc with barely a comment from dear old Auntie. Awful wasn't it!

But mikewsmith - nailed it really 😉 and as noted recently the canny folk of Scotland saw through the whole currency debacle fortunately. No wonder they have such a strong asset mgt industry!

Now for austerity etc.....

media bias...
People presenting stuff that you disagree with

+1

Seems that Corbyn managed to forget the words to the National Anthem today, so decided to stay silent 🙄 Even some of his own support don't seem impressed.

*If* he's really got a way of making us all well off by taxing high earners without chasing them abroad whilst printing money without causing significant inflation or significantly increasing the interest we have to pay our creditors then I really don't care if he sings the national anthem or not.

EDIT: Good point made below. On reflection, I don't GAF either way. It seems far more likely that he's anti-monarchy than anti-Britain, and that seems a fair enough position to take.

[s]*If* he's really got a way of making us all well off by taxing high earners without chasing them abroad whilst printing money without causing significant inflation or significantly increasing the interest we have to pay our creditors then [/s]I really don't care if he sings the national anthem or not.