MegaSack DRAW - 6pm Christmas Eve - LIVE on our YouTube Channel
I would argue
Oh, well, that settles it then - why bother with experts eh?
Do you think that it's acceptable for the state to issue medical interventions against the religious wishes of adults?
Capacity is a complex issue that doesn't really lend itself to blanket comment - that's why it so often ends up in court
Capacity is a complex issue that doesn't really lend itself to blanket comment - that's why it so often ends up in court
So you're saying that women don't have the psychological agency to make a decision in regards to their treatment - but some male religious folk do? 😆
Oh, well, that settles it then - why bother with experts eh?
You mean like the RCOG?
BTW: A clinical trial of forced counselling would never pass the ethics stage.
you're saying that
Am I? Where? Seems you're trying to extrapolate...
I'm assuming that is what you are implying by stating that capacity is a complex issue - which it really isn't in the case of healthy women.
Not really a complex issue is it
Consent to treatment is the principle that a person must give permission before they receive any type of medical treatment, test or examination. This must be done on the basis of an explanation by a clinician.
It becomes complex with children or those who are so mentally unfit so as to lack that capacity.
I'm assuming
Ah, right, shall we put that in the same box as
indirectlys advocating
Whereby you keep having to make up stuff that you wished I had said to base your argument on, because what I actually said left you floundering
No Nifan, you're purposely obfuscating your opinion - just in case someone calls you out on it - a tactic that you have fairly skillfully mastered as a coping mechanism in the Trump thread.
because what I actually said left you floundering
Where? Forced counselling trials can't be done due to ethics, so only an informed opinion can be made about the results of forcing counselling on people.
And experts? The experts ****ing agree with me. 😆 Experts are only experts if they back up the opinions of right-thinking Trump supporters/Tories though, aren't they? 😆
purposely obfuscating your opinion
We're going to need that ducking stool again
Children, can I just point out that you are two men arguing over a matter that concerns neither of you. Neither of you have had nor will ever go through an abortion. Perhaps leave this to those who might, eh?
I do - I don't tell women or support the idea that they need counselling. 👿
Round up the dwarfs that will fix it.
What a boot single mothers eh.
And today on vox political
In 2002, a secret Liberal Democrat document came to light – produced by the Association of Liberal Democrat Councillors – in which local activists were urged to “be wicked, act shamelessly, stir endlessly” in order to win elections.
Though I'd like to see proof of such a document
This thread has gone a bit off piste.
Good read on the hypocrisy of the right wing press, re energy price caps
especially after Fallon was caught out lying through his teeth on R4 this morning
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2017/apr/23/energy-prices-tory-cap-miliband-freeze
This thread has gone a bit off piste.
On STW?
Never!
[quote=jambalaya ]I'm not so sure @aracer
If it's Le Pen vs Macron of Fillion then yes its expected than Le Pen loses to tactical voting.
There we go then. Though I was wrong about your next president not being the winner of yesterday's vote - clearly I'd not been keeping up with polling as I'd expected Le Pen to get most votes in that.
ninfan - Memberpossibly explains your own inability to accept other people's opinions as being just as valid as yours.
Genuine LOL, LOLZ, ROFL, etc. 😆 😆 😆
I don't know how you have the bare faced cheek. 😆 😆
Works for me Tim. 😉
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I like that you gave him a LibDem coloured flag
Tim says yellow is the new blue. And red.
Have you seen the vote swap they've arranged in York?
They're pairing York Central LibDems with York Outer Labour types and agreeing to vote for each other's parties.
Tactical voting innovation space or what?
Perhaps it's happening all over the country of course and I just hadn't noticed it.
Perhaps it's happening all over the country of course and I just hadn't noticed it.
It's happened before at a local level, and Vince Cable and Julian Huppert have been on Twitter encouraging Brighton Lib Dems to vote Green, in apparent exchange for a deal made in Richmond Park.
Postal Votes will be issued in two waves around 24 & 31 May 2017
That's me not voting then, out the country.
My daughter votes Green in Brighton as she thinks they should have an MP at Westminster. She thinks their polcies are a bit nuts
Postal Votes will be issued in two waves around 24 & 31 May 2017
So they're sending them out in Whit Week? Good work.
I assume people saw the Independent link I posted in the Corbyn thread. Tories are predicted to beat Labour in Wales for the first time in 100 years
Relying on polls rarely ends well.
Tories are predicted to win 12 seats in Scotland. somehow I doubt it
Vote swapping has been a 'thing' for a while now. There was a website for the 2015 election: http://voteswap.org
[quote=miketually ]Vote swapping has been a 'thing' for a while now.
I'm sure it has - the question is whether it's likely to become a far more significant thing.
12 seats in Scotland seems a bit unlikely given they have 1 now. They will make big gains to say 6-8 IMO, Labour to be wiped out. This is going to give the Tories plenty of ammunition to bat back Sturgeon, not that the tesukts will make any difference to her single issue rhetoric. Even better results in Wales where Tories will become the largest party.
Labour are going backwards, so far they've offered more bank holidays and a dogs breakfast over defence. As/when the Tories turn up the heat on Corbyn it's going to be carnage.
and still May is till too scared to debate corbyn?
[quote=jambalaya ]Labour are going backwards, so far they've offered more bank holidays
My totally amateur reading of that is that it's quite an astute policy suggestion - from the POV that it's likely to win them votes where they need them. It certainly doesn't seem likely to harm their chances.
My totally amateur reading of that is that it's quite an astute policy suggestion - from the POV that it's likely to win them votes where they need them. It certainly doesn't seem likely to harm their chances.
I reckon so too. Unlikely to cost them votes from people who would have voted for them and quite likely to win a few. Also probably fairly uncontroversial within the party.
Quite imaginative too, I don't think many people saw it coming.
At very least it gives them something to talk about instead of the myriad of stuff they can't agree on.
Good idea.
and still May is till too scared to debate corbyn?
Or wise enough not to.
It certainly doesn't seem likely to harm their chances.
Nothing will.
Perhaps it's happening all over the country of course and I just hadn't noticed it.
Well let's hope it does happen and it works eh?
Reports that Zac is returning to try and get Richmond back? As a Tory this time.
deadlydarcy - Member
Reports that Zac is returning to try and get Richmond back? As a Tory this time.
hes got no shame has he!
on the plus side brexshit may be motivating the youth vote
tjagain - MemberTories are predicted to win 12 seats in Scotland. somehow I doubt it
I don't know what they did to the maths to make that add up, as far as I can tell the swing they're talking about in numbers, if applied evenly wins them back Roxburgh, which wouldn't be at all surprising, but no other SNP seats. No idea what these other 10 vulnerable seats are supposed to be, there just aren't many marginal seats where the Tories are within reasonable reach. Of course the second weakest majority in Scotland is Mundell and I doubt he feels very safe, after that it's Carmichael, and Labour have got to have a chance in Glasgow East...
The idea that the tories winning a few seats is a crushing blow to the SNP is pretty funny though. "Losers! We won 10% (*) of all the seats and you only won 80%! Bet you feel stupid now, everyone hates you". Meanwhile in Westminster 50.7% is a triumphant victory. That won't stop people trying to run with it but it's going to be pretty embarassing to watch.
(* why not, let's go nuts)
Reports that Zac is returning to try and get Richmond back? As a Tory this time.
He'll win
mefty - Member
Reports that Zac is returning to try and get Richmond back? As a Tory this time.
He'll win
just think of all the slightly racist leaflets he can produce with full party funding (+ the off the book extras, obvs)
@mefty I wouldn't vote for him, Jess Phillips had it nailed in that tweet of hers
@aracer my take of the holidays thing is "what a total joke", I mean there are so many issues facung the country and JC's suggestion is more days off.
@kimbers debates have no upside for the favourite / current PM - May is not daft there is absolutely no need to do one.
He'll win
He may well win. After all, there's a dearth of Eton-educated posh-boy dog whistling types like him in the HoP. There's a good chance the residents of Richmond will gladly see him back in to help with the shortage.
@aracer my take of the holidays thing is "what a total joke", I mean there are so many issues facung the country and JC's suggestion is more days off.
its approximately 1,000,438 x less stupid than brexit as a solution to all our problems, but these are crazy times after all
[quote=mefty ]He'll win
I wouldn't be so sure - it was a Lib Dem seat until 2010 (when they narrowly lost) and check the way that constituency voted in the referendum. It wasn't a whim voting him out last time.
Jess Phillips had it nailed in that tweet of hers
He kept a promise he made to his electorate, didn't work out for him because many were apathetic about it - but therein lies his path to victory in my view.
[quote=jambalaya ]@aracer my take of the holidays thing is "what a total joke", I mean there are so many issues facung the country and JC's suggestion is more days off.
He's trying to win an election. Do you think he should announce some important policy which the people he needs to vote Labour will pay no attention to? I thought the whole criticism about him was based on him being useless at winning elections...
I wouldn't be so sure - it was a Lib Dem seat until 2010 (when they narrowly lost) and check the way that constituency voted in the referendum. It wasn't a whim voting him out last time.
I know I live in it. The LibDems poured alot of resources in to win the by-election, which they won't be able to repeat. There was a lot of apathy illustrated by turnout down 20% hence my view he has a good chance.
debates have no upside for the favourite / current PM
Surely an obvious upside would be winning votes? Wasn't that why she called the election in the first place, to give people a chance to unite behind her and her party?
Or does she think she'd lose votes in a face-to-face debate?
Surely an obvious upside would be winning votes?
I don't think she needs any help from debates to do this - she is on course to break the record for the highest number of votes presently held by John Major.
There was a lot of apathy illustrated by turnout down 20% hence my view he has a good chance.
Brenda from Brizzle makes me think that turnout might not be rollocking this time 😉
Or does she think she'd lose votes in a face-to-face debate?
Of course she thinks she'd lose votes, for all the well accepted reasons sensible incumbents avoid debates spelled out in this thread.
Going back to Zac...
Runs dog-whistle campaign against Muslim mayoral candidate. Steps down from his seat "on principle" and loses in supposed Brexit backlash. Comes back to represent party from which he resigned because of a policy on an airport which hasn't changed.
Representing so many issues in politics today. He'd be perfect.
[quote=kimbers ]Brenda from Brizzle makes me think that turnout might not be rollocking this time
Which is what gives hope to the thought that it might not quite go according to the opinion polls. It's the relative turnout which could do it (along with tactical voting, but that will have a relatively minor effect compared to what variations in turnout could).
It's a nice thought aracer, but I'm not optimistic
Re Brenda's reaction, it's almost as if people are sick of politicians stirring up division and disunity in the country to satisfy their own hunger for power...
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(both via [url= http://www.thepoke.co.uk/2017/04/24/10-tips-improve-life-139/ ]The Poke[/url])
Of course she thinks she'd lose votes, for all the well accepted reasons sensible incumbents avoid debates spelled out in this thread.
I thought w had cleared up this myth. There isn't enough evidence in UK examples and the US has some but it's far from conclusive. It hurts an incumbent of they have a questionable record and plenty of lies/u turns to talk about.
Love the bus idea too.
Also can anyone be bothered to find the quotes from Jamby dismissing polls as irrelevant (I think there was only a few hundred)
On polling data that I checked your Monday morning they were all carried out at the latest Thurs or Fri last week so before any even minor policy or appearances were done so highly inaccurate of swing voters which is what counts.
Apparently we have reached Peak UKIP. Meet their Garscadden/Scotstounhill candidate, Gisela Allen:
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(clipping via [url= http://www.thepoke.co.uk/2017/04/24/people-sharing-article-ukip-candidate-calling-peak-ukipper/ ]The Poke[/url]. Original story: [url= http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15240329.Ukip__39_s_new_Scots_candidate_backs_guillotines__castration_and_flogging_____and_you_should_hear_her_views_on_gorillas/ ]The Herald[/url])
kimbers - Memberand still May is till too scared to debate corbyn?
Yes - because she know that without her cheerleaders behind her she will look daft and that the rest will gang up on her
TV debates are one place I expect Corbyn to come over well.
I could vote for that. Death penalty (guillotine would be OK) for people who fill up plastic bags with dog poo and hang them from trees.
It gets better Graham - she's into beastiality
Struggling to determine if Gisella Allen is real or a parody
A bit of both, like the party she represents.
I see May wants to be a world leader in preventing tourism. 😆
I suppose given that she's had the same holidays for the last 43 years, I can see where that's coming from.
[quote=Tom_W1987 ]It gets better Graham - she's into beastiality
I hope you're not intolerant of beastialists
Death penalty (guillotine would be OK) for people who fill up plastic bags with dog poo and hang them from trees.
She's abolished plastic bags. So think again!
Is it fair to say that we've found the shallowest bit of the already not-very-deep UKIP talent pool?
slippier than a greased up watermelon in a swimmingpool
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vjPSemRlpAk
Theresa May getting a few rejections knocking on doors. Maybe they think she's going to be a bloody difficult woman. 😀
Meanwhile, Mummy came to visit my neighbourhood yesterday evening...another community hall full of placard holding stuffed shirts. Hilariously, the local Tory councillor posted, in Mummy's defence, that there were indeed working class people in the hall. He knew for sure, because he could see some of them wearing "paint spattered overalls". 😆
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Another very good day for the Tories.
Another very good day for the Tories.
Another day, another #jambafact
Another very good day for the Tories.
The Tories dropped by 10 points in the polls in the first week of the campaign
Why won't Corbyn debate on TV? I understand why May won't, but Corbyn has all to gain and usually presents well.
Because he's a Lilly livered surrender monkey 😆
I have no idea and agree it's odd, he seems to capitulate at strange things. I'm going to hazard a guess it's to do with some misguided notion of fairness and that the debates wouldn't be legitimate without Tory participation
"Why won't Corbyn debate on TV?"
Gives a platform to opponents. Unless May is involved he's better off staying well away.
Another very good day for the Tories.
Another very bad day for the country. But who cares about that? It's only the poor who'll really suffer, jamba will be fine.
Because the only two who even with a following wind could realistically form a government are Corbyn and May.
And therefore the debate needs to include both those two.
If Submarine May (to use her old nickname) has decided to run away there's not much point in doing it - unless he's guaranteed that they will empty chair her and keep referring to her absence.
