[Closed] ISIS -Islamic State of Iraq and Syria

They have been pretty selective in Iraq-only going for Sunni areas where they can at least count on less resistance.

Baghdad is a different proposition all together and they may not be able to hold it even if they initially have some success there.

Iran for one won't let Baghdad fall - it is hugely important to them that they have a Shiite neighbour in Iraq to keep Saudi Arabia's power in check.

It is going to be a mess for some time though and it is likely to have security implications to the West but these people have been around for a while and are more interested in gaining territory locally.

Am i correct to assume than a large number of these mercenaries have come from this country and other European nations to fight in Syria? If so at some point they will return and aim to create chaos from within

Iran for one won't let Baghdad fall

I had wondered what their motivations were: helping the Shiites, or gaining some territory to get themselves closer to Israel. Maybe a bit of both?
Maybe this is also why the Americans (and us) -who lets face it partially created this mess by getting rid of Saddam- are seeming a bit cold on the idea of helping out.

EDIT: Not that Saddam was an angel, but he seemed to keep all the neighbours under control.

George W Bush. What a guy. What a plan.

rossi46
Am i correct to assume than a large number of these mercenaries have come from this country and other European nations to fight in Syria?

Although led by an Iraqi I believe that ISIS is mostly comprised of foreigners, many being Russians. And they're not "mercenaries".

EDIT : Perhaps Russian involvement in ISIS shouldn't be over emphasised, most ISIS fighters come from Arab countries, out of those that don't, many come from Russia/the former SU. I suspect British numbers are very small indeed.

George W Bush. What a guy. What a plan.

He had a plan??? 😆

You know that you're through the looking glass when Iran and the States are on the same side. Neither wanting to see Bahgdad fall. Ironically both are rendered powerless by their constant previous meddling in Iraq's affairs

America has seemed powerless for a while now- Mr Putin has made them look weak recently aswell. And i suspect China also will have a pop at them soon 😉

you realise that if someone took gwb and tb out there and beheaded them it would all calm down

I'll do it! 🙂

(maybe get chewkw to do it actually thinking about it... I've got to put the kids to bed)

Well it is precisely because there is zero chance of that happening that they were so enthusiastic about going to war.

War is much more attractive when it's other people, and other people's children, who are going to die, and not you or your children.

[url= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chickenhawk_%28politics%29 ]Chickenhawks[/url] sums it up nicely.

Handily, as ever [url= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_State_of_Iraq ]Wikipedia[/url] will tell you all you need to know about the history of this group.

And don't forget we in the West armed them when Mr Assad was the enemy in Syria 🙄

Well it is precisely because there is zero chance of that happening that they were so enthusiastic about going to war.

That and the profits, both from the weapons industry and the resources plundered...

I wouldn't be surprised in the least if these 'islamic extremists' were funded and trained (whether they themselves realize it or not) by western intelligence services as a means of furthering the demonization of the Muslim faith and as a pretext for returning troops to the area to apply further pressure to Iran and by proxy, Russia and China.

Of course, there is the possibility that they could be Russian Assets, attempting to further their powerbase in the area, but I would imagine Russia would not have an interest in creating such a high profile anti islamic sentiment.

binners - Member
You know that you're through the looking glass when Iran and the States are on the same side. Neither wanting to see Bahgdad fall. Ironically both are rendered powerless by their constant previous meddling in Iraq's affairs

soobalias - Member
you realise that if someone took gwb and tb out there and beheaded them it would all calm down

...nobody had taken a pop at the bastard

Well UK taxpayers are paying £6million a year to protect him.

[url= http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/6874145/Tony-Blair-costs-British-taxpayers-6m-a-year-to-protect.html ]Tony Blair costs British taxpayers £6m a year to protect[/url]

yunki - Member

I'll do it!

(maybe get chewkw to do it actually thinking about it... I've got to put the kids to bed)

I will make two of them snog each other passionately ... 😆

When ISIS get near the big oil fields America will pile in.

What do you think Mosul is then ?

I'll give it 6 months before the CIA start funding Al Qaeda to fight ISIS

Well it would require a name change so that people could forget who they were. Like when we decided to stop calling the Mujahideen in Afghanistan the Mujahideen and call them Al Qaeda instead, so that people wouldn't remember that we armed, trained, and financed, Osama bin Laden and his followers.

Perhaps we can go back to calling them the Mujahideen ?

I'll give it 6 months before the CIA start funding Al Qaeda to fight ISIS

Doubtless after funding ISIS in the first place, with assistance from MI6 and Mossad

all good though; guns give people jobs; war is good for the economy

One things for certain, hundreds of "British" jihadists are about to get on the job training. Just how many will eventually return to the UK to spread their goodwill is anyone's guess.

Mujahideen

AKA ISIS

Perhaps we can go back to calling them the Mujahideen ?

[img] [/img]

Kin attention seekers.

Imagine naming your political party / army after a crap bottom bracket / chainset standard....

Muppets.

@chluke- they haven't. It is more properly ISIL (Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant) but the Merkans wouldn't have understood that.

Actually it's the Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham. Levant is a very western word.

Just out of interest, are they allowed to use the ISIS word? I thought Shimano had that trademarked?

And today Tony Bliar has that "What's going on here" look slapped all over his Chevy Chase.
"Weren't me Guv" he insists.

😆

Got to agree with jivehoneyjive, in so far as western foreign policy towards the Islamic states and/ or states adjacent to the Suez seems to have changed from outright subjugation towards support of hardcore Islamic groups who place religious concerns way above the national interests of these countries.

seems like the west wants to render any Islamic state as chaotic as possible, divide and conquer, keep them distracted from their objective interests.

I just saw the photos of the massacre that is all over the news- scenes reminiscent of Nazi Germany and DR Congo a few years ago.
Horrific.
I guess it's been happening in Syria these past couple of years that it's perhaps become acceptable to these jihadists. Even Al Qaeda disowned them.
Barbaric animals.

Bugger, I posted in the other thread...

1/3 of the 9/11 casualties, will be interesting to see how folk react.

Nothing there about 9/11 Squirrel??
Is it the correct link?

[url= http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/15/iraq-isis-arrest-jihadists-wealth-power?CMP=EMCNEWEML6619I2 ]guardian article[/url]

It soon became clear that in less than three years, Isis had grown from a ragtag band of extremists to perhaps the most cash-rich and capable terror group in the world.

Armed by us and the US and funded by Saudi Arabia - i think they could well do some damage for years to come.
Oh the Irony

So the UK government has now decided that ISIS should be banned as a terrorist organisation and that membership and support for them should be a criminal offence.

[url= http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/jun/16/isis-syrian-terrorist-groups-banned-britain-iraq ]Isis terror group to be banned in Britain[/url]

Funny how ISIS has for years been operating in Syria taking large swathes of the country and committing horrifying atrocities and yet it wasn't classed as an illegal terrorist organisation and membership and support for it wasn't a criminal offence.

But now that they are causing trouble for that nasty sectarian and corrupt western-backed government in Baghdad, and are doing exactly the same things in Iraq as they have been in Syria, they suddenly become unacceptable terrorists and supporting them becomes a criminal offence.

[i]Home Office officials said that the move was triggered by the jihadist organisation's actions in Syria but developments in Iraq had underlined the need to ban the group in Britain.[/i]

Yeh right......"triggered by the jihadist organisation's actions in Syria" which has been going on for years - not since last week. In fact they have been fairly quiet in Syria since they've been focusing on Iraq. So it clearly wasn't "triggered" by actions in Syria. That's just another blatant Tony Blair type lie.

[i]Security minister James Brokenshire said: "We condemn all acts of terrorism committed in Syria"[/i]

Well I can't say that I can recall the UK government condemning acts of terrorism committed by the "rebels" fighting the Syrian government. These condemnations must have been very low key. By their own admission they didn't even class them as terrorists until this week.

Perhaps now they will put pressure on Tony Blair's very special friends, the dictators in Saudi Arabia and Kuwait, to stop supplying weapons to these newly discovered terrorists ?

Interesting read, this: http://www.salon.com/2014/06/16/sorry_george_w_bush_but_this_whole_mess_is_still_your_fault/
It calls for the impeachment of George Dubbya, and I was reading an op-ed today that said it wouldn't be impossible for Parliament to impeach Blair, as well. Very rare, last done in 1809, IIRC, but if the political will was there...
I admit to finding the idea of Blair and Bush being effectively on trial simultaneously highly appealing.

Nothing there about 9/11 Squirrel??
Is it the correct link?

No, I was referring to 1000 claimed dead vs ~3000 on 9/11

I've been wondering how an irregular force of what? 10,000? Or less probably, has been able to rout the US trained and equipped Iraqi army.
globalfirepower.com says they've got 271,000 front line troops and the tanks and guns to go with it. They must be a special kind of completely effing useless unless there is a bigger plan going on.

I've been wondering how an irregular force of what? 10,000? Or less probably, has been able to rout the US trained and equipped Iraqi army

Ironic isn't it that the UK has re-opened it's embassy in Tehran. The West must be very worried now that Iraq will descend in to full civil war and the Iranians will feel empowered by having an anti-western state as their neighbour.

It never ceases to amaze me, the complete lack of understanding of the situation out there, this time thanks to a total screw up President who favoured Shi-ite over Sunni, what did he think would happen?

We here in the UK are so deep into the reason for the mess throughout the entire region dating back to both World Wars, badly drawn borders after the first, establishing Israel after the 2nd, establishing the Shah of Iran and countless other smaller examples of imperial meddling including the recent Blair Bush Oil Agenda driven incursion and the drive by in Libya.

Now with a Liberal in the White house and a Political eunuch in No 10, Russia making them both look like wimps, it's hardly surprising local forces have taken over the baton. 'They' understand one thing and one thing only, strong forceful action, it's medieval over there and only medieval tactics work, the whole region is tribal, they have blood feuds dating back years, 'democracy' as we understand it would never function, heck we've been screwing up since the original Crusades, thinking that by cosying up to Iran it'll sort itself out is so naive as to be criminal. Shi-ites are the minority, they are a troublesome minority at that, it's bad enough we fall out with Islam, but to now attempt to take sides between the warring factions and to pick the wrong side is stupidity. It's not just Saudi that's Sunni, ****stan is Sunni, pretty much the entire Islamic world is Sunni which was why they were happy enough for Iran to be the fall guy, this latest turn of events is not going to end well, in fact it may even be the start of something much much worse, not good news at all.