[Closed] iDiet tip

I haven't had milk for over 12 months, haven't had soya drink for about 6 months or more, haven't lost any weight either. 😥

I saw an interesting program called 'Why Aren't Thin People Fat' or something last night.

There is so much more to this staying thin lark than we've discussed on this forum.

You're all going to die of heart-attacks though 😀
[url] http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2010/04/full-fat-dairy-for-cardiovascular.html [/url]

Is it on iPlayer or similar Yeti? I know there's a lot to it, that's clear from just looking at people and what they eat.

From the link,

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Apparently, although milk is thought of as low GI, it has a high insulin response. Cottage cheese is ok on the slow carb diet, if you want a bit of dairy..

Dunno - it was a repeat being shown on one of those high numbered channels on freeview.

Did a pretty basic experiment (a repeat of an older one apparently) where they fed a group of slim/normal students 5000 Kcal a day for several weeks and monitored how their bodies changed.

All gained weight but to different extents and in different ways... some stored it in muscle others in fat.

Some peoples metabolism will adjust to meet the calorie intake in their diet. Some peoples bodies will omit chemical signals to prevent them over eating in the first place.

It is thought that much of this is dictated by your genes and your childhood development etc etc.. and that for the average adult your weight will be pretty constant bar a small amount of middle aged spread.

Essentially... embrace that belly.

Intriguingly (almost) I've just made a latte for maybe the second time in the last year.... Normally never even bother to buy milk, but Mrs iDave has it in her tea.

P-G; just put cottage cheese in my coffee, as you suggested...tasted rank.

I just read all of IanMunro's link - it's bloody interesting.

Seems there's milk and there's milk. Different cows in different countries fed different diets; pasteurised, un-pasteurised and low temp pasteurised.. aged cheese versus non aged.. grass fed cows..

Milk definitely tastes different in the USA, and Mrs Grips' 'lactose intolerance' is almost non existent in the UK, apparently because the milk is different.

Milk. It seems to be significantly more detrimental to the diet than I thought it would be.

It also ruins coffee.

yup, black coffee all the way, the last time I drank coffee with milk must have been probably around 1994 or 1995.

Kev

Milk definitely tastes different in the USA

Quite often I hear Americans taking about grass fed beef, and grass fed milk. I'm guessing that with intensive farming methods it might not be the norm there.

iDiet tip - [s]Milk. It seems to be significantly more detrimental to the diet than I thought it would be.

I was having two small 250ml lattes with whole milk per day, thinking it wasn't the worst thing. But I found myself getting really very hungry despite eating big compliant meals otherwise. Then it occurred to me that the milk could have been causing the problem, since it apparently causes lots of insulin to be produced. Because I was so hungry I ended up failing on the diet by mid afternoon.

Black coffee only today and I feel fine, no snacks, and not especially hungry either.[/s]

Don't have stuff that's not on the allowed list..... 😉

In other words, iDave was right.

I'm havin cheese tho after reading that link!

iDiet tip - Don't have stuff that's not on the allowed list

That's what I was going to suggest!

I am coming to the conclusion that some things on the disallowed list are much worse than others though.

I hear Americans taking about grass fed beef, and grass fed milk. I'm guessing that with intensive farming methods it might not be the norm there

I don't think it is. I buy organic milk here in the belief that it contains more goodness, presumably because it's more grass fed?

I've just made a latte for maybe the second time in the last year

Second time in 5 days then?

on a different Idave note, I've found how to make idave compliant bread/muffins for having with soup, also makes ace dumplings for big bean stews

go on tazzy...

I'll sort out a proper weight n measure version as it's a bit "bucket chemistry" at the moment, the main thing is getting the palm oil to bean flour mix right to effectively make veg suet without using the shop stuff that has a trace of rice flour in it. ( not that it would make a massive difference if you were lazy)

[url= http://www.bicycling.com/training-nutrition/nutrition-weight-loss/big-fat-lies ]So then, all you carb lovers and iDiet doubters.....[/url]

Nice one dave, I'll, errr, digest that properly later.

Does still allow for fruits though?

Is that difference because the iDiet is for fatties looking to lose whereas the article is talking about athletes keeping weight off?

Can't you keep that news quiet Dave?

You know you would hate to be mainstream.

Over Christmas I watched A Sunday in Hell for the 1st time.

Noticed one of the top riders and his team mates were eating steak for breakfast.

Dave's link mentions Brussel Sprouts, so for that reason I'm out.

[url= http://www.bicycling.com/training-nutrition/nutrition-weight-loss/benefits-milk-and-other-dairy-products-cyclists ]So then, all you milk dodgers...[/url]
[url= http://www.bicycling.com/training-nutrition/nutrition-weight-loss/11-tasty-summer-beers-post-ride-recovery ]...and recovery drink users[/url]
that website is pure tosh

rewski - wouldn't a pint of milk and a pint of beer give you very similar fuel to a posh recovery drink?

The film about Cav on the TDF showed them all glugging down wine on an evening.

Yay, the first idave diet / molgrips update thread of the year! 🙂

Mol, fwiw, i've given up lattes (previously with skimmed milk) and a good 95% of my chocolate addiction. That's the only change I've made and I've lost 4kgs and inches all over. Drinking effectively a pint of whole milk in your two lattes a day is a lot of fat/calories compared to skimmed milk, never mind cheating on the idiet 😛 I also find drinking coffee makes me seriously hungry (especially if i have a coffee about 2pm, by mid afternoon I'm hungry) so I always have healthy snacks to hand so I don't have to resort to the vending machine evilness. I hope drinking black coffee helps you stick to the diet, but if not, you could consider not having two coffees to see if that helps?

*waves at TSY*

TSY - most probably, although I probably wouldn't drink them at the same time. That website will probably be saying avoid yellow fruits with spots next week.

Rewski - it's like snakebite and black for the fitness fanatics.

Hey up Dirty... you tried green tea?

Does the article cover how to get enough calories whilst avoiding fast carbs? I'm really struggling at the minute so have been topping my diet up with chocolate or cheese and crackers.

You could substitute them with doughnuts, they've got a higher fruit content.

Compressed carbs is the way to go, rolling pin and a pack of sorren, works everytime.

i missed the idiet Phenomena and rueing the decision as i'm effectively 2 stone overweight now 😳 Is there a way to get on this express train of weight loss?

The Southern Yeti - Member
Does the article cover how to get enough calories whilst avoiding fast carbs? I'm really struggling at the minute so have been topping my diet up with chocolate or cheese and crackers.

It suggests starch is the problem, and too many conflate starch and carbs. Eat carbs from non-starch sources (some whole grains), and that carbs should be 50% of your meal.

I buy organic milk here in the belief that it contains more goodness, presumably because it's more grass fed?

The opposite is often the case. As in less grass fed.

To have organic outdoor cows you need to put your organic reared cows into organic certified fields. It takes 3 years of organic use to convert a field from non to organic. During this time you can't sell the produce as organic even though you are often paying extra to produce this way.

To do the same with with shed cows you can do so overnight. Buy your organic cows from market and put them on a concrete floor all year round, feed them organic feed.

It goes against the ethos of organic but which do you think is most popular?

Sorry to shatter you beliefs. 😥

Phil I actually read a study that said there was more omega 3 in organic milk. That's where my 'belief' came from, you can't blame me for that. Plus it's not much more expensive.

So I still see an awful lot of cows standing in fields eating grass. Surely they are dairy cows?

Drinking effectively a pint of whole milk in your two lattes a day is a lot of fat/calories compared to skimmed milk

Hmm but this isn't about calories so much, it's about insulin. And milk makes your body produce a lot more insulin than the sugar in it would suggest.. I think that might help lower your blood sugar and make you hungry.

Yeti - I had this problem in Germany. The solution is to do LESS exercise but more focused.. but you are an addict so that won't wash I'm sure 🙂 I found there was a limit to how many beans/veg I could eat so I ended up topping up with simple carbs around exercise and I started to lose more weight, cos I was riding harder.

Molly - yep, I have to be addicted to something, it's just the way it goes.
Been reading a lot of stuff about triathlete's nutritional plans... I'm almost tempted to start taking supplements / loads of bread.

I think that might help lower your blood sugar and make you hungry.

I've been thinking about this. From what I can tell, the insulin issue is less about controlling hunger, and more about what insulin does in terms of storing fat. Yes, no, maybe?

That's where my 'belief' came from, you can't blame me for that.

So I still see an awful lot of cows standing in fields eating grass. Surely they are dairy cows?

I wonder what affect a lower insulinogenic diet has on reserving metabolic syndrome. In my (weak) understanding eating too many simple carbs (sugars including starches etc) increases the amount of insulin released by the pancreas. If your diet contains too many simple carbs for too long the cells of your body build up insulin resistance - this is metabolic syndrome. To counter this the pancreas has to produce more insulin, but that only makes the problem worse and makes you feel hungrier. If the pancreas works too hard it becomes exhausted and you get diabetes.

In addition to problems with insulin, consuming too much sugar increases the amount of triglycerides (bad fats) in your blood stream. Too much fat in your blood = you get fat.

So, for overweight people doing the iDave and reducing simple carb intake helps your pancreas, potentially reduces cell resistance to insulin, and reduces the bad fat in your blood = big win and weight loss.

...maybe.

This is an interesting read: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/17/magazine/mag-17Sugar-t.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all

Jon, this kind of diet is prescribed for metabolic syndrome I think. It significantly reduces insulin resistance afaik.

Apparently, insulin floating around your blood all the time is responsible for a lot of ageing processes too. Although I read that online so who knows.

Insulin does a lot of things though, some good and some bad, and some depending on circumstances. It's anabolic.. which might be why carbs help recovery...?

Oh Duchy Originals from Waitrose seems to be a good source of grass fed stuff.

Careful, middle class food has a massive impact on insulin levels.

Careful, middle class food has a massive impact on insulin levels.

I think you're getting insulin and smugness mixed up.

I`ve just started on iDave/4HB diet, after building up to it for a while...

I`m 4 days in so far and feeling pretty good, inspite of this being the first time in years with no sugar or milk in Hot drinks for me !!

12st6,3/4lbs starting weight and 4 days in I`m down 4.5lbs
I know that a lot of that will be water loss but It all feels very sustainable, unlike atkins and some other stuff I`ve done (Ultimately unsucessfully) over the years.

10.5st is target "Fighting weight"

CaptJon - you are essentially right. One of the real advantages of high protein, highish fat, low carb type of diets such as iDave's is that they lead to very stable and low levels of insulin in the blood. This helps reduce appetite and hunger - which is a major cause of people falling off diets even when they really want to loose weight.

Whilst the comments about milk having a greater effect on insulin spiking than the sugar contained might suggest might be true, what causes insulin spikes varies greatly from person to person. I know of a lady who cannot drink coffee or tea (even black), because the caffeine causes her insulin to spike so severely that it can lead to hypoglycaemia and collapse. But she can drink any amount of milk.
Flavourings can do it, sweeteners can do it, Mars bars can do it (but that's maybe not too surprising.... )

Colin

12st6,3/4lbs starting weight and 4 days in I`m down 4.5lbs
I know that a lot of that will be water loss but It all feels very sustainable, unlike atkins and some other stuff I`ve done (Ultimately unsucessfully) over the years.

10.5st is target "Fighting weight"

12st 6 is my target weight!

high protein, highish fat, low carb type of diets such as iDave's

FFS for the millionth time it's NOT supposed to be A ****ING LOW CARB DIET!!!

yo, where can i find the idave diet - STW forum search yields lots of people talking about idaves diet but i can't find it.

I took am on a health kick. 31, 6'1" and 15st3 so i've pledged to get down to 13st by St Paddy's day or i'll give 100 quid to charity.

I started on Monday and have basically just been controlling calories, lots of raw veg, almonds for snacking on and healthy meals. The biggest change for me is in portion control - i used to eat enough meat in one sitting that should have done two meals.

Its getting easier now but the first couple of days are hellish as your body adjusts to small, regular meals and i've cut out all choc, crisps tea / coffee and most importantly booze from daily life. I plan to have a treat once a week (maybe a couple of low carb beers etc) but looking forward to the 17th for a steak and a pint of guinness 🙂

one thing that did disappoint though, i weighed myself on my brother in laws scales on NYE and read 15st 3lb and change. I bought my own scales on Weds there and tried them and apparently had lost a pound. Tried them again this morning and have gained a pound back 🙁

EDIT - i realise the use of two sets of scales will largely account for this, but i was hoping for a big drop to get me going 🙂

I was hoping for 3-4lbs like cr500dom up there ^

PS is there a reliable way of working out your target weight? Dont wanna fail at this and i will work at it, but no point trying to hit a weight i'll realistically never get to....

I'm eating a serrano ham, lentil and pimenton hearty stew... I'm radiating smugness.

link here:

https://www.sugarsync.com/pf/D6580668_7607415_613824

bump.
just so i can find it lateras i am off to work now.

FFS for the millionth time it's NOT supposed to be A **** LOW CARB DIET!!!

Colin

FFS for the millionth time it's NOT supposed to be A **** LOW CARB DIET!!!

So where can I get more information on this low carb diet? Is it like Atkins?

*buys meat*

Have we established if tzatziki is in yet?

Jamie - see Captjon's link above (reposted here for your convience)

[url= https://www.sugarsync.com/pf/D6580668_7607415_613824 ]iDave diet[/url]

For sure. Loads round here also, though all of the organic farms in the local area keep their dairy cows in sheds 24/7.

There is a requirement for the cows to be outside the majority of the time.

http://www.soilassociation.org/whatisorganic/organicanimals/dairycattle

Whilst the comments about milk having a greater effect on insulin spiking than the sugar contained might suggest might be true, what causes insulin spikes varies greatly from person to person

Interesting, and that ties in with something else I read that said GI was measured to be very different in different people and even at different times of day.

peoples lifestyle will affect how sensitive they have become to insulin, so yeah there will be individual variations in responses to foods. the trick is finding a regime that will work for most people, most of the time.

A personalised approach is what I'm going for. Really failed a lot lately though, since coming back from Germany.

iDave - Member

high protein, highish fat, low carb type of diets such as iDave's

FFS for the millionth time it's NOT supposed to be A **** LOW CARB DIET!!!

Mr Atkins can help

cheers.
Is it any good?

Hopefully.

I have gone from 147 to 162lbs over the festive period.

I eschewed sleep for eating Cadbury's Heroes.

So, anyone have details of a high protein, highish fat, low carb diet, it sounds just the thing?

Just in case you're not being sarcastic, Don S, iDave's diet, whilst NOT low carb, has the same effect on insulin as I described above.

Colin

Just in case you're not being sarcastic, Don S, iDave's diet, whilst NOT low carb, has the same effect on insulin as I described above.

181cms and 66,67kg

What's that in old money?

Lanky steak of piss!
6'ish and 10,5 stone.

Damn. I bet you couldn't go out the last couple of days?

Well, I guess you could have wore some of these....

[img] [/img]

...assuming your beanpole legs could lift 'em 😉

It is effectively lower carb than typical western diets though because it's quite hard to eat a ton of beans, but it's quite easy to eat a lot of bread or potatoes.

Damn. I bet you couldn't go out last few days?

I have gone from 147 to 162lbs over the festive period.

Bufftingz

6'ish and 10,5 stone.

I'm a smidge under 6' and a smidge over 11 stone. In December I ate 32 mince pies and 24 Tunnocks Caramel Wafers, in addition to me normal diet. With Christmas dinners and drinks I gained [i]almost[/i] half a stone, which I've now lost.

🙂

Bufftingz

Just more of me to love.

iDaves now done (another) book btw-

[url= http://www.amazon.com/Low-Carbon-Diet-Pounds-Be-Solution/dp/0963032720 ]http://www.amazon.com/Low-Carbo-Diet-Pounds-Be-Solution/dp/0963032720[/url]

BoardinBob - Member

12st 6 is my target weight!

Yeah But I`m only a short@rse 😉

4.75lbs down after the first week, but thats only part of the story, Belly and moobs are half the size they were !!

Thats a result in my eyes 😀

Especially as the only real excercise I got last week was a small session on the turbo....

Strangely though, I really felt rough after my cheat day and couldnt wait to get back on the diet !!
It really has changed how I feel, and it does feel really sustainable

The pain starts here. As well as being on iDave, my week looks like this for the next 6 (at least) as I start fight camp tonight.

Monday - Boxing

Wednesday - Boxing bodyweight

Friday - Strength & conditioning

Saturday - Boxing

Sunday - Bike

So 6 weeks of hard training plus iDave and it'll be interesting to see the results

Strangely though, I really felt rough after my cheat day and couldnt wait to get back on the diet !!
It really has changed how I feel, and it does feel really sustainable

I used to feel like that, i just can't give up the booze at weekends, it's like a mild addiction. I say I'm going to stay in but come 7pm saturday evening I get itchy feet and just go out, then regret it the following day!

Also have a look a Korean food it is very healthy and tasty just cut the rice.

Boxing.. hmm.. I must admit I fancy some kind of martial arts from a training point of view. Problem is I my lifestyle's not stable enough for that kind of thing.